Sheik Video & Video Critique Thread

[#HBC | Scary]

Yup, it isn't too difficult. Just mess around with it and you'll find it.

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

So I know I said I knew how to pivot needle, but I failed doing it on Thursday.

How does I pivot needle?

 

[#HBC | Scary]

Run
Press B
Lean Joystick opposite direction
???????
Profit!

I can show ya if you need help.

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

I think that the only thing that really stood out to me was the lack of needles, Needles are really good at punishing landings from a distance.

 

[ALIX212]

also,in order to pivot needle,
before pressing B, the control stick must be in its neutral position.

 

[Ripple]

also,in order to pivot needle,
before pressing B, the control stick must be in its neutral position.

This actually isn't true. Its not necessary

 

[Jimmyfosho]

when i try to pivot needle i always end up rolling back for some reason.

 

[Ripple]

when i try to pivot needle i always end up rolling back for some reason.

You're pushing back after you press b. Do it before

 

[Ripple]

3 days past. this doesn't count as a double post.

my videos vs. MJG in winners finals are about to go up. some in-depth critique would be appreciated

you'll see a vast improvement since my last videos

here it is

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LuORKp8LX7Q

 

[<π]

quick one.
You keep going in when he has to come to you. it is SO HARD to watch all the projectiles I can't do it while I'm watching you guys play. just wait out side of that short hop bomb toss range when you get ahead and look for strong opportunities to punish.

becareful with follow ups on Toonlink because he can attack out of air dodge right? if you think he'll air dodge your fair don't attack short hop back, off, and maybe punish his new forced landing with needles.

needles; try to keep them charged because they are big damage in this match up and even worth trades some times

you can fair boomerang. if you are gonna land and boomer is gonna meet you landing point. don't air dodge (it won't matter) fair, nair, or bair the boomer instead if you can.

DON'T TRY TO PRESURE ANYONE OFF THE LEDGE WHEN YOU HAVE PERCENT ADVANTAGE. you lost two matches doing that. stick to safe pokes like needles or chain (and that isn't safe in this match up)
even when you are ahead you should try to avoid pressuring people off because the have a huge advantage on the ledge and will just get free damage from you. most people get bored and jump on stage and fight if you wait and don't interact at all.

dsmash is a terrible poke really easy to punish. if you are standing looking at a shield go with a jab if you expect a shield drop. that leads into dsmash or nair if you cancel you jabs and follow up, but with much much less risk on your end.
sh nair is another option with kill power than is going to be harder to punish on block.
upB is another I saw you use it at least once. very very safe on block against most of the cast.

not really in depth, just some quick stuff I saw. If I get time I'll go over stuff more.

 

[riocosta123]

- That was pretty good and you have the right gameplan (Chip was one of the the people that trained me and taught me the matchup) but I think you need to work on follow ups from jab outside of rapid and grab to maximize damage. jab to -> ftilt, nair, dsmash all **** hard

-Roll less.

-Lay off on throwing out dash attacks. It has so much cooldown that the risk/reward is not worth it. I primarily use it as punishing OOS and landings.

-You were winning a couple of times but it seemed like MJG won the war of attrition. You stopped charging your needles and being safe and got punished badly. I just expect every TL match to be at least 5 minutes long (a la melee Samus) and that helps to keep me steady rushing in. I think you have the right idea, you just have to execute it as consistently as your opponent.

 

[Kudemo]

Yo guys, i'm playing sheik as second for now and i would like to show you 2 recent videos :

Vs Skelerex (DDD) : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dhRIeckXHiA

Vs Zudenka (Peach) : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9xaVmME5HI

 

[#HBC | Scary]

Give me a little bit, completely bogged down by hw and stuff. Will look in a bit, especially because I wanna see how you do vs. Skelerex since I don't like the DDD MU personally.

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

So up-b is good to use against ddd when he's recovering since it's so slow? Gotta remember that.


Grand jeux kudemo. Je avons vraiment apprecié la manière dont vous avez utilisé son vent de DDD à votre avantage!

 

[<π]

upB is a reasonable move in general. think of it as a high knock back low risk counter. I'll use it a lot if I expect a rush in and get rewarded at for zero risk.

Kudemo, you are SO RISKY! you obviously have an understanding of the game, but you put so much int oyour attacks to the point where you are completely left open if they wiff. you don't need to double jump fair if they are on a platform above you.

 

[Zankoku]

I uploaded this mostly to study what I was doing on my first stock, but maybe the rest of you can find some insight in it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kZsGaWtBEM

 

[manofgames4555]

My Sheik debut! Let me have it! I want to be good...my first time playing Sheik. Please take the time and critique me!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYOLR_knv_s

 

[Zankoku]

I can tell Sheik is going to be difficult for you, because right now your top priority should be getting your fundamentals in order. 70% of your movement was rolling, and almost all of the remaining 30% was dashing so that you could dash attack, jump and aerial, or dashing usmash. You had a tendency to just throw out moves like dsmash, fsmash, and Vanish, and you had rather haphazardly spaced aerials that made it really easy to punish anything you did against shield.

If you don't plan on maining Sheik, I recommend first getting good at the game in general before continuing to use her. If you do plan on switching mains, please put some more careful thought into your game. In particular, try not to use rolls so much and start moving more naturally.

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

I can tell Sheik is going to be difficult for you, because right now your top priority should be getting your fundamentals in order. 70% of your movement was rolling, and almost all of the remaining 30% was dashing so that you could dash attack, jump and aerial, or dashing usmash. You had a tendency to just throw out moves like dsmash, fsmash, and Vanish, and you had rather haphazardly spaced aerials that made it really easy to punish anything you did against shield.

this describes me so accurately its scary.

about the vid, you're trying way to hard ot be hype, sometimes you gotta chillout a little and play defensive. Definitely need to work on your spacing, like with bair, try to hit with the (smell0 disjointed part, and retreat after throwing it out, d-smash is an amazing move, just try to make sure it connects when you throw it out. Too many random air dodges, also too much jumping in general, you should try and control the ground more than the air. Use more needles and f-tilt. U-smash is a horrible approach, it's like a snake f-smash you only do it if you have a hard read.

 

[manofgames4555]

I can tell Sheik is going to be difficult for you, because right now your top priority should be getting your fundamentals in order. 70% of your movement was rolling, and almost all of the remaining 30% was dashing so that you could dash attack, jump and aerial, or dashing usmash. You had a tendency to just throw out moves like dsmash, fsmash, and Vanish, and you had rather haphazardly spaced aerials that made it really easy to punish anything you did against shield.

If you don't plan on maining Sheik, I recommend first getting good at the game in general before continuing to use her. If you do plan on switching mains, please put some more careful thought into your game. In particular, try not to use rolls so much and start moving more naturally.

Thanks for your wise. I really appreciate it. In my defense. I actually play alot smarter and better I was just experimenting (something I always do) I main Donkey Kong and want Sheik to be a strong secondary. I agree with you on most points entirely. I will work on everything...Insight on my thoughts. I wanted to confuse the wario with my unorthodox movement (being aware of normal motion). Truthfully it worked at first but, me throwing up smash out like that is a no no. lol! I had no forward tilts and no grab releases lol! I played horribly and well below what I am capable of. But, I was caught up in the moment and wanted to just confuse him but, lost patience after the suicide (my controller was messed up) . I also thought my almost comeback was rather good versus his olimar in game two.

PS. Thanks alot, I really do want to be potentially the best Sheik and Donkey Kong in the Nation one day. I've got a long way :D

 

[manofgames4555]

this describes me so accurately its scary.

about the vid, you're trying way to hard ot be hype, sometimes you gotta chillout a little and play defensive. Definitely need to work on your spacing, like with bair, try to hit with the (smell0 disjointed part, and retreat after throwing it out, d-smash is an amazing move, just try to make sure it connects when you throw it out. Too many random air dodges, also too much jumping in general, you should try and control the ground more than the air. Use more needles and f-tilt. U-smash is a horrible approach, it's like a snake f-smash you only do it if you have a hard read.

Lol at it describing you also! Match two was good at 5:50 no points for that :D! I destroyed his second life as olimar no? After my attacks I even waited for him to throw out a grab to dash and punish him leading up to the edgegaurd lol. But, I hear you boss thanks for your wise. I'll be back with a much improved sheik. Thanks to you guys. Seriously appreciate your time.

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

These are the vids from my last tournament, only one that aren't still up are the vids from WF

Would appreciate critiques, but don't kill yourselves over it lol

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bTfIJQUHa5k Tutu vs Rayquaza grand finals set 1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOIR51eHw5U Tutu vs Rayqauza grand finals set 2 games 1-3

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sigLk4-UnCs Tutu vs Rayquaza grand finals set 2 games 4&5

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FP7lD7Hr5vE Tutu vs Tech_Chase Winners Bracket set

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPt_f7XQJxA Tutu vs Coco (2 friendlies)

 

[phi1ny3]

-empty SH more against snake, especially when they start hucking fast grenades, it allows you to prevent them from pressuring your space while approaching/pseudo-camping him back (lets you charge needles gradually), and at worst if he ftilts you, since you're in the air it only hits you with the first one, reducing your damage a lot. You have a lot of mixups on snake from SH, like if you do a non FF fair at the right time, you can bait a grab/ftilt and punish. FF AD is also awesome if you're coming in from behind, it's punishable though)

-Learn the snake's personal grenade timings, snakes like this are really easy to unravel their camp game if you can learn their typical grenade patterns, if you keep jumping over grenades/spacing them out when he starts cooking them, it'll be hard for a snake to fully make you approach all out (btw, if you get fully charged needles, if he does a shield drop grenade, you can snipe him sometimes for some massive damage, since the needles will push snake back, and expose the grenade to the front and blow it up on him). Use less uair for direct punishment, make it more of a "option forcer", it's better to use utilt/dsmash/charged usmash on snake if you want to directly cover his options.
Fun fact: if the snake is looking forward to grabbing you again out of dthrow, if you do a regular getup -> buffered turnaround, you can either jab or even beat him to the grab with your own if you're frame perfect, since turnaround + grab = 7 frames to his 8. This won't work if he anticipates with jab or if he's good at exploiting your vulnerable "wakeup", but still good to know since a lot of snakes will be looking for this since sheik's tech rolls are terrible and easy to read.
-NEVER EVER USE DUMB STUFF LIKE WHAT YOU DID ON SNAKE'S SHIELD, EVER. You should avoid getting grabbed at all costs in the MU, Snake's dthrow is extremely free for reading sheik, and taking that much damage in one sitting's too much, you should only let him get you from shield when you goofed up an aerial on block, never make it easy. You want to be the quickest bamf out there when playing this MU, always be moving, forcing snake into the bad situations and controlling the match, and as tempting as it is, never force the kill on him, that's where you're going to take a bazillion damage lol, just pretend none of your smash moves exist when he's on the ground (dsmash is punishable by ftilt on block too btw).
-At high percents, don't directly attack his shield, Snake's utilt is broken lol.
-Oh yeah, if you're playing against a snake that knows the MU, expect your ftilt locks to be stuffed by a buffered grenade, that'll stop your tilts 90% of the time (that's when you do ftilt x1-2 -> grab). You did good overall, but the biggest problem was that you got impatient around snake and didn't respect his punish options. Never, EVER, sleep on a snake, with sheik you're going to lose your life so quickly.

Overall you did good, you had some cool hard waiting punishes for when he landed, loved the roll reads (very smart), Notice how once you started playing safer, you did better? Your grand finals matches were pretty good, seems like you just needed to readjust and you were good to go haha. lulzy zelda match, and once again, SH is like a jacknife for this MU, you can use it for neutral game, when you're approaching, and when you're trying to bait snake to do stuff, like when you SH to bait the air dodge, then dsmashed for the kill last game.
I'll get to the other matches hopefully, but that's like the one I feel the most comfortable critiquing. I hardly use her for the MK MU, although lately this has been less and less true.

 

[Zankoku]

So the top 3 of amateur brackets went
1: Hino :marthbrawl:
2: aisight :sheikbrawl: :marthbrawl:
3: Clario :marthbrawl:

As a result, this is me, playing 17 consecutive games of Sheik vs Marth.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKR93BqTH-o
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PndWFXXA39w
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AR52bdQ7XhY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RowFnpTlLHw

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

Ty for the critique phil nye


also Ankoku I feel really bad for you.

 

[phi1ny3]

yaaaaay, I get to learn a bit more about this MU lol...

 

[Zankoku]

I'd appreciate advice since I'm not exactly an amazing player or anything.

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

I'll try and watch these over break.

It just sucks that you had to play Sheik's worst MU 17 times in a row lol.

 

[Zankoku]

I could've made it a lot less if I either just won every game or lost every game. : \

 

[phi1ny3]

So the top 3 of amateur brackets went
1: Hino :marthbrawl:
2: aisight :sheikbrawl: :marthbrawl:
3: Clario :marthbrawl:

As a result, this is me, playing 17 consecutive games of Sheik vs Marth.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKR93BqTH-o
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PndWFXXA39w
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AR52bdQ7XhY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RowFnpTlLHw

I would replace half of your hyphen usmashes with utilts, especially since he wasn't in kill percent most of the time, minus if he were to get tippered. Utilt helps heap damage (I know Marth can upB between hits, but I've rarely had it happen from spacing it, and it usually isn't worth it when you do space the utilt) and press your advantage being underneath (and at low percents you can string a boost/dash grab after utilt, further continuing the juggle, except Marth can probably upB that, if not, you can at least needle/DA him), your usmash feels very telegraphed and forced, and while they were safe, you would often lose that positioning you put marth in. Play more vertically, your needle and fair/nair game are great, but don't overlook uair/utilt/continuing after your throws, it's like the one spot that sheik can put marth in some bad positions without worrying about guessing his upB/fair/nair as much, I know dthrow is not exactly combo material, but imo the reason I use it and people should still use it anyways is because even with DI, it puts your opponent in a really bad position, unless they are at higher percents and can DI away really far lol. Utilt is also harder to punish if the opponent has landed safely, because it covers air dodges more effectively.

You have a dangerously borderline rolling habit, you were smart enough to make it hard to punish, but it seems like it would be a little too easy to force you to roll if you're feeling pressured if a better marth were to play you. Roll is really good v. Marth, don't get me wrong, but I feel that you could mix it up, doing things like just barely walking away out of range, Full hopping just slightly to egg on his reaction, etc., would all make it harder to predict your roll.

Your needle game is pretty good, I like the consistent spacing you use to makes sure that it's win-win.

I would feel less inclined to get too bold against Marth when inside, a good marth will cut that with upB oos and DB (sideB is sooo good v. sheik when the marth figures out its utilities in the MU). I think some other stuff you could try is doing empty SHs facing backwards, threaten to use bair which is one of your aerials that can reach marth if he whiffs fair, and you can get a lot of nice needle/grab/ground game mixups just from using this more alone.

I liked some of your traps after throws, the fthrow -> fair -> bair is pretty solid against marth. I would try once again to improvise a little, think of some more tweaks to put marth back in that bad position. He's not snake, but he still is relatively weak at defending himself from below.

Oh yeah, while you're at it, try playing with fullhops if you want to, sometimes these are great in baiting the opponent to get him to think you're exposing yourself to juggling (and admittedly, sometimes they're right), but it's still very easy to AD/land behind marth when he tries bearing down on you and misses, or to throw in some aerials/needles to stop him from getting in.

Also, this is more a question than anything, but I notice sheiks like you and Judo use SH rising nair and FF it so that it has that lag. Is this intentional, or accidental? I can't help but feel that I've seen this punished often enough to conclude that it isn't valid if it is intentional. I think better nair mixups would be to make it either completely lagless, or do the thing Earth does and wait until the very last possible second to input it and surprise the opponent when he drops shield to try to counter what he thinks is going to be an "empty hop".

I think you underestimate Marth's punishing capabilities sometimes, doing stuff on shield that isn't safe is something that's easy to do, but it's something that if you can avoid, it'll change how well you'll do a lot. You're sheik, you're great at making the opponent slow down and keep popping shield up to stop your harassing, you should take advantage of that. Think more about what makes the opponent put up shield, and what makes him think it's safe to come out. For example, one nice thing I like doing sometimes is if I know I've flustered the opponent enough to grate down on his reaction speed, I'll sometimes do a quick jab, SH back, then when he drops shield to try to get a punish going, fall back into him with a fair/nair (this works especially well if I've crossed up on him because of the limited options he usually has). I feel that Sheik's mobility is almost a move/tactic all on its own than just a trait, and the greatest advantage is making the opponent guess and have to limit his options turtling more.

 

[Zankoku]

I'm glad to hear that people other than myself agree that a large part of Sheik's game is her sheer powers of intimidation.

 

[phi1ny3]

Yes, although intimidation in my mind is something like high aura lucario or DK lol, where it's like "Block, or you die @ 80%" lol

Sheik is more of the styling/"Imma dance all over u, try to keep up, k?" sort of person. But yeah, when she builds up some good momentum, it's fun to make the opponent get freaked out about takiing damage from sheik haha. She's like classic harass (at least how I play her she is).

 

[Judo777]

Sheik's nair has REALLY bad priority on bottom and gets stuffed by almost everything once its been out for a while (however <3 was right it does stuff diddy barrels). So the landing lag after FFing the nair doesn't matter that much, because the other option is not FFing it and it staying in the air longer, which is basically as bad as lag.

I FF the nair simply so its out for less time because I would rather take a little lag after 30 frames (like 5 extra frames of lag or w/e) then no lag after 45.

 

[phi1ny3]

Like I understand SH, then FF nair, but doing it after while doing rising nair seems really punishable.

The rising nair's a good mixup imo because people often try to go after landing lag esp. if it doesn't hit their shield first, and depending on the character, if you did it while retreating it seems generally safer if you don't let it lag in this way.

 

[Zankoku]

If you've already hit a player or a shield, then you might as well fast-fall it because they're going to react to that. A slow-falled nair is only useful for catching dodges, though.

 

[Prince Nero]

hi there everyone I'd like to get a critque. Honestly I have no idea how to play this match up and it was from a while ago just never had time to bring it here anyways any advice is great. :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oe80XJf87kc&feature=related

 

[Zankoku]

That entire game was dumb. Use ftilt more effectively and if you do use it, don't start trying to lock at 0%, because it shouldn't work (he could've shielded it). Upload games that take longer than 3 minutes and don't involve something like you jumping into a suicide spike if you want more meaningful advice.

 

[-Mars-]

Lolz that 2008 playstyle is amazing.

 

[-Mars-]

U guys wanna watch some vids of me losing?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gBY...LB66145E7D2CDDFE1&lf=results_video&playnext=2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X5Fmrb7WYQs&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sw3nYZFtkMc&feature=related

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GHqB6DtLQU

since every1 posting vids and such this is me vs L_Cancel grand finals last tournament