Smash Back Room Weekly Character Discussions! FINAL UPDATES: Ness + Lucas. All done!!

[NESSBOUNDER]

I think it's Lucario.

Priority and projectile game are check. He can chain grab and gimp Snake as well as having the spacing options to deal with him. Not everyone thinks he's a good character, he has some great AA mixups and mindgames, and his reverse double team is a useful AT that allows him to get close to projectile users.

But it could also be Ness or Pika.

 

[vanderzant]

I think it's Pikachu, but that's probably because I main him.

 

[Onxy]

Sounds like Olimar.

 

[kupo15]

well as i said before, i dont think lucarios ES techniques have mindgames attached to them. At least noone said i was wrong before

The prob with pika is that he only has one AT (QAC) with mindgames attached and it is not disputed. I should have snakes vids later today to prove that its and even matchup ^_^

It cant be oli because Oli has excellent mindgames just for being olimar. Other than that desync AT, i dont think there is any other AT's oli has. I could be wrong

About ness, idk much about his AT game but his projectile is so so and doesnt match up with pika or pit i dont think. I dont have a problem with it maybe because im pit.

So both pika and oli only have one AT and the hint refers to several. Idk if oli's is disputable but pikas isnt. Lucario has many techs but without mindgames attached because you cant do anything after them. It is only served as an offensive defense because of the lag after.

Pit has many AT's, most have mindgames attached, and are the most controversial techs.

 

[Stealth Raptor]

Where does it say in the hint that the AT for mindgames have to be disputable/controversial?

 

[infomon]

Kupo15, I think you're taking the term "AT" way too seriously. I don't think the techniques mentioned in the hint necessarily have to refer to some unexpected behaviour in a character's moveset that someone on Smashboards pseudo-arbitrarily decided to announce was an "AT". Pika's QAC can't be considered his only "technique", even if it's the only real AT that people talk about.

Hmm, but I might be wrong with respect to what the hint's trying to suggest. *shrug*

 

[kupo15]

Include this character's awesome projectile game, ridiculous priority on some attacks, and incredible mindgames because of certain techniques, this character has quite a bit of potential. But only certain people can truly use (or even see) this potential, which is likely why there is such a difference in opinion.

No one would ever dispute a characters great projectile attack priority to not use them. If this character has this, then there is no disagreement which means the last sentence refers to certain techniques and Pit has the most techniques that are disputable. Only a select few ppl and truly use all of Pits AT's and they are the only ones who see the potential of them; unless you got pwned by them

 

[Stealth Raptor]

when it comes to QAC for pika, it is very hard to put into practice, and as such there are few good pika players out there.

 

[kupo15]

im sure it is but the hint says techniqueS. Im not a pika main so you would know more about that then me. The same goes for pit, there are very few out there who are good ^_^

 

[Niko_K]

It's gotta be Pikachu or even Peach.

Biased but im leaning towards peach, only because of one stupid little conspiracy....shes fifteenth on chillin and travis' tier list xD

 

[betterthanbonds9]

We have no techniques? You sure we're playing the same character? O,o

I see tons of ES techniques, followup mixups to many of our moves, B-reversal, ExtremeSpeed, and our bloody ROLL is the best in the game.

...

HOLY ****.

I'm betting on Ness, now.

too bad ES doesn't hurt anybody. How many times do you extremestop? The only technique i use it for is the extremehog, and that isn't really a mindgame imo, it's just grabbing the ledge faster...

oh and of course extremeawesome, but that's stage specific

everyone can pseudo stick, and a roll isn't a technique....

 

[Inuashakent]

Pikachu, or Pit, maybe ness...

I would have to bet on ness, he fits the description.

 

[Anth0ny]

Definately sounds like Pikachu.

 

[Fire!]

Yep, its Pika.

Mostly because his D-Smash and Thunder Jolt. I don't see Ness to have any mindgames, but it could be Pit. Doubt it though.

 

[TehBo49]

#15 = Pika

Finally

 

[kupo15]

I still dont see why its pika over pit TBH :\

Here is a match against snake http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHYsIpsMu74

There have been posts as to why pika isnt it but not as to why Pit isnt.

 

[YoshiBomb]

the past few hints have all been almost Yoshi except last weeks so why not

YOSHI

 

[betterthanbonds9]

the past few hints have all been almost Yoshi except last weeks so why not

YOSHI

because the word rainbow would be in the hint somewhere

 

[chucklesXcore]

I still dont see why its pika over pit TBH :\

Here is a match against snake http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHYsIpsMu74

There have been posts as to why pika isnt it but not as to why Pit isnt.

kupo, your easily one of the best Pit's, but that match...you kinda got lucky on that last stock.

 

[betterthanbonds9]

kupo, your easily one of the best Pit's, but that match...you kinda got lucky on that last stock.

agreed, but it was a nice finish, short and sweet

edit: 4300 ftw

 

[kupo15]

what!? psh that was planned! lol ^_^ Actually when I did that, he said, "are you serious!?" lol I kinda just did it without thinking. Ill have to do that more often.

Well how about this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GvN4SckEgik He has beaten me pretty hard and Im not finished uploading but Im posting wins for the sake of this argument.

I still believe that Pit vs Snake is even. Its all about avoiding the tilts (because you know they are coming) and manipulating the explosives and Pit has a good ability to do so. Also, release grabs by the edge work wonders since it puts them below the stage. The hard part is getting the first hit, but then once your on a roll, its easier, until the invincibility from the next stock :\

Also, ppl say its hard to edge guard because Snakes go so high. A half charged arrow will knock them from the cypher at anytime thus killing them because they are so high. All you have to do is really plan ahead to avoid the air dodge.

My fellow Pit players think I am insane for thinking this way but I dont have too tough a time with Snakes..they are quite fun and challenging!! XD

Thanks for the compliment ^_^

 

[betterthanbonds9]

actually i dont think it's pit because i dont think there's a region that thinks pit sucks

 

[chucklesXcore]

what!? psh that was planned! lol ^_^ Actually when I did that, he said, "are you serious!?" lol I kinda just did it without thinking. Ill have to do that more often.

Well how about this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GvN4SckEgik He has beaten me pretty hard and Im not finished uploading but Im posting wins for the sake of this argument.

I still believe that Pit vs Snake is even. Its all about avoiding the tilts (because you know they are coming) and manipulating the explosives and Pit has a good ability to do so. Also, release grabs by the edge work wonders since it puts them below the stage. The hard part is getting the first hit, but then once your on a roll, its easier, until the invincibility from the next stock :\

Also, ppl say its hard to edge guard because Snakes go so high. A half charged arrow will knock them from the cypher at anytime thus killing them because they are so high. All you have to do is really plan ahead to avoid the air dodge.

My fellow Pit players think I am insane for thinking this way but I dont have too tough a time with Snakes..they are quite fun and challenging!! XD

Thanks for the compliment ^_^

that match was rapesauce, although I was surprised when he fell for those 2 grabs in a row. usually Pit can't chain anything together cuz its so easy to DI out of.

And I don't think your crazy, but Pit doesn't do well against Snake. He just does much better than most people if you play him right. Hes probably close to even, but not quite, just because its so much harder to get a KO with Pit(especially against snake) than with Snake. I mean, a few tilts at 110%+ and your pretty much dead. Hell one up tilt and with brawl's low ceilings you can pretty much count on death. I agree that Pit does much better than most of the cast though. He's got a lot of ways to counter Snake. If you play well your advantages right, which Kupo does in the first stock really well then you can have an easier time with Snake I notice. Snake has horrible aerial and Pit's aerial is great so its just a bad match up in the air. The key with a good Pit is keeping Snake in the air and off the stage.

 

[NJzFinest]

I think the next character is Fox

 

[kupo15]

yea I was on a roll that match.

yes I agree. And for the CG, yes he can sidestep it but if done at the right time, you can pull it off. I have been experimenting with a dash attack after then an Utilt after that. It works quite well if they are not too low to hit you after the dash A. Yesterday I also found out that if you are in the air recovering, its bad. I will always be a wimp and glide to the other side safely to restore the adv to neutral.

And for gimping snakes recovery, its all about thinking way ahead. All of Pits non multi hit aerials knocks snake from the cypher at any time. You can Wing refresh and follow snake up and hit him. Its cool.

 

[CHOMPY]

something tells me that its either Pit of Pikachu.

 

[JhMS]

I dont think is Ness,he has troubles with Snake thanks to the grab release to up tilt.
Ummmmmmmmmmm.....Fox.
Yeah it could be Fox but still im staying with my bet of Pikachu.
If it is Fox:Amazing.My main xD.

 

[kupo15]

well if Dsmash is pikas only good priority move, then pit beats that with several high priority moves like the hint says

 

[YumeMaxx]

I'm going to saaaaaaaay... OLIMAR!!!! BWAHAHAHA

No logical backing on that one, but he's my main and I don't really have a proper guess today. It seems too iffy to me.

 

[ChaoticSamus]

I think its Olimar.

 

[M.K]

Lucario or Olimar.

 

[Lemon Drop]

My vote goes out to Sandbag. Possibly Pit.

 

[Doctor X]

Even? Pshh.... Pit counters snake. Bair out of his recovery is too good and arrows **** him by forcing him to drop his grenades or stopping them dead in the air. Once you figure out how to space out his tilts he's cake.

I wish I had some matches to put up... I think I will Tuesday, hopefully.

 

[Nintendevil]

I read and thought of Pika and olimar, but then the last sentance...

But only certain people can truly use (or even see) this potential, which is likely why there is such a difference in opinion.

Well I think everyone knows What pikas potential is

>_______________>

Olimar...

 

[Swordplay]

I would say olimar...

I wanted to say pikachu one they mentioned snake. Thunder can really punish snakes high recovery.

The second they mentioned good spam though with this it really can only be olimar.

 

[FBM]

Olimar.

I've heard Oli mains scoff at the matchup with Snake and he's definately a character that doesn't seem like anything special at first glance, especially with his recovery. He also has nice priority and he's tough to read sometimes.

Pit and Pikachu both seem like good characters on the surface. Why on Earth anyone would doubt them is beyond me. They are both fast with spamming projectiles, great recoveries, and decent KO power.

 

[asob4]

Olimar.

I've heard Oli mains scoff at the matchup with Snake and he's definately a character that doesn't seem like anything special at first glance, especially with his recovery. He also has nice priority and he's tough to read sometimes.

it's oli's advantage dammit >_>
rabble rabble rabble

 

[Onxy]

Olimar's Usmash, Fair, and Bair don't have much priority, but his Fsmash has some, Uair has some, Nair has a ton, so does his Dsmash and tilts.

 

[Vulcan55]

because of the comment on what reigon you are from, I would guess that the character is from a game un-released in America.
Thusly, my vote goes out to Lucas.

 

[WoapGang]

Who's that Smasher...


ITS PIKACHU!!!!! (Cookie for reference)

But in All Necessary Seriousness

I'm not Quite sure about the regional opinions of Pikachu, but I've Most Definitley Seen Mind Games with Pikachu. His Projectile is also quite a find