Rule #2: Never listen to Fino +1

[Dnyce]

I think it depends on a bunch of different things. I know that is pikachu uses fair to momentum cancel while a pikmin is on they almost instantly stop in midair.

I would say it's worth looking into, just realize the variables involved.

 

[L_Cancel]

Thanks for the feedback guys. o:

Idk if I can test it tonight @ Hilt, unfortunately

@ Rich, we should def talk about Oli sometime lol

@ Fino, The instance where I first noticed it was playing against wario, when he MC'd with dair. Died at 100% with DI from a red pikmin u-smash on picto. looked like he was going to survive, then the dair was slowed down from the pikmin and he just died.

also. lol. Your Ike pivot grab everything advice works. >_> lol

 

[Dajayman]

I'm loving your avatars Fino. <3

 

[DtJ Hilt]

Do any of you guys ever jump at someone while their landing to bait the airdodge, then land and usmash? That's an incredible kill setup. I've been doing this forever with aerials, but never thought to do it for smashes. Just make sure you space yourself so if they decide to attack you don't get hit. Works amazing on snake.

Usually what I do is chase my opponent into the air a lot throughout the game, usually with uair, and then, when I know the uair isn't going to work (or they're at kill percents), jump to bait their air dodge, follow their landing, and usmash when the air dodge ends. It's great lol.

@L, lemme know whenever you wanna test it I'm good whenever.

 

[L_Cancel]

kk Hilt, I'll let you knoooooow.

 

[Sky Pirate]

Torchic would totally be cuter though

I strongly disagree, but they both have wings and set things on fire so I will let it slide.

 

[Pyronic_Star]

if your going to land and u-smash... its pointless not to inair for the extra damage (thats what I do)

 

[-Vocal-]

Do any of you guys ever jump at someone while their landing to bait the airdodge, then land and usmash? That's an incredible kill setup. I've been doing this forever with aerials, but never thought to do it for smashes. Just make sure you space yourself so if they decide to attack you don't get hit. Works amazing on snake.

Hilt basically gave me this exact same advice last week :D

Anywho, has anyone ever tried using dtilt to combo on low percents? I've been experimenting with it lately. Optimally, if they're at 0%, it goes something like dtilt->dtilt->grab->dthrow->fair, and that does around 40 damage range. Though I'm fairly certain it could be DIed out of, players would have to DI towards Oli (or maybe up->fast aerial?) which I don't think people think to do, not to mention the element of surprise can work wonders Also, even if it's not this specific combo, I've seen success using just one dtilt as well.

Kinda jumbled post, but what are your thoughts?

 

[Stealth Raptor]

if your going to land and u-smash... its pointless not to inair for the extra damage (thats what I do)

problem is they can SDI out if they have strong enough di

 

[-Vocal-]

Hey, even though my last strategy question hasn't been answered, I've got another! I was looking at the "Best vids of Each Character" thread and someone noticed San do this tech called the Reverse Jump Cancelled Up Smash, here are some videos:

Reverse Jump Cancelled Up Smash
San Performing RJCUS At 5:14

Sure, ours doesn't have the same range as Ike's but it seems like it could still be REALLY useful - a retreating purple usmash would be amazing :D The input isn't too hard once you get the hang of it. Have any of you tried this, and have you had any success with it?

 

[Pyronic_Star]

if you do it perfect they can't smash Di out cause they hit the ground and are in a weird animation... not even wigi or peach can stop it


and I've been practicing d-tilt when people double jump to grab the ledge so that it pops them up and I can fair them back off

 

[-Vocal-]

if you do it perfect they can't smash Di out cause they hit the ground and are in a weird animation... not even wigi or peach can stop it


and I've been practicing d-tilt when people double jump to grab the ledge so that it pops them up and I can fair them back off

Hadn't thought about that, I'm trying it

 

[Stealth Raptor]

i can sdi out of nair more then half the time. it takes really good sdi to do it, even just good sdi will still leave you in usmash position though. it really depends on how low you do it and how many times it hits

 

[Pyronic_Star]

exactly... it can only be sdi if we hit them enough, thus, do it perfect and they can get out

btw rich, I shall explore up-b from the ground, I only jump and do it now

 

[DtJ Hilt]

if your going to land and u-smash... its pointless not to inair for the extra damage (thats what I do)

In this situation they're air dodging, so the first part of the Nair wouldn't hit them. What Rich is talking about is landing during the opponent's air dodge, while staying out of range of their attacks. In order to do the nair, that you're talking about, you would have to be closer to your opponent, which isn't safe, most of the time. In what we're talking about, you're out of range of their attacks while in the air, but still in range to hit them with an up smash after their landing. So yeah, we're talking about two different things, for the most part. Different positions and situations.

 

[Noa.]

Whether or not you can SDI out of iNair to whatever depends on so many things. Maybe one day we can find out exactly how iNair works best, but that would take such a long time lol.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

I started to test its hit stun. Then I realized that each hit of Nair has a different amount of hitstun dependant on where it hits the opponent, and there are four areas. So, Four areas per hit, seven hits, means twenty-eight different amounts of hit stun that I different feel like testing in one go through.

<_<

I need to post up what I have so far for hit stun, I keep putting it off.

 

[Noa.]

Exactly. And besides seperate hits of nair have different trajectories of knockback.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

Alright, guess it's about time I started testing frames again.

 

[RichBrown]

I like how the only time we ever discuss this game is when I post something XD I'm really digging everything that has been said so far

Logic: Yeah I've randomly just done a grounded upB here and there, it's **** since people will usually only airdodge it if you jump. Nice discoveries w/ Dtilt, I STILL don't ever use that move and I hate that I can never find a use for it, but what you came up with sounds legit. Continuing with the theory craft, you could Dtilt, jump and bait the airdodge, then spike lolol. I'll definitely start playing with this. I wonder if Dtilt clanks with illusion? :o

Hilt: You and your frame data discoveries... you're nuts. haha

 

[L_Cancel]

I've been really enjoying these past few pages. We're all working to make Oli's metagame betterrrr~ n__n/

 

[Denti]

My pikmin got stuck under the side of ps1's wing and I lost my MM.

 

[Pyronic_Star]

@hilt
you jump at them and once you see them ad you Di towards them and do a falling nair... its not unsafe because you have 2-4 frames upon landing and your nair will be out hitting them before they can do anything

 

[DtJ Hilt]

If you're below them? You can't DI up. What I mean is staying out of their zone where they can't hit you and being below them. Also, if you try to hit them with the Nair, you usually would have to hit them after they land, and it's difficult to time before they throw out their shield. If you don't try to hit them when they land, and if they're too high above you, and you only hit them with the top section of the Nair, it's a lot easier for them to DI out of it before they're set up for the Up Smash.

Like I said, neither of us are "wrong", we're just talking about two different situations. While what you're saying does work, and is definitely effective, it doesn't apply to this situation.

Edit: Guys I'm in the Oli Chaaaaatttt!!

 

[Pyronic_Star]

I thought rich was thinking of it as if Wt were beside them and falling, my b

in other news I found a use for f-tilt, to use it like ic's and g&w's d-tilt... so when people are falling and have used there double jump, you can put them off stage with there up-b being there only option

 

[Dnyce]

also. lol. Your Ike pivot grab everything advice works. >_> lol

I'm keeping a tally for when people realize that I wasn't trolling <.<

Reverse Jump Canceled Up Smash talk

Yeah, I've been looking on where there is a thread that tells you how to do it. I've been looking for MONTHS ;-;

 

[Sky Pirate]

Olimar chat is horrible. Hilt called me a gay weasel and trolled me twice.
Then he called me "Tiny" and threw rotten fruit at my rump as I passed him in the street.

Spoiler

(This is almost completely untrue. :3)

 

[Turazrok]

Lol metagame. I just play oli.

 

[@TKbreezy]

THIS ISNT SOCIAL AT ALL!!!!

/rant

atleast olis band together...you don't find this on any other page

Edit: srsly though you guys dont have a tactical discussion thread?

 

[DtJ Hilt]

lol it kinda shifts back and forth between the two and serves both purposes. We're not like the PT boards with a social topic and THREE tactical discussion threads XD

 

[@TKbreezy]

those tactical discussions suck...lol

and I really gotta change my image

in friendlies I main PT

in Tourney and Teams I mean Kirby (and use falco with speed sometimes)

I still use PT in tourney but only against matchups I really like, like DK or something.

anyway if I somehow whip up some info on Oli (because L just kicks my ***) ill let you know his secrets...lol

 

[DtJ Hilt]

I thought you used Falco mainly in tournament nowadays, didn't know you played Kirby .-.

I do keep forgetting you're not a PT main though XD

 

[@TKbreezy]

Falco Got REALLLY BORING like REALLY FAST

if anything I main squirtle...lol

I can still use pit a little bit but I will probably never be tourney legit with him

recently i have been messing around with fox though...he's so fast and combo oriented with a super solid kill move...I love it!!

 

[Sky Pirate]

It's unfortunate that he can get grabbed. >_<

*doesn't know what a tactical discussion thread is*

 

[DtJ Hilt]

Basically, a metagame discussion thread. Where we talk about what possibilities we could explore, or how to improve our character in various ways. Pretty much what we've been talking about for the past few pages, lol.

 

[Noa.]

I don't think it's too necessary honestly. The only true benefit is that all the metagame relevant information would be all in one place. So if you wanted to review it all to get some ideas it wouldn't be difficult.

 

[-Vocal-]

Whether or not you can SDI out of iNair to whatever depends on so many things. Maybe one day we can find out exactly how iNair works best, but that would take such a long time lol.

I started to test its hit stun. Then I realized that each hit of Nair has a different amount of hitstun dependant on where it hits the opponent, and there are four areas. So, Four areas per hit, seven hits, means twenty-eight different amounts of hit stun that I different feel like testing in one go through.

<_<

I need to post up what I have so far for hit stun, I keep putting it off.

My pikmin got stuck under the side of ps1's wing and I lost my MM.

Karma for not sharing your tourney results with us Jk, that's rough man

I thought rich was thinking of it as if Wt were beside them and falling, my b

in other news I found a use for f-tilt, to use it like ic's and g&w's d-tilt... so when people are falling and have used there double jump, you can put them off stage with there up-b being there only option

...you need to post here more.

I'm keeping a tally for when people realize that I wasn't trolling <.<


Yeah, I've been looking on where there is a thread that tells you how to do it. I've been looking for MONTHS ;-;

I'm on that tally :D And you don't need a thread, it's not that hard actually; all you need to do is

1. Dash one direction
2. Smash the other direction like you're about to pivot
3. Immediately quarter circle up and press A or c-stick up.

If you choose A, you can charge it if you think someone's about to run right into it. The timing also seems to be a bit easier with A; if you c-stick too early, you just usmash the direction you were dashing, and I think too late makes you jump instead. Thanks, since it seems like you're the only one who noticed I really do think this could be useful

 

[Tin Man]

oli metagame discussion? what did I miss?

 

[Dajayman]

Reverae hyphen usmash is too easy, Fino is just trolling. :3

 

[Dnyce]

1. Dash one direction
2. Smash the other direction like you're about to pivot
3. Immediately quarter circle up and press A or c-stick up.

Then why is it called reverse 'jump canceled' up-smash?