Q&A Sheik Strategy & QnA

[KirbyKaze]

Yeah when I played Scar at RoM2 I got like D-throw U-tilt regrab because he didn't DI away every time. It's so gay.

Tope how can I make you love me?

 

[Tope]

defeat me at this game

aka quit bein a scrub ^^

 

[KirbyKaze]

You sir are a hater.

I will defeat you.

 

[Tope]

I'll be at apex we can play there

 

[KirbyKaze]

And I will take what's mine!!!!!!!



a hug <3

 

[Tope]

your dignity? my top tier strats? my anal virginity????? omg the possibilities are endless

 

[Winston]

Reaction time is about 0.2 seconds, so 12 frames in this game

So, assuming you can write it as [ Tech Time - 12 frames (for reaction) = Time to React ] you have a good amount of time to get tech stand (14 frames of animation remaining, so you have like 7 to hit them because if you miss they Shine to escape -- this can be rectified in other ways but ideally you hit them while they're still in their animation) and like 28 for the tech rolls (in terms of animation left remaining it's 28 -- you'd again have to input the grab before then, so really more like 20-21). That's quite a difference.

It's just wikipedia, but:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hick's_law

suggests that it takes longer the more options you have to react to (which makes sense).

I think it definitely takes more than .2 seconds.

edit: now that I think about it some more it's probably closeish to .2 seconds after all for the tech in place because you kind of "assume" it, not sure how that affects the time for the other options though.

Also KK, where did you find the frame data for the tech animations?

 

[Kira-]

I thought standard reaction time was .3 seconds? I think I read that somewhere on srk forums

 

[KirbyKaze]

Also KK, where did you find the frame data for the tech animations?

It's in the OP...?

 

[Winston]

Oh yeah I'm a moron. Thanks. TBH I'd never looked at the op before

 

[Mew2King]

my reaction is like 0.26 average, 024 average when I'm REALLY fast

so it blows

I just know a lot and predict well

 

[soap]

I thought standard reaction time was .3 seconds? I think I read that somewhere on srk forums

my reaction is like 0.26 average, 024 average when I'm REALLY fast

so it blows

I just know a lot and predict well

lol quit braggin

where can i test this anyways?

 

[Winston]

Hm looking at the magus tech data, Fox and Falco actually start moving at frame 9, so isn't the time you have to react in actually 31 frames, not 40?

Am I not understanding it correctly?

 

[john!]

all this techchasing info is really useful, thanks guys

and lol @ kk and tope

 

[KirbyKaze]

Hm looking at the magus tech data, Fox and Falco actually start moving at frame 9, so isn't the time you have to react in actually 31 frames, not 40?

Am I not understanding it correctly?

That's probably correct. I didn't really look too deeply into the rolls because they're considerably easier than the tech stand.

 

[SPAWN]

About the cg'ing Ganon at 0, I have to check out what I was talking with Magus about but I'm pretty sure you can do it at like 5 lol. Once I get AR in the mail this will be much easier for me to verify things.

spawn u gotta teach me to ledge guard. ive gotten much better, but i want sleepyk to add me to the list of sheiks who dont let him come back once he goes off

Just be smart. When edgeguarding Falco when he's far offstage he's going to do one of three things.

Airdodge>LOL GET *****
Phantasm> OH BOY I HOPE I'M GOOD AT REACTING/HITTING THIS OVER B EARLY ENOUGH
UPB> OMFG ****ING NOOOB LOOLOLOLOLOL

I just assume they're always going to phantasm above the stage or sweetspot. Then I just react and make good decisions. I'll get up some more videos maybe....

That's how far I got, I'll read the rest later when I'm not so busy and I have internet on my laptop again. >_>

 

[nicaboy]

i shouldnt even be posting. oh gg tope. fun meeting/mm you. hella fun. i hear plank wasnt man enough to wanna play lol.planks a hella cool guy though

 

[unknown522]

Just be smart. When edgeguarding Falco when he's far offstage he's going to do one of three things.

Airdodge>LOL GET *****
Phantasm> OH BOY I HOPE I'M GOOD AT REACTING/HITTING THIS OVER B EARLY ENOUGH
UPB> OMFG ****ING NOOOB LOOLOLOLOLOL

I just assume they're always going to phantasm above the stage or sweetspot. Then I just react and make good decisions. I'll get up some more videos maybe....

That's good. Once they recover low, then it's impossible for them to recover, unless you let them get close enough to the wall to tech. F-tilt/b-air/n-air/d-smash does the rest.

ooooo isn't that just delightful.... and shield get up attack is what i try for everytime... even if they roll i try to react with a WD oos and get em

you can just crouch in front of them, to make things easier.

 

[h!tboxexplo!ter]

Reaction time is about 0.2 seconds, so 12 frames in this game

isnt that spontaneous reaction time (i think .25 is at least)? if you expect something (which you would for tech chasing, and there are so many things to watch for in addition to that) its prob more like 8-10 frames

Just be smart. When edgeguarding Falco when he's far offstage he's going to do one of three things.

Airdodge>LOL GET *****
Phantasm> OH BOY I HOPE I'M GOOD AT REACTING/HITTING THIS OVER B EARLY ENOUGH
UPB> OMFG ****ING NOOOB LOOLOLOLOLOL

I just assume they're always going to phantasm above the stage or sweetspot. Then I just react and make good decisions. I'll get up some more videos maybe....

T

if theyre close i like jumping off and doing rising nairs back to the stage. i can see as many as 4-5. profit
i like them against falcon too. if i can lucky i can get 3 nairs, then dsmash the reflex up-b->fair. mo profit

 

[Tope]

hooray sheik dittos.... >.> .....

 

[Lawrencelot]

isnt that spontaneous reaction time (i think .25 is at least)? if you expect something (which you would for tech chasing, and there are so many things to watch for in addition to that) its prob more like 8-10 frames

Nah, reaction time is usually measured while expecting something. Else it's kinda hard to measure. If you're driving a car and you suddenly have to break or something, the reaction time is probably higher. It's about 20-25 if you're expecting something I think.

 

[h!tboxexplo!ter]

Nah, reaction time is usually measured while expecting something. Else it's kinda hard to measure. If you're driving a car and you suddenly have to break or something, the reaction time is probably higher. It's about 20-25 if you're expecting something I think.

your post count is perfect btw. it would be really easy to measure spontaneous reaction time. but with tech chasing you only need to watch 4 things, but really just 2.5-3. as opposed to lets say walking to class and a frisbee comes at you from 3 o'clock. i would expect very different numbers for those two things

 

[soap]

i actually feel more comfortable with blind reaction

expectations cloud my judegement

 

[KirbyKaze]

I think if Falco wasn't in this game I might have mained Fox by now.

Sheik vs technical space animal is like just patience. It's so frustrating. It's not bad or anything, but you just wait and stare at them and spend a lot of time with spacing. And more spacing. And convincing them that holding shield is fantabulous so you can then reap grab --> death combo. Plus some pressure (spaced moves) and slowing them doing when they're getting a little too crazy with their movement, you're just waiting for them to give into their antsy nerves and be stupid.

Sheik is so boring sometimes.

 

[soap]

you can do pretty well just freestyle throwing moves out there too.

its more fun than being patient

 

[KirbyKaze]

This is true.

I guess I'm just jealous of Fox's shield pressure game.

 

[Winston]

Don't all characters besides space animals themselves have to deal with them by spacing a bunch and being patient?

I don't think it's just sheik.

 

[soap]

sheik shield pressure has some advantages over foxes shield pressure. with fox you have to really work your way inside to start pressuring, then u like have to keep doing stuff and not mess up or you get grabbed.

sheik can like space a bair, walk away for a sec, run back boost grab the roll. or throw a tilt if they try anything funny. the goofy lazy nature of it is definitely more my style

 

[#HBC | Mac]

lol sheiks shield pressure is def vastly inferior to foxes -- not even a question

 

[KirbyKaze]

Don't all characters besides space animals themselves have to deal with them by spacing a bunch and being patient?

I don't think it's just sheik.

Peach can explode all over shields.

But yeah I get what you're saying.

 

[Tope]

i actually feel more comfortable with blind reaction

expectations cloud my judegement

this ^^^^ 100% angus for me

 

[Dynamism?]

I need help. I don't know if anyone here would bother but I'm posting this anyway.

I've really been struggling to narrow down the characters I use in tournament, etc. (a main in general really) I simply can't decide who to play. I enjoy playing them all and have been successful in MMs and tourneys with each of them so none of that has cleared this up for me or been an issue, I just simply don't know who to stick with so even use random often.

If anyone cares about having 1 more Shiek player, or wants me to stick with him if you know me or anything, please vote. :\

Any input is good but meaningless votes are completely welcome too if you don't know me/don't care but would still want me to play Shiek or something.
I just need help.

Thanks. hahah
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=10468126#post10468126

 

[soap]

play sheik fox and marth and counterpick people

that seems to be the most logical decision (if you like to beat people)

 

[ChivalRuse]

play sheik fox and marth and counterpick people

that seems to be the most logical decision (if you like to beat people)

Sound advice. Lol.

 

[KirbyKaze]

That works until you find someone that's just plain better than you overall and can overcome the matchup. Or you get gayed by double blind somewhere down the line.

 

[Teczer0]

That works until you find someone that's just plain better than you overall and can overcome the matchup. Or you get gayed by double blind somewhere down the line.

play sheik fox and marth and counterpick people

that seems to be the most logical decision (if you like to beat people)

Funny story I do this

Well... replace sheik with peach

THEN I do this XD...

Though soon I'll soon be replacing Marth with Sheik probably

 

[KirbyKaze]

I think you only need two most of the time. Space animal + ranged character/floaty has positive matchup or even on everything.

 

[Teczer0]

I think fox/falco + sheik is a solid mix by itself.

But yea you're probably right Dave.

I just <3 playing peach and find a lot of uses for her.

But theoretically the more characters you can play the better imo

 

[Vts]

I think fox/falco + sheik is a solid mix by itself.

But yea you're probably right Dave.

I just <3 playing peach and find a lot of uses for her.

But theoretically the more characters you can play the better imo.

tell iori that :D.

also boo

**** it don't edit your posts while i'm trying to quote you ><

 

[pockyD]

fox or falco beats everyone anyway