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Teams Tier List: version 1

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Mundungu

Mundungu

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There's no way SoPo is better than mario, let alone doc. His recovery is a lot worse, all of his aerials are worse, his grab combos are worse (excluding d-throw chain grabs). I guess his wavedash and maybe downsmash are better, but that's about it.

I always thought of Popo as a really nerfed mario, since they do seem kind of similar.
 
Grim Tuesday

Grim Tuesday

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At a top level, they all have horrendous recoveries. SoPo can at least recover from a very long way back, it's quite match-up dependant.

Yeah, all of his aerials are worse, I'll give you that.

You can't "exclude D-Throw chain-grabs", the amazingness of SoPo's dthrow makes up for the lack of an amazing F/B/Uthrow (his Uthrow is still quite good mind you).

His wave-dash is definitely better, and I think his down smash is as well.

I'll accept that he's nerfed, but not REALLY nerfed.
 
J

Jordaash

Smash Cadet
Joined
Apr 21, 2011
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Shiek is amazing in teams if you can actually find a good one, she can completely control the match. Also, Falco is always lame in teams. Shiek should be top of high and Falco should be under gannon. Gannon is really good in teams after all. He kills people and he doesn't die.

Take any team with falco in it and replace it with any other character in high and you have a better team. Falco is a singles character. The sooner you accept that the sooner you'll stop losing in teams. Look at the tourney results.
 
gm jack

gm jack

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Jordaash said:
Shiek is amazing in teams if you can actually find a good one, she can completely control the match. Also, Falco is always lame in teams. Shiek should be top of high and Falco should be under gannon. Gannon is really good in teams after all. He kills people and he doesn't die.

Take any team with falco in it and replace it with any other character in high and you have a better team. Falco is a singles character. The sooner you accept that the sooner you'll stop losing in teams. Look at the tourney results.
Click to expand...
Mango and lucky?
 
A

Armada

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 28, 2010
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1,366
Puff overrated coming from people that not understand teams.

Everything leads to rest if you know how to make it succésfull. She also is really good at saveing her team8s.

But they key for puff is the rest and read situations to get even more rests. This is way better than the most people think and I guess that´s cause people overall can´t read situation in teams good enough to truley understand why Puff is so good.

The only char that is a bit close to Puff is fox but I guess I don´t have to say why (cause everuone put him first/second).

After that I really wanna say falco is third.

-Lasers- Best move to help your team8 from being edgeguarded and also save the offstage.


-Shine- The best move to start team combos dosen´t matter what % they have (ok not to high but still :p) the move in generall also is one of Falcos best moves and Falco use the move a lot cause he´s appoaches is the second best in the game.

-Dair- You have the best startup for teamcoms and also have a perfect finisher for teamcombos with your dair.

He´s recovery is not that good but overall he deserve 3rd spot in a tier below Puff/Fox

Than it´s hard but I think Peach is next one.
Easy damage (d-smash still seems to work out well)
Good saves (her turnips is underrated)
Don´t die fast (okay m2k prove that with every char but still :p)

The only problem is her speed in some situations (if you read the match this becomes a smaller problem by far) and her second jump to follow up in teamcombos (even if you read perfect you are still to slow in many situations)

Then Falcon or Sheik is fifth but Im to lazy to give my opinion on this ones too :p

Edit: Kirby and Y link is way to low
 
Nedved

Nedved

Smash Apprentice
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huum, I think Sheik is way better than Falcon in team.
CF is easier to edge guard and can't help you to get back on stage. Cf's combos needs a lot of space so combos could be interrupt easier.
Sheik has needles and easy combos. Needles help recovery and break combos as well.
 
Mokumo

Mokumo

Smash Ace
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so what is the BEST team? how would we rank that?

there are like... 676 (26^2??) different team combinations. i don't think that matters as much because it seems the only characters truly worth discussing for being the best teams are fox, puff, sheik, falco, peach, and maybe falcon and ganon. in total that's 7^2 = 49 different team combinations. I hope i don't suck **** at math right now and am doing this wrong, but it seems right.

double fox is pretty ghey, fox/puff is up there too. team darkrain/silentspectre is an outlier
 
john!

john!

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it's (26^2 + 26) / 2 guys

since all teams except same character teams are counted twice in 26^2, you have to count same character teams (26 of them) twice by adding them in again, and then divide by 2
 
J

Jordaash

Smash Cadet
Joined
Apr 21, 2011
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Fudge, I can't argue with armada. Maybe Falco is ok, but I still think Sheik and Captain are better. Peach is probably better too.

John is right, it's (26^2+26)/2 which is 351 possible teams.
using just top 7 that's (7^2+7)/2 which is 28 possible good teams.

So who's going to make the first top to 28th tier list?
 
L

Lukahn

Smash Apprentice
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May 5, 2010
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148
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Dijon, France
Puff's just a gift in teams. Just gotta have a good teammate to wake her up, and then you go on frenzy. And she commes to rescue just to fine. I think she's right on this place.
 
Vinodh

Vinodh

Smash Apprentice
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Mar 4, 2008
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137
My opinion:
Jigglypuff is not top tier in singles.
Jigglypuff is top tier in teams.
 
Brookman

Brookman

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Rather than tiering the individual characters. . . shouldn't you tier the teams??

Like. . puff is great but double puff. . . . not so much
 
E

Elyssa Xey Hexen

Broken!
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john! said:
it's not permutation though, it's combination, and that doesn't account for teams of the same character

why is this still being discussed? lol
Click to expand...
Fox x fox
fox x jigg
etc.

26 times unique pairs.

Alright, now that fox has been paired with everyone...

You then move onto only jigglypuff with people and ignore fox though since his pairing and jigglypuff was done already and counted. So, you have 25 unique pairs.

Falcon gets paired with everyone minus fox and jigglypuff. So, you only have 24 pairs.

Do you see the pattern?

26 + 25 + 24 + 23 + 22 + 21 + 20 + 19 + 18 + 17 + 16 + 15 + 14 + 13 + 12 + 11 + 10 + 9 + 8 + 7 + 6 + 5 + 4 + 3 + 2 + 1 = 351 possible unique pairs

This should end all debates. Use logic, not complicated maths.
 
1048576

1048576

Smash Master
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I think Falcon is right where he is, mostly because of his fair. If you aren't 0-deathing the Falcon, he'll interrupt every combo your teammate tries to do (or finish his teammate's combos), and it'll kill ridiculously early with no edgeguarding needed.
 
P

PEEF!

Smash Hero
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LOL you think Mario is a better teams character than Ice Climbers loooooool
 
P

PEEF!

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Grim Tuesday said:
^Thankyou SOOOOOOO much Peef.

I tried to explain why ICs should be higher before and no one listened.
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The problem is that people think "OMG no 0-death grabs, these guys must suck" but the grab>smash is still so powerful, and ICs recovery is really REALLY good when you have a teammate to keep you from getting hit again and again and again. ICs live hella long, hit reallly hard, and really are one of the best support characters in teams, behind Jiggs and Peach obviously.
 
Divinokage

Divinokage

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PEEF! said:
The problem is that people think "OMG no 0-death grabs, these guys must suck" but the grab>smash is still so powerful, and ICs recovery is really REALLY good when you have a teammate to keep you from getting hit again and again and again. ICs live hella long, hit reallly hard, and really are one of the best support characters in teams, behind Jiggs and Peach obviously.
Click to expand...
Until you start fighting Ganon/Peach in teams.
 
P

PEEF!

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Divinokage said:
Until you start fighting Ganon/Peach in teams.
Click to expand...
Yeah they are really weak vs a couple teams including that one, but with the right teammate it isn't too bad. Plus several of the characters listed above ICs have much worse matchups.
 
Divinokage

Divinokage

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PEEF! said:
Yeah they are really weak vs a couple teams including that one, but with the right teammate it isn't too bad. Plus several of the characters listed above ICs have much worse matchups.
Click to expand...
If I tell you Vwins and I 6 stocked, Chu and Azen. Can you say it isn't too bad? I also remember Chu had to think for 5 mins to choose a character lol.
 
D

Deleted member

Guest
When chu was a good player, other good players would team with chu just so they wouldn't have to play against him.

...
 
B

BigD!!!

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sheik and falco are definitely better than falcon, probably peach too

falcon is ok on bigger levels, but his problem is that everybody else has fast moves and counters out of shield and defensive situations, while falcon just has to run away

running away works in singles, but in teams there are other players to run into and it opens things up for the other team to ignore you

falcos can disrupt with laser, do incredible and easy team combos, and then sit in shield when things get rough, they have a fast spot dodge and shine bair out of shield to get them out of sticky situations.

sheik can do most of the same stuff as falco, and has amazing rolls/spotdodges/nair out of shield as well, the only thing she suffers is that some of her edgeguards take a long time on anything but marth/spaceys

i dont know much about peach, but i think shes better than falcon just for having mixups that dont rely on spacing coupled with a decent spot dodge

falcon suffers in teams for the same reasons marth does; his game is based on spacing and not getting caught in shield and that doesnt work with 2 extra dudes you might run into/hit

dk should be lower, you just roll around cause if you shield you get hit anyway
 
MK26

MK26

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27 C 2 = 351

did you guys ever do those problems in hs where its like 'if everybody in a room shakes hands with everybody else, how many handshakes take place? and the answer was "[# of people] C 2"? Same thing, except theres a ditto which is the equivalent of shaking hands with yourself, so the answer is "[# of people + 1] C 2" = 27 C 2 = 351

*scurries away*
 
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