Scar on the Melee vs Brawl debate: What does competitive really mean?

[Samochan]

My point was that the physics make sense. As I said, I'm aware we're talking about a game with anthropomorphic animals from outer space and magical girls, but people still generally like it when the things they can do in a game make sense to them.

Such as...?

Double jumping in the air? Aerial dodge? Bubble shield? Invincibility? Hidden Hitboxes? Many up b's? (like dolphin slash)

>_>

Physics don't make much sense to me.

 

[Reaver197]

Arguing over how "realistic" the smash series is? And using anime as an example?

EL - OH - EL

 

[Dark Sonic]

For a random person like you or me, that's the case. However, for experienced martial arts fighters (which applies here since all Brawl combatants fight at least a decent amount in their games), they can take hits a lot better since they either know how to deal with or can resist the pain better.

Marth slices Fox with a fair...Fox up smashes.

How is this realistic at all. When would a Fox be wearing a combat outfit and be fighting against a medevil swordsman? When would getting sliced in half not kill said Fox? And why would getting kicked be so much more deadly than getting sliced?

You're thinking too much of those anime where the characters either pull out magic attacks out from their rear ends or pilot a giant robot. Watch one that uses real life physics and you'll see what I mean.

I stab you in the Gut...you bend over in pain
I knee in the face when you bend over...you real back from impact
I punch you in the face...you real back further due to momentum from the knee to the face.
I hook your front leg and pull it foward...you real back even further and are likely knocked off balance.
I push your chest down from this position...you fall

That was a 5 hit real life combo. And now that you're on the ground...I get to "tech chase"

My point was that the physics make sense. As I said, I'm aware we're talking about a game with anthropomorphic animals from outer space and magical girls, but people still generally like it when the things they can do in a game make sense to them.

Then we should take away air control, up Bs, second jumps, and bubble shields as well, because those are impossible.

You're working under the assumption that anyone new has had no experience with competative Smash before joining. I admit I did not really lurk here for a while before joining (just long enough to get an idea of the comminuty, which only takes a few days at most)

No...it really doesn't. It easily can take months to just get used to who to listen to on the boards, and who actually knows what they are talking about.

but I was still part of the Melee competative community long before now and simply got my information from elsewhere.

Good for you but the fact of the matter is that a good reputation must be earned, and that your opinion is indeed less valuable than others until proven otherwise.

 

[The Halloween Captain]

Don't you guys just love how bashing noobs brings about intelligent conversation? While I realize that noobs often enter the boards totally unaware of what they are talking about (me being a prime example two months back) I hardly see the purpose of this discussion at all. In the final analysis, Melee is dead. Brawl is alive. And it doesn't matter what competitive really means - because it won't bring melee back.

 

[LP4Life666]

Don't you guys just love how bashing noobs brings about intelligent conversation? While I realize that noobs often enter the boards totally unaware of what they are talking about (me being a prime example two months back) I hardly see the purpose of this discussion at all. In the final analysis, Melee is dead. Brawl is alive. And it doesn't matter what competitive really means - because it won't bring melee back.

And it only took 390 pages. :bigthumbu

 

[Skler]

I went to a Melee tournament yesterday.

It had 24 entrants I think, which isn't a lot but it also isn't terrible. Melee isn't dead, you're silly if you say that. It's smaller then it was before, but brawl tournament attendance is also dropping. The Brawl section of the tournament had a 25 person drop in attendance. That's a lot.

 

[Zankoku]

I'm pretty sure I still see Melee tourneys getting hosted. I don't see how a game dies when a decent number of people still play it.

 

[metaXzero]

Melee isn't dead. But it might as well be on life support.

KEEP SUPPORTING MELEE!!

 

[NJzFinest]

I was still part of the Melee competative community long before now.

What the ****... you = who???

 

[Aesir]

I went to a Melee tournament yesterday.

It had 24 entrants I think, which isn't a lot but it also isn't terrible. Melee isn't dead, you're silly if you say that. It's smaller then it was before, but brawl tournament attendance is also dropping. The Brawl section of the tournament had a 25 person drop in attendance. That's a lot.

24 entrants is terrible >_> stop deluding yourself melee is on the road to death.

 

[DarkDragoon]

24 entrants is terrible >_> stop deluding yourself melee is on the road to death.

Aesir's father never hugged him as a child.
-DD

 

[-Wolfy-]

Aesir, stop deluding yourself concerning his delusions. Everything dies, and that is a fact. Except melee.


EDIT: Nice sig. I'm hooked on Code Geass.

 

[Aesir]

Aesir, stop deluding yourself concerning his delusions. Everything dies, and that is a fact. Except melee.


EDIT: Nice sig. I'm hooked on Code Geass.

Really?

mm10

1: Falcon Punch ($50.60)
2: Cort ($27.60)
3: Dazwa ($13.80)
4: Skler
5: Eve
5: Pine
7: AOI
7: Boxman
9: Nuro sucks
9: Flaco
9: Hayato
9: MattDotZeb
13: Xander
13: Weapon X
13: KevinM
13: Sai
17: Questor
17: Pef7
17: Vigiliante
17: Kyu Puff
17: ThreeX
17: Variola
17: Spife



As skler says "not that bad"


mm9:

1: Cort ($72.60)
2: PC Chris ($39.60)
3: Darc ($19.80)
4: HBK
5: Racer X (Elen)
5: Gerudo
7: ZoSo
7: Skler
9: Hazzard
9: AOI
9: Vigilante
9: Trees
13: Aiser
13: Alejandro_P
13: 3x
13: Silas
17: Speed Racer (Questor)
17: Pine
17: Icylight
17: AwesomeSean
17: Sar
17: Roman
17: Milktea
17: KevinM
25: Pef7
25: Ricky
25: Spife
25: Reno
25: Alex
25: Purple Cobra
25: Jordan
25: Kyu Puff
33: Murch
33: Charley

it's amost doubled.

Melee isn't making a come back it's dying. I'd hate to admit but it's true, denying it is to deny the facts.

 

[metaXzero]

Melee won't die as long as people support it. That's a fact.

 

[Skler]

24 entrants for a local tourny isn't too bad. Mass madness used to get around 30-40 regularly, and then right before brawl that went up to like 60-70.

The main thing is a bunch of you CT people ended up not going. Where were you, spawn, blue, milktea, darc and awesomesean HUH?

Melee isn't getting bigger, but it isn't like a ton of melee people switched to brawl. There aren't a lot of people who switched from melee to ONLY brawl.

 

[-Wolfy-]

I guess we should all just face the facts and go play brawl.

But wait...

If we do just that then we are the reason it dies.

Pessimism met with the mob mentality is an awful combination.

 

[The Halloween Captain]

There will always be those who stay behind.

They get left behind.

No big deal, its only a game.

 

[Aesir]

24 entrants for a local tourny isn't too bad. Mass madness used to get around 30-40 regularly, and then right before brawl that went up to like 60-70.

The main thing is a bunch of you CT people ended up not going. Where were you, spawn, blue, milktea, darc and awesomesean HUH?

Melee isn't getting bigger, but it isn't like a ton of melee people switched to brawl. There aren't a lot of people who switched from melee to ONLY brawl.

Jake is busy, lil works, sean doesn't go to tourneys anymore cause he thinks it's a waste of money, I didn't go cause I had no ride.

Our attendance wouldn't have jumped the entrance all that much. Fact is melee is a dying game that will only decrease as time goes on. Many have realized this.

No ones telling you, you can't play melee or you shouldn't. What they're saying is accept the facts and realize it's dying.

I guess we should all just face the facts and go play brawl.

But wait...

If we do just that then we are the reason it dies.

Pessimism met with the mob mentality is an awful combination.

*********** met with sticking words into peoples mouths is dumb. I never said you didn't I'm just pointing something out, melee is dying. Play the game you want to play but don't whine when melee starts losing tourney support.

 

[-Wolfy-]

I never whined I just pointed out the snowballing effect of pessimism.

And if you can reason that melée is not gaining more support, then it is dying more than it is thriving, but there still seem to be enough players to keep it going for the time being.

and I hope you don't think I've been rude, I value your point and assertions.

 

[Aesir]

I never whined I just pointed out the snowballing effect of pessimism.

And if you can reason that melée is not gaining more support, then it is dying more than it is thriving, but there still seem to be enough players to keep it going for the time being.

My point isn't about now it's about the future. Stop shoving words into my mouth, it's not good debating it's ********.

 

[LOL_Master]

melee won't die because i am still playing melee

 

[-Wolfy-]

I'm not shoving words in your mouth, you seem more acidic in tone than is probably necessary.

 

[Zankoku]

There will always be those who stay behind.

They get left behind.

No big deal, its only a game.

It's called "playing more than one game."

Though I suppose bad players are incapable of doing that. Some johns about "losing all their tech skill" or "nobody plays Melee any more."

 

[-Wolfy-]

I've found that its not too difficult to play both frequently and simultaneously, however playing brawl exclusively and then going back to melée does have a more devastating effect on habits.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

>___>

Can't we all just get along?

/typical shallow statement

Smooth Criminal

 

[AetherLord]

If people stil play it..then its not dead...

Just wait...Good amount of people are gonna go back to melee...I know I definately have...

 

[thumbswayup]

Melee for ****ing life.

 

[EC_Joey]

I did it. I went to Mass Madness 10 and did not play a single game of Brawl. All Melee.

 

[thumbswayup]

I did it. I went to Mass Madness 10 and did not play a single game of Brawl. All Melee.

You are a God among men.

 

[stratele]

I played melee to death, and your right, its different in a strange kind of way.

But brawl, is an overall better game in my opinion. I got used to it fairly quickly. And now all I play is brawl.

But I played melee the other day, and I found that my skills on that wernt changed at all. infact I was better. They are still similar games.

I found melee harder, also I never used Z/L canceling or wavedashing or whatever. I have only just heard of em. Ive got by fine, they just sound like stupid techniques that arent meant to be techniques that people use to make the game easyer. Fight like men

 

[Corigames]

I found melee harder, also I never used Z/L canceling or wavedashing or whatever. I have only just heard of em. Ive got by fine, they just sound like stupid techniques that arent meant to be techniques that people use to make the game easyer. Fight like men

And this is why you like Brawl more. If you like playing duck pins with bumpers, go ahead. But people who want to play for real will grab some 15 pound balls and go Bowling. (That was a metaphore for Brawl being watered down and Melee being better).

 

[LavisFiend]

If people stil play it..then its not dead...

Just wait...Good amount of people are gonna go back to melee...I know I definately have...

The issue is that only older smash players will go back to Melee if they sort of grew with the scene.

Chances are good that the majority of the newer crowd entering the whole smash craze will not go to Melee because they will only see melee at face value and Brawl at face value, and Brawl at face value dwarf's Melee at face value because it has quantity and illusions of quality.

The sad truth is that Brawl is too obscenely popular at the current moment.

 

[Corigames]

We should all abandon ship because all the cool kids are doing it... except all the cool kids aren't. All the new people are doing it and are dragging the old***s down too. If you honestly like Melee more, then play it, please. It would suck to get OK at Brawl and not like and find out you were amazing at Melee and love it. If you go with the one you WANT to play, regardless of who's playing it, it makes everyone's life easier.

Stop saying it's dead. It's not. Stop abandoning things because everyone else is doing it. They're not. Don't be stupid.

 

[LavisFiend]

Wow Corey, with your abilities of putting words in people's mouth, you can really make yourself seem so very smart.

I never said it was dead.

I never said everyone was abandoning it.

I never said I abandoned it.

Just shut up, and quit bending my words.

 

[Corigames]

Because I quite directly addressed you didn't I? Are you not putting words in my mouth by saying that I was talking to you? Aren't you high and mighty by saying you are being oppressed by me? You can make yourself seem very smart by trying to retort to a person who wasn't even speaking to you. Actually, I'm quite impressed at how that even works!

Just shut up and stop bending my words.

 

[LavisFiend]

What amazes me is how you never man up for the stuff you say and always try to find a way to weasel out of it.

You don't need to quote someone when you want to directly speak to them. Your comment was aimed at mine. It preceded right after mine, and due to the material being directly related to what I said in the beginning and fueled based off things I didn't even say is how I came up with a claim of you taking what I said out of context to try to make yourself out to be better than me.

There is also the whole "stop saying it's dead" comment of yours.

Who is saying it is dead? If you are under the assumption I was, (because your comment is an understood "you" without proper specification,) you are wrong, because I didn't.

If someone else said this, and it was TRULY aimed at them, then wouldn't you think it would help to SPECIFY who you were directing the whole entirety of your post at instead of posting something that can easily be connected with my post as a hostile misguided post of taking someone out of context?

If you were not directing the post at me....

Who were you directing it to?

 

[KosukeKGA]

Everyone who plays Brawl and has not played Melee.

 

[metaXzero]

I played melee to death, and your right, its different in a strange kind of way.

But brawl, is an overall better game in my opinion. I got used to it fairly quickly. And now all I play is brawl.

But I played melee the other day, and I found that my skills on that wernt changed at all. infact I was better. They are still similar games.

I found melee harder, also I never used Z/L canceling or wavedashing or whatever. I have only just heard of em. Ive got by fine, they just sound like stupid techniques that arent meant to be techniques that people use to make the game easyer. Fight like men

Stating an opinion is one thing. But thosw last lines..

It's like you want to get verbally assaulted here. >_<

 

[Corigames]

What amazes me is how you never man up for the stuff you say and always try to find a way to weasel out of it.

Yes, I always do that. It's my thing. I get off by jumping into threads, masturbating on some poor new guy's face, and then trying to slip away before someone catches me on it. Well ****, it looks like you caught me this time. Slap the cuffs on and send me away.

You don't need to quote someone when you want to directly speak to them.

That's true.

Your comment was aimed at mine.

that's false

It preceded right after mine,

That's true

and due to the material being directly related to what I said in the beginning and fueled based off things I didn't even say is how I came up with a claim of you taking what I said out of context to try to make yourself out to be better than me.

So, let me get this straight. My post followed yours, so you thought it was related. Ok, that's understandable. Yet, when looking into it further and discovering that I wasn't talking about what you said, instead of then assuming I wasn't talking about you, you instead thought, "Wow, he's putting words in my mouth?" Is that about it? If so... **** you.

There is also the whole "stop saying it's dead" comment of yours.

Who is saying it is dead? If you are under the assumption I was, (because your comment is an understood "you" without proper specification,) you are wrong, because I didn't.

I know you didn't. I think I would agree with the post you made before deciding to point a flamethrower at me for all the wrong reasons. Maybe that's your thing. I gotta ask... did you at least ***? If not, I'll keep going until you do. Anything to make you feel better.

If someone else said this, and it was TRULY aimed at them, then wouldn't you think it would help to SPECIFY who you were directing the whole entirety of your post at instead of posting something that can easily be connected with my post as a hostile misguided post of taking someone out of context?

No, because I assume that if I say, "Republicans suck!" a democrat that also dislikes Republicans wouldn't be offended by it. If what I'm saying doesn't affect you, then you shouldn't be effected by it.

If you were not directing the post at me....

Who were you directing it to?

Fact is melee is a dying game that will only decrease as time goes on.

Melee isn't making a come back it's dying. I'd hate to admit but it's true, denying it is to deny the facts.

24 entrants is terrible >_> stop deluding yourself melee is on the road to death.

I didn't notice until just now that it was one person making all those claims. I guess I just assumed that it was multiple people saying that Melee was dieing out, and so I made a "shotgun" post aimed at everyone posting like that. However, you decided to jump in fron of the barrel and tank the whole shot. Thanks, way to KS.

 

[metaXzero]

You missed The Halloween Captain corey (The one who first said "Melee's dead" here).