TAKE THAT! Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney smashes the prosecution!

[MissingGlitch]

Vergeben's explanation makes sense...but it is also dumb?

It does explain the insane list we got this morning. It's believable they jumped the gun after seeing that, because frankly that was a bombshell that didn't seem to make any sense.

...but we are led to believe he included brackets for some character companies but not others? I understand the ones with more limited and/or obscure options, but some of the companies here feel like they should have gotten brackets while others didn't.

I am somewhat inclined to believe him more than not, but the communication - or lack thereof- is abysmal here.

It basically just feels like we are back to before he made the list this morning.

 

[GoodGrief741]

At this point I'm physically unable to feel hopeful, mainly due to the constant back and forth, but I truly believe we have the best shot.

If come TGA the turnabout takes place, I'll be cheering like a mothertrucker.

 

[TemporalShrew]

It basically just feels like we are back to before he made the list this morning.

I haven’t kept perfect track of his statements, but I’m pretty sure that’s exactly where we’re at. Verg basically unraveled the entire speculation scene for a day, then went “oopsy daisy” and took it all back.

 

[Krankees]

It basically just feels like we are back to before he made the list this morning.

With a few more deconfirms if they're correct. This time being characters such as Reimu from Touhou, Kat from Gravity Rush, and Arle from Puyo Puyo (Sorry )

 

[Hinata]

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/78235954?jumpto=145#145

Verge confirms Capcom is still on the table, and also says his source hasn't told him Capcom's dead yet.

Which, considering Verge asked said source about Capcom earlier during the whole misunderstanding...

 

[AceAttorney9000]

Even with Vergeben backtracking from his Thanos-snap from earlier, there's still the matter of the NoA insider claiming Capcom is deconfirmed and Sabi acting weird about it... though granted, if Vergeben had heard something from his insiders about Capcom being completely deconfirmed by now, I imagine he would've included it in his backtrack post. Instead, Capcom is absent from the list...

EDIT: 'd

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/78235954?jumpto=145#145

Verge confirms Capcom is still on the table, and also says his source hasn't told him Capcom's dead yet.

Which, considering Verge asked said source about Capcom earlier during the whole misunderstanding...

View attachment 251161

So never mind what I just said. Capcom's looking pretty likely after all.

 

[MissingGlitch]

Even with Vergeben backtracking from his Thanos-snap from earlier, there's still the matter of the NoA insider claiming Capcom is deconfirmed and Sabi acting weird about it... though granted, if Vergeben had heard something from his insiders about Capcom being completely deconfirmed by now, I imagine he would've included it in his backtrack post. Instead, Capcom is absent from the list...

It's almost like Capcom is the weird variable in all of this....

 

[Arctiq]

I tried my hand at making one of those fighter cards, but with Phoenix Wright. This took way longer to make than I had anticipated:

Here is the criteria for the song list:
-Each game gets their cross-examination song, pursuit song, and objection song
-Main-line games will get 3 extra songs
-Side games will only have one extra song

Classic Mode: The Ultimate Turnabout!
Spoilers for the stage conditions and their meanings:

Spoiler

Stage 1:
Defeat Robin
-References the first case in Ace Attorney

Stage 2:
Defeat Phoenix Wright (red variant) and Little Mac (Pink Sweater variant).
Phoenix Wright enemy is giant.
Size will decrease when fighter is at 75%
-References the second case of Ace attorney

Stage 3:
Defeat Snake and Ganondorf.
Ganondorf enemy is giant.
Snake will rarely fight.
-References the fourth case of Ace Attorney

Stage 4:
Defeat Robin.
Zelda will appear once Robin is at 50%.
-References the first case of Justice for All

Stage 5:
Defeat Zero Suit Samus, Daisy, and Palutena.
Pichu will disappear once Palutena reaches 50%.
Pikachu will appear once Daisy reaches 75%.
-References the second case in Justice for All

Stage 6:
Defeat Meta Knight and Peach.
Peach turns invisible sometimes.
Pikachu appears after Peach reaches 75%
-References the last case in Trials and Tribulations

Stage 7:
Defeat Giga Bowser.
-References the struggle Phoenix has to go through with facing opponents much larger than him

Let me know what y'all think! I had a lot of fun compiling this.

Also I don't know who exactly made the Phoenix head (I grabbed it from WingedSupernova's signature). If anyone knows, can you let me know so I can properly credit them?

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Can I be added to the support list please? I think I asked before, but I'm still not on it though.

 

[RawkHawk2010]

Can I be added to the support list please? I think I asked before, but I'm still not on it though.

Likewise.

 

[AmphabulouSnake]

Damn, I feel like the real war for the next few days will be Capcom VS Bamco, or more precisely Phoenix Wright VS KOS-MOS, which hurts me because I want both characters in :'(
It's a battle between Vergeben and Sabi lol
BTW I'm continuing my playthrough of the first Ace Attorney game and it's just, AWESOME and GREAT and AMAZING already so I'm super excited :D

 

[TheYungLink]

I tried my hand at making one of those fighter cards, but with Phoenix Wright. This took way longer to make than I had anticipated:

View attachment 251173

Here is the criteria for the song list:
-Each game gets their cross-examination song, pursuit song, and objection song
-Main-line games will get 3 extra songs
-Side games will only have one extra song

Classic Mode: The Ultimate Turnabout!
Spoilers for the stage conditions and their meanings:

Spoiler

Stage 1:
Defeat Robin
-References the first case in Ace Attorney

Stage 2:
Defeat Phoenix Wright (red variant) and Little Mac (Pink Sweater variant).
Phoenix Wright enemy is giant.
Size will decrease when fighter is at 75%
-References the second case of Ace attorney

Stage 3:
Defeat Snake and Ganondorf.
Ganondorf enemy is giant.
Snake will rarely fight.
-References the fourth case of Ace Attorney

Stage 4:
Defeat Robin.
Zelda will appear once Robin is at 50%.
-References the first case of Justice for All

Stage 5:
Defeat Zero Suit Samus, Daisy, and Palutena.
Pichu will disappear once Palutena reaches 50%.
Pikachu will appear once Daisy reaches 75%.
-References the second case in Justice for All

Stage 6:
Defeat Meta Knight and Peach.
Peach turns invisible sometimes.
Pikachu appears after Peach reaches 75%
-References the last case in Trials and Tribulations

Stage 7:
Defeat Giga Bowser.
-References the struggle Phoenix has to go through with facing opponents much larger than him

Let me know what y'all think! I had a lot of fun compiling this.

Also I don't know who exactly made the Phoenix head (I grabbed it from WingedSupernova's signature). If anyone knows, can you let me know so I can properly credit them?

Your song list is complete and utter garbage because there aren't any Investigations 2 tracks /s

In all seriousness the Classic Mode, Spirits, stage, and choice of costumes for Phoenix are 100% on the mark. I was memeing on the song list but I appreciate the Ghost Trick music.

 

[BlackInk]

Damn, I feel like the real war for the next few days will be Capcom VS Bamco, or more precisely Phoenix Wright VS KOS-MOS, which hurts me because I want both characters in :'(
It's a battle between Vergeben and Sabi lol
BTW I'm continuing my playthrough of the first Ace Attorney game and it's just, AWESOME and GREAT and AMAZING already so I'm super excited :D

Namco easily wins. They deserve a rep for making ultimate possible in the first place when it seems impossible. These dlc fighters were considered the final fighters when they made their decisions in November 2018.

 

[Flyboy]

This is crazy. This is the best it's looked for our boy. It's turnabout after turnabout. That said, I'm not going to get my hopes up too much. Still wild. What a ride!

 

[KirbyMonadoBoy]

I've also thought about the the possibility having a Hero-like situation with 4 different characters. Imo the 4 most important charactere are:

Phoenix, Apollo, Athena & Miles Edgeworth

This would be a dream come true if they were all playable. In case they come as a single character, each of them comes with one alternative outfit.

In case they will have a moveset in pairs similar to Marvel Vs Capcom, Athena unfortunately is the one character who doesn't have a suitable partner: Juniper is too unrecognisable and only appeared in one game and Simon is too different figurewise compared to Maya.

But after some thinking I found the best solution, Athena works better as a partnercharcter - this also fits better due to her being female and the developers not having to worry about her animations too much – we will get the following 3 playable characterduos:

- Phoenix + Maya (3 different outfits, including a pink sweater Phoenix alt and a Hobo Phoenix alt -> if we are very lucky, then we get either Ema or Trucy instead of Maya as a partner in the Hobo Alt, since Maya didn't appear in AA4 and it would be freaking awesome to also have Ema or Trucy playable in one of the alts)

- Apollo + Athena (2 different outfits, in the alternative outfit they appear in their respective school uniforms)

- Miles + Kay (2 different outfits, young Miles & Kay and mature Miles & Kay)

What do you think about this? Imo it would be a great way to have many fan favourites of the AA-series playable) and this would make me very, very happy.

 

[Dukemon102]

Ok. I just woke up... let's see the news...

At this point I feel we are just playing a shared online trial. The constant turnabouts are taking all of my breath.

Is this the first time Vergeben has backtracked? What kind of leaker backtracks?
At least he denied his own claim himself. And not Sabi. Which saved us from a community civil war.

The Turnabout Terror is back again baby.
It's impossible to bring him down.

I've also thought about the the possibility having a Hero-like situation with 4 different characters. Imo the 4 most important charactere are:

Phoenix, Apollo, Athena & Miles Edgeworth

This would be a dream come true if they were all playable. In case they come as a single character, each of them comes with one alternative outfit each.

In case they will have a moveset in pairs similar to Marvel Vs Capcom, Athena unfortunately is the one character who doesn't have a suitable partner: Juniper is too unrecognisable and only appeared in one game and Simon is too different figurewise compared to Maya.

But after some thinking I found the best solution, Athena works better as a partnercharcter - this also fits better due to her being female and the developers not having to worry about her animations too much – we will get the following 3 playable characterduos:

- Phoenix + Maya (3 different outfits, including a pink sweater Phoenix alt and a Hobo Phoenix alt -> if we are very lucky, then we get either Ema or Trucy instead of Maya as a partner in the Hobo Alt, since Maya didn't appear in AA4 and it would be freaking awesome to also have Ema or Trucy playable in one of the alts)

- Apollo + Athena (2 different outfits, in the alternative outfit they appear in their respective school uniforms)

- Miles + Kay (2 different outfits, young Miles & Kay and mature Miles & Kay)

How would you like that? I would be beyond happy, I want them all!!!

The problem I see with this is that unlike the silent DQ heroes. Every AA character has his own personality and therefore, animations.
Also there is the magical gimmick everyone except Edgeworth has. If that is included. You have to switch it around. They are situable for Dark Samus level echoes tho.
But Edgeworth should be his own character (Flying chess pieces as projectiles FTW).

 

[Sabrewulf238]

Boys...

We're back.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/78235954

Woopsie.

You know, say what you will about Vergeben, but at least in terms of Smash Bros this feels like the first real mistake on his part. Before this I've always thought/begrudgingly accepted that he was very reliable.

Though I suppose in fairness I still believe he has a legitimate source.

 

[Lyncario]

Vergeben not diconfirming Capcom anymore is great news for Phoenix, this time of speculation really is an AA trial.

 

[KirbyMonadoBoy]

The problem I see with this is that unlike the silent DQ heroes. Every AA character has his own personality and therefore, animations.
Also there is the magical gimmick everyone except Edgeworth has. If that is included.

I think the animations of all characters could be adjusted to unified animations in the world of Smash Bros. without looking too weird, they don't have to use the exact animations from the games. And regarding the taunts they still could have different taunts, I don't think this is an obstacle. Regarding the magical gimmicks - Edgeworth used the Magatama in Trials & Tribulations, so it has some canonical basis.

 

[Calamitas]

. . .Oh wait, I just thought of the perfect analogy to make on the Vergeben situation for this thread.

It looks like Vergeben. . . just updated the autopsy report.

 

[Dukemon102]

I think the animations of all characters could be adjusted to unified animations in the world of Smash Bros. without looking too weird, they don't have to use the exact animations from the games. And regarding the taunts they still could have different taunts, I don't think this is an obstacle. Regarding the magical gimmicks - Edgeworth used the Magatama in Trials & Tribulations, so it has some canonical basis.

But by doing this I think we are squashing the potential uniqueness and sillyness of Phoenix. Because Edgeworth is there. So there can't be silly animations.
Edgeworty has used the Magatama once. But since then, he has become his own character with his own methods to get info (BASIC LOGIC AND FLYING CHESS!!).
The ideal way to bring more AA characters is making Apollo a Richter-level echo fighter and switch the Magatama move with the Bracelet.
Edgeworth should be a second rep or semi-clone. He has the potential to be way different from defence attorneys gameplay-wise.
Plus they would all get their own 8 colors (Oldbag color for Edgey pls).

 

[kirbsmash]

He's not dead yet...? Please tell me lawyer man's still in.

 

[Dukemon102]

He's not dead yet...? Please tell me lawyer man's still in.

He is alive. And stronger than ever. In fact. This is the part of the trial when the Pursuit theme is playing.

 

[fogbadge]

so after deconfiming nearly everyone, nearly everyone is back in the game? somebody is just trolling us at this point

 

[Deleted member]

He is alive. And stronger than ever. In fact. This is the part of the trial when the Pursuit theme is playing.

But because this is a fighting game, we use this remix instead:

 

[Dukemon102]

But because this is a fighting game, we use this remix instead:

SEE YOU IN COURT
SEE YOU IN COURT
CONTRADICTION
SEE YOU IN COURT
THAT'S ILLEGAL
SEE YOU IN COURT
ORDER IN THE COURT, OBJECTION OVERRULED!!
X-FACTOR
The one who actually committed the crime...is YOU! No alibi, no justice, no dream, no hope! It's time to pay for your crimes! TAKE THAT!
HYPER COMBO KO!!

Sorry.. my head automatically adds this lines with this song. 500 hours of playing Phoenix Wright does that to you.

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

It basically just feels like we are back to before he made the list this morning.

Not entirely. There were still some mew disconfirms.

 

[3BitSaurus]

SEE YOU IN COURT
SEE YOU IN COURT
CONTRADICTION
SEE YOU IN COURT
THAT'S ILLEGAL
SEE YOU IN COURT
ORDER IN THE COURT, OBJECTION OVERRULED!!
X-FACTOR
The one who actually committed the crime...is YOU! No alibi, no justice, no dream, no h--

(Connection has been lost. Returning to the Online Menu.)

Sorry.. my head automatically adds this lines with this song. 500 hours of playing Phoenix Wright does that to you.

You forgot one important factor. Fixed it for you.

 

[ThunderSageNun]

that's one hell of an oopsie, things would have been worse if fighter 5 just proved Verge wrong, but this is going to definitely take a hit on his credibility.

Damn, I feel like the real war for the next few days will be Capcom VS Bamco, or more precisely Phoenix Wright VS KOS-MOS, which hurts me because I want both characters in :'(
It's a battle between Vergeben and Sabi lol
BTW I'm continuing my playthrough of the first Ace Attorney game and it's just, AWESOME and GREAT and AMAZING already so I'm super excited :D

I mean, if we're to believe Verge, Namco is still out, so it's Capcom vs...????
I guess Verge did give the axe to a few characters still, for whatever that's worth, he still stands on every no he gave up until the Level-5/Namco post included

• Arle
• Sakura
• Crash (did he never say this one before?)
• Tracer
• Reimu
• Kat (lol)

 

[Deleted member]

Oh well, guess I'll just drop by and say that as a Darkstalker fan who has no hope of Morrigan getting AND Amaterasu looking dubious, good luck with Phoenix everyone. Might as well play cheerleader.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Boys...

We're back.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/78235954

Hurray! But man, those poor SW fans are still going to feel crushed.

Well, we definitely aren't seeing Arle any time soon, so the Daisy theory died before it could even sprout anyway.

And I was certain we wouldn't get a Bamco character yet anyway.

Also, something just hit me earlier in regards to Milk-Bosatsu/Mr H's mystery character. What if Mr. H thought Maya was the female fighting character they saw?

• Maya wears Japanese clothing
• Flying projectiles are involved in the MvC3 moveset, if I'm not mistaken
• Maya looks like a character from a fighting game

 

[Deleted member]

And I was certain we wouldn't get a Bamco character yet anyway.

I don't trust this, since Verge and Sabi have conflicting opinions. I mean, Sabi hasn't hard deconfirmed anything Capcom-related that isn't Dante.

 

[Wyoming]

so after deconfiming nearly everyone, nearly everyone is back in the game? somebody is just trolling us at this point

It's because he sent the list he had to the source, but some companies had characters in brackets.
The source told him the characters mentioned aren't in. Or something similar.

Verge thought it meant everything on the list was disconfirmed. He was told later he misunderstood. That means the only characters that are newly disconfirmed are Reimu, Sakura Shinguji, Arle Nadja, and Tracer.

It's believable enough as it explains the huge and sudden list we got that basically removed everyone imaginable.

Also I know people claim he is backpedaling, but there's no reason for him to do so. It's not like we got a leak from an intern during the day, and he fixed his error within 24 hours.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I don't trust this, since Verge and Sabi have conflicting opinions. I mean, Sabi hasn't hard deconfirmed anything Capcom-related that isn't Dante.

Well I'm not taking any chances, as the Kencineroar incident proved he can get results on a good day. Attempts to speak out against him rarely haven't ended well before the Minecraft claim, but at least his two unreliable leaker groupies aren't around anymore.

Kat (lol)

Sometimes I don't understand how people think the "Nintendo appearance of any sort" criteria stopped mattering when that has yet to happen, really.

With a few more deconfirms if they're correct. This time being characters such as Reimu from Touhou, Kat from Gravity Rush, and Arle from Puyo Puyo (Sorry )

It's all good man, patience is a virtue. You won't see me jump to conclusions again like I did before CTR's Nitro Tour was revealed.

 

[ThunderSageNun]

I haven't really checked to see if they said anything else, but I'll say sabis statement from last night is...eh. I understand wanting to set yourself apart from Verge as who knows if they work with the same source, but this is also the same person that's been giving comments on whether they back up or no his claims pretty constantly lately, and also implied that they take the information from them by twitter/discord or something. It sounds more like petty internet drama than anything that worthwhile for our guessing game.
I'll still hold out in case Capcom ends up receiving the axe these last few days, but it sure has been one crazy ride lately, and if someone backs up nazyrus, well, at least we do have more companies to think about than yesterday with verges snap.

 

[Deleted member]

I'll still hold out in case Capcom ends up receiving the axe these last few days, but it sure has been one crazy ride lately, and if someone backs up nazyrus, well, at least we do have more companies to think about than yesterday with verges snap

I'll just hang around here for that. My most wanted rests in the stability of Phoenix's. Should Capcom EVER get disconfirmed, well, it also affects me.

Dear God, thank you for having Verge go back on such a simple miscommunication error. Amen.

Well, **** happens for a reason, because it's ****, and it happens.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Possible, disconfirmed, possible, disconfirmed... What a turnabout.

This really is like a Phoenix Wright case in action.

Let's just hope it's not the flashback case from Apollo Justice. You know the one.

 

[Flyboy]

Sad about Arle, but obviously I'm pretty happy at how good it's looking for most of my other most-wanted. We are flying blind! I think Verge's explanation makes a lot of sense, was concise and clear, and only makes me want that TGA reveal more.

I mean, I'm prepared for the eventuality of it not happening, but what can I say, I'm thirsty for info.

 

[Deleted member]

Sad about Arle, but obviously I'm pretty happy at how good it's looking for most of my other most-wanted. We are flying blind! I think Verge's explanation makes a lot of sense, was concise and clear, and only makes me want that TGA reveal more.

I mean, I'm prepared for the eventuality of it not happening, but what can I say, I'm thirsty for info.

Yeah. But what about fe-

you said you gave yourself 3 days to think about setting hopes for the future pass.

Well, that was when everything went to hell and ****! But yeah, 3 days to reflect.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

For what it's worth, Jon's question seemed like a set up for someone either answering it, or proving him wrong. Ambiguous, but not a definitive answer.

Also, he did a Pauline joke post not long after his rant against leakers, too soon, Jon...