Sakurai does not want Smash to be a competitive franchise

[Mardyke]

The more I read that article on Sakurai, and the more I hear the criticisms and cynicisms of players against anything other than a full-out competitive game in the likes of Starcraft II, the stronger I sympathise and agree with him.

Let's not forget what we're talking about here when we talk about a competitive game - we're talking about a game. Something we play for fun. I've played my fair share of competitive games and while I know the adrenaline of fully outdoing someone, I also know the penalty of being outdone or not living up to the other person's standards. There are a lot of "pros" who are borderline antisocial whether victorious or defeated, but are almost never humble; and it's even worse when they pretend to be humble but obviously aren't.

That's the kind of gamer a fully competitive game urges. Not one who plays the game for fun, not one who remembers that a game's a game and not something worth ignoring your entire work for. When I look at a SSB video online, I'd like not to worry about what happens to the other guy if he loses: I just think that both players do their best to put up a good fight, and as long as they do that then that is what counts - not that someone can do it better than them.

I suppose when it comes to the essence of a competition, I feel similar to Sakurai. And that's why I like Brawl both as a fun game and a competitive game - I can feel good whether or not I win or lose. There'll always be room for improvement, but having a heartier atmosphere helps far more than an intimidating one.

Also, first post. Woohoo to Smash World. :D

 

[rathy Aro]

There is too much *****ing about Brawl vs. Melee on this site. If Sakurai did see this he would really be ashamed of American gamers. I don't think people in Japan made a big fuss about it (then again I could be wrong).

I don't think American competitive smashers care about Sakurai's feelings. There's a general dislike for him here.

 

[Black Mantis]

The more I read that article on Sakurai, and the more I hear the criticisms and cynicisms of players against anything other than a full-out competitive game in the likes of Starcraft II, the stronger I sympathise and agree with him.

Let's not forget what we're talking about here when we talk about a competitive game - we're talking about a game. Something we play for fun. I've played my fair share of competitive games and while I know the adrenaline of fully outdoing someone, I also know the penalty of being outdone or not living up to the other person's standards. There are a lot of "pros" who are borderline antisocial whether victorious or defeated, but are almost never humble; and it's even worse when they pretend to be humble but obviously aren't.

That's the kind of gamer a fully competitive game urges. Not one who plays the game for fun, not one who remembers that a game's a game and not something worth ignoring your entire work for. When I look at a SSB video online, I'd like not to worry about what happens to the other guy if he loses: I just think that both players do their best to put up a good fight, and as long as they do that then that is what counts - not that someone can do it better than them.

I suppose when it comes to the essence of a competition, I feel similar to Sakurai. And that's why I like Brawl both as a fun game and a competitive game - I can feel good whether or not I win or lose. There'll always be room for improvement, but having a heartier atmosphere helps far more than an intimidating one.

Also, first post. Woohoo to Smash World. :D

You sir receive an epic win!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Jack Kieser]

I assure you, the community does not agree with either of your sentiments.

 

[Black Mantis]

What I don't get is how people can hate Sakurai even though they've never met him. Sakurai hasn't done anything to anyone on this site such as kill a loved one or set someone's house on fire but because he designed a video game a certain way they talk crap about him and say they hate him or he's ********?

 

[LOL_Master]

no one hates sakurai as a person you fool, it's the decision he made, so if you made the decision that he made, you will be hated for that decision, if i saw sakurai on the street i'd say what's up, but then talk about how i don't like some of the things he did for brawl and then obviously make l8ke teh next game like way betterr

 

[Black Mantis]

no one hates sakurai as a person you fool, it's the decision he made, so if you made the decision that he made, you will be hated for that decision, if i saw sakurai on the street i'd say what's up, but then talk about how i don't like some of the things he did for brawl and then obviously make l8ke teh next game like way betterr

Trust me I've seen many people put in that they hate Sakurai on this site along with that he's ********.

 

[Mardyke]

Then how come there are so many messages on this board on any given day insulting Sakurai the person just as much as there are honest, well-meaning criticisms?

 

[Jack Kieser]

no one hates sakurai as a person you fool, it's the decision he made, so if you made the decision that he made, you will be hated for that decision, if i saw sakurai on the street i'd say what's up, but then talk about how i don't like some of the things he did for brawl and then obviously make l8ke teh next game like way betterr

You know just as well as we do that this is NOT the case. People honestly think (and post!) that Sak must have a personal vendetta against competitive gamers in general and SWF in particular. More people than is healthy really think that Sak made every decision he did out of pure hateful spite for this community.

I don't agree with him either, but it's pointless to name-call and disrespect anyone to the extent that people do on this site towards one person.

 

[Black Mantis]

Like I said, if Sakurai saw this crap he would be ashamed of American gamers.

 

[Jack Kieser]

Honestly, I think this thread needs to be shut down. I really don't see the point in discussing something like this; this thread's revival can only bring more bad crap. Besides, it always inevitably brings on the MvB spam, and Mic has already warned us about that.

 

[Black Mantis]

Honestly, I think this thread needs to be shut down. I really don't see the point in discussing something like this; this thread's revival can only bring more bad crap. Besides, it always inevitably brings on the MvB spam, and Mic has already warned us about that.

I agree with you about this thread being closed.

 

[ADHD]

We don't need a japanese martin luther king, I see no oppression in this game

 

[Mardyke]

Competitive players don't care about black people?

:O

 

[Black Mantis]

We don't need a japanese martin luther king, I see no oppression in this game

Ok that was just random.

 

[Jack Kieser]

So, I was reading up on Spore just now, and I found an interview Gamasutra did with Soren Johnson, lead AI programmer (IIRC). He worked on the AI for the Civ series, and I found a section of the interview that has a surprising parallel to Sak's design choices in Brawl:

BS: It seems like it's such a spectrum, because character creation is obviously super-casual, but RTS is super-hardcore. Even I don't touch it, because it's too much for me to think about. It's such a spectrum for a game that is more casual-targeted in general.

SJ: Yeah, doing an RTS is really tough inside of Spore, because I would say the RTS genre in general has a big problem, in that it's one of the most ghettoized. I'll dip into almost any genre nowadays except for maybe fighting games or whatever.

I'll play almost any different type of game, and I play strategy games, so I play RTSes. But I think there are a lot of players who will play almost any type of game except for RTSes, because people just have the sense of, "There's a thousand things to do. I'll never be able to get them all. I'll never be able to handle it all."

BS: Too many stats?

SJ: Yeah. The single-player campaigns have never been very compelling, mixed with the fact that if you're going to be playing multiplayer, you're just going to get wiped out. It's a very intimidating genre. It's been kind of freeing, to be honest, to make one that... one of the nice things about the Civ and Tribe game in Spore is that there's not a story and it's not multiplayer. So right off the bat, we don't have those issues to deal with.

How does this apply to Sak? He was tasked with taking an incredibly complex and competitive genre, one that even Mr. Johnson admits to shying away from, and making it playable for a vast majority, instead of just the uber-hardcore. Much like how Spore takes only the best parts of an RTS and leaves the most standoffish components out, Brawl does the same with fighting games; hitstun is reduced meaning that players have more freedom to retailate, gravity is lowered giving players increased mobility, and speed is slowed down allowing more time to think.

Anyone who played Spore already, I'm sure, will say that it is a remarkable game... but it is invaribly a dumbed-down version of about 3-4 other genres. Civ does RTS better, but people are enjoying Spore more. However, Spore was never meant to be a Civ-killer, and is unapologetic about it, tasking Civ-styled players to just go and play another game. Spore has no qualms about being what it was designed to be (no more, no less), and neither does Brawl.

So, has anyone learned anything about the design process yet? Or are people still going to complain about every little detail they don't agree with as an excuse to be d*ckish?

 

[RDK]

Even though Sakurai did put in tripping which is very annonying I appreciate Brawl for what it is. This issue just goes back to Nintendo's new direction towards marketing the Wii towards everyone. This whole casual gamer crap is stupid to me but everyone on this site can admit that Nintendo is making a killing in sales.

At the end of the day if you were in business what would you rather have? A hardcore game that appeals only to a certain audience (Melee), or a game that still maintains the hardcore essence and can appeal to everyone because of the different styles of control (Brawl) (lest face it those **** casual gamers could never use a Gamecube controller if their life depended on it) ?

I assure you that Brawl does not maintain the "hardcore essence". Lawl.

At least the best still win in Brawl.

The problem is how often the best win in Brawl. Yes, the majority of the time, the player who deserves to win wins. But you're not taking into account the inherent randomness and horrible programming flaws apparent in the game. Looking at it from a competitive standpoint, it's a train wreck.

And I look at it from a competitive standpoint because I'm a competitive player. Yes, Smash isn't really a true fighting game, and the community makes it what it is. Melee was great by accident. It's only natural that we're disappointed with Brawl because Sakurai turned it into a casual BAWLfest instead of making another Melee-type game.

There is too much *****ing about Brawl vs. Melee on this site. If Sakurai did see this he would really be ashamed of American gamers. I don't think people in Japan made a big fuss about it (then again I could be wrong).

I don't really give a flying **** about what Sakurai thinks. Or Japanese gamers for that matter.

You know just as well as we do that this is NOT the case. People honestly think (and post!) that Sak must have a personal vendetta against competitive gamers in general and SWF in particular. More people than is healthy really think that Sak made every decision he did out of pure hateful spite for this community.

I don't agree with him either, but it's pointless to name-call and disrespect anyone to the extent that people do on this site towards one person.

If you honestly thinks competitive gamers want to kill Sakurai, you're just out of their mind. Yeah, we hate his view on gaming, but we don't actually hate HIM.

 

[Black Mantis]

I assure you that Brawl does not maintain the "hardcore essence". Lawl.



The problem is how often the best win in Brawl. Yes, the majority of the time, the player who deserves to win wins. But you're not taking into account the inherent randomness and horrible programming flaws apparent in the game. Looking at it from a competitive standpoint, it's a train wreck.

And I look at it from a competitive standpoint because I'm a competitive player. Yes, Smash isn't really a true fighting game, and the community makes it what it is. Melee was great by accident. It's only natural that we're disappointed with Brawl because Sakurai turned it into a casual BAWLfest instead of making another Melee-type game.



I don't really give a flying **** about what Sakurai thinks. Or Japanese gamers for that matter.



If anyone honestly thinks competitive gamers want to kill Sakurai, they're just out of their mind. Yeah, we hate his view on gaming, but we don't actually hate HIM.

If it wasn't hardcore then there wouldn't be tournaments for it.

 

[Jack Kieser]

First of all, if you don't care what Sak thinks, why should he care what YOU think?

Secondly, people blow how 'anti-competitive' Brawl is WAY out of proportion. Tripping does NOT make every game a coin-toss. DDD's chain-grab does not annihilate tournaments. IDJR does not break every aspect of the game. The best player 9/10 times will win. As far as most people are concerned, that's not even a requirment for competition (as far as most people are concerned, the only requirement is that two people want to compete), so anything past that is just speculation.

 

[Black Mantis]

The way people talk on this site everybody might as well hate Sakurai. I've seen way too many posts were Sakurai is reffered to as ********, having his brain removed from 2001 - 2007, stupid, gay, and the list goes on.

 

[bobson]

The way people talk on this site everybody might as well hate Sakurai. I've seen way too many posts were Sakurai is reffered to as ********, having his brain removed from 2001 - 2007, stupid, gay, and the list goes on.

That's because this is the internet. Anything anyone mildly dislikes is discussed like that.

 

[Black Mantis]

That's because this is the internet. Anything anyone mildly dislikes is discussed like that.

Unfortunately, the Internet is full of *******. You're not retared Bobson but insulting someone because of the way they designed a game is.

 

[RDK]

If it wasn't hardcore then there wouldn't be tournaments for it.

Um, just because there's tournaments for an activity doesn't automatically make it hardcore. Not in the least. There are tournaments for Brawl because for some reason people prefer it to Melee, which is something I just can't get my head around. Yeah, it was fun for the first month or so, but after that a lot of players who was actually decent at Melee and understood how to play Smash competitively either left Brawl or left Smash.

First of all, if you don't care what Sak thinks, why should he care what YOU think?

I never said Sakurai should care what I think. It's his game; he can make it however he likes. However I can ***** about his decision all day long, because in the end, it's not him getting stuck with a mediocre game, it's me, and all of you.

Secondly, people blow how 'anti-competitive' Brawl is WAY out of proportion. Tripping does NOT make every game a coin-toss. DDD's chain-grab does not annihilate tournaments. IDJR does not break every aspect of the game. The best player 9/10 times will win. As far as most people are concerned, that's not even a requirment for competition (as far as most people are concerned, the only requirement is that two people want to compete), so anything past that is just speculation.

But the fact that 1/10 times the best player does not win should be cause for concern. In Melee the numbers were even smaller than that. Why play a game that's inferior for good competition over a game that's near perfect?

Plus, randomness isn't even the half of it. The game mechanics are simply apprehensible to anyone who actually has any history with competitive fighting games.

Unfortunately, the Internet is full of *******. You're not retared Bobson but insulting someone because of the way they designed a game is.

Sweet Jews for Jesus, we have a winner.

 

[Black Mantis]

Um, just because there's tournaments for an activity doesn't automatically make it hardcore. Not in the least. There are tournaments for Brawl because for some reason people prefer it to Melee, which is something I just can't get my head around. Yeah, it was fun for the first month or so, but after that a lot of players who was actually decent at Melee and understood how to play Smash competitively either left Brawl or left Smash.



I never said Sakurai should care what I think. It's his game; he can make it however he likes. However I can ***** about his decision all day long, because in the end, it's not him getting stuck with a mediocre game, it's me, and all of you.



But the fact that 1/10 times the best player does not win should be cause for concern. In Melee the numbers were even smaller than that. Why play a game that's inferior for good competition over a game that's near perfect?

Plus, randomness isn't even the half of it. The game mechanics are simply apprehensible to anyone who actually has any history with competitive fighting games.



Sweet Jews for Jesus, we have a winner.

Your facts are wrong because I just came from a biweekly and they had both Melee and Brawl there. Twenty two people entered for Brawl and Melee had less than 10. Also, I've met more people through Brawl than any other game. Melee isn't near perfect at all.

 

[RDK]

Your facts are wrong because I just came from a biweekly and they had both Melee and Brawl there.

Oh my God, Brawl biweeklies. That must mean Brawl is hardcore!!!11!!ONE!!!

Twenty two people entered for Brawl and Melee had less than 10.

So? This is one tourney you're talking about, and I highly doubt you have anywhere near the required tournament experience to be making the outrageous claims you do. I can tell just by the things you say.

As for tourney attendance, usually it's the other way around--at least in my experience. Brawl is so boring and predictable that by the time the finals come around, everyone else has migrated to the other side of the room to play and watch Melee.

Also, I've met more people through Brawl than any other game. Melee isn't near perfect at all.

Again--nobody cares. Your personal experience means nothing. It =/= fact. Just because you've met a bunch of people through Brawl than any other game has nothing to do with how popular other games are.

And explain to me how Melee isn't near perfect but somehow Brawl is. That should be a riot.

 

[Black Mantis]

Oh my God, Brawl biweeklies. That must mean Brawl is hardcore!!!11!!ONE!!!



So? This is one tourney you're talking about, and I highly doubt you have anywhere near the required tournament experience to be making the outrageous claims you do. I can tell just by the things you say.

As for tourney attendance, usually it's the other way around--at least in my experience. Brawl is so boring and predictable that by the time the finals come around, everyone else has migrated to the other side of the room to play and watch Melee.



Again--nobody cares. Your personal experience means nothing. It =/= fact. Just because you've met a bunch of people through Brawl than any other game has nothing to do with how popular other games are.

And explain to me how Melee isn't near perfect but somehow Brawl is. That should be a riot.

People post for hundreds of tournaments on this site. Please don't doubt my skills I'm good and I don't have to prove it to you. If you don't care about my experiences then why should I care about yours? The reason I said I met alot of people is because you used the word community. I live on a college campus and slowly me and my friends are forming a smash bros community. I never said Brawl was perfect but as for Melee just look at this

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Smash_Bros._(series)#Reception

 

[Puddin]

People post for hundreds of tournaments on this site. Please don't doubt my skills I'm good and I don't have to prove it to you.

You see the thing is, he can doubt your skills unless proven otherwise. Therefore yes, you do have to prove you are good to him.

 

[Black Mantis]

He has to prove his skills to me as well. I don't like playing online so its not going to happen. Lol can somebody please close this thread?

 

[RDK]

He has to prove his skills to me as well. I don't like playing online so its not going to happen. Lol can somebody please close this thread?

I never said anything about proving my skills. I merely said the community disagrees with you on just about everything.

I never said Brawl was perfect but as for Melee just look at this

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_S...ies)#Reception

Using scores from casual gaming sources to cite a competitive game in a discussion about the competitive game is the epitome of stupid. I'm sorry, but you are incredibly dense. I'm probably going to stop posting here now.

 

[Black Mantis]

Lol since when was IGN a casual gaming site? They've been around much longer than smashboards. I'm done now any person who can hate and insult a man just because he made a video game has real issues. Sakurai would be ashamed of us American gamers because of this crap!

 

[Puddin]

Lol since when was IGN a casual gaming site? They've been around much longer than smashboards. I'm done now any person who can hate and insult a man just because he made a video game has real issues. Sakurai would be ashamed of us American gamers because of this crap!

Uhm....no.

 

[Fletch]

And explain to me how Melee isn't near perfect but somehow Brawl is. That should be a riot.

I want to hear this too, please provide this analysis Mantis.

Lol since when was IGN a casual gaming site? They've been around much longer than smashboards. I'm done now any person who can hate and insult a man just because he made a video game has real issues. Sakurai would be ashamed of us American gamers because of this crap!

Have you read some of the stuff they have said about Brawl? Basically the only place to get a credible review or insights to these kind of games is on a dedicated site, such as Smashboards, which generally thinks that Brawl is not a very competitively-viable game.

 

[RDK]

Sometimes I wonder why I even give trolls like that the time of day. Then I realize that they're not trolls and they actually believe what they're saying.

 

[Neon304]

Sometimes it's not about losing friends, sometimes its about losing playing partners. I'll say this: I'm only decent at Smash. I didn't really excel at any of the three Smash games (mainly because I lack precision dexterity) in a sense of 'I do well at tournaments', but I do play the game well all considering. Apparently, I play the game well enough to drive people away from it.

My roomate refuses to play most times, with me or at all (unless I can get him drunk; I'm working on getting him plastered enough to MM me ). Most of my other friends who used to play don't play any more because they think it's 'futile' to do so, which is (again) my fault. I don't know how to pull punches, so even people who are just trying the game out never give it a chance because I'm the only other one playing (because everyone else won't), and I always beat them.

I'm sure that I am not unique in this aspect. From a player base standpoint, making the game feel as though it isn't futile to play is VERY important, and it's part of the reason why Smash is so successful. Most other fighters are so 'pure' that many gamers who aren't the most hardcore of the hardcore don't play them for fear that they're wasting their time in an endevor in which they aren't capable of having fun. The only reason Melee was that way as well was because we stripped everything 'unpure' out of it. So, what do you think the logical thing for Sak to do, considering a massive player base was, is, and always will be his top priority?

There's a reason you need Ocarina to turn off tripping, and guess what? We're that reason. So, no, I don't blame Sak for making the choices he did. A ) They weren't gamebreaking. Brawl is still an amazing game. B ) As important as we make ourselves out to be, we are nowhere near the majority here. Something had to give, and as far as priorities go, we were not at the top of the list. After all, this wasn't supposed to be a game for SWF, this was supposed to be a game for Nintendo/MGS/Sonic fans. C ) Even with all the supposed 'anti-competitive' stuff in Brawl, the best still win. I beat all of my friends consistantly in Melee, and I'm doing it in Brawl, just like I lost consisantly in high-level Melee play and I'm losing now in Brawl.

Seriously, we need to stop being so a$$hurt about this, because we have some self-important complext that is 'convincing' us that Sak had to absolutely HATE us or something stupid like that. Just go back to your Ocarina code hunt and stop b*tching about something you can't change. (That last part is directed to all the people b*tching; if you aren't b*tching, then it isn't aimed at you.)

You have said what I could not. Well put.

 

[OrlanduEX]

Sometimes it's not about losing friends, sometimes its about losing playing partners. I'll say this: I'm only decent at Smash. I didn't really excel at any of the three Smash games (mainly because I lack precision dexterity) in a sense of 'I do well at tournaments', but I do play the game well all considering. Apparently, I play the game well enough to drive people away from it.

My roomate refuses to play most times, with me or at all (unless I can get him drunk; I'm working on getting him plastered enough to MM me ). Most of my other friends who used to play don't play any more because they think it's 'futile' to do so, which is (again) my fault. I don't know how to pull punches, so even people who are just trying the game out never give it a chance because I'm the only other one playing (because everyone else won't), and I always beat them.

Clearly, your friends are scrubs and you are not. You can either play easy against them and be bored, or thrash them and drive them away.

I'm sure that I am not unique in this aspect. From a player base standpoint, making the game feel as though it isn't futile to play is VERY important, and it's part of the reason why Smash is so successful. Most other fighters are so 'pure' that many gamers who aren't the most hardcore of the hardcore don't play them for fear that they're wasting their time in an endevor in which they aren't capable of having fun. The only reason Melee was that way as well was because we stripped everything 'unpure' out of it. So, what do you think the logical thing for Sak to do, considering a massive player base was, is, and always will be his top priority?

Melee was just fine as it was. The game sold like 8,000,000 copies. Let's say 100,000 of those players were competitive players like you and me. That leaves well over 7,000,000 scrubs playing for fun. And guess what, they didn't suffer one bit while we enjoyed a highly complex and competitive game. With Brawl, Sakurai dumbed it down for no reason. Tripping and other such bs is not very appealing to anyone. He went out of his way to try to stop people from winning consistently at the game, to make it something where "everyone wins". It just serves to piss off people who like to play seriously, but it doesn't help increase the appeal of the game.

There's a reason you need Ocarina to turn off tripping, and guess what? We're that reason. So, no, I don't blame Sak for making the choices he did. A ) They weren't gamebreaking. Brawl is still an amazing game. B ) As important as we make ourselves out to be, we are nowhere near the majority here. Something had to give, and as far as priorities go, we were not at the top of the list. After all, this wasn't supposed to be a game for SWF, this was supposed to be a game for Nintendo/MGS/Sonic fans. C ) Even with all the supposed 'anti-competitive' stuff in Brawl, the best still win. I beat all of my friends consistantly in Melee, and I'm doing it in Brawl, just like I lost consisantly in high-level Melee play and I'm losing now in Brawl.

No his choices weren't game breaking, but from my stand point, they prevent the game from being the great game that it could have been. Brawl is just a less fun version of Melee, not the great successor that it should have been.

 

[Greenstreet]

i like sakurais view point. games are supposed to be fun. yay for kids in training mode.

 

[metaXzero]

So competitive play isn't fun?

 

[MarKO X]

IGN could possibly be considered a hardcore gamer site. Not a hardcore Smash site. There's a difference. (although notice the word "possibly")

One thing to realize though about Melee being perfect and Brawl not so much or Brawl being perfect and Melee not so much... it's opinion, truly based on perspective.

If you're a gamer who likes playing good games, then Brawl is a great got**** game. It's got nearly everything you would want in a "game" (notice the quotes... not a competitive game, but a "game"): tons of single player content to deal with, great graphics, an outstanding soundtrack, minigames, and a great multiplayer that's fun for hours on end.

If you're a competitive Smash player who was around during the competitve glory days of Melee, then Brawl is pretty lackluster. Sure, it has nice little 1player modes, great graphics, and great music, but where's the WaveDashing? No, I'm not that ignorant, but the fact of the matter is this is one fighting game where the sad little ATs just don't cut it. Like, Melee has Lcancelling and WDing (just to name a few), Street Fighter has Reversals and meaty attacks (just to name a few), CvS2 has the SF stuff plus roll cancelling, and while I'm not up on my GG, I'm pretty sure it has some nice stuff to keep people playing it as well.

But maybe Brawl just isn't designed to be a fighting game... really... I just noticed this as I was typing it...

All of the great fighting games have s*itty 1 player modes. (beat up a number of fighters and beat the game). Brawl does not.

Hmmm... maybe SSB64 and Melee are better than Brawl... oh boy, this is bad.

 

[Neon304]

So competitive play isn't fun?

Nobody ever said that. Playing competitively is great fun, for those who can handle it, but if somebody who can't handle it plays someone who can, and the competitive player goes all out, then it becomes a turn off for the other player.


The smash bros series has always been my favorite game series since the first time I played it because of how fun it was, and I for one believe that everyone deserves to have that feeling fun while playing smash bros. Most players wont walk away for just losing 1 round, they walk away after losing continually over and over again, and rarely taking 1 stock from their opponent.

It took me years to learn this, and I turned friends and family away from several of my favorite games, just so I could be the best. All of a sudden, there was no one left to play with. No body left to share the fun with.

 

[freeman123]

I doubt Capcom expected Street Fighter 2 to be as competitive as it was when they made it the first time. But that didn't stop them from acknowledging how competitive it became, and they improved on the competitive aspect of the game over the next 400 times they remade it.

So I don't think it's a good excuse to say that "Smash was never intended to be competitive."