The Gta+Niagara Brawl Power Rankings! (last updated 06/28. OMG RLY!?)

[swordgard]

honestly, im fucking sick of you saying that.

its ridiculous

its like saying "Albert Einstien was a genius, why cant you be?"

Ally is INHUMANE. if everyone could reach ally's level, then he would not be special, he would not be a big deal. stop relating to him all the time for fuck's sake, ally is so different than we are. the way his mind works is so well adjusted to this game, which is why he can play so well.

ally has a natural talent in this game that we simply cant reach. practising and training can only bring you so far, and trust me, considering that im a wifi player, i get REGULAR practise. but ally is at an entirely different league and level, one which i cant reach simply because i CANT. its impossible.

the best players of this game are only there because they have a natural talent at it, not by "stepping it up."



everyone flames you and gets pissed at you, but ive been fine with you, up until now where you simply stand me down saying "oh lol step it up," ignoring all of my efforts and how hard ive been trying for recognition in this friggin game.

what the hell are you saying, im "stepping it up" as much as i fucking can.

dont pass aside my efforts as if theyre nothing, it really pisses me off.

its not my fault that anytime i get to a high point in this game, people will start playing like total douches. from planking, to camping, to spamming on a fucking ******** counterpick, i think ive taken enough shit from this game, and im not about to take any shit from you either.

Erm, its not all about training. Its about understanding game mechanics, keeping yourself at the top of the metagame by reading stuff and researching about stuff noone knows about. Everyone can reach his level, simple as that. Even m2k said he had no natural talent and he had to learn everything to get where he was. Just training mindlessly is not all that matter, theory is worth even more. If you actually start to think and analyze your replays you can get much better. This is how i got so far and why i will keep on improving, same as to why meep will keep on improving, same as to why dom will keep on improving and so on. We stop practicing only to get better mindgames, that will get you far but you cant only rely on that. You need a deeper understanding of how the game works, ally has that, and you can get that too. You and him are no different in the game, you always have access to the same amount of options, you can always do the same as him. Whenever he dthrows you, you have the same amount of options as he does when you dthrow him. Hes not different, no one is. This is what is great about this game.


Its really easy to blame "lack of talent". I lack talent at smash games. Terrible tech skill, took me so long to understand mindgames. I had to work my *** off to get where i am, talent can help, and yes ally may have tons of talent, but that wont stop anyone else from reaching his level.


Im tired of whiners like you . Go and read tons of guides, start doing research on your own, analyze problematic situations, you will start winning. Continue on whining and training mindlessly, you will continue to lose.

 

[Tin Man]

Erm, its not all about training. Its about understanding game mechanics, keeping yourself at the top of the metagame by reading stuff and researching about stuff noone knows about. Everyone can reach his level, simple as that. Even m2k said he had no natural talent and he had to learn everything to get where he was. Just training mindlessly is not all that matter, theory is worth even more. If you actually start to think and analyze your replays you can get much better. This is how i got so far and why i will keep on improving, same as to why meep will keep on improving, same as to why dom will keep on improving and so on. We stop practicing only to get better mindgames, that will get you far but you cant only rely on that. You need a deeper understanding of how the game works, ally has that, and you can get that too. You and him are no different in the game, you always have access to the same amount of options, you can always do the same as him. Whenever he dthrows you, you have the same amount of options as he does when you dthrow him. Hes not different, no one is. This is what is great about this game.


Its really easy to blame "lack of talent". I lack talent at smash games. Terrible tech skill, took me so long to understand mindgames. I had to work my *** off to get where i am, talent can help, and yes ally may have tons of talent, but that wont stop anyone else from reaching his level.


Im tired of whiners like you . Go and read tons of guides, start doing research on your own, analyze problematic situations, you will start winning. Continue on whining and training mindlessly, you will continue to lose.

Cruxis it will take time, keep doing what ur doing and get better at it no worries bro

 

[sauc3]

cruxis does have a point though, some people are just better suited for smash.

once ken learned the AT he never played or practiced between tournaments,
mango didn't play his puff for like 5 tournaments before genesis.

Some people are just better than other people (not saying they work less, cuz im sure they work their *** off), but that doesn't mean (cruxis) that it is impossible to get on their level, it just means you're gunna have to try harder (like any aspect of the world)

 

[Cruxis]

Erm, its not all about training. Its about understanding game mechanics, keeping yourself at the top of the metagame by reading stuff and researching about stuff noone knows about. Everyone can reach his level, simple as that. Even m2k said he had no natural talent and he had to learn everything to get where he was. Just training mindlessly is not all that matter, theory is worth even more. If you actually start to think and analyze your replays you can get much better. This is how i got so far and why i will keep on improving, same as to why meep will keep on improving, same as to why dom will keep on improving and so on. We stop practicing only to get better mindgames, that will get you far but you cant only rely on that. You need a deeper understanding of how the game works, ally has that, and you can get that too. You and him are no different in the game, you always have access to the same amount of options, you can always do the same as him. Whenever he dthrows you, you have the same amount of options as he does when you dthrow him. Hes not different, no one is. This is what is great about this game.


Its really easy to blame "lack of talent". I lack talent at smash games. Terrible tech skill, took me so long to understand mindgames. I had to work my *** off to get where i am, talent can help, and yes ally may have tons of talent, but that wont stop anyone else from reaching his level.


Im tired of whiners like you . Go and read tons of guides, start doing research on your own, analyze problematic situations, you will start winning. Continue on whining and training mindlessly, you will continue to lose.

you assume that i dont read up guides or anything online, and i dont know where you got that from.
i have read up basically every snake guide, ive watched all of ally's videos, ive tried to learn of what to do and how to play.
its much easier said than done. it all comes down to how your mind works, and thats just something youre born with.

your example of the dthrow, although ally and i may have the same options, ally can analyze much faster than i can. and that comes from how quickly you can think or interpret, a skill ally was just born with, and i was not. thats out of my control. thats just the way his mind works, and mine unfortunately does not.

ally IS different, thats why hes such a big deal. the way he can know how is opponent thinks is NOT something that anybody else can do, thats just his natural talent. he isnt just your typical player, and no amount of hard work could ever close the gap between him and i.



youre also forgetting one very important thing:
this is a game.

just a stupid, stupid game.

its meant to be played for fun, not analyzed to death and droned to the point where it loses its meaning.

i dont have the patience, or the time to kill myself over a videogame. there are so many more important things i need to pay attention to in my life, brawl is something i consider to be for fun, or at least i used to.

sure, winning is nice, but i dont want to win by picking japes and camping with falco.
i dont want to win by using double MK in teams.
i dont want to win by planking my opponent with MK and dragging the match on for 8 minutes.

but in our scene today, it seems like that is the only way to win, nobody cares about having a good clean match without BS.

 

[swordgard]

you assume that i dont read up guides or anything online, and i dont know where you got that from.
i have read up basically every snake guide, ive watched all of ally's videos, ive tried to learn of what to do and how to play.
its much easier said than done. it all comes down to how your mind works, and thats just something youre born with.

your example of the dthrow, although ally and i may have the same options, ally can analyze much faster than i can. and that comes from how quickly you can think or interpret, a skill ally was just born with, and i was not. thats out of my control. thats just the way his mind works, and mine unfortunately does not.

ally IS different, thats why hes such a big deal. the way he can know how is opponent thinks is NOT something that anybody else can do, thats just his natural talent. he isnt just your typical player, and no amount of hard work could ever close the gap between him and i.



youre also forgetting one very important thing:
this is a game.

just a stupid, stupid game.

its meant to be played for fun, not analyzed to death and droned to the point where it loses its meaning.

i dont have the patience, or the time to kill myself over a videogame. there are so many more important things i need to pay attention to in my life, brawl is something i consider to be for fun, or at least i used to.

sure, winning is nice, but i dont want to win by picking japes and camping with falco.
i dont want to win by using double MK in teams.
i dont want to win by planking my opponent with MK and dragging the match on for 8 minutes.

but in our scene today, it seems like that is the only way to win, nobody cares about having a good clean match without BS.

Contradiction much? You said you cant achieve that level then admit its possible with enough patient/time. You make your choices on whether you want to win or not and how much your willing to put into it. MK is far from being your only option. And why can you decide what is BS and what is not? Maybe i consider snakes tilt BS? Maybe its not fun for me to have all my attacks outranged by it. So stop whining about what you consider BS. None of these things have been over centralizing the metagame, they are far from being overpowered as they are beatable.

Also, you know, maybe ally just LEARNED to get better through experience.
Either way, for such arguments, you need to take a stance, either you play for fun, where winning does not matter any way so competition is meaningless, or you play to win, where everything is fine until it creates overcentralization. If you want to play for fun, then just play as whoever you want and dont complain if you lose, just say it was not really fun. Even then, fun is subjective, maybe i enjoy getting camped to death(and i really do, and im not the only one). If you play to win, you contradicted yourself. So for all i care, your argument seems to me more like johnning than anything.

Also, your mind can be conditioned to become faster at analyzing, it is surprising how well humans can adapt!



EDIT: Oh and if talent is all that matters, its fun to know that everyone has a pre determined limit they can never get to and thus everyone can be happy without trying. People who win are simply terribly lucky for being who they are.

 

[SilverDoc~]

sure, winning is nice, but i dont want to win by picking japes and camping with falco.
i dont want to win by using double MK in teams.
i dont want to win by planking my opponent with MK and dragging the match on for 8 minutes..

You've just called Phil and I out, we will be sure to use those in game mechanics on you more often.

Want to know why...? CAUSE IT GETS US CASH!

 

[swordgard]

You've just called Phil and I out, we will be sure to use those in game mechanics on you more often.

Want to know why...? CAUSE IT GETS US CASH!

I encourage you guys to try them on me next time we play, i have gayer in game mechanics to use on you XD

 

[Cruxis]

Contradiction much? You said you cant achieve that level then admit its possible with enough patient/time. You make your choices on whether you want to win or not and how much your willing to put into it. MK is far from being your only option. And why can you decide what is BS and what is not? Maybe i consider snakes tilt BS? Maybe its not fun for me to have all my attacks outranged by it. So stop whining about what you consider BS. None of these things have been over centralizing the metagame, they are far from being overpowered as they are beatable.

Also, you know, maybe ally just LEARNED to get better through experience.
Either way, for such arguments, you need to take a stance, either you play for fun, where winning does not matter any way so competition is meaningless, or you play to win, where everything is fine until it creates overcentralization. If you want to play for fun, then just play as whoever you want and dont complain if you lose, just say it was not really fun. Even then, fun is subjective, maybe i enjoy getting camped to death(and i really do, and im not the only one). If you play to win, you contradicted yourself. So for all i care, your argument seems to me more like johnning than anything.

Also, your mind can be conditioned to become faster at analyzing, it is surprising how well humans can adapt!



EDIT: Oh and if talent is all that matters, its fun to know that everyone has a pre determined limit they can never get to and thus everyone can be happy without trying. People who win are simply terribly lucky for being who they are.

contradiction? how was i contradicting myself, i stand by what i say that i cannot reach ally's level.

although i am not denying that i can improve, of course there's always room for improvement. its just that im at a point where practise doesnt make much of a difference anymore, and its, like you said, adaptation to the game, which im just not suited for i find.

and quite frankly, i think everyone can agree that being camped by a falco on japes is BS. i think everyone can agree that being planked is BS. try it out sometime. there really is no possible way to approach. at all. Snake's tilts can be shielded, then punished, at least. even if they do have range, they are still much more easily dealt with than what i have listed.

and why is it that you MUST be either one or the other: play to win, or play for fun? why is it impossible to be both? THATS what i consider to be an ideal competitive community, thats what i would consider to be the most enjoyable.

and TBH, i have nothing to say to anyone who enjoys being camped to death. honestly, nothing at all, because thats like someone who says they enjoy exams or essays. i just really have nothing to say to someone like that, lol.

You've just called Phil and I out, we will be sure to use those in game mechanics on you more often.

Want to know why...? CAUSE IT GETS US CASH!

ya ive called you guys out, way i see it is that you guys only resorted to those methods because you knew you couldn't beat me otherwise, so all that really showed was how desperate you were to beat me. guess i was better then

at least that was the case at the time that is, of course youve found other ways to beat me legitly and ive got nothing to say to those times.

I encourage you guys to try them on me next time we play, i have gayer in game mechanics to use on you XD

lol see, do you understand what i mean. its just all about who outgays who. its never a match where both players can honestly tell each other "good games" after and mean it.

i wish i realized a long time ago that getting the money is the only point of the brawl competitive scene.

i could have saved myself a LOT of time, and money.

 

[SilverDoc~]

its 7:11 gone to get a slurpee

inb4blackjokes

 

[swordgard]

contradiction? how was i contradicting myself, i stand by what i say that i cannot reach ally's level.

although i am not denying that i can improve, of course there's always room for improvement. its just that im at a point where practise doesnt make much of a difference anymore, and its, like you said, adaptation to the game, which im just not suited for i find.

and quite frankly, i think everyone can agree that being camped by a falco on japes is BS. i think everyone can agree that being planked is BS. try it out sometime. there really is no possible way to approach. at all. Snake's tilts can be shielded, then punished, at least. even if they do have range, they are still much more easily dealt with than what i have listed.

and why is it that you MUST be either one or the other: play to win, or play for fun? why is it impossible to be both? THATS what i consider to be an ideal competitive community, thats what i would consider to be the most enjoyable.

and TBH, i have nothing to say to anyone who enjoys being camped to death. honestly, nothing at all, because thats like someone who says they enjoy exams or essays. i just really have nothing to say to someone like that, lol.




ya ive called you guys out, way i see it is that you guys only resorted to those methods because you knew you couldn't beat me otherwise, so all that really showed was how desperate you were to beat me. guess i was better then

at least that was the case at the time that is, of course youve found other ways to beat me legitly and ive got nothing to say to those times.



lol see, do you understand what i mean. its just all about who outgays who. its never a match where both players can honestly tell each other "good games" after and mean it.

i wish i realized a long time ago that getting the money is the only point of the brawl competitive scene.

i could have saved myself a LOT of time, and money.

Simply because if you play to have fun and play to win then you will have contradicting things. Either way, some people enjoy playing vs campers because its beatable and its simply about outsmarting the other while he camps, reduce his number of jumps and then hit. Look, the argument of playing for fun really does not mean much since fun really is subjective. If you say you dont want to play vs people who enjoy getting camped, then your simply creating an arbitrary rule for yourself as to what is acceptable and as to what is not. And thus by this, you now fit Sirlin's definition of scrub : D. Otherwise, if you are for fun, then you gotta accept that people have fun playing differently. If you play to win, everything goes unless it overcentralizes the game. If you want to win and have fun, then you have to understand that other people want to win, thus can play "gay", and maybe they enjoy playing in this way. Maybe they also enjoy playing vs that way. Whichever argument you have, they both come back to it being fine for gayness to be introduced.


Also, tbh, i said outgay because i actually find it funny about how everyone says this or that is gay, so i decided to replace every time i say outplay/mindgame/beat/etc by the gay term so that everyone feels like they are still better and have not really lost. If people just lose to gayer things, then they dont think they really have to practice since its not their fault, "they just got gayed", they continue on placing worst since they arent training either.



Finally, im pretty sure if there is always room for improvement then you should inevitably reach allys level at some point.


EDIT: I dont recall falco on japes being unpunishable, or MK planking/aircamping being unpunishable. Especially with snake.


Double edit: Doc get on aim so i can properly congratulates you for your wins!

 

[AvariceX]

I think people took the play to win mentality too far with this game. I totally support Sirlin's theories, but there are other easier, more reliable, and more profitable ways to make money... and if you're not having fun playing a game then there are more fun ways to make money too. If there are people out there who can stand doing what it takes to win in Brawl and still have fun then more power to them, but as soon as you stop having fun it defeats the purpose of playing a game; even in competition (just get a job if you want money).

 

[swordgard]

I think people took the play to win mentality too far with this game. I totally support Sirlin's theories, but there are other easier, more reliable, and more profitable ways to make money... and if you're not having fun playing a game then there are more fun ways to make money too. If there are people out there who can stand doing what it takes to win in Brawl and still have fun then more power to them, but as soon as you stop having fun it defeats the purpose of playing a game; even in competition (just get a job if you want money).

Oh i agree, i just completely enjoy the competition. Finding new ways to win is always fun. The adrenaline pumping and the heart pounding during an intense match, the fun of reading your opponents move, i love it all. New "gayer" strategies are simply new puzzles which require new ways to be solved and beaten. If there is no solution, then nobody can ever beat it and it gets banned. If one person can, anyone can!

 

[Toronto Joe]

id like to think my MK isnt lame,although MK is a lame char in general so i guess it doesnt matter lmao

i have some pretty good umad combos(fatal knows)

 

[Tin Man]

Wen will the OP get updated?

 

[Niko_K]

Joe your MK is mad good. Too bad I still go even with you as Peach xD.

This tournament was a bunch of BS for me, it's not johns. It's the truth.

 

[Runawayfire]

I'll update the post as soon as I get a chart from Dud? Is that on its way Gi or?

On the subject of gayness in brawl, you do what you can to win. At that same time I believe you should accept the consequences of that, if you abuse a frowned upon advantage the consequences will be people will look down on you, and you may never really recover from that.
At the same time some people may truly respect you more because they support Sirlin-ism.

I feel I always tried to play an honest medium, you obviously need to exploit your characters advantages, but at the same time I would rather be known for winning for outplaying, not outgaying my opponent. Things like running away for position and strategy is outplaying, running away for 8 mins is outgaying IMO.

 

[Pho]

Man, I haven't checked this thread in ages, and people are at each others' throats.

I remember back in my first couple of tournaments, I played with "honor." Meaning the instant I saw gay styles of play, I reamed out whoever did it. Don't remember? Ask Worldjem/Er!x and even Fool when he first entered the scene. The difference between the two is that Fool learned how to win without resorting to such tactics(although I saw it happen against Mikey vs his Dedede). I used to get so rattled up, asking myself, "if you're not even having fun, why not just get a job?"

Then I remembered why I do anything competitive. I like talking with people about the game. To socialize. Hell, it doesn't even have to be about Smash. People DO have lives outside the game, and Smash is just a common ground all of us share. What's frustrating is that I can see from Cruxis' point of view is that he invests time into it, just to get gayed by simple yet effective tactics.

But Swordguard does bring up a valid point. It's not that practice makes perfect. Correct practice makes perfect.

 

[Mikey7]

I think people took the play to win mentality too far with this game. I totally support Sirlin's theories, but there are other easier, more reliable, and more profitable ways to make money... and if you're not having fun playing a game then there are more fun ways to make money too. If there are people out there who can stand doing what it takes to win in Brawl and still have fun then more power to them, but as soon as you stop having fun it defeats the purpose of playing a game; even in competition (just get a job if you want money).

Its not that people took the play to win too far its just the nature of the game that makes it looks worse than it is. FOR EXAMPLE:
-8 mins to run the clock isntead of 90 seconds for other fighting games - but people do run the clock in those...trust me people turtle for 90 seconds...I turtle for 90 seconds with like every character
-no block stun paired with extremely broken ics + mk. mks got unlimited options lol, he can literally do everything perfectly and you really can't exploit most of it unless the mk makes a mistake. and on top of that the game itself mostly rewards safety so these 2 characters just **** everything else. oh snake too hes pretty gay, and camping falco of course....and diddy lol

Anyway yeah point made, play to win just seems worse in brawl lol but its the same everywhere

Also had to address a couple points:

1) idk if Michelle is making a chart, just copy paste my list for now I guess

2) Joe - yeah your mk is good but....its SO GAY holy crap lol DEFINATELY GAY
Gayness list: 1) Ace 2) Doc 3) JOE 4) Hype

3) Niko: friendlies reaaaaalllly don't count, I doubt any peach could go even with Joe in tournament

 

[Tin Man]

Getting a job will make you more money in less time then being pro at smash ever could

 

[nickcam]

i have some pretty good umad combos(fatal knows)

Combos? brawl? Up air up air nado is not a combo lol. On the side note of people doing whatever it takes to win ya it happens in every game but brawl is jokes to how bad it has gotten.

 

[SilverDoc~]

I feel I always tried to play an honest medium, you obviously need to exploit your characters advantages, but at the same time I would rather be known for winning for outplaying, not outgaying my opponent. Things like running away for position and strategy is outplaying, running away for 8 mins is outgaying IMO.

Joe, Nate is politely telling you to stop being an outgayer LMFAO.

Minus ftw.

 

[.decoy]

i think nate includes you too doc. politely.
<3

edit...

2) Joe - yeah your mk is good but....its SO GAY holy crap lol DEFINATELY GAY
Gayness list: 1) Ace 2) Doc 3) JOE 4) Hype

interesting observation mikey...it seems that gaynes varies directly with success in gtan's pr. furthermore, it seems you are more likely to exhibit gayness (at high levels) if you play mk. i'll will say that the sample here is small and might not be generalized to the entire population but. it is interesting nonetheless.

 

[Gichan]

Nate, update the list normally for now, Michelle will get on the list as soon as she returns home, but that won't be for a while. We are still painitng and renovating and then there is Halloween. She'll most likely be back home next week.

 

[swordgard]

Cool, now instead of people calling stuff OP or broken, now its simply gay.


Why work on your character when the other is simply gay? I wonder how meep and many others manage to beat these "gay" characters. By beating something gay, you now qualify as something gayer dont you?


Seriously, if you stopped considering how youve been gayed and actually put time in trying to beat it it would not be so much of a problem. Running for 8 minutes does not result in a change of in game mechanics, its most often simply the player who gets impatient.

 

[Anth0ny]

Good **** Joe and Iliad! And I can't believe Phil lost his spot... times are changing. Doc is too ****!

Also =( at Ambrose quitting. Hopefully he can come out sometime in the future.

Also, MKMKMKMKMKMKMKMKMKMKMKMK

 

[SilverDoc~]

Good **** Joe and Iliad! And I can't believe Phil lost his spot... times are changing. Doc is too ****!

Also =( at Ambrose quitting. Hopefully he can come out sometime in the future.

Also, MKMKMKMKMKMKMKMKMKMKMKMK

Hey Iliad, you beat Cruxis.

Sorry, had to

 

[Runawayfire]

Ok, I'm gonna just copy and paste the list, so its not going to be very glamorous. (Doing all the cool colours and **** takes forever...)

 

[Iliad]

Hey Iliad, you beat Cruxis.

Sorry, had to

Tee Hee...

10TeeHees

 

[sauc3]

yo U and C's, you're all really good, and ima let you finish, but ...

sauc3 is placin top 7 at OiN, TOP 7!

 

[Iliad]

Best post ever? Or best post ever?

I'ma beat Cruxis again for good measure, and while I'm at it, i'm gonna spank 1 to 2 other people on the PR.

This U&C **** has me cocky, watch the **** out boys n girls.

Spoiler

I'm taking my home sweet home of 13th or 17th again, I'm calling it. Fuck my curse.

 

[.decoy]

**** 13th or 17th...

step it up

 

[SilverDoc~]

Nate that font is disgusting bro, change it to blue.

Like the blue you have.

 

[Tin Man]

I wanna come to more tourneys, need a good alibi

 

[JustNoOne]

Nate that font is disgusting bro, change it to blue.

Like the blue you have.

Yo don't diss purple bro! Purple is the next pink, which is also black so purple replaces black =P

 

[Tin Man]

at the end of the day, everyone just wants to be black

 

[SilverDoc~]

..............? Tinman lets stay on topic please, all you're doing is encouraging black jokes don't you ****ing think?

-___- my god.

 

[Niko_K]

I couldnt be any more dissapointed lmfao

 

[Tin Man]

I don't there anyone here can be classified as ********, by the way the new PR was updated and the current topic is on playing gay, I simply responded to JustNoOne's post rather then argue about what is and isn't gay which is subjective. By the way do black jokes offend you?

 

[Cruxis]

Best post ever? Or best post ever?

I'ma beat Cruxis again for good measure, and while I'm at it, i'm gonna spank 1 to 2 other people on the PR.

fuck that shit, im not ever leaving a c4 on the stage again against you

also, yo i agree change the color

and add the character icons instead of just writing the names of the chars, it just looks so boring like this

 

[KC18]

awsome raidos, keep hauling a.ss man. list looks good