Simple Questions & Answers Thread (READ FAQ in OP)

[Ripple]

What is donkey kongs momentom cancel? (Horizantel and vertical).

bair is his best option in both cases

 

[Rizk18]

I have a q, why does Dk dominate Lucas?

 

[DtJ S2n]

We have a really easy 0-death on him from grab. Our Cargo (f-throw) forces a grounded release, in which Lucas and Ness are in lag, meaning we get to grab again indefinitely. We can also d-smash them out of the release, giving us a very easy kill move to do at the end of that.

Other than that, while approaching can be annoying, it's easy for us to knock him out of the air and his ground game is really mediocre.

 

[Z1GMA]

Sup, guys.
I've decided to try N see if I can get any good with DK.

I've got a couple of questions:

How would a DK Moveset Tier List look like?

What moves are the most Spamable?

What move(s) are saved most effectively for kills?

What is the most common thing ppl do wrong when they play as DK?

Thx in advance / Z1G <3

 

[DtJ S2n]

Welcome! DK is super fun.

A move tier list from me goes something like this.
1. Giant Punch (Neutral-B)
2. B-air
3. Up-b
4. Up-tilt
5. Down-smash

Only the top 3 of that is really solid. 4/5 can be replaced by u-tilt/d-tilt/f-tilt/d-smash/u-air/maybe even down-b.

Down-smash is really the only move you should actively save for kills. You can choose to save a move like u-tilt/b-air/u-air for a kill, they're all easy to land and kill fairly early.

I see a lot of new DK's try to jump at people who are on the ground. Don't jump "at" people.

Also something important that you'll probably not realize. DK's grab is really bad.

 

[Z1GMA]

Wow, I didn't know nB was considered THAT good.
Does it have more uses than SA & early kills?

Also something important that you'll probably not realize. DK's grab is really bad.

I main Ganon, so I should be ok

 

[Ripple]

I main Ganon, so I should be ok

ganons grab is better

 

[Z1GMA]

ganons grab is better

T-rex Arms takes the cake.

 

[Ripple]

T-rex Arms takes the cake.

arms that don't have a grab box outside the arms take the cake.

 

[DtJ S2n]

That. It's small, we're big, and it's 2 frames slower than the average. Shield grabbing is really difficult, they have to mess up seriously and basically be inside your shield. Ganon has that same problem but at least his is average speed. I've gotten grabbed out of so many shield grabs before.

Don't even try to dash grab.

Our pivot grab is alright, but our dashing animation is really stupid. Our dashing animation sticks our feet way behind us so it's not like it extends past where our vulnerable spot was.

 

[Z1GMA]

arms that don't have a grab box outside the arms take the cake.

It's the same with Ganon.
His hand reaches further than his bubble.
On top of that, his range is just ridiculous for a Big Man.

His Dash Grab is OK, but his standing grab, not to mention his Shield Grab = Trash.

 

[DtJ S2n]

I like how we're arguing who has the worse grab.

And I mean Zigma if you wanna talk relatively, we're bigger than Gdorf, don't even have a dash grab, and ours is 2 frames slower. Plus you guys have Gerudo which is a really cool option. If DK had that oh man.

To be honest I'd really like to see the grab bubble on ours.

 

[Z1GMA]

Ya, DK Gerudo Dtilt Jab Lock Galore.
Would be too broken

Gerudoing after taking bumps on the shield isn't an option since Shield Grabbing with Gerudo (Gerudo OoS) is a really bad idea :/

Here's DK's Grab Bubble: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qExAo_hAXhI
7:18
Like, 150% the range of Ganon's.

If you ask all the Ganon Mains at our boards what character has the worst grab, they'll say Ganon, lulz.
I'm not really sure who has the better grab of the two, though.
But Ganon's grab is complete trash - Believe me.
Someone who plays them both should be able to judge.

If DK had Ganon's grab, he'd be able to Dash Grab better
- If Ganon had DK's grab, he'd be able to actually Shieldgrab.

btw, about size. DK is bigger, but we're taller

 

[Makke]

....................

 

[Z1GMA]

DKs dthrow can chaingrab at low % and the cargo options are very good, include the cargo release stuff DK have against Ness & Lucas.

We were discussing who's worse at "getting a grab", not what you can do when you actually get the grab.

But yeah, DK's options out of a grab are superior to Ganon's, like you're saying.

I would say DK has a better "grabgame" altogether than Ganon.
Luckily, we have the Gerudo to somewhat even it up.

And I know you're good with both DK & Ganon, 9F.
So it would be weird if you didn't know who had the better grab.
Listen to 9F, ppl.

 

[Makke]

....................

 

[BadKarma]

where can I find info on the AT where DK can UpB near/off a ledge and have invisibility frames or something like that? I havent had much luck finding a thread or video on it :/

 

[Neon!]

Badkarma- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3CmvJM-Rq8&feature=channel_video_title

Wow i cant believe i missed this grab discussion lol. I'd love to see the grab bubble for dk and ganon's pivot grabs too.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

So is there anyone who particularly skilled at abusing the SA Frames of DK's moves that I can take a look at?

I'm back to screwing around with again lol. I got very good at Powershielding and abusing Grab Armor thanks to D3 so I'd like to look into how my playstyle could translate over to DK.

 

[DtJ S2n]

In general I'd say Ook gets the most superarmor off. Not many videos of him though. Will and Ripple use a lot of the Up-b super-armor glitch though, if you'd like to see practical applications of it.

Get used to how bad DK's grab is. 2 frames slower than normal and small. Pivot grab is alright. Our throws are good though!

 

[crifer]

Our pivot grab is ****, not alright omg.

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

to be honest that was the exact reasons i thought it would be. im satisfied atm. now i will happily be patient for another couple weeks.

and then i will ask about the dk pit write up as i really want to know how a character we can 0-62+% true cg>attacks, has the easiest recovery to mirror shield, is 100% outprioritized by our whole movest (and our moves are faster), is easily hit with our op bair, and has no real solution to perfect spaced planking especially when combined with scrooging and circle camping with the tactic in this video (i know i lose at the end but im making a point). http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P836RYUudzM&list=UUsOy2X6gEclSCyFlDOUKBCQ&index=3&feature=plpp_video

not to mention arrows really rack up the damage both on and offstage and set up gimps and the fact that our jab, side-b, and nair damn near invalidate his shield is now only a -1 for donkey. what possible factor appeared out of no-where to make this better for donkey kong?

oh ya and our cps on him should we lose make it horrid for him. i swear if the only thing they mention is killpower, im gonna laugh because hitting pit with dk is nothing short of incredibly hard

cassio said to ask the individual character boards about this so i am

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

on the chart it says -1. but in the character spread it says otherwise. i didn't notice that till just now

edit:

didn't see that they changed the chart. gave it color and such. when it was just black it said it was only -1. but now i remember people saying the characters were out of order on the chart. please ignore my rant

 

[DtJ S2n]

I don't even want to start on how much I dislike the match-up chart, though I'll agree that Pit really is a pain.

 

[1PokeMastr]

If you don't know the Mu.. and Pit Nairs..
Haha..

 

[zmx]

I have a question regarding DK's cargo throw to stage spike.

It seems if you hold up when he's off the stage while doing it, you'll be released from it. Basically according to the guides this gets you out faster than any sort of mashing. However, this only works sometimes. So I'm not sure what's going on. Is it character dependent? Is there a specific timing involved when you have to hold up?

And yes I know you can just tech it but that still depending on who you're using puts you in a bad spot and there's a chance you can mess up. The above method might be fool proof and according to one guide I read it is. And yet it isn't............

 

[DtJ S2n]

To my knowledge, holding up is the most effective method for every character (and that it works with every character). Naturally the length of the cargo is based off of your percent as well as how fast you start holding up. At higher percents and if you're near the edge, it's difficult to not get CSS'd. Don't know what else to tell you.

 

[1PokeMastr]

Holding up + Mash is the best way to get out.

 

[crifer]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3YsJ1F41R8

wtf is wrong with will´s punch at 5:58 ??? never seen that before.

 

[DtJ S2n]

My only guess was that Shadow got hit by a shoulder punch and DIed like a god. I don't think that was very stale and 19% feels low for even a shoulder punch. I don't really know tbh.

 

[crifer]

My only guess was that Shadow got hit by a shoulder punch and DIed like a god. I don't think that was very stale and 19% feels low for even a shoulder punch. I don't really know tbh.

that was my guess, too... but I think it´s more likely to be a 3rd hurtbox of the punch?

 

[1PokeMastr]

It has 3 hit boxes.

One hits up ( Shoulder )
The arm has the obvious knock back.
Then there's a specific space inside Dk that has a REALLY REALLY weak hitbox in it.
I've experienced it many times.

 

[DtJ S2n]

If that's the case there'd have to be four. There's a hitbox not far down from the Shoulder box that can hit people backwards as strong as a normal punch box. So it'd be the one inbetween that and his normal punchbox, which would essentially make it an... Elbow punch.

What a weird part of the move to get hit with. I'm glad this somehow isn't a common thing.

 

[crifer]

If that's the case there'd have to be four. There's a hitbox not far down from the Shoulder box that can hit people backwards as strong as a normal punch box. So it'd be the one inbetween that and his normal punchbox, which would essentially make it an... Elbow punch.

What a weird part of the move to get hit with. I'm glad this somehow isn't a common thing.

I´m glad that my spacing is so good, that it never happened to me ;D

 

[aqua421]

are there any good videos that demonstrate the ice climber mu?

 

[1PokeMastr]

are there any good videos that demonstrate the ice climber mu?

I'm not sure about this one, but, how I play the Mu is..

- Ban FD.
- Go to platform stage and platform camp them.
- They're ready to Uair, walk off and Bair.
- Space around Blizzard with Down B.
- Up B sparingly to separate them.

 

[DKwill]

I'm not sure about this one, but, how I play the Mu is..

- Ban FD.
- Go to platform stage and platform camp them.
- They're ready to Uair, walk off and Bair.
- Space around Blizzard with Down B.
- Up B sparingly to separate them.

Also:
- Punish squall recoveries with SA punch/up angled f-tilt.
- When you land a grab, cargo hold immediately and jump + up-throw.
- When grabbing Popo, mashing pummels is acceptable if Nana is standing right next to him since she will be caught by them.
- Avoid f-tilt use unless IC's are airborn.
- Down-b a lot. (Reflects ice blocks, forces IC's to take to the air to get around it if spaced correctly)

 

[1PokeMastr]

Also:
- Punish squall recoveries with SA punch/up angled f-tilt.
- When you land a grab, cargo hold immediately and jump + up-throw.
- When grabbing Popo, mashing pummels is acceptable if Nana is standing right next to him since she will be caught by them.
- Avoid f-tilt use unless IC's are airborn.
- Down-b a lot. (Reflects ice blocks, forces IC's to take to the air to get around it if spaced correctly)

Last part sounds like the Ganon Mu.

 

[waldorf2007]

When I play against Ice climbers and get a grab I always cargo immediately like you said, but usually I do a jumping, rising back throw. The trajectory isn't perfect for nana but I've found that because of the back throw, DK is turned around. If you are on the edge, it is actually possible to grab, jump, back throw, and being turned around, jump (or just fall) with a fair to hit nana to spike or knock back

In addition to this, if popo tried to up air, I can usually (as I am now turned around) fall with bair, trading if popo doesn't space it to be perfectly under you

I think Uair may be better but the idea of having me in the air with a double jump and nana flying away, popo having little to no control, is very enticing especially when a spike can kill early from fair.
Any thoughts on this? I think popo can space things to nullify this but I haven't played an ICs who understood and reacted to what I was going for

 

[aqua421]

i normally just btrhow when i get a grab, nana runs off stage and i can get a spike. I know it is risky because i can get fsmashed in the process but it seemed to work fine on lain when i played him at apex.