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Pound Prizes

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Mew2King

King of the Mews
Joined
Jul 18, 2002
Messages
11,263
Location
Cinnaminson (southwest NJ 5 min drive from Philly)
oh yeah, I forgot about this, warriorknight last year replied to what I said

here's what he said

Warriorknight wrote at 12:19 AM on Feb 1, 2010 :
Yea that really sucked man. After I heard that our bracket matches were still good I explained our situation to PLNK, that we got here at the same time and are getting different treatment. He didnt even want to put them in losers. The worst part was that both our teams were at the beginning of the bracket. I'm guessing whoever you were supposed to go up against went ahead and quickly announced that you guys werent here so they can move on. Nobody had the decency to call any of us and say that Jman/M2k's match had just been announced. smh

http://allisbrawl.com/blogpost.aspx?id=53105&page=5

it's in the middle of the page

doesn't mention the 20 dollar thing though, but he admits it's the same situation for him and DJ as it was for me and Jman
 

AllyKnight

Banned via Administration
Joined
Apr 30, 2008
Messages
10,881
Location
*'~-East Coast/Quebec/Michigan-~'*
Hey Plank, weren't you suppose to make sure everyone didn't scram people? OH and you said it was fine for me. I'm not to blame, you put this **** on you by not doing what you've told people.
 

Zodiac

Smash Master
Joined
Aug 10, 2005
Messages
3,557
Whenever there is an event where the venue is accommodating hundreds of people there is a risk of this happening, everyone knows that, or everyone SHOULD know that. I found myself in this very position once, luckily it was a local and only $40 was on the line. I wasn't there but, plank thank you for running this tournament.

Although I do sympathize with both sides...

not being able to pay the winners sucks..
being a winner and not getting money sucks.. Really this is a lose lose situation and the best thing to do is to just accept it and move on.
 

Shenanigans

Smash Cadet
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Messages
63
i don't want to rage, but. . .

people definitely spent more than 30k coming to the event. they spent far more than that on lodging, gas, plane tickets, food, and other amenities.

but you want them to take on more debt just to save plank's ***.

hmmmm.

and to the point of "worked hard," i don't think you realize how much people work on smash. i happen to know dr peepee
puts in tons of work everyday on smash, and it is insulting that you, being a person who plays (presumably) the game of smash and respects the skill involved, would belittle his efforts. the winners have indeed worked hard. the combined value of practice people in the tournament have put in even at minimum wage at least exceeds a million bux

edit:

@ fatal: at the time of last pound, i sold him 8 cubes with melee and he had already 10 setups then so just a clarification on that part
Okay, I don't know if you worded that wrong or not, though you made it seem as though anyone person spent more than 30k just to make it to pound 5.

Which I am gonna have to disagree with. The type of "work" we all do as smashers is what most people in the world outside of the smash community would consider for the most part non-productive in the grand scheme of things. Though to most people within the community, it can be considered work. Though I have always viewed it as my way of having a ****ton of fun. If I win money by playing a game, I'm all for it. Though I would never consider it an actual means of work. Which is why it is in quotation marks in my statement.

So you had a logical, but invalid point in my opinion. I never once considered playing smash "work" but more of one of my favorite hobbies that I would have loved to have been one of the greats at. I am even waiting on P:M (if it makes it big) to reinsert myself back into the tourney scene for a fresh, but familiar start.
 

CEOJebailey

The People's Organizer
Joined
Mar 23, 2008
Messages
168
Location
Orlando
Hey guys, My name is Alex Jebailey which some of you already know. I'm the man in Charge of the CEO 2011 Fighting Game Championships in Orlando, Fl this summer.

This Situation is unfortunate because this could happen to any major event, First off Plank ran Smash for my CEO 2010 Event and he was one of the best TO's I've ever worked with in terms of efficiency, now with that said he didn't have to put any money up(He paid for the Insurance Certificate but I reimbursed him) So he didn't have any risk involved like that of his own Pound V.

With that Said I know the risk involved with securing a big venue because like most Good TO's we have a dream of putting together the best events possible to increase mainstream exposure. Now what Plank did with Pound V was put his TOTAL TRUST into the fact that Smashers would help fulfill the hotel(sadly because we are all gamers most of us are completely broke and living off of parent's money( don't deny it if you were one of 10 people that crammed into one hotel room) which is the same I'm doing with my CEO Event(Which is a $20,000 Risk for me). Not just Planks but any TO's biggest mistake is not having the capital to promise payouts and he is at total fault for not paying out what he promised to the players, but because he has shown everyone he is completely in debt all the arguing in the world and bashing won't help get everyone's money back. Not that I'm defending him(I've promised a $5000 pot for my EVO seeding games, luckily because I've won so many tournaments myself I can risk the money), but this will ruin the chances of a 5 year event of ever becoming bigger than what it was.

I've been around the Scene for nearly 15 years now and I've seen so many Organizers come and go but just one mistake no matter how successful their past records are and it's curtains for them. Granted they should NEVER promise something you can't fulfill and this issue won't come up but just realize how incredibly hard it is to do what we do for so little in return. We put together big events cause we Love bringing people together, Plank is one of those people, If he was in it for the money he would of been gone after Pound 1's success. Now he was put up against a wall financially(And life is all about money and without legit sponsors Plank had nothing to work with before the event) and he had to go with The Golden rule of life which is Survival and he's doing what's in his best interest for himself and his life otherwise this mistake will end up costing him debt for the rest of his life).

For all the people that are owed money they have every right to go after Plank until he can return something to them. All that hard work, practicing, winning for nothing, I don't care if it's just a videogame tournament even though we play cause it's fun, but if you're promised money and you don't receive it you have every right to never attend an event from someone who owes you money again so I hate for a 5 year event to disappear because of this major mistake by getting a hotel venue.

Moral of all this is, if you want to keep the competitive community alive(I used to play smash and even I must admit 10 years strong is mighty impressive and deserves merit) then you have to realize it's just like any other hobby out there, you put money in to help out TO's and their events. Think of it this way, Look at MMOs like World of Warcraft, people are paying 10-15 bucks a month to keep playing the same game. You guys just had to buy Smash Bros with no monthly fee, the least you can do is save up some money to get a hotel room and not cram 20 dudes into a room to save money) again that's not a defense to plank, but think of it on the bigger picture.

Anyways who knows if anyone I just said means anything to you guys but to sum it all up, From the outside looking in, it's a shame one of the best TO's I've ever met got himself into a very deep hole that will be impossible to climb out of. Going after a broke man won't get you your money back, it's up to the community to either forgive or just move on and hope someone else with balls can come out of nowhere and step up to the plate for something to replace POUND 5. I did that last year when a scammer completely cancelled his event, so I'm sure this can lead to an even stronger community in the future so don't let it ruin the fun that this is all about.


I wanted Plank to help out With CEO 2011 again but I know he won't want to be around anything for a long time so I've dropped his name from the thread and leave it up to Hungrybox and other local smashers to help the East Coast for some big things. This wouldn't be the first community I've helped save. So Come on down to DISNEY WORLD and enter the CEO 2011 Tournament lol http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=296882

Jebailey OUT.
 

Voodoo Daddy

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 7, 2006
Messages
234
Location
Towson, MD
wiki is simple for smashers to understand. Tort law in this country is simple. If you fulfill the elements of the tort you will have a ruling in your favor. even wiki can get those elements right. its not complex. fraud is fraud.

From www.fraudlaw.org:

To sustain a finding of common law fraud, the trial court in most cases must make findings of fact as to each of the nine elements of fraud. Howell v. Kraft, 10 Wash. App. 266, 517 P.2d 203 (1973). Those elements generally are: (1) a representation of an existing fact, (2) its materiality, (3) its falsity, (4) the speaker's knowledge of its falsity or ignorance of its truth, (5) his intent that it should be acted on by the person to whom it is made, (6) ignorance of its falsity on the part of the person to whom it is made, (7) the latter's reliance on the truth of the representation, (8) his right to rely upon it, and (9) his consequent damage.
we have no fact. There was only a listed entrance fee.

We have no solid definitions. We have a verbal agreement, but if the verbal agreement is ones word versus another it becomes knoll. I know that case, I've seen fraud cases. It's not like there's anything solid to prove. Again, you can always get a lenient judge, but I don't think we can claim a great truth nor provide evidence.

We have hearsay and no documentation.

If I were an attorney I would not be scared of this case.

EDIT: But I appreciate you actually trying to find information.
 

Tommy_G

Smash Champion
Joined
Mar 20, 2008
Messages
2,355
Location
Miami, FL
dude u clearly havent been to soup kitchens and done community service. ive talked to these people and some of them work get money but still dont have money for food and by ur definition the work they are doing isnt a job cause they not being paid enough. GTFO u ignorant *****.

also their are people who sell enough drugs to sustain themselves but u cant put that on a resume either. so again eat a **** u ignornat S.O.B.

edit My bad at thinking GIMR was saying gaming isnt a job. i apologize for that.
Community service is voluntary and not a job. The same thing usually applies for soup kitchens.

And when its not voluntary
Min wage is $7.00, even 20 hours (4 hours/day for 5 days a week) of that is $140 week=$125/week

Please let me know of a region that someone can reliably make that much money and I'll shut up.

How is making money illegally related to deciding if a hobby can be considered a job? Does anyone try to make a hobby out of selling drugs?

Any other stupid claims you'd like me to disprove?
 

Эикельманн [РУС]

Banned via Administration
Joined
Jul 17, 2009
Messages
5,263
Location
Orlando/Владивосток
Hey guys, My name is Alex Jebailey which some of you already know. I'm the man in Charge of the CEO 2011 Fighting Game Championships in Orlando, Fl this summer.

This Situation is unfortunate because this could happen to any major event, First off Plank ran Smash for my CEO 2010 Event and he was one of the best TO's I've ever worked with in terms of efficiency, now with that said he didn't have to put any money up(He paid for the Insurance Certificate but I reimbursed him) So he didn't have any risk involved like that of his own Pound V.

With that Said I know the risk involved with securing a big venue because like most Good TO's we have a dream of putting together the best events possible to increase mainstream exposure. Now what Plank did with Pound V was put his TOTAL TRUST into the fact that Smashers would help fulfill the hotel(sadly because we are all gamers most of us are completely broke and living off of parent's money( don't deny it if you were one of 10 people that crammed into one hotel room) which is the same I'm doing with my CEO Event(Which is a $20,000 Risk for me). Not just Planks but any TO's biggest mistake is not having the capital to promise payouts and he is at total fault for not paying out what he promised to the players, but because he has shown everyone he is completely in debt all the arguing in the world and bashing won't help get everyone's money back. Not that I'm defending him(I've promised a $5000 pot for my EVO seeding games, luckily because I've won so many tournaments myself I can risk the money), but this will ruin the chances of a 5 year event of ever becoming bigger than what it was.

I've been around the Scene for nearly 15 years now and I've seen so many Organizers come and go but just one mistake no matter how successful their past records are and it's curtains for them. Granted they should NEVER promise something you can't fulfill and this issue won't come up but just realize how incredibly hard it is to do what we do for so little in return. We put together big events cause we Love bringing people together, Plank is one of those people, If he was in it for the money he would of been gone after Pound 1's success. Now he was put up against a wall financially(And life is all about money and without legit sponsors Plank had nothing to work with before the event) and he had to go with The Golden rule of life which is Survival and he's doing what's in his best interest for himself and his life otherwise this mistake will end up costing him debt for the rest of his life).

For all the people that are owed money they have every right to go after Plank until he can return something to them. All that hard work, practicing, winning for nothing, I don't care if it's just a videogame tournament even though we play cause it's fun, but if you're promised money and you don't receive it you have every right to never attend an event from someone who owes you money again so I hate for a 5 year event to disappear because of this major mistake by getting a hotel venue.

Moral of all this is, if you want to keep the competitive community alive(I used to play smash and even I must admit 10 years strong is mighty impressive and deserves merit) then you have to realize it's just like any other hobby out there, you put money in to help out TO's and their events. Think of it this way, Look at MMOs like World of Warcraft, people are paying 10-15 bucks a month to keep playing the same game. You guys just had to buy Smash Bros with no monthly fee, the least you can do is save up some money to get a hotel room and not cram 20 dudes into a room to save money) again that's not a defense to plank, but think of it on the bigger picture.

Anyways who knows if anyone I just said means anything to you guys but to sum it all up, From the outside looking in, it's a shame one of the best TO's I've ever met got himself into a very deep hole that will be impossible to climb out of. Going after a broke man won't get you your money back, it's up to the community to either forgive or just move on and hope someone else with balls can come out of nowhere and step up to the plate for something to replace POUND 5. I did that last year when a scammer completely cancelled his event, so I'm sure this can lead to an even stronger community in the future so don't let it ruin the fun that this is all about.


I wanted Plank to help out With CEO 2011 again but I know he won't want to be around anything for a long time so I've dropped his name from the thread and leave it up to Hungrybox and other local smashers to help the East Coast for some big things. This wouldn't be the first community I've helped save. So Come on down to DISNEY WORLD and enter the CEO 2011 Tournament lol http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=296882

Jebailey OUT.
Just so everyone who's too lazy to go back and see it can read the best post in this thread.
 

ADHD

Smash Hero
Joined
Feb 18, 2008
Messages
7,194
Location
New Jersey
Since I'm not getting my money and neither are the people that deserve it far more than me, I might as well just immaturely speak my mind for what I think of him after these events and a previous one in the past, seeing as how these are the only things I have to judge him for.

Plank is a living sack of ****.

Ahh, that felt good. Now I'm going to practice hardcore for a tournament with an actual trustworthy TO @ Whobo 3.
 

trahhSTEEZY

Smash Champion
Joined
Jul 24, 2007
Messages
2,287
Location
vegas baby
This Situation is unfortunate because this could happen to any major event
Pretty unfair statement, anything COULD happen at any major event, that doesn't mean it's acceptable or more justifiable just because it could happen.

I honestly don't think this is a 'likely' problem. Will something like this happen at Genesis? No, I guarantee not, because they didn't make some dumb *** deal with the hotel, they're planning ahead properly.
 

S0FT

Smash Ace
Joined
May 7, 2007
Messages
956
Location
Planet Earth
"This Situation is unfortunate because this could happen to any major event" - GoggleMyName

"anything COULD happen at any major event" - trahhSTEEZY


.......
 

Pierce7d

Wise Hermit
Joined
Dec 20, 2006
Messages
6,289
Location
Teaneck, North Bergen County, NJ, USA
3DS FC
1993-9028-0439
I might go to your tournament now. That was too pro.

Since I'm not getting my money and neither are the people that deserve it far more than me, I might as well just immaturely speak my mind for what I think of him after these events and a previous one in the past, seeing as how these are the only things I have to judge him for.

Plank is a living sack of ****.

Ahh, that felt good. Now I'm going to practice hardcore for a tournament with an actual trustworthy TO @ Whobo 3.
So come over
 

S0FT

Smash Ace
Joined
May 7, 2007
Messages
956
Location
Planet Earth
"This Situation is unfortunate because this could happen to any major event" - GoggleMyName

"anything COULD happen at any major event" - trahhSTEEZY


.......

this
 

Laijin

Smash Hero
Joined
Oct 10, 2004
Messages
5,848
Location
Rylai the Crystal Maiden's Igloo
Typically, this is the part where we explain why his statement or argument is weak, and or point out fallacies.
Oh right I forgot about that part. Soft did it for me though.

"This Situation is unfortunate because this could happen to any major event" - GoggleMyName

"anything COULD happen at any major event" - trahhSTEEZY


.......
 

GimR

GimR, Co-Founder of VGBootCamp
Joined
Nov 2, 2006
Messages
5,602
Location
Maryland
NNID
VGBC_GimR
@ Jebailey: Nice post. Just to clarify though, smash has a lot of awesome national tournaments. Pound was only one of them
 

ProTip

Smash Rookie
Joined
Mar 9, 2011
Messages
2
Since I'm not getting my money and neither are the people that deserve it far more than me, I might as well just immaturely speak my mind for what I think of him after these events and a previous one in the past, seeing as how these are the only things I have to judge him for.

Plank is a living sack of ****.

Ahh, that felt good. Now I'm going to practice hardcore for a tournament with an actual trustworthy TO @ Whobo 3.
Hey, I have a better idea:
How about getting a job? Or finishing college or something like that?

Yeah, that sure would be a lot more creative than wasting you life by playing a figgin' videogame which will NOT give you a career or a job on any industry.

Oh hell, who am I to tell you what to do? I'm only a guy making $3000 a month, not living off on my mothers money, like some people seem to be doing.
 

S0FT

Smash Ace
Joined
May 7, 2007
Messages
956
Location
Planet Earth
His statement meant that something like that could happen at any major tournament.


Then you said anything could happen at a major tournament.... but his statement was unfair...

Nothing else you said after that matters.
 

luke_atyeo

Smash Hero
Joined
May 10, 2008
Messages
7,215
) and he had to go with The Golden rule of life which is Survival and he's doing what's in his best interest for himself and his life otherwise this mistake will end up costing him debt for the rest of his life
I've been seeing this arguement alot in this thread, (so I dont mean to just pick on you dude) and let me just get this straight.
there was about what, $10k dept that he had to pay off?

you call that being in debt for the rest of your life?

a few years back, when I was about 18, I got into an $8000 debt through no fault of my own, and it took me around a year to pay it back.

I dont care what you say, the only way $10k can put you in debt your entire life is if your terrible at life and refuse to do any work.

just putting that out there.


also on another note, people keep claiming that if we were in the same situation as plank, we'd all take the prize money and pay the debt too.
now, I dont think anyone can deny that (simply because you cant really prove that you wouldnt unless you have ever been in that situation)
HOWEVER, what I think most of us would have done, would have been to handle this whole situation a hell of a lot better.

sure plank ****ed up, and we should all have some sympathy for his situation, but again, he handled it very very poorly.




also, laijin, you still going?
I though you were too mature and 'quit' this whole discussion like you said you would?
you cant resist the call... of the thriller.
 

trahhSTEEZY

Smash Champion
Joined
Jul 24, 2007
Messages
2,287
Location
vegas baby
Oh right I forgot about that part. Soft did it for me though.

"This Situation is unfortunate because this could happen to any major event" - GoggleMyName

"anything COULD happen at any major event" - trahhSTEEZY


.......
what don't you get about that?


His statement meant that something like that could happen at any major tournament.


Then you said anything could happen at a major tournament.... but his statement was unfair...

Nothing else you said after that matters.
Right, anything could happen at a major tournament, but GoogleMyName said it in a defending manner for plank, like well unfortunately this CAN happen at a major. So im simply saying, OF COURSE IT CAN happen, but that doesn't change anything. Something that can happen doesn't mean it's more likely to happen.

his statement was unfair because he was justfying the fact that something like this happened, just becuase IT CAN HAPPEN, which isn't right imo.
 

S0FT

Smash Ace
Joined
May 7, 2007
Messages
956
Location
Planet Earth
Im def. not supporting you.

If you were responding to the quoted portion of his post. You def. read into it. aloooot
 

Voodoo Daddy

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 7, 2006
Messages
234
Location
Towson, MD
I've been seeing this arguement alot in this thread, (so I dont mean to just pick on you dude) and let me just get this straight.
there was about what, $10k dept that he had to pay off?

you call that being in debt for the rest of your life?

a few years back, when I was about 18, I got into an $8000 debt through no fault of my own, and it took me around a year to pay it back.

I dont care what you say, the only way $10k can put you in debt your entire life is if your terrible at life and refuse to do any work.

just putting that out there.


also on another note, people keep claiming that if we were in the same situation as plank, we'd all take the prize money and pay the debt too.
now, I dont think anyone can deny that (simply because you cant really prove that you wouldnt unless you have ever been in that situation)
HOWEVER, what I think most of us would have done, would have been to handle this whole situation a hell of a lot better.

sure plank ****ed up, and we should all have some sympathy for his situation, but again, he handled it very very poorly.




also, laijin, you still going?
I though you were too mature and 'quit' this whole discussion like you said you would?
you cant resist the call... of the thriller.
Dude... college?

It's expensive. i mean mine's not, but ask scar and I'm sure he has at least a xool 20k in debt minimum. Dude went to Upenn.
 

Pierce7d

Wise Hermit
Joined
Dec 20, 2006
Messages
6,289
Location
Teaneck, North Bergen County, NJ, USA
3DS FC
1993-9028-0439
Hey, I have a better idea:
How about getting a job? Or finishing college or something like that?

Yeah, that sure would be a lot more creative than wasting you life by playing a figgin' videogame which will NOT give you a career or a job on any industry.

Oh hell, who am I to tell you what to do? I'm only a guy making $3000 a month, not living off on my mothers money, like some people seem to be doing.
Except he's in high school, and he's taking care of his business. He's also accepted to college and plans to attend in the fall. Doesn't give anyone the right to rob him of his earnings.
 

Merkuri

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 1, 2010
Messages
1,861
Again, I don't know why people are saying that Plank is under no legal obligation to pay anything. Does no one watch Judge Mathis or Judge Joe Brown? People get awarded money with less negligence/breach of duty(legal terms) than what we're seeing here.
 
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