Q&A Sheik Strategy & QnA

[Sweet™]

Are they anytimes that her side-b is somewhat useful?

 

[john!]

Fox and Peach players *****ing about how hard life is for them has very little to do with Sheik

life is easy for peach... compared to the 20 or so characters that are worse than her

 

[KirbyKaze]

Are they anytimes that her side-b is somewhat useful?

M2K is the only Sheik that's ever made it look like a real move. I don't like it though.

 

[soap]

I can't play peach. I dont know how to deal with not being able to catch people running away and jumping over me.

 

[unknown522]

I will forever be against the use of chain. Sometimes you may get lucky with it though

 

[Kaffei]

Are they anytimes that her side-b is somewhat useful?

You can troll bad Marths with it when you have a stock lead LOLOLOL

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

I can't play peach. I dont know how to deal with not being able to catch people running away and jumping over me.

Press downb then realize you have more range than marth

 

[darkatma]

New topic: Over's space animal game
Does anyone else think his dashdance game is absolutely breathtakingly beautiful? And the way he spaces things around the ledge is super fresh to me too.

 

[KirbyKaze]

I think his recovery vs Peach turnip is superb.

 

[darkatma]

I think his recovery vs Peach turnip is superb.

it's really not hard to do at all once you learn the timing, I do it all the time (after having learned it from overtriforce a few tournies back)

still looks cool though

 

[soap]

New topic: Over's space animal game
Does anyone else think his dashdance game is absolutely breathtakingly beautiful? And the way he spaces things around the ledge is super fresh to me too.

can u link a couple of matches u have in mind?

 

[Sweet™]

When are opportune times to use dair?
How do you PC Hog?

Trying to cram in last minute stuff before a regional. Figure anything can help me at this point.

>_>

 

[Strong Badam]

Nedech beat Overtriforce with Donkey Kong
Discuss.

 

[gm jack]

Dair is good to land either when you launch them with a tilt or dash attack, or to tech chase with on platforms. Generally, if you see an opportunity to use it in a combo, do.

 

[Sweet™]

Dair is good to land either when you launch them with a tilt or dash attack, or to tech chase with on platforms. Generally, if you see an opportunity to use it in a combo, do.

Well I mean, given the situation that I hit someone onto a platform, then is my better option to do a 'rising' dair because the hitbox stays out longer?

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Nedech beat Overtriforce with Donkey Kong
Discuss.

Who beat who?

 

[gm jack]

Well I mean, given the situation that I hit someone onto a platform, then is my better option to do a 'rising' dair because the hitbox stays out longer?

If you time the fast fall right, a FH dair can cover the missed tech and tech in place, while also putting you and the ground quickly enough to chase the rolls to either side, as the platform limits them.

SHFFling uairs through platforms in that situation also works.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4MVFIui5hfA

At 10.35 there is an example of how easy dair is to just put into any opportunity which arises for extra damage. I suck and I can do this, you should be able to do this too. Just trust in yourself that is will connect, because it is easier to combo into than I first thought. Don't just throw it out though, as it has pretty bad priority.

 

[KirbyKaze]

If you time the fast fall right, a FH dair can cover the missed tech and tech in place, while also putting you and the ground quickly enough to chase the rolls to either side, as the platform limits them.

You can usually cover at least one of the rolls with the dair this way too. And still have time to chase the remaining tech roll. This is nice because dair often leads to funner things than grab & dash attack on a platform.

 

[gm jack]

I wasn't sure if that was the case, or if I was just slightly late with my dair when that worked. Going to give it some practice if it does work though.

 

[Van.]

Who beat who?

SHOTS

i respect that all american pride sveet. i respect it deeply

 

[Vincent46]

so why don't people dash cancel -> ftilt more

 

[gm jack]

Ftilt is easy to cc, or can easily be punished if it misses or hits a shield. And grabs or dash attack tend to have better reward.

 

[Jolteon]

pivot ftilt is the way to go

 

[darkatma]

so why don't people dash cancel -> ftilt more

more difficult to space due to sliding compared to wavedash->ftilt

 

[silentSWAG]

So when falcon tries to smash di jab reset

- jab jab?
- jab ftilt?
- fsmash?
- uptilt?,
- wait
- the old usmash

 

[Kaffei]

I like jab jab

 

[silentSWAG]

The new meta falcon is learning to smash di the second jab

 

[Jolteon]

jab jab doesn't work :[

jab ftilt seems to work for me, but to be honest I haven't bothered to check and see if it's inescapable. jab utilt seems kinda cool though since it's a much better launcher than ftilt is.

 

[Kaffei]

The new meta falcon is learning to smash di the second jab

OLOLOLololl

What about usmash

 

[SonuvaBeach]

Fairly certain KK went into detail as to why jab-jab worked on Hax and how it shouldn't have, but is a good mixup. I am more of a fan of jab-->f-tilt when they smash di or depending on the placement on stage jab run forward react with upair/nair/fair (specifically to Juggle's smash di away jump away or double jump).

I am not completely certain what covers what and why, I just switch to cover however they got out the last time and remember cover it next time or at least be aware in the set.

 

[TaFoKiNtS]

I wrote this on the Falcon Boards

Basically the situation is this

My options as sheik if you do not tech the d-throw

1.) jab --> wait and tech chase
2.) jab --> jab
3.) jab --> f-tilt (my favorite)
4.) d-smash (the bailout)

What I mentioned to you is this:
If you are mixing up doing SDI out and simply not SDI --> immediate tech roll after my jab reset, double jab from sheik can't cover both options. Double jab --> wd ftilt/fair can counter the hard SDIs of Falcon. However, by initiating the 2nd jab, I cannot cover Falcon's option of simply tech recovering and rolling away, since the 2nd jab will have too much post lag for me to dash to where you roll. Hence, it is a r-p-s mixup like you mentioned


Hax's inclination is to always try to SDI the first jab and not mix in a couple of tech roll aways after the jab reset. M2K knew this and punished accordingly. I tried doing the same to Scar the other night and got dominated for doing double jab on his no-tech recovery. I think jab --> ftilt is 100x better, especially since it'll push them towards the side of the stage most of the time.

To counter sheik's jab shinanagins, you have to mix up SDIs and tech rolling/getup attacking the reset. It seems hopeless to get tech-chased endlessly, but if you are in the mindset of "I always have to SDI the jab", then you will be incredibly easy to read and Sheik's will have a field day comboing you to death.

One thing I'm experimenting with is also double jab --> slight pause --> wd fair/ftilt. Sometimes I can catch the falcon in their jump and make them extra vulnerable.

SUPER SECRET TIP #1
I've been thinking for a while about what key components separate a decent falcon from a good one. I played Scar a decent bit this week and noticed that he had much more options and was ready for much more to counter many things that sheik does. For example:

1. If I am not perfect on a tech chase, he is really good on mixing in buffer rolls, gentlemens, raptor boosts, and not doing anything. Most other falcons will typically give up and give me the re-grab even if my read/timing wasn't perfect and they had an opportunity to escape. Slightly better Falcons have a boner for buffer rolls and will only buffer roll. Great falcons mix in everything.

2. Scar can punish me when I try to shield poke with OOS nairs, dairs, rolls. Most falcons just sit in shield

3. Scar makes sure to keep moving in the matchup and have solid stage control. Most falcons have tunnel vision and focus on getting a grab or a nair without being mindful of stage control.

4. Scar does not miss combos....

5. Scar's edge guarding is top notch. Scare me away with the threat of bair, grabs ledge, stomps --> knee or reverse knee when i land on stage. Makes sure that my recovery to ledge shinanagins do not work.

PS: I'll turn this into a AMA in regards to the falcon/sheik matchup from the Sheik's perspective.

 

[silentSWAG]

Damn everyones such a damn tryhard.

Good ****

 

[Maybe]

So my friends have been telling me that I'm gay and cheap for playing Sheik... and basically most of the high-tier floaties. I used to play spacies but I felt like I would get punished way to hard for missing techs. Then I picked up Sheik/Marth and a little Peach on the side and I gotta say - Tech chasing/CGs (IMO) > Combos. I feel like they're smoother and when executed properly, looks damn amazing. However, my friends give me mad sh*t for Tech chasing and Chaingrabbing because I play Sheik and Marth now... What should I do?

 

[stelzig]

Start giving them **** for everything they do too. It's not even hard, all characters are damn gay. Except marth, I cannot complain about anything marth does to me, because he's still so bad

 

[Beat!]

So my friends have been telling me that I'm gay and cheap for playing Sheik... and basically most of the high-tier floaties. I used to play spacies but I felt like I would get punished way to hard for missing techs. Then I picked up Sheik/Marth and a little Peach on the side and I gotta say - Tech chasing/CGs (IMO) > Combos. I feel like they're smoother and when executed properly, looks damn amazing. However, my friends give me mad sh*t for Tech chasing and Chaingrabbing because I play Sheik and Marth now... What should I do?

Can't please 'em all. No matter what character you play, there will always be someone who calls you gay/cheap. Listening to whiny *****es won't do you any good. Play whoever you enjoy the most and don't listen to complaints.

Start giving them **** for everything they do too

... you want him to lower himself to their level and become a scrub himself? Terrible advice imo.

I mean, you could definitely give them **** for complaining and calling stuff cheap, but I don't see how complaining back about their playstyle/whatever is going to help at all.

 

[silentSWAG]

Ummm
It really dosent matter if ur homies call something gay. Just realize that u are winning. And some players di

If ur good. U should **** them (mango style) - it feels good
Just remember that tournament is always playing by the rules of winning/ lossing. So u should play "gay" ftw

 

[Sweet™]

SWAG and I have to deal with being called gay by the people we play with all the time.

You just have to learn to deal with it, and just smile as you're beating them if they're complaining.

Smiling is one of the best IRL mindgames.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

tl;dr

Tell them to get on your level.

Smooth Criminal

 

[stelzig]

... you want him to lower himself to their level and become a scrub himself? Terrible advice imo.

I'm assuming that he's taking their comments too seriously and should try to take them more lightly. I have yet to meet someone who genuinely whined. But maybe it's just in the danish community that giving people **** without generating hate is common...?

But even if these people are actually "scrubs", then turning it back on them in a lighthearted manner shouldn't be hard. You don't have to sound mad or complain like hell to make these comments, and see if they can take it even though you're clearly not very serious about it.

(i'm also of the opinion that "giving people hell" is actually a very good way of showing them that no character is more fair or whatever in this game. Though I like to act like marth (or the character I'M playing!) is, as you could see in my previous post)

Edit: Actually I do remember king funk getting a little mad after listening to one of our memes (for a while) when he had only recently moved to Denmark ("Is that the only thing you can do?"). So maybe it is just a danish thing, lol.

 

[Beat!]

Well, okay. I didn't understand that you meant he should do it in a "lighthearted" manner. I guess that could work. I'd like to see it before I believe it, though.

Ugh, this would be a lot easier if scrubs just stopped being scrubs.