The "best" players

[FoxLisk]

amsah not SDing in that set and then winning it is pretty good evidence that he's better than Jman. consistency is a pretty big deal, and SDing smacks of inconsistency.

one reason to consider m2k > amsah by default since they havent played is because M2K has proven himself against a pool of players that includes most of the best players except for Amsah and Armada and a couple other top europeans. I'm not saying he is better than Amsah, just that it's not entirely stupid to put him above Amsah for that reason.

As for the 'm2k is worse than kenb ecause their record is like 9-3': consider this. Smash is a weird sport. Every tournament is an open. Thus everyone is playing against extremely high level competition. This does not happen in other sports: players or teams are matched, generally, against players or teams around their level. For example, in chess, if you are rated 1500, you'll be in the 1400-1600 section of a tournament and be playing against opponents you have a reasonable chance of beating. As M2K was rising to the top, he would have to play Ken. This gives an unfair representation of their actual relative skills. If M2K had never been paired against Ken until he was at a level close to Ken's, their record would be dramatically different.

 

[Luma]

thx rostigalen

and again bigwenz, sd'ing is a players mistake, and it is part of the game, you could also say if that gimp didnt happen or if he did this or that different it might have affected the match/set, but in the end it doesnt matter, amsah won, end of story again

 

[marthsword]

Wow, m2k dickrider right here, m2k never "beat" ken, whenever he beat ken, ken didn't care/had legit johns. None of you m2k dickriders understand that if ken came back right now he would **** hungrybox and armada (and mabye even mango)

king of smash.... forever

On the dickriding issue, I agree with you. But consider this: is it fair to single out one person as an M2K d-rider? M2K got 20 pages of "mad props" when all of us believed he was match rigging. He's Brawl's Mango.

/not making sense too tired.

Subtopic: Best Falco. Name runner-ups if needd.

 

[Iron Dragon]

On the dickriding issue, I agree with you. But consider this: is it fair to single out one person as an M2K d-rider? M2K got 20 pages of "mad props" when all of us believed he was match rigging. He's Brawl's Mango.

/not making sense too tired.

Subtopic: Best Falco. Name runner-ups if needd.

Best Falco?

That's easy.

Dr. Peepee

 

[Jimbo Slice]

Falco!!!!!!!

Mr. Try Hard
Stack it up
DIE!!!
Happy Feet
Lazer Sensei

I know there are great European players but I'm an ignorant American.

 

[ruhtraeel]

Best Falco?

That's easy.

Dr. Peepee

Lol. I'm sure you mean not including... erm. You get the drift.

 

[Iron Dragon]

Falco!!!!!!!

Mr. Try Hard
Stack it up
DIE!!!
Happy Feet
Lazer Sensei

I know there are great European players but I'm an ignorant American.

Oh you're counting Mango? well...

Mango hasn't played Falco in tournament in awhile...otherwise I'd say Mango yeah.

Then PP for sure though

 

[Jimbo Slice]

That's why I listed Mango as mr. try hard i.e. when he's actually playing falco and cares

The amount of ridiculous in this thread makes me long for SS vs Darkrain debates. Even though that was also a dumb argument it was at least fun.

 

[BigWenz]

thx rostigalen

and again bigwenz, sd'ing is a players mistake, and it is part of the game, you could also say if that gimp didnt happen or if he did this or that different it might have affected the match/set, but in the end it doesnt matter, amsah won, end of story again

its just one set though and since they were close i wouldn give the edge to either one at this point. like zhu and amsah to my knowledge only played one set but amsah whupped up on zhu (particularly the first match it was a solid 3 stock) so i would say amsah is better hands down. when the matches are close and a player SD's yes its a players mistake but that doesnt change the fact that if it didn happen the outcome could be different.


whether or not someone SD's has a huge effect on the match so it does matter. im not takin anythin away from amsahs victory. its melee anything can happen including SDing. However since its such a rare occurence for someone of jmans caliber to SD like that i dont think that u can definitively say amsahs better than jman off that one set since it was so close. if jman was known to SD often in tourny then yea amsah is better cause he doesnt do that. but that is clearly not the case.


also SDing is different then gimping and all the other things that can change an outcome of a match. this is cause when u SD A) ur opponent had nothing to do with ur death. B) it wasnt something u choose to do. gimps or all that other stuff is irrelevant when talking about how a match could have turned out differently since gimping is just another way a player can take another players stock and a players choices define how good a player he or she is.

 

[ruhtraeel]

I'd say,
Mango = Perfect Falco, sorta boring to watch (it's slower than other Falcos)
PP = Best judgment
Shiz = Most aggro/best tech skill
Zhu = Most flow (chains stuff together very nicely and fluidly)
Lambchops = Most sudden/unpredictable

I dunno if I'm missing anyone

 

[Archangel]

Why is this still open????

 

[BigWenz]

I'd say,
Mango = Perfect Falco, sorta boring to watch (it's slower than other Falcos)
PP = Best judgment
Shiz = Most aggro/best tech skill
Zhu = Most flow (chains stuff together very nicely and fluidly)
Lambchops = Most sudden/unpredictable

I dunno if I'm missing anyone

i really dont see how mango's falco is boring to watch. like have u seen the recent norwalk training vids? that falco is sexy and alotta fun to watch. a good falco by definition cant really be boring to watch.

and possibly throw axe in there? like at the all falco tourny didn he beat like everyone cept PP?

 

[ruhtraeel]

i really dont see how mango's falco is boring to watch. like have u seen the recent norwalk training vids? that falco is sexy and alotta fun to watch. a good falco by definition cant really be boring to watch.

and possibly throw axe in there? like at the all falco tourny didn he beat like everyone cept PP?

I just counted the Falco mains. I thought of putting him in there, but he's not a true Falco :-p

But yeah, imo Mango's Falco just does stuff that works well, and it plays how... you would expect a really good smash player to play Falco. But like, Shiz... SO FUN TO WATCH!

 

[ConnorTheKid]

Axe's falco is the ****

 

[Druggedfox]

I'd say,
Mango = Perfect Falco, sorta boring to watch (it's slower than other Falcos)
PP = Best judgment
Shiz = Most aggro/best tech skill
Zhu = Most flow (chains stuff together very nicely and fluidly)
Lambchops = Most sudden/unpredictable

I dunno if I'm missing anyone

I'm going to be entirely honest:

Mango: Perfect falco, not boring to watch.
Mango: Best judgment
Mango: Best tech skill, as aggro as shiz
Mango: Most flow
Lambchops: Most unpredictable

*fixed*

 

[Nø Ca$h]

if you sneeze everytime somebody mentions you mango would be almost dead. hop off his hairless 3 inch ****

 

[ruhtraeel]

I'm going to be entirely honest:

Mango: Perfect falco, not boring to watch.
Mango: Best judgment
Mango: Best tech skill, as aggro as shiz
Mango: Most flow
Lambchops: Most unpredictable

*fixed*

Mango's the most fundamentally perfect. He's consistent, does consistent things, things that are guaranteed to work, etc.
I like watching people like Shiz more because he pulls out the most ridiculous stuff, and it's just a blast to watch IMO. Mango's... just too perfect. I don't have a sense of excitement cause he doesn't do the stuff Shiz or PP do.

Oh and Zhu said in his podcast that to have a solid Falco/Fox, you just need to work on your tech skill and it will bring you far. He also said that there are exceptions, such as Mango.

But yeah, why is this thread still alive? We already answered the original poster's question. I'm not reading this anymore LOL

 

[marthsword]

This should be fun.

KDJ Pichu vs. t0mmy
Shiz vs. Zhu
Tink vs. Dope vs. Vidjo vs. Drephen vs. Darkrain

 

[Druggedfox]

Um, using what someone said in a podcast as proof doesn't mean much to me... mango's tech skill is pretty ridiculous, when he actually wants it to be. He can do both the consistent side of tech skill, and the flashy side...

I don't mind someone having a different opinion, but saying mango's not technical is like saying hungrybox doesn't know how to bair, or that jman doesn't chaingrab =P

 

[Charlesz]

Mango
Hbox
Armada
Mew2king
Dr.PP

Done deal.

 

[FoxLisk]

yeah... what? mango has the best tech skill in the world hands down.

 

[t3h Icy]

Matches I want to see happen:

Amsah vs Mew2King
Amsah vs Dr. PeePee
Mew2King vs Dr. PeePee
Calle W vs Shiz
Jman vs Zhu
Jman vs Lucky
Mew2King vs Hax
Darc vs Mango
Amsah vs Axe
Axe vs Drephen
Darc vs Armada

 

[Dr Peepee]

I want those to happen too.

 

[Druggedfox]

Mango's falco/fox vs Amsah would be pretty tight.

Amsah vs anyone would be pretty tight... we need amsah over here >_>

 

[Iron Dragon]

Matches I want to see happen:

Amsah vs Mew2King
Amsah vs Dr. PeePee
Mew2King vs Dr. PeePee
Calle W vs Shiz
Jman vs Zhu
Jman vs Lucky
Mew2King vs Hax
Darc vs Mango
Amsah vs Axe
Axe vs Drephen
Darc vs Armada

Agree with a good amount of these.

Jman vs Zhu has already happened once though and Zhu won. Though it'd definitely be good to see again.

Don't agree with the Axe ones though. Also don't agree with M2K vs Hax but *shrug*

 

[t3h Icy]

A few would be more about who would win than super entertaining matches, like Tope vs Drephen at Pound 4.

 

[metalreflectslime]

Matches I want to see happen:
Mew2King vs Dr. PeePee

Already happened.

 

[Druggedfox]

Maybe he means nowadays?

 

[choknater]

you know what? i want to see all these people play SHROOMED.

 

[metalreflectslime]

I want to see DaJuan at an international Melee tournament too along with Lucien.

 

[t3h Icy]

Already happened.

Dr. PeePee has improved a lot since then, while M2K hasn't changed much.

 

[PoundSlap]

wasnt it tipped off 5 where pp took a game off m2k? that was a while ago and i think pp got much better. he even did well against armada. m2k should suggest to split pots if they meet in bracket and just play it out.

 

[Merkuri]

^^ I doubt it. DRPP loses to players like Axe, Lucky and Jman; and although they are all great players they are not M2k level. I'm confident M2k would beat DRPP comfortably enough the next time they play.

 

[Rubyiris]

inb4 pp beats all the players you mentioned at rom/genesis 2 :3

axe got dis tho.

 

[Plairnkk]

inb4 pp beats all the players you mentioned at pound :3

axe got dis tho.

fixed

10char

 

[Druggedfox]

^^ I doubt it. DRPP loses to players like Axe, Lucky and Jman; and although they are all great players they are not M2k level. I'm confident M2k would beat DRPP comfortably enough the next time they play.

Saying Dr PP "loses" (present tense) to people like axe and lucky isn't necessarily accurate... we haven't really seen it happen since pound, where lucky got coached and PP still sucked at falco dittos =P

That said, m2k would still probably win... I heard he's pretty good at fighting falco

 

[Dr Peepee]

I beat lucky in a MM at apex too. 3-1.

I have gotten better.

 

[marthsword]

Jman and Mathos should form "Team Gay Campers".

 

[Iron Dragon]

PP struggles with Marth a bit is the issue I think when considering him against M2K.

Guy has gotten ridiculous though. I don't even know how he does it.

 

[Divinokage]

I beat lucky in a MM at apex too. 3-1.

I have gotten better.

True but at the same time when 2 top players fight each other.. the amount of mix-ups that is involved is pretty insane, so anything can happen.. it's very hard to control the match.