Scar talks Lean Melee [2012YotF]

[NES n00b]

^^Maybe the nair approach can work vs samus if you fast fall between the 2 hits so that the second hit connects just before you hit the ground, followed by dashing away asap? If you space it right it should work.
But that requires VERY precise spacing & timing. And this type of spacing also requires you to have (almost) no momentum in the jump, which decreases the range in a way.
Dair just feels safer/better in general vs someone who's CC:ing

Scar: Hugs said in the samus boards that samus has the advantage over falcon in that matchup. I know you've played with him, do you know why he thinks samus has the advantage? And what do you think of this matchup?

He probably thinks Samus has the advantage cause there is no good ways to land kill moves on Samus and no reliable way to edgeguard her and the fact she can beat Falcon's priority if she spaces right and is patient.

I am not going to say what I think of the matchup. I am going to say that LEARN TO SPACE THE NAIR. Not that hard.

Edit: Mostly you want to hit with the second part of the nair. You can use the first hit of the nair to stop approaches, but when you are truly approaching, you are mostly going to hit with second hit of the nair.

 

[Scar]

Scar: Hugs said in the samus boards that samus has the advantage over falcon in that matchup. I know you've played with him, do you know why he thinks samus has the advantage? And what do you think of this matchup?

I 3 stocked him at pound3, and I didn't make it out of second round of pools and he got like 5th or something. Clearly he was the better player but I ***** him and should have won the set if I hadn't choked.

Most CFs he plays probably have a big problem with him jab canceling all the time but idk, he played like any other Samus IMO. M2K's Samus is infinitely harder and he makes it seem like the matchup may almost be even, but I still beat him, and god forbid I play Samus vs his CF, there is literally nothing she can do.

HIGHLY in CF's favor.

edit: If she hits you with upB at low %s wiggle out and grab her or otherwise ****. Once you hit her and keep pressure on there is nothing she can do but upB, all you have to do is predict one of them, dj away, wait for her to land and knee the balls off her, if she's going for the ledge then just uair her offstage, she has no dj, **** her recovery.

upB is a pretty bad move all said and done, it just frustrates people. also make sure you know all of the timings for shieldstun because almost all of my first hits v samus are against stupid attacks on my shield, it's pretty easy to consistently punish all of her smashes, you have a nice frame gap so take your time. I have also punished dtilt but that requires either more precision or the people i have hit out of it were too stupid to IASA

 

[Mox]

what can i do against ganon?

 

[JonaDiaper]

**** him??

 

[demodemo]

i hate getting inside characters with huge disjointed hitboxes like marth and roy

is there a move or tactic captain falcon has that will break their defense consistently? i know all of cf's moves get outranged D:

or do i have to like DD and do random things until they approach and whiff something?

 

[DrewB008]

just gotta trick em basically, yeah

dash dance or shield and bait attacks that you can punish

nair does ok sometimes but you gotta catch them when theyre not quite ready otherwise theyll just hit you

 

[HugeHo]

I 3 stocked him at pound3, and I didn't make it out of second round of pools and he got like 5th or something. Clearly he was the better player but I ***** him and should have won the set if I hadn't choked.

Most CFs he plays probably have a big problem with him jab canceling all the time but idk, he played like any other Samus IMO. M2K's Samus is infinitely harder and he makes it seem like the matchup may almost be even, but I still beat him, and god forbid I play Samus vs his CF, there is literally nothing she can do.

****, freakin randoms thinking they're hot **** long after 99% of the respectable pro community drops out of the scene.
Get the **** out of here.

LoL @ you bragging about 3 stocking me in a pools set that you lost. That's like me bragging about 3 stocking you in the friendlies we played prior and afterwards. You should know better man. But any chance to brag about a close set vs HugS i guess. Right?


You had your 20 man crew backing you up as well. I was on your turf.
No johns but my experience allows me to win in situations like that, I don't care about ******. The fact of the matter is, you didn't win, and I know the match up better.

Watch the vids again, I choked way more than you did. That last stock where I ***** your ****, that's the real HugS. I thought you'd be respectable enough to not base an entire match up on a single pools set.
Well, that's your experience with the match up I guess. Gotta take what you're given. I've only done it for about 4 years though, so I guess you'd know more.

Get the **** out of here kid.

 

[MikeHaggarTHAKJB]

^^So I'm guessing you're Hugs?
Could you share more opinions about the Samus-Falcon matchup?
I've started using CF against Samus a little bit cuz my fox sucks against Samus. Would you consider it worthwhile to learn CF to use against Samus? (considering I main fox)
Thanks Scar & Hugs

 

[HugS™]

^^So I'm guessing you're Hugs?
Could you share more opinions about the Samus-Falcon matchup?
I've started using CF against Samus a little bit cuz my fox sucks against Samus. Would you consider it worthwhile to learn CF to use against Samus? (considering I main fox)
Thanks Scar & Hugs

Go ahead and use Falcon. 99.9% of all samus players have trouble in the match up anyways. You'll be way more successful since a lot of less experienced Samus players will just try to Dsmash your shield all day. But the match up should still be in Samus's favor.

Look, the fact of the matter is, anyone above Samus on the tier list can beat Samus if the player played perfectly.

However, the idea is not to create expectations that exceed practicality. That is, if no one can do it, why talk about it?

By all practical means, Samus should beat falcon. Yes, I know, you have all these keyboard warriors talking about how easy it is to avoid "this" or to punish "that". But in practice, things don't work out that way. Especially amongst falcons. Especially amongst falcons vs me.

I know using my Samus as an example isn't very practical and kind of contradicts what I said. But don't be fooled. Using the metagame as a standard is always acceptable. And I've always used players who have taken their characters to their metagames as standards for my ideas on match ups.

 

[Kouryuu]

Prior to Pound 3 (i.e. at his prime), Hugs never lost to a Falcon for 3 straight years.

LOL @ Scar thinking he was the man to end the streak.

 

[JonaDiaper]

he said he has experience vs m2k's samus tho. its m2k come on

 

[soap]

lolol HugeHO

thats waaay better than hugs

 

[onlymaskde]

What are some good stages to take Sheik and Marth to (besides Stadium)?

 

[DrewB008]

fd and dreamland

 

[Mokumo]

yo scar, why do falcon and luigi make such a good team? is there anything other than grab+knee/up+b or chop > falcon punch?

 

[Scidadle]

What should I do vs a lighter character such as a jiggs or mario if I get them in a grab? I can never connect down throw + knee

 

[JonaDiaper]

try down throw nair or uair

 

[DrewB008]

id uthrow mario, at least at some percents, i dont think you can hit him with anything if he DI's dthrow away

jiggs always dthrow, go for uair most of the time cause you can get rested if youre not perfect with the knee, which is pretty hard to be

 

[NES n00b]

id uthrow mario, at least at some percents, i dont think you can hit him with anything if he DI's dthrow away

jiggs always dthrow, go for uair most of the time cause you can get rested if youre not perfect with the knee, which is pretty hard to be

Upthrow doesn't have enough hit stun. And no you can always hit him with something with downthrow even if it is just a grab. You just have to hit him with quick moves.........

 

[DrewB008]

are you serious

man i have **** tech skill

but uthrow uair works, and im pretty sure uthrow knee works at a few percents, i mean it works on peach how can it not work on mario

 

[NES n00b]

are you serious

man i have **** tech skill

but uthrow uair works, and im pretty sure uthrow knee works at a few percents, i mean it works on peach how can it not work on mario

it works in the sense that they will nair but still get hit I guess.

 

[DrewB008]

yo i just experimented some and i gotta say that uthrow is more reliable, mashing A the nair still didnt come out when we tried uthrow uair but dthrow that was correctly DI'd was never followed with anything unless it was tech chased at low %

 

[Scar]

****, freakin randoms thinking they're hot **** long after 99% of the respectable pro community drops out of the scene.
Get the **** out of here.

LoL @ you bragging about 3 stocking me in a pools set that you lost. That's like me bragging about 3 stocking you in the friendlies we played prior and afterwards. You should know better man. But any chance to brag about a close set vs HugS i guess. Right?


You had your 20 man crew backing you up as well. I was on your turf.
No johns but my experience allows me to win in situations like that, I don't care about ******. The fact of the matter is, you didn't win, and I know the match up better.

Watch the vids again, I choked way more than you did. That last stock where I ***** your ****, that's the real HugS. I thought you'd be respectable enough to not base an entire match up on a single pools set.
Well, that's your experience with the match up I guess. Gotta take what you're given. I've only done it for about 4 years though, so I guess you'd know more.

Get the **** out of here kid.

lol Wow good **** there bud. It's completely obvious from the entire rest of the post that I wasn't bragging at all, in fact the point I was making wouldn't have held if the entire emphasis wasn't on the fact that you were way better at that point.

Sorry I hurt your pride big guy.

 

[Hax]

scar is gonna leave genesis a verrrrry rich man

 

[Scar]

lol seriously i should just MM the entire west coast

if i get to hax pound 3 status ill beat silent wolf easy lol, im pumped to play all those guys though, SW, eggz, KA MASTER (love that guy), SS, zhu, the list goes on and on

 

[DtJ Jungle]

lol just be humble when you ****

and keep training. EC got somethin to prove.

 

[Eggz]

Beating Silent Wolf easily is quite an arrogant claim when you don't know how good the NorthWest is now. Just sayin'. <3 Scar.

 

[Kouryuu]

Scar must REALLY have a small ****.

Most of the players he mentioned would BUT **** him. And it's even funnier how he thinks WC won't improve at all while he gets to "hax Pound 3 status" LMAO. Scar... when people think of the EC, trust me when I say that you don't come to anyone's mind. That's how it is now and sadly, that's how it will always be.

Seriously... stop thinking you're GOOD. You're 2nd rate at best (that might be an overstatement though).

 

[NES n00b]

LOL at eastcoast and westcoast shenanigans.

Edit: Also drew, you can regrab mario if he DI's the downthrow away at low percents.

 

[Scar]

Beating Silent Wolf easily is quite an arrogant claim when you don't know how good the NorthWest is now. Just sayin'. <3 Scar.

lol Yeah that was a joke, more like Hax propaganda. btw

you don't know how good the NorthWest is now.

... that sounds awesome.

Seriously... stop thinking you're GOOD. You're 2nd rate at best (that might be an overstatement though).

True, instead I should get pumped to play random WC scrub 45. We'll see, trash talk is cool but there's no point in repeatedly annoying me if we already have 20 bucks on the match, just go practice and I'll buy my 200+ dollar plane ticket.

And I'll whip my **** out at any time bro I'll put 5 bucks on that too. If you're black I get odds tho 'cause that just ain't fair.

Also drew, you can regrab mario if he DI's the downthrow away at low percents.

Yeah dthrow nair isn't always guaranteed like it basically is vs Doc, so dthrow regrab works, but even at some low%s they can upB out of a lot of throw combos that usually work, so watch for that.

 

[JonaDiaper]

And I'll whip my **** out at any time bro I'll put 5 bucks on that too. If you're black I get odds tho 'cause that just ain't fair.

ahahahahahahah i almost died because of this lmao

oh man your too freakin good

ahh

 

[Mogwai]

lol just be humble when you ****

Scar? Humble? What?



TO: West Coast
RE: Scar

No matter how much of a douche bag Scar is towards you and how much you want to judge him, don't underestimate him. Scar's no joke and will knee your face in. Good talk, see you out there,

Mogwai

 

[Kouryuu]

Keep it in your pants Scar, I'll quit pestering you. Just don't forget our MM.

I'll probably drop by time to time to keep reminding you.

 

[Byron 1337]

Scar- What are some suggestions when you being edge guarded by Marth.

 

[Mogwai]

Scar- What are some suggestions when you being edge guarded by Marth.

I'm not scar, but i've found that fast falling is the best option. might as well save yourself the frustration and time of being fsmashed 645718347589741239847 times in a row and start the next stock ASAP.

 

[Scar]

Keep it in your pants Scar, I'll quit pestering you. Just don't forget our MM.

I'll probably drop by time to time to keep reminding you.

lmao That sounds good it'll keep me practicing.

Scar- What are some suggestions when you being edge guarded by Marth.

Alright well I'll start off by saying that my general rule vs playing Marth is to not get frustrated and assume that every single time you're offstage, expect that you are not going to make it back onto the stage. This will help you not play stupidly if you do get edgeguarded 0-death, and give you extra incentive to **** him when you're both on the stage.

You always want your jump, but then again recovering in the middle of the stage can be a good idea so you can DJ falcon kick dj again, so if you're recovering really high I would suggest the "up and over" approach and aim for the middle of the stage. Top platforms are of course the best, you'll probably get naired so DI up. Lower platforms suck b/c if you get tipped you die. Keep stage positioning in mind, I find that FoD (as unholy it is) is better vs Marth than Yoshi's, so maybe ban YS.

Anyways when you're below the stage the only huge tip I have for you is to practice reverse upB, and before that even, make sure you can come as close to sweetspotting as CF is able to. Know what you're up against, Marths are fairly easy to read in terms of what they're going to do, but they don't really care because it's really effective no matter what.

dtilt, nB, and fsmash are what you're up against, and reverse upB will pretty much always get you around all three of them if they are spaced far from the ledge. If their spacing is closer then don't go for the sweetspot and try to upB into them, upB will grab and YESZ all of those moves.

That aside if you're grabbed at the ledge at low %s DI away please, otherwise you'll see a pretty fair dtilt tipper combo or whatever other crap Marth can do to you.

 

[DrewB008]

i feel the need to say experiment with that FoD vs ys stuff before you just take scars word on that, let your own preference decide cause i know i strongly prefer story to FoD

 

[Scar]

Yeah I hate FoD too but I just started playing on it, there are some neat things you can do with the platforms with dairs and fB's but bottom line if you shffl around a lot they ARE going to get in your way.

IMO vs Marth YS is bad because the bottom of the stage is so small it's difficult to maneuver and give yourself time to sweetspot, he can also hit you with that stupid downward angle on the stage, and tippers are so easy to line up it's not even fair.

Fountain is terrible because it will mess up all your combos and there is just as little room to run around.

These 2 stages should be the counterpick choices against you though so learn how to deal with one of them vs Marf.

 

[DrewB008]

yeah, i shffl around a lot

ive done my fair share of goofy fod tricks, but overall i feel like situations arise there too often where i know the thing i want to do just wont happen. my instincts and habits will tell me to do things that will work on every other level but wont work there.

i also like tech chasing on the platforms on yoshis story

 

[Eggz]

Haha I've wanted to play Scar for a while. Any big EC melee tourneys comin up? I've been wantin to come out for a while. I'm going to one in the midwest in a couple months.