Question: When is it okay to purposely try and profit from running a tournament?

[Bing]

honestly, I think the fee should cover winnings and set up costs(tv rentals, systems, tables, chairs etc the **** you need for a tourney). I wouldnt want anything back provided I got to see some ****** matches filled with hype.

 

[otg]

The last few times I've housed people, **** has been stolen, people wrecked stuff and since I'm way too nice to people, I always end up getting more then double the amount of people that I originally planned on housing. Not just that, but since I'm way too ****ing nice to people, that reputation gets out and I have way too many people hearing from other people that I'm housign and that I'm a pushover so they feel they can just invite themselves over.

It gets really frustrating, and I've all but stopped. People have taken advantage of me way too many times, and if you expect me to just open up my house to anyone because you travelled a really far distance, you're out of your mind. Maybe if this was a year ago, but I'm way too bitter now to be that generous.

 

[Plairnkk]

The last few times I've housed people, **** has been stolen, people wrecked stuff and since I'm way too nice to people, I always end up getting more then double the amount of people that I originally planned on housing. Not just that, but since I'm way too ****ing nice to people, that reputation gets out and I have way too many people hearing from other people that I'm housign and that I'm a pushover so they feel they can just invite themselves over.

It gets really frustrating, and I've all but stopped. People have taken advantage of me way too many times, and if you expect me to just open up my house to anyone because you travelled a really far distance, you're out of your mind. Maybe if this was a year ago, but I'm way too bitter now to be that generous.

This for me too.

Good post az and thank you, you're pretty legit yourself!


also bones post was mad good


tournaments are a 2 way street. people expect the TO's to do everything for them perfectly yet half of my tournament is spent doing needless things that could've been solved so easily just by a cooperative community!! (quitting people out of friendlies, searching for people, hunting down finished pool sheets/filling them out when people dont and finding out who won what sets)

At Apex I found a pool sheet with like 3 matches played sitting on the upside down with chair marks all over it. This was one of the last pools left and they had completed the entire pool. instead of filling out the sheet they finished the pool and everyone just scattered, and when i found the disheveled pool paper on the ground FINALLY it wasn't even filled out and I had to go around and ask people who won what matches!!!! This was like 30 minutes for nothing. Things like this happen all of the time

Nonetheless I love what I do and I will obviously take the negatives with the positives. Knowing I gathered 600 people together to do something they love and I provided a positive experience to almost all of them is worth more to me than any amount of money could ever be.

 

[g-regulate]

understand your point

but you have to understand

when someone opens up their house

their house gets *****

im not saying you would do it

but some people are just a-holes and dont care about peoples things

That's the point that Wife was trying to make... that the integrity level of the community has dropped, proven by you saying these things. More so often people had the integrity to not destroy a place because they get an indoor place to sleep/play for free! This was like 04/05 and doesn't really happen anymore.

Also, regardless of the setup at RoM, I would gladly pay $10 per day for a tournament of that caliber, with that many setups and quality players. In terms of how much fun I had compared with the money I spent, it was definitely fair. That's all anyone should worry about.

 

[TunaCasserole]

@Wife: I definitely haven't been around as long as you have, and so I can sympathize with your disappointedness of the evolution (rather, devolution) of certain aspects of the community. But, like OTNezziahMafiaPOFXYTJessiahTEQ?? mentioned, one seems justified in being skeptical of housing people he might not be so familiar with. Not everyone is as cool as you (Good **** in pools by the way. I had more trouble with you than I did with MacD I'll work on that matchup for next time).

Also, I like your point about the how in the past TOs were competing for attention and attendance from the community, while now TOs actually seem to be doing people a favor by hosting anything at all. Personally, I find this transition to be a little surprising, but still reasonably understandable. Objectively, it probably doesn't seem too hard to onlookers to run a tournament, but I'm sure hosting tourney after tourney takes its toll on TOs (all the bull**** they have to deal with, is what I'm talking about here).

If I had the resources and time, I might be willing to step up and try to host something some time. Unfortunately I'm preoccupied with school most of the time. Still though, TFS should host a tourney at some point (BEST OTBEST?!??!?!?!)

@TOs profiting: Someone said this before and I completely agree, so I'll echo what was already said: If TOs deliver, I have no problem accommodating them for the time and effort they invest in hosting tournaments. Personally, my reasons for TOing wouldn't be driven by any sort of desire for profit (see Plank's aforementioned reason for TOing), but I definitely understand where TOs who are motivated partially by making marginal profits (again, ONLY if they deliver) are coming from. That being said, the main thing that seems to hold tournaments back from being AMAZING is the fact that TOs are just too nice. It shouldn't matter whose late or for whatever reason, if someone is late, they are DQd. That should be the GOLDEN STANDARD for ANY TOURNAMENT, and it, simply, is not. If people step up and change JUST THIS portion of their TO-running agenda, tournaments will suddenly be so much more pleasurable for everyone.


That being said, ROM3 was my first national (barring GT2 in the UK), and I feel that it is appropriate to express my deepest appreciation to Alu and the rest of the "behind-the-scenes" crew for stepping up and even hosting anything at all, and ma doo Prog$ for shouting all day and giving epic play-by-plays on the stream. Good ****in dookie diarrhea doo doo bull **** PROG$$$$$$$$$. Alu, you're hella cool, and even though things tend to start late @ No Johns and stuff, it's still always a pleasure going to your tournaments. If you get strict with DQing and being serious about getting **** started on time no matter what, the experience for you and everyone else will be that much better. If people are late and ***** at you because they were really excited to enter, or they devoted so much time to getting there, or whatever else, tell them to **** off -- if they devoted so much time to attending, they should do EVERYTHING in their power to be punctual. NO EXCEPTIONS. If people are concerned about getting stuck in traffic, get to the venue WAY EARLIER. It's better to waste some time beforehand than not being able to attend the tournament at all, especially if you came from WC and incurred massive flight expenses.

Of course, the issue of punctuality is not the only issue with these kinds of tournaments (the pools were pretty screwed up in some cases, for example), but in all honesty, I think if TOs focused as much as possible on running things on time, that would make everyone soooooooo much happier.

 

[prog]

my 02.

wife, things have changed a lot since 05. the amount of integrity in the community is on a rapid decline. i said i was retiring after this tournament, and although i had a great time at it, the community cemented all of the reasons why i want to leave all this behind. i won't say anything more than that.

 

[MattDotZeb]

my 02.

wife, things have changed a lot since 05. the amount of integrity in the community is on a rapid decline. i said i was retiring after this tournament, and although i had a great time at it, the community cemented all of the reasons why i want to leave all this behind. i won't say anything more than that.

...
=(


But you're so ****ing good at RPS.

 

[Hazygoose]

wife, cactuar, and bones: awesome posts. this is my favorite thread i've seen in a long *** time.

 

[ranmaru]

Well me Aicila and No cash got to Nanuet at 1:36 pm. We woke up at 6:05 AM.

I wouldn't be happy to be dq'd, but I'm glad Alukard did allow us to still enter, even after having to go wayyy across the street to get to an ATM lmao.

I wasn't prepared money wise because of last minute things : [

But I'm sure Alukard had said that he wouldn't want anyone making it all the way there, and missing the main event. I respect him for that.

I just payed my $20 venue fee, I was glad it wasn't more than that. He profitted? Oh well, let's hope he does something with it (some of it at least) to benefit the community... but it really doesn't matter to me. I payed my price.

: ]

 

[TheGoat]

The last few times I've housed people, **** has been stolen, people wrecked stuff and since I'm way too nice to people, I always end up getting more then double the amount of people that I originally planned on housing. Not just that, but since I'm way too ****ing nice to people, that reputation gets out and I have way too many people hearing from other people that I'm housign and that I'm a pushover so they feel they can just invite themselves over.

It gets really frustrating, and I've all but stopped. People have taken advantage of me way too many times, and if you expect me to just open up my house to anyone because you travelled a really far distance, you're out of your mind. Maybe if this was a year ago, but I'm way too bitter now to be that generous.

This sounds ****ing upsetting. I am new to the smash scene, and at least from what I have seen so far, the majority of the community is great. I'm upset to hear people would be such *******s; staying at someones house, even for free???? And not being completely respectful? That is just appalling.

I think it's great we're examining all this. Good for us. What I'd like to offer is this:

It seems like back in 04-06 it was a privilege to host a tournament. People had to compete with one another for "the summer spot" and they had to outperform other tournaments to establish themselves. Now, it's more like TOs are doing the community a favor by hosting, as opposed to the community doing the TO a favor by attending.

Wife, correct me if I'm wrong since you are from way back when; but it seems to me the reason for this is because smash was much larger back then. Because of that, there were more people regularly hosting, and thus there was competition, and that created higher quality tournaments. Kind of like an economics thing.
Nowadays, people are starving for tournaments. TOs are doing the community a favor by hosting, people just want to have tournies and will go to wherever they are being hosted.

Is the difference clear? And I think that's a natural (if regrettable) evolution of the smash scene.

On a related note, I had to pay for a hotel this weekend, which is a shame. It used to be that nobody ever had to pay for housing. It was positively unheard of. It was what separated us from Halo. And I think the diminished presence of free housing for out-of-staters is symptomatic of the same problem that is lowering the quality of tournaments.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

One last point: I do happen to think the integrity of the smash community has deteriorated. However, the quality of the game play is stellar. I'm so constantly amazed at how steadily the metagame advances, and how hard the players work to push this game to its full potential. So we should all be very proud of ourselves for that.

This is sad to hear. I am curious Wife, do you believe there were any specific factors contributing to the general decline of the community's integrity? Thanks.

 

[Ben-Teezee]

It mainly has to do with what OTG has said and magnify that to even bigger things. quite frankly ppl have had to become more aware who they help cuz there has been those couple of a-holes that just take advantage. smashers were so nice and naive and they got jipped on more than one occasion. from ppl borrowing money and not paying back, to ppl not respecting ppls homes to ppl always asking for rides and not even offering gas money or tolls, every aspect of smashers kindness has been abused. I still try to be as kind as possible to everyone but my situation doesnt allow me to house/drive ppl etc...

it is sad I miss the good old days

 

[ChRed2AKrisp]

Yeah, it's kind of sad that we even need to be thinking about security nowadays. I think it's actually due to, in part, the Wii's popularity. When melee was the only game in town, what did we have? cheap controllers that everyone carried around, and a cheap system that was the second or third most popular of its generation.

Now we have the Wii which has sold millions upon millions of consoles, still sells for 250, and is so popular that you have more people who just waltz in and out and take ****.

Also, as has been pointed out, the community itself has degraded in terms of what we had over games like Halo. We were polite. Friendly. Helped each other out. This ties into the problems with being on time etc that I pointed out in my previous post. I've lost I think 3 controllers, 2 with names on them. There were never controllers left out. People either took them intentionally, or more likely, took them by accident, but didn't care enough to say "Hey, I found this controller, someone need it?". I don't think we're malicious, but there's more of a "who cares about the next guy as long as I'm doing fine" I remember at that chudat tourney I mentioned in 04 my friend literally just walked up to chu and asked if he could show him some IC's stuff and chu said "sure", and they sat down and played for a bit. At RoM 2, I went up to a couple guys playing by themselves on a TV(all the TVs were filled and had multiple people waiting to play) and asked if I could get next, and they literally just said "No, we want to just play each other". It wasn't even like I went up to m2k and mango playing friendlies and asked if I could get in with them, these were two guys I didn't recognize (and I recognize any relatively known EC player, having either played or talked with them) from who knows where, with their own TV who just basically rejected allowing other people to play with them at this national tournament. That kind of **** would never happen before. Maybe a "let me just finish this set", but never a "We don't want to play with you, go some where else".

 

[Hazygoose]

I remember at that chudat tourney I mentioned in 04 my friend literally just walked up to chu and asked if he could show him some IC's stuff and chu said "sure", and they sat down and played for a bit. At RoM 2, I went up to a couple guys playing by themselves on a TV(all the TVs were filled and had multiple people waiting to play) and asked if I could get next, and they literally just said "No, we want to just play each other". It wasn't even like I went up to m2k and mango playing friendlies and asked if I could get in with them, these were two guys I didn't recognize (and I recognize any relatively known EC player, having either played or talked with them) from who knows where, with their own TV who just basically rejected allowing other people to play with them at this national tournament. That kind of **** would never happen before. Maybe a "let me just finish this set", but never a "We don't want to play with you, go some where else".

that's so rude. i would be so pissed to just be told "no."
more on otg being too nice of a guy and people stepping on the old schoolers because they're used to being polite...at HoG2 every tv was taken, and i just walked to up otg and whoever he was playing with someone else i had promised to play with, and when i asked if i could get next on the tv otg immediately match reset and unplugged. it felt really awesome that he was being so considerate to someone he just met, reminded me that some people are still just as courteous as "the mlg days." MORE OF THIS and the community can definitely recover to where it once was :D

 

[Ben-Teezee]

when i use to play Soul calibur there was always a rule at tournaments against squatting (the act of not getting off the tv after losing) there should be one in smash.

 

[Laijin]

I'm really liking where this thread is going. This could potentially jumpstart the reverse of decline of this community and something positive can come out. I completely agree with Wife. The community's integrity is falling down a cliff rapidly. If we don't do something about it soon, this could potentially be the knife that stabs melee in the back(rather than the fact that the game is aging). Majority of my most memorable melee experiences happened between 04-06. I have been playing through 07-10 as well, why do I have fewer and fewer memorable times as the years go by? I definitely would like to see some sort of change although it would be very difficult unless the entire community agrees and comes together. A tournament is made successful by not only the TO but the players as well.



To Alucard and the other RoM3 TOs: I really hope you didn't take this personally. It wasn't my intention to suddenly make enemies or what not. Like I said before, I just used RoM3 since its the most recent tournament and most players will be able to relate easiest. I think you guys are cool and I really do hope you take to heart the advice that is coming out of this thread to make RoM4 even better. The advice on making everything more transparent should be followed by every TO. Not everyone will agree on how much a TO should profit from a tournament. Differences in opinions aside, I believe making things more transparent will benefit will everyone.

when i use to play Soul calibur there was always a rule at tournaments against squatting (the act of not getting off the tv after losing) there should be one in smash.

there should also be a rule about sitting at a tv with 99 stock turned on for a long period of time...

just sayin'

 

[Laijin]

double post

 

[Hax]

not only do i believe that the smash community has deteriorated, i believe society as a whole has deteriorated. the way i perceive it is similar to my perception of the smash metagame; as time passes people realize that they can get farther by utilizing certain technique's (in this case theft/manipulation are the advanced techniques LOL). i definitely feel that in the year 2010 people seek self-benefit more than relationships with others; this has shown both in and outside of smash. i don't know if it legitimately derives from our economy or not, regardless it is quite evident.

EDIT: I think a step in the right direction would be for TO's to man the **** up and ban people that are damaging our community. DJ Nintendo (he's a close friend of mine but I have to keep it real) and Eggm currently owe people money that it does not seem they plan on repaying. I have contacted TO's about banning these offenders and my requests have been brushed to the side because TO's would rather not get involved. as the role models as of our community, TO's should take the initiative to do something about this.

 

[prog]

On phone. Banning doesn't get money back. blacklisting doesn't get money back.

 

[Ben-Teezee]

On phone. Banning doesn't get money back. blacklisting doesn't get money back.

however it would deter more ppl from following the trend. some punishment is better than no punishment. murderers arent thrown in jail so the ppl they kill come back to life, theyre thrown in jail so more ppl dont kill. also i agree on the 99 stock thing. *stares hard at m2k*

 

[Venom NY]

I'm really liking where this thread is going. This could potentially jumpstart the reverse of decline of this community and something positive can come out. I completely agree with Wife. The community's integrity is falling down a cliff rapidly. If we don't do something about it soon, this could potentially be the knife that stabs melee in the back(rather than the fact that the game is aging). Majority of my most memorable melee experiences happened between 04-06. I have been playing through 07-10 as well, why do I have fewer and fewer memorable times as the years go by? I definitely would like to see some sort of change although it would be very difficult unless the entire community agrees and comes together. A tournament is made successful by not only the TO but the players as well.



To Alucard and the other RoM3 TOs: I really hope you didn't take this personally. It wasn't my intention to suddenly make enemies or what not. Like I said before, I just used RoM3 since its the most recent tournament and most players will be able to relate easiest. I think you guys are cool and I really do hope you take to heart the advice that is coming out of this thread to make RoM4 even better. The advice on making everything more transparent should be followed by every TO. Not everyone will agree on how much a TO should profit from a tournament. Differences in opinions aside, I believe making things more transparent will benefit will everyone.



there should also be a rule about sitting at a tv with 99 stock turned on for a long period of time...

just sayin'

Well, at first I will say when I saw this thread and being on of the T.O's @ ROM 3 I was EXTREMELY pissed off because I honestly felt like we were being back stabbed basically because people were accusing us of stealing money and I also felt like people were saying we did a horrible job and ****. I remember trying to make plans before ROM with Alu MONTHS before, and we tried to do so much like tv's, projectors and I even wanted SO BADLY to throw in like $500 of my own money in the pot....but guess what...BILLS! Thats my quick .02 on that.

Like a point plank made and im getting some stuff from other people too, people do not co-operate with the t.o's like 85% of the time. I seriously remember walking around trying to do security for people (because seriously there were like 20+ people that were trying to sneak in and on day 2 someone tried to steal something and got caught) and I was also helping alukard by checking on pools and matches etc. Im seeing the majority of people say that there were like more than 4 or 5 t.o's or some**** in reality it was ONLY me and alukard. Prog, SleepyK and waffles were there to help us record matches (and I am extremely grateful for that again) but that was it, like basically it was run by Alu,Me his girl and sis THATS IT! There were few times when people helped us out by yelling **** it out like "quit your games and listen to pools" thats about it. And then this whole deal with the money is RIDICULOUS!

Like seriously why shouldn't a t.o get paid? Like, we didn't have a lot of resources and were not ****ing loaded with cash for us to have all these things like more setups, "renting tv's" (I didn't even know that **** existed anymore) and real quick speaking of renting tv's we basically did, by helping people out with venue fee, we discounted venue for bringing setups so we were basically "renting tv's", anyways back to what I was saying, we don't have that money for all this stuff like seriously WE TRIED. Alu bought mad chairs but, it wasn't enough and I want to say sorry for that. Like people don't understand that the effort was there...and also this whole thing about t.o's not profiting and going negative is ****ing HILARIOUS IMO!.

Like I don't think people understand that people need money to survive in America. We live in 2010, there are like 0 jobs now and things are just fcking terrible right now for A LOT of people financially. I have A HUGEamount of of respect for all the good t.o's especially Alex Strife (probably THE BEST T.O of all time). But the fact that he went negative at like Apex and viridian city and **** is just RIDCULOUS, seriously thats what you ****ing call taking advantage of people. Someone said this in one of the earlier pages of this thread, I don't remember the exact quote but imma say what i remember.
"People talk about stuff being for the community and what not, but do they truly appreciate what your doing for them? "The answer to this in my opinion is a STRONG no, there are those FEW EXCEPTIONS OF PEOPLE that actually give a **** and are very respectful....but then there are a bajillion a-holes and its so easy to see who they are by just talking to them for a few seconds. For example: someone said that they asked to play at ROM 2 and they said no...like thats just ****ed up they OBVIOUSLY DON'T GIVE A **** ABOUT THE COMMUNITY. And what OTG said too, people going to his house basically inviting themselves and breaking and stealing ****?!??!?? REALLY? AND PEOPLE WONDER WHY THERES A DECLINE.

It truly is sad to see how the community is now, but times change, people change and speaking of people, these are not the people that were in 05-07 etc. I use to play in the Deadly Alliance/ Ken and Isai/ Husband and Wife era...and I must say I miss those days. People were really humble and nice but its different now. The majority of these people are gone, and the new people have DEF. changed the community wether we want to see it or not...@ ROM 3 (which was my first tournament since 08) I saw nothing but cocky people with terrible attitudes. Like I remember telling people that they had to play there pools matches and record the results and stuff and people literally gave me back talk like if im telling them to do something stupid...like YOU PAID FOR THIS! WHY THE **** ARE YOU FIGHTING ME ABOUT THIS!? JUST DO IT! People are clearly losing respect and cooperation for T.O's and that **** is I.M.O what is destroying this community.

I really hope smash does not die...Super Smash Brothers Melee is one of the greatest games of all time hands down and every other community can suck it, and although I am extremely mad and sad at what everyone is saying I will do ANYTHING to keep Melee alive, I would've never met any of the great people that i've met through this game because people were so friendly and cool.

One last thing I want to say is that, if ROM 4 does happen...I WILL run up to EVERYBODY AND SCREAM IN YOUR EARS WITH A MEGAPHONE IF YOU DO NOT PLAY AND LISTEN TO OUR INSTRUCTIONS! NO F'ING MERCY.

 

[Plairnkk]

Venom I totally hear you there. A lot of people don't like me personally because of the way I come off at tournaments (Dq'ing, simply turning gamecubes off/pulling out cords while people are still playing) but I am simply trying to get tournaments done on time and players DO NOT listen if you don't enforce things.

I would KILL for other TO's to start enforcing things a bit more. I'm tired of feeling like the mean one!!




edit:::: I would also like to point out that this thread makes me sick to my stomach. Reading cases of people stealing things or of people not allowing to let others play friendlies really is insulting. I don't even like TALKING about the decline of the community. I've tried so hard for the past 4 years to help BUILD the community, and Pound being my last tournament I'd hate to think everything I did was for nothing.

 

[Venom NY]

Venom I totally hear you there. A lot of people don't like me personally because of the way I come off at tournaments (Dq'ing, simply turning gamecubes off/pulling out cords while people are still playing) but I am simply trying to get tournaments done on time and players DO NOT listen if you don't enforce things.

I would KILL for other TO's to start enforcing things a bit more. I'm tired of feeling like the mean one!!




edit:::: I would also like to point out that this thread makes me sick to my stomach. Reading cases of people stealing things or of people not allowing to let others play friendlies really is insulting. I don't even like TALKING about the decline of the community. I've tried so hard for the past 4 years to help BUILD the community, and Pound being my last tournament I'd hate to think everything I did was for nothing.

Don't worry bro, you will not be alone in enforcing these rules anymore, I can guarantee that, I wish I could go to Pound and help you out I really really do.

This thread def. hurts =/ for all the reasons you said and more.

 

[ranmaru]

Venom I totally hear you there. A lot of people don't like me personally because of the way I come off at tournaments (Dq'ing, simply turning gamecubes off/pulling out cords while people are still playing) but I am simply trying to get tournaments done on time and players DO NOT listen if you don't enforce things.

I would KILL for other TO's to start enforcing things a bit more. I'm tired of feeling like the mean one!!




edit:::: I would also like to point out that this thread makes me sick to my stomach. Reading cases of people stealing things or of people not allowing to let others play friendlies really is insulting. I don't even like TALKING about the decline of the community. I've tried so hard for the past 4 years to help BUILD the community, and Pound being my last tournament I'd hate to think everything I did was for nothing.

No, you didn't do those for nothing. : ] We'll always remember what you did for the community, and we can always choose to do what you did.

 

[D20]

Respect.

Show some to the TOs... and they will show it for you. Our community is very lucky to have members like Alucard and Plank, who really put it all on the line so these events can continue. I get so upset when I see players trashing venues, witness people disobeying (or simply not listening) to the TOs' instructions, and hear stories about questionable (if not illegal) activity going on at the venues and hotels. As some of you have already mentioned, the TO/player relationship IS a two-way street. We are the reflection of one another. Unfortunately, I think everyone here is preaching to the choir... the posters in this thread DO seem to recognize that the scale of these events (such as RoM and Pound) is large. The "troublemakers" and "dissenters" are probably not reading (or caring) about what is posted in this thread. I believe we ALL need to take it upon ourselves to lead by example when we attend these tournaments.

I will see everyone at Pound V.

 

[Venom NY]

Respect.

Show some to the TOs... and they will show it for you. Our community is very lucky to have members like Alucard and Plank, who really put it all on the line so these events can continue. I get so upset when I see players trashing venues, witness people disobeying (or simply not listening) to the TOs' instructions, and hear stories about questionable (if not illegal) activity going on at the venues and hotels. As some of you have already mentioned, the TO/player relationship IS a two-way street. We are the reflection of one another. Unfortunately, I think everyone here is preaching to the choir... the posters in this thread DO seem to recognize that the scale of these events (such as RoM and Pound) is large. The "troublemakers" and "dissenters" are probably not reading (or caring) about what is posted in this thread. I believe we ALL need to take it upon ourselves to lead by example when we attend these tournaments.

I will see everyone at Pound V.

Very true, it is very likely that the people that do all of these bad things are not looking at this and really don't care because they start trouble for us in the first place and why would they care now? And WORD UP! about PEOPLE TRASHING THE VENUE, I REMEMBER AFTER DAY 1 IT WAS RIDICULOUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I don't think people notice that we DO provide people with garbage cans to throw stuff away.

**** post D20

 

[Plairnkk]

Lol at *Pound* 4 people broke into another building on the fairgrounds next to the venue and smashed a handle of rum on the floor and just left the broken glass everywhere. Strained relations with the venue ++ cost extra money. Some people are just rude

 

[Linguini]

not only do i believe that the smash community has deteriorated, i believe society as a whole has deteriorated. the way i perceive it is similar to my perception of the smash metagame; as time passes people realize that they can get farther by utilizing certain technique's (in this case theft/manipulation are the advanced techniques LOL). i definitely feel that in the year 2010 people seek self-benefit more than relationships with others; this has shown both in and outside of smash. i don't know if it legitimately derives from our economy or not, regardless it is quite evident.

EDIT: I think a step in the right direction would be for TO's to man the **** up and ban people that are damaging our community. DJ Nintendo (he's a close friend of mine but I have to keep it real) and Eggm currently owe people money that it does not seem they plan on repaying. I have contacted TO's about banning these offenders and my requests have been brushed to the side because TO's would rather not get involved. as the role models as of our community, TO's should take the initiative to do something about this.

Aziz ur such a ***

But I agree with the society moral deterioration rant.

I completely agree with G-Reg on this one, the TO can benefit as much as he wants, as long as the tournament experience is made efficient/enjoyable/comfortable.

Many of these factors were already listed but I could add a couple more:

-Well designed area of play, i.e. table areas that aren't crammed and comfortable seating where the players can see the tv evenly. This was a major negative part of my Tipped Off 6 experience. The 4 chairs where part of a bench,for the majority of the tv's, and they were nailed to the ground.People placed the tv's in terrible locations and thus caused people to get reeeeeally ****ty angles in tournament matches.

-Good air-conditioning(if tournament is in summer). Genesis failed at this, and, sorry Plank I have to say that Pound 2 tops it off for most sweaty tournament lol. I remember my hands slipping off the controller and heard m2k b!tching about it as well. There was also Fogged windows due to the evaporated sweat LOL

-At least 1 projector for hype matches and finals. This makes the tourney goers feel more involved in the tournament, thus adding hype. Pound 4 and Genesis used this efficiently.

And the pound 4 venue was sick because I was smoking at the racetrack right behind the fairgrounds like all day haha

 

[Nintendude]

So I don't actually have time to read all of these posts, but....
In defense of the ROM3 TOs, I've been to tournaments at ToyWiz since 2006, and the guy who owns the store is a money grubbing ****. I would not be surprised if he's responsible for this unaccounted for cash.

 

[phish-it]

So I don't actually have time to read all of these posts, but....
In defense of the ROM3 TOs, I've been to tournaments at ToyWiz since 2006, and the guy who owns the store is a money grubbing ****. I would not be surprised if he's responsible for this unaccounted for cash.

I was just going to say the same thing. The worst part is he does nothing other than provide a venue. Alukard, and before that Bailey were the ones actually running the tournaments; conducting registration, seeding the bracket, calling out matches and making sure the tourney gets done.

The manager (Jeff) does nothing but collect a fat percentage of the people participating.

 

[D1]

ROM3 was awesome. Apex and Pound 4 were awesome. I won't rate any tourney better than the other, but if those guys got payed for their efforts, I say no one should have any problem with it. They're the hosts, if you don't like what's going on don't attend. Plain and simple.

 

[DK SmAsH]

First and Foremost Thank you Alu and others for hosting/making the tourny! I had fun and I plan to go to more in the future. That being said, no one is perfect and people will always find something to complain about so try not to take things too personally!! This thread is about the morality of profit from running a tourny, if you made profit, than you're due to criticism in this thread. Don't read it if you can't/don't want to handle it. ^.^b

There should be some sort of DQ rule in place at every tournament. I personally I like the mages DQ rule:
After a match has been called, if a player is two minutes late he will receive a warning. At 4 minutes late, he will be given a loss for the first game of the set. After six minutes, he will be given a loss of the entire set.

Great ruling idea, but perhaps let there be slightly more time before loss of set.

id be happy to pay a larger venue fee and have the TO make however much he wants, but it needs to be earned..... i.e.

adequate setups
speedy bracket/pool making
printed pool sheets
sound system of some kind
reliable scheduling
sensible and clear rule/stagelist
adequate chairs
breathable space around the venue

just an overall comfortable experience

i have no problem with a TO making money..... but if these things are lacking then the TO isnt earning his pay.

Agree Completely. <3 G-Regulatizzle

There is so much that honestly I talked to alu about one of them of course was getting a megaphone I honestly even offered to put money in the pot (and I dont have alot of money to begin with)

People do not know how expensive it is to live in NYC FORREAL FORREAL.

Then why didn't you have a megaphone? No Johns. Also, when I had lost my keys, dude that worked for the venue (may have been owner) busted out a MEGAPHONE to shout to everyone that my keys were missing. Why not use that? And unless they have been living in an isolated cave all their life, i think people do know how expensive it is to live in NYC (even tho it wasnt in NYC) if that is a serious issue to you, host the tourny somewhere else less expensive. (Or move to a less expensive state.)

With your join date of 2009 I wouldn't expect you to understand. And please, don't tell me what the housing situation is like in NY. I've stayed in dozens of places around NY and NJ, both in hotels and in smashers' houses, and I've been doing it since before you knew how to L Cancel.

And I know housing isn't always available, that's exactly the point I was making. But it's not unavoidable, which is why I brought it up.

What's up with NY people thinking everyone else doesn't/can't know about their ordeal? You all are just in another dayum state, it's not so different that we can't relate...

Every MLG this year also ran ahead of schedule with only 20 setups. That includes the 250 person MLG event plus a 64 team bracket (MLG Columbus was the 250 person event, which ran EXACTLY on schedule the entire weekend, except when it came to the finals cause M2K beat everyone really fast).

And why can't our T.O.s do this with more set-ups? o.O Probably because the community as a whole doesn't take them as serious, and T.O.s aren't strict enough. Step your **** Smash Community.

but you have to understand
when someone opens up their house
their house gets *****
im not saying you would do it
but some people are just a-holes and dont care about peoples things
so most people turn away from housing people

Don't invite random strangers into your house and you can avoid this problem. Have people you know and can trust stay. If people you are letting stay want others you don't know to stay, say no or hold them entirely responsible for those people. Problem solved.

The last few times I've housed people, **** has been stolen, people wrecked stuff and since I'm way too nice to people, I always end up getting more then double the amount of people that I originally planned on housing. Not just that, but since I'm way too ****ing nice to people, that reputation gets out and I have way too many people hearing from other people that I'm housign and that I'm a pushover so they feel they can just invite themselves over.

It gets really frustrating, and I've all but stopped. People have taken advantage of me way too many times, and if you expect me to just open up my house to anyone because you travelled a really far distance, you're out of your mind. Maybe if this was a year ago, but I'm way too bitter now to be that generous.

refer to above.


So bottom line:
T.O.s should most certainly earn money for their hard work (this doesnt mean **** the community with venue fees, i know times are tough, but they are hard for everyone, players included) BUT if a tourny isn't run well, then fukking
MONEY BACK!!

On phone. Banning doesn't get money back. blacklisting doesn't get money back.

...neither does causing riots.

 

[Plairnkk]

lol shaun you are hilarious. we need to chill again soon

 

[WassupJB]

i read the first post, d1's, wife's, pc jona's, and dk smash's post.

i'll read other posts later. as i TO i want to read more but as of the moment it's 330am and i'm tired.

oh and wife owned pc jona.

-jb

 

[Nihonjin]

Hosting a successful tournament takes a lot of effort and time, it's work. When you work, you deserve to get paid. Not only because it's fair, but also because it gives the TO's incentive to keep hosting tournaments and make them even bigger and better than the last time.

So yes, TO's should make money from hosting tournaments.

The only thing I ask is that they be candid about it.

 

[P.C. Jona]

.



10char

 

[Venom NY]

Then why didn't you have a megaphone? No Johns. Also, when I had lost my keys, dude that worked for the venue (may have been owner) busted out a MEGAPHONE to shout to everyone that my keys were missing. Why not use that? And unless they have been living in an isolated cave all their life, i think people do know how expensive it is to live in NYC (even tho it wasnt in NYC) if that is a serious issue to you, host the tourny somewhere else less expensive. (Or move to a less expensive state.)



What's up with NY people thinking everyone else doesn't/can't know about their ordeal? You all are just in another dayum state, it's not so different that we can't relate...

***To first post*****
I didn't even know there was a megaphone in the store... like I said a long time ago in idk what page, that was like the second time ive ever been at that venue. We didn't get a megaphone because like I said before in another gargantuan post I made before....Bills, LOL I don't understand how you read my post but skipped what I said about that like I didn't already address it LMAO. I really wish I could move to another state I would've been done it, thats def. a much easier said than done thing. In my opinion the venue isn't that bad, especially with the free parking and its actually the biggest venue I've ever been to in nyc VS something thats actually inside the city. I remember back in 06-07 when there were huge tournaments like Zenith, people had to come into the city pay like the exact same venue fee that there is now + try to find parking and if not they had to park in one of those money stealing garages where they charge like $10 for an hour and ****

****Second post**** But there is a difference though. Like I seriously remember hearing it on the news on how beast it was that living in NYC is the most expensive state to live at in America hands down. And its like if you live where we live (me and alu) so thats bronx, manhattan, queens, brooklyn everything is expensive now like its ******** (I didn't want to say how expensive things are every where else because I don't know those areas like that). But yeah bro, you have to see it to believe it, and it's not like were ignorant to the fact that recent issues have affected the entire America but we have mad ****, the main one being over crowding here and that alone = **** in so many ways LOL (especially in the job department) but I don't even want to get into that on the boards.

 

[crismas]

Dionis, I completely understand the idea of having bills to pay. But Brian's been running No Johns and ROM's for a few years now. There's no reason that for a few years he (and others) couldn't pitch in or save up for a megaphone. This wasn't the first tournament he ever ran. I'm not *****ing about anything, I'm just saying that at this point for ROM3 there's no excuse. A sound system of some kind would be really REALLY helpful in managing people.

 

[Alukard]

i got ya ROM4 is going to be off the hook WATCH! <333

 

[otg]

@ DK Smash:

The thing you don't get, is that these aren't random strangers. I know all of the people who have crashed at my place, if not personally then at least through their name/reputation on the boards, so I should feel comfortable letting them crash right?

What's alarming, is something went missing in my mom's room when I housed a ****load of people for the No Johns over the summer that Hbox went to, and the only person I know who crashed in there is someone who I refuse to believe took it, but what the hell else could've happened?

**** is ****ed up, that's all I'm saying, and people seem to have this idea that you should go out of your way for people in the community just because we all love this game. Well, I'm kinda done with that.

 

[ranmaru]

Yeah. Need someone to be security and **** lol.

When I'mma host mad I'd donate extra venue fee (to a charity, my girlfriend will choose ) or use it for the next tournament. (something that you guys would want of course, that would be used in the second)

But like I need to get a car, that's the only way to assure myself that I can get around for tournaments. I'm going to take my permit test, but I'm 21 now holy ****.