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Thank You Plank For Pound 4

P. O. F.

Smash Ace
Joined
May 5, 2009
Messages
820
Location
2008 Melee Player
I could have made a post in the results thread to thank plank but I'd rather do it this way to be sure he sees my thoughts on the event. (Thanks for writing down the directions to the bus stop and getting me home man!) (You too Ebo, try not to get pulled over and wear your seatbelt son)

Pound 4 was the biggest Melee tournament of all time. With that came players from all over the world to come and compete and showcase their skills to everyone who still plays this game. HDL from Puerto Rico showed us that Link can compete at high levels and Skler is not the only one, Armada once again came through under extreme pressure to place very nicely, West Coasts Silent Spectre took Armada out of Winners singles, and so much more. This tournament had so much hype and Plank followed through and delivered an amazing event. With the new stage ruleset, proper date selection, pre registration, transportation for ooc and oosers, organization through cars to drop off and pick up smashers to the airport, getting everyone housed, good seeding and brackets for all events, proper selection for projector screen matches and livestream, strict organization and rules to keep schedule going, and all of this done with little to no problems made this worthy of possibly being the greatest tournament Melee has or ever will see.

This event wasn't a simple "Oh, look! Theres Armada guys. Wouldnt it be cool to play him?" It was more like, "Oh, theres Axe, Taj, Dark Rain, SS, Hax, Jman, M2K, HuGs, Ka-Master, Armada, Vidjo, Silent Wolf, Chu Dat, and every other good player to ever play Melee. I should go play some of them!" I was really happy to finally get a chance to play all these guys. I missed out on playing HugS and Dark Rain but made sure I played everyone else at least in a set. IMO, not playing any of these guys is pretty epic fail. lol.

I've taken a look at the (semi) results thread and as always I see players who did not go to the tournament finding SOMETHING about the event that was "unfair" or was "stupid" or was not seeded properly. Stop making the Melee scene look bad by complaining about dumb things. Half of you should try doing what Plank had to do. Just think about that for one second. :) I'm sick of going into results threads and hearing whiners and people who did not attend complain. LOL, are you kidding me? Why do you care? This crap just reminds me of Brawl kids complaining. ew.

There were also a couple of things that I noticed at this that really bothered me and actually got me thinking. In the grand finals a few people taunted Hbox and literally stated things along the lines of "when are you losing? Just give up." Are you kidding me? Are you for real? Once again, this is ******** and completely uncalled for. I can understand trash talk and having fun to build up hype for your region but to go out of your way to be rude to someone in a match bluntly is beyond ridiculous. I also noticed some high end players (not exactly top level) pre deciding the outcome of their next pool before they even played their matches. I know I show this all the time and always post it but can we please all watch this for the love of god:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K9khDedACgY

I know gimpyfish is retired or whatever but god, do I love that segment. Is it corny and cliche? Yes. But its soooooooo true. I could literally give you guys 3-4 PERSONAL examples of this right now. 2 of which happened at pound 4. lol.

I must have heard "I'm playing ____, that's a loss." a good ten times at this tournament. I hate when people give up and not trying to their full ability and believing they can win. Did any of you know that SPAWN from CT beat Lucky in tournament? I bet some of you do not even know who SPAWN is. He won because he believed he could do it. (Good **** SPAWN)

Honestly if you think about it for a second, have you ever talked to a high level player about their upcoming matches or how they think they'll do or how they talk about players? Think about Kage, Hax, PC Chris, MaNg0, Swiftbass, Ka Master, Silent Spectre, and Darc. They all are very confident, respect their opponents abilities, and are aware and accept the fact that they may indeed not come out on top all the time.

I have learned so much about competitive Melee at this tournament. Not so much about the game itself but what it takes to be relaxed in an important match whether it is tourney or MM, how you need to be mentally and physically while playing, never doubt or question your opponents abilities, and to never get frustrated because you will play worse.

I hope that everyone who attended this learned a great deal about smash, what it means to be part of a community, and enjoyed this weekend as much as I did.


Thanks again Plank for everything you've done!

Carry on,

P. O. F.
 

Mew2King

King of the Mews
Joined
Jul 18, 2002
Messages
11,263
Location
Cinnaminson (southwest NJ 5 min drive from Philly)
My teammate Jman was 10 minutes late for a winners finals team match because his car wouldn't start from the venue so he got there a bit late, and Plank DISQUALIFIED US FROM THE WHOLE TOURNAMENT. Both winners bracket AND losers. His logic was that it was unfair to the people in loser's bracket that they have to play Mew2King and Jman so he DQed us from the whole tournament.

Warrior Knight, who CAME with Jman, was allowed to enter with his teammate.

And on top of THAT, Doll wanted to forfeit his teams match to us anyway so we could go on and win the tourney, and Plank wouldn't let them do that.

It's ****ing bull**** and unacceptable. Me and PC arrived late for Pound2 so we were put in losers bracket but we still came back and won. Everyone I asked and told the whole story/situation to agreed with us as well that it's extremely unfair. Being DQed from winners AND losers?? NOT ALLOWING OPPOSING TEAM TO FORFEIT WHEN THEY SAID THEY WOULD. ALLOWING Warrior Knight to enter but not me and Jman. It's COMPLETELY UNFAIR. I practiced Sheik a lot for that tourney and teams with Jman only to get DQed because Jman arrived late and Plank was an *******. 700 dollars down the drain for no reason at all.
 

DarkISDA

Smash Lord
Joined
Oct 4, 2006
Messages
1,027
Location
St-Anne-Des-Plaines, Qc
...What? That's so stupid! It's unfair for the person in the losers that they'd have to play you? What the **** is that stupid logic? If you would have lost in some way in the winner brackets at that point, you'd still have to play them. Wow.... stupid... sorry for you.
 

Anth0ny

Smash Master
Joined
Oct 14, 2007
Messages
4,061
Location
Toronto, Ontario
My teammate Jman was 10 minutes late for a winners finals team match because his car wouldn't start from the venue so he got there a bit late, and Plank DISQUALIFIED US FROM THE WHOLE TOURNAMENT. Both winners bracket AND losers. His logic was that it was unfair to the people in loser's bracket that they have to play Mew2King and Jman so he DQed us from the whole tournament.

Warrior Knight, who CAME with Jman, was allowed to enter with his teammate.

And on top of THAT, Doll wanted to forfeit his teams match to us anyway so we could go on and win the tourney, and Plank wouldn't let them do that.

It's ****ing bull**** and unacceptable. Me and PC arrived late for Pound2 so we were put in losers bracket but we still came back and won. Everyone I asked and told the whole story/situation to agreed with us as well that it's extremely unfair. Being DQed from winners AND losers?? NOT ALLOWING OPPOSING TEAM TO FORFEIT WHEN THEY SAID THEY WOULD. ALLOWING Warrior Knight to enter but not me and Jman. It's COMPLETELY UNFAIR. I practiced Sheik a lot for that tourney and teams with Jman only to get DQed because Jman arrived late and Plank was an *******. 700 dollars down the drain for no reason at all.
If that's the truth, that is pretty BS. No way around it.

Besides that, the tourney was awesome. Good **** Plank!
 

Kite91

Mada Mada Dane
Joined
Mar 19, 2007
Messages
1,071
Location
East Stroudsburg, Pa
My teammate Jman was 10 minutes late for a winners finals team match because his car wouldn't start from the venue so he got there a bit late, and Plank DISQUALIFIED US FROM THE WHOLE TOURNAMENT. Both winners bracket AND losers. His logic was that it was unfair to the people in loser's bracket that they have to play Mew2King and Jman so he DQed us from the whole tournament.

Warrior Knight, who CAME with Jman, was allowed to enter with his teammate.

And on top of THAT, Doll wanted to forfeit his teams match to us anyway so we could go on and win the tourney, and Plank wouldn't let them do that.

It's ****ing bull**** and unacceptable. Me and PC arrived late for Pound2 so we were put in losers bracket but we still came back and won. Everyone I asked and told the whole story/situation to agreed with us as well that it's extremely unfair. Being DQed from winners AND losers?? NOT ALLOWING OPPOSING TEAM TO FORFEIT WHEN THEY SAID THEY WOULD. ALLOWING Warrior Knight to enter but not me and Jman. It's COMPLETELY UNFAIR. I practiced Sheik a lot for that tourney and teams with Jman only to get DQed because Jman arrived late and Plank was an *******. 700 dollars down the drain for no reason at all.

That was pretty BS, if anything you guys should of only been sent to Losers. Jman got his revenge though in singles lol ****. Wish you guys didn't get dq prob the only team able to beat Mango/Lucky. Ether way Good **** M2K, good luck if you go to Apex, return the title of top smasher to East Coast
 

rathy Aro

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 16, 2008
Messages
1,142
Lol@how biased and untrue M2K's post was. I'll make a more detailed response when i have time but a few things that aren't true.

Doll never asked me to forfeit the match to M2K. That is a total lie, and I would've allowed that to happen as long as Jman was there by the time the next set came up in brackets. Doll only told me that Jman wasn't here, which is why i was alerted to the situation. When a player tells me their opponent isn't there after the match is called, I give 10 minutes then a DQ. That's simply my policy, I dq'd tons of people from both teams and singles to make sure things happened on time (and they did).

As far as warriorknight he got to stay in bracket 100% only because his opponents never came and told me that he was not there. His part of the bracket was help up and inconvenienced the tournament, and had I have had ANY idea I would have obviously DQ'd them as well. The problem is I can only enforce what I know. Whatever team Warriorknight's team was fighting never said a word to me. I wish they would have, the tournament would've went a bit faster.



One more thing I have to address is the conduct of ADHD. I stayed quiet in the tournament because I didn't want any real drama going on there, but here is what ADHD said to me when I told him that the prizes were going to be paid in checks. Note I hadn't exchanged a word with ADHD the entire tournament yet.

"Plank you better pay me or I am going to come to your house shoot your girlfriend and hang her from the ceiling" I handled the situation professionally and didn't make a big deal of it, but that was really disturbing, uncalled for, and a huge ***** move ADHD. I have to go pick more people up from the airport, more on the dramas later.
always two sides
 

The Newb

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 28, 2004
Messages
713
Location
Mechanicsville, VA
Unbiased: You guys should reserve judgment until Plank has a chance to defend himself.

Biased: He's actually out HIMSELF driving people to the airport(s) because nobody else can be bothered. He also actually bought hotel rooms for the Europeans who arrived early. What did you do? You sat around and complained and *****ed about how unfair the world is.

You're right though, M2K; Plank is the *******.
 

Eddie G

Smash Hero
Joined
Nov 24, 2006
Messages
9,123
Location
Cleveland, OH
NNID
neohmarth216
^ This guy speaks truth. Most of you I saw at the venue didn't say **** in person. Why start drama now?

Plank is a cool dude who did a lot for a number of people. Don't sit here and ***** about getting DQed for not following the rules no matter what the circumstances may have been. Me and Dark.Pch were disqualified from Brawl teams because we couldn't hear the announcement for teams over the Silent Spectre vs Armada hype, but we were simply too late and I just went with it and got my refund for doubles. I didn't whine, I didn't *****, it was unfortunate that it happened, but they had a tourney to run and I understood that. You're not special, non of the top players are special, so stop expecting treatment that no other smasher should receive. That goes for all of you.

And ADHD...not cool man.
 

Crimson)S(hadow

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jun 26, 2007
Messages
81
Location
salinas,ca
m2k i completely agree, total bull**** by plank. also they were talkin on livestream how it was bull**** going on with the brackets how plank got as far as he did. people should stfu about m2k being punctual because people who came just as late were still allowed to play, which CAN ONLY POINT TO plank having something against m2k and jman. even read some of the pre-pound 4 threads it hints tourny host's disrespect towards m2k.

this is FAR from a professionally run tournament; it is something done for smashers by smashers. which makes it so ******** to be a **** about the rules... ESPECIALLY since it was one of the finals for one of the events. pretty sure ANY other tourney host would have waited even for a half hour or more, i mean i remember hearing on livestream how time was definately not an issue. i remember at west coast's cgc one time we waited hours and hours for mango to come, so why can't east coast do the same for their heroes?
 

Eggm

Smash Hero
Joined
Aug 29, 2006
Messages
5,178
Location
Neptune, NJ
You guys siding with m2k have no idea how hard it is to run a tournament. I only run small locals and its really hard to get people to pay attention to you and stop playing friendlies and get people to show up on time and stuff. I cannot even begin to imagine how much work/effort/skill involved in trying to run a tournament of this size takes. The fact that he got everyone to stop playing friendlies at the same time with that countdown and actually got **** running on time is nothing short of a miracle. That threat doesn't work unless you do "super ****" moves so I'm glad he did it. Do you know how long it would take to run the tournament if he couldn't get everyone to stop playing friendlies come up to the mic to start pools/brackets? It would never have finished on time. And no one would take his DQ's serious unless he was super serious. So that's that.

Oh yeah I forgot why I was posting in this thread to begin with. I also want to thank you plank for the best tournament I've ever attended. Your hard work was obvious throughout and it paid off for all of our benefits without you getting much from it. Nothing but respect.
 

P. O. F.

Smash Ace
Joined
May 5, 2009
Messages
820
Location
2008 Melee Player
Yeah, no offense M2K but pound 4 > attendance than both pound 3 and 2. I understand your point and why its unfair but like Eggm said, if he did not be strict about everything no one would take him seriously and things would not have started and ended on time. Honestly, think about it for a sec: You and Jman are obviously probably not going to get into the losers bracket at all (if so, really late in tourney) and you guys would DESTROY the losers bracket really fast. I'm sorry you lost your $ or whatever but your situation does not make up for all the other 40+ teams that entered and have to suffer because SOMEONE ELSE arrived late. Thats unfair to them more so than it is to you. If you've got an issue or something to discuss with Plank contact him in a PM and don't create another PB N J drama scene. Getting random smashers to side with you does not help your cause.

P. S. - Although you did not beat Hbox or Armada I thought you played extremely well and it was really nice to see you play Marth again. :) I saw you training prior to your match w armada and asked you to play. When you told me, "Sorry, i've really got to practice this match up." I was pumped. Don't be so hard on yourself man. Maybe you didn't win but I can tell you at least tried your best.
 

KageMurphy

Smash Master
Joined
Dec 3, 2005
Messages
3,965
Location
Swoosh
I'm with M2K simply because its not anyone's fault their car was having trouble, plus we were cheated out of seeing some really REALLY good teams sets if they were allowed in, oh well.

Everything else was pretty awesome though.
 

omegawhitemage

BRoomer
BRoomer
Joined
Apr 23, 2005
Messages
2,617
LOL I love listening to Jason complain about how he thinks he deserves special treatment anytime something like this happens. News flash M2K, just because you're "the best" doesn't mean you get special treatment.

Good job overall Plank.
 

Keblerelf

Smash Ace
Joined
Feb 3, 2008
Messages
770
Location
Ogallala Aquifer
Pound 4 was fun. I couldn't have thought of a better way to start off 2010. My only complaint is how round 3 pool were made because there were a couple with several regional players in it (ex. hugs, falcomist and ss in one pool)

but nevertheless, it was amazing.
 

Eddie G

Smash Hero
Joined
Nov 24, 2006
Messages
9,123
Location
Cleveland, OH
NNID
neohmarth216
m2k i completely agree, total bull**** by plank. also they were talkin on livestream how it was bull**** going on with the brackets how plank got as far as he did. people should stfu about m2k being punctual because people who came just as late were still allowed to play, which CAN ONLY POINT TO plank having something against m2k and jman. even read some of the pre-pound 4 threads it hints tourny host's disrespect towards m2k.

this is FAR from a professionally run tournament; it is something done for smashers by smashers. which makes it so ******** to be a **** about the rules... ESPECIALLY since it was one of the finals for one of the events. pretty sure ANY other tourney host would have waited even for a half hour or more, i mean i remember hearing on livestream how time was definately not an issue. i remember at west coast's cgc one time we waited hours and hours for mango to come, so why can't east coast do the same for their heroes?
Shut the **** up. Did you even attend the tournament to even spew any of this bull****? Plank did a fantastic job.
 

Kite91

Mada Mada Dane
Joined
Mar 19, 2007
Messages
1,071
Location
East Stroudsburg, Pa
Overall im not picking sides im just saying that it was bs for being totally DQd and not sent to Losers, overall it was a great tourney besides the grand finals which suck major ***...just saying
 

trahhSTEEZY

Smash Champion
Joined
Jul 24, 2007
Messages
2,287
Location
vegas baby
this seems extremely ****ed up
Of course it does, it's coming from the person who got DQ'd, you expected something a little less biased?

Read Plank's quote a little up. Makes a bit more sense.


Though I do understand Plank's reasoning for the most part, I just don't see why they couldn't have been sent to Loser's. And if the reasoning is because

and you guys would DESTROY the losers bracket really fast.
Well, that's kinda lame, so because they're **** they're even MORE out-prioritized? Does that mean an even worse team would've been okay cause they wouldn't have ***** as much in the brackets..?

IDK, I just think they should've been sent into a lower-bracket or something. anything but make them waste probably more than half their trip considering they had a really good chance at winning.
 

mers

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 25, 2008
Messages
997
Location
Oberlin College, Oberlin, OH
I really don't understand how this is an issue. Jman WAS late. He DID break the rules. Sure, the punishment feels harsh, but it was established beforehand, Plank was following the rules he set earlier. There's not really any grey area here. If they had been on time, they could have played, but they weren't. It's that simple.

If it had been a team with less famous players, everyone would side with Plank. Being late = DQed. That's how it works. It's only because M2K and Jman, two huge names, were DQed that there is even controversy. Pros don't get special treatment.

And the whole WarriorKnight thing, Plank already said he would have DQed him too if he had even known that happened.

That said, <3 M2K and Jman. You two are seriously my favorite smashers to watch. Wish I could have seen you win teams.
 

tekkie

Smash Master
Joined
Sep 28, 2008
Messages
3,136
Location
Shpongle Falls
i'm interested in Plank's point of view.

i'm sure we'll hear about it sometime this week. surely for now he's in a sleep coma until like thursday
 

SDC

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 10, 2009
Messages
1,035
Location
There was a state here, it's gone now...
For all of you wondering why Plank DQed M2K and Jman, but not Warriorknight, here is your answer, please read ALL of this post, the part that tells why is in bold:

Lol@how biased and untrue M2K's post was. I'll make a more detailed response when i have time but a few things that aren't true.

Doll never asked me to forfeit the match to M2K. That is a total lie, and I would've allowed that to happen as long as Jman was there by the time the next set came up in brackets. Doll only told me that Jman wasn't here, which is why i was alerted to the situation. When a player tells me their opponent isn't there after the match is called, I give 10 minutes then a DQ. That's simply my policy, I dq'd tons of people from both teams and singles to make sure things happened on time (and they did).

As far as warriorknight he got to stay in bracket 100% only because his opponents never came and told me that he was not there. His part of the bracket was help up and inconvenienced the tournament, and had I have had ANY idea I would have obviously DQ'd them as well. The problem is I can only enforce what I know. Whatever team Warriorknight's team was fighting never said a word to me. I wish they would have, the tournament would've went a bit faster.



One more thing I have to address is the conduct of ADHD. I stayed quiet in the tournament because I didn't want any real drama going on there, but here is what ADHD said to me when I told him that the prizes were going to be paid in checks. Note I hadn't exchanged a word with ADHD the entire tournament yet.

"Plank you better pay me or I am going to come to your house shoot your girlfriend and hang her from the ceiling" I handled the situation professionally and didn't make a big deal of it, but that was really disturbing, uncalled for, and a huge ***** move ADHD. I have to go pick more people up from the airport, more on the dramas later.
 

rathy Aro

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 16, 2008
Messages
1,142
Did everyone just skip over my post? >.> I'll try this again:

Lol@how biased and untrue M2K's post was. I'll make a more detailed response when i have time but a few things that aren't true.

Doll never asked me to forfeit the match to M2K. That is a total lie, and I would've allowed that to happen as long as Jman was there by the time the next set came up in brackets. Doll only told me that Jman wasn't here, which is why i was alerted to the situation. When a player tells me their opponent isn't there after the match is called, I give 10 minutes then a DQ. That's simply my policy, I dq'd tons of people from both teams and singles to make sure things happened on time (and they did).

As far as warriorknight he got to stay in bracket 100% only because his opponents never came and told me that he was not there. His part of the bracket was help up and inconvenienced the tournament, and had I have had ANY idea I would have obviously DQ'd them as well. The problem is I can only enforce what I know. Whatever team Warriorknight's team was fighting never said a word to me. I wish they would have, the tournament would've went a bit faster.



One more thing I have to address is the conduct of ADHD. I stayed quiet in the tournament because I didn't want any real drama going on there, but here is what ADHD said to me when I told him that the prizes were going to be paid in checks. Note I hadn't exchanged a word with ADHD the entire tournament yet.

"Plank you better pay me or I am going to come to your house shoot your girlfriend and hang her from the ceiling" I handled the situation professionally and didn't make a big deal of it, but that was really disturbing, uncalled for, and a huge ***** move ADHD. I have to go pick more people up from the airport, more on the dramas later.
READ ABOVE!
 

SwiftBass

Smash Hero
Joined
Apr 25, 2006
Messages
5,804
Location
Thunder Whales Picnic
To people questioning plank..once again, SCROLL UP. it's quoted.
For all of you wondering why Plank DQed M2K and Jman, but not Warriorknight, here is your answer, please read ALL of this post, the part that tells why is in bold:
yea my bad mad cryin was going on so I skimmed. but now I know and knowing is half the battle
GI JOOOOOOOOOOE!!!!
 

ph00tbag

C(ϾᶘϿ)Ͻ
Joined
Mar 16, 2007
Messages
7,245
Location
NC
Also, Plank has at several junctures given his explanation for DQing M2K and Jman from both winners and losers. He did so because he knows from experience that doing so can heavily skew results by knocking out players in losers who otherwise would have performed well, and that's not fair to the people that the DQ'd players defeat; it's essentially an arbitrarily applied death sentence due to the better player's failure to arrive to the match on time.

I might have handled it differently, as would have many TOs. That doesn't detract from the validity of Planks methods. Personally, I have to give mad props to Plank for having the balls to stand up to M2K and Jman and their hordes of ignorant bootlickers for the duration of Pound 4 about it.
 

JCaesar

Smash Hero
Joined
May 28, 2004
Messages
9,657
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Project MD
NNID
JCaesar
So this was pretty much the greatest smash tournament ever, and I didn't even enter any of the main events. Good **** Plank, seriously. 5 stars.
 

Spife

Smash Master
Joined
Sep 15, 2007
Messages
3,016
Location
Neriak
I have yet to seen this information posted, and sorry if it has, but why the **** was there no communication? If Jman's car really wasn't starting, why didn't he contact SOME ONE at the venue? Or, why didn't some one at the venue (namely m2k or anyone who was effected by this) not contact Jman?

If Plank had known that both Jman and Warriorknight were going to be late BECAUSE OF CAR PROBLEMS, I'm sure he either would have given them both more time, or DQ'd them both so there wouldn't have been a stupid double standard. I can see where Plank is coming from, and I am in no way a knowledgeable TO, but it's hard, ethically that is, to look the other way when he DQ's 1 of 2 people who were the same amount of time late. I don't really care that he didn't know that Warrior Knight was just as late either.

Guh, people need to communicate better.
 

The Newb

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 28, 2004
Messages
713
Location
Mechanicsville, VA
Also, Plank has at several junctures given his explanation for DQing M2K and Jman from both winners and losers. He did so because he knows from experience that doing so can heavily skew results by knocking out players in losers who otherwise would have performed well, and that's not fair to the people that the DQ'd players defeat; it's essentially an arbitrarily applied death sentence due to the better player's failure to arrive to the match on time.

I might have handled it differently, as would have many TOs. That doesn't detract from the validity of Planks methods. Personally, I have to give mad props to Plank for having the balls to stand up to M2K and Jman and their hordes of ignorant bootlickers for the duration of Pound 4 about it.
QFT.

You are awesome.
 

SDC

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 10, 2009
Messages
1,035
Location
There was a state here, it's gone now...
Personally, I have to give mad props to Plank for having the balls to stand up to M2K and Jman and their hordes of ignorant bootlickers for the duration of Pound 4 about it.
Quoted for truth.

EDIT:
I have yet to seen this information posted, and sorry if it has, but why the **** was there no communication? If Jman's car really wasn't starting, why didn't he contact SOME ONE at the venue? Or, why didn't some one at the venue (namely m2k or anyone who was effected by this) not contact Jman?

If Plank had known that both Jman and Warriorknight were going to be late BECAUSE OF CAR PROBLEMS, I'm sure he either would have given them both more time, or DQ'd them both so there's not this stupid double standard. I can see where Plank is coming from, and I am in no way a knowledgeable TO, but it's hard, ethically that is, to look the other way when he DQ's 1 of 2 people who were the same amount of time late.

Guh, people need to communicate better.
Good point.
 
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