There is next to no knockback, correct, but what little knockback there is moves the opponent in the upward/forward direction. Because of slow fall speed, floaties will stay more or less where they are in midair as you fall to the ground. Fastfallers can be counted on to move to the ground at more or less the same speed as you and therefore can land inside your pitiful grab range. This is why fair leads into something like a dsmash for a floaty a lot more easily than it does grabs, although the stuntime is pretty crappy all around so it may be risky to go for it when it isn't a sure thing.
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Pikachu: A discussion
- Thread starter Tope
- Start date
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
RaynEX made me do it!
He whipped me until I finished!
I have welts on my welts!
But then backup arrived hauled him off to the gas chambers.
Also here have a Fox U-throw U-air guide.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=6430282&postcount=1
He whipped me until I finished!
I have welts on my welts!
But then backup arrived hauled him off to the gas chambers.
Also here have a Fox U-throw U-air guide.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=6430282&postcount=1
you are spamming this EVERYWHERE arent you?
-Chad-
Slackerator
That blew my mind Kaze =O
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
Hey chad how come I don't have your aim.
More importantly why didn't we friendly at TGMT.
edit: raynex says you're pretty good
More importantly why didn't we friendly at TGMT.
edit: raynex says you're pretty good
Dark Iori Yagami
Smash Lord
lol evil gay fox, <3 you are amazing.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
evil gay fox is awesome <3
Hey there Pika fans.
I was messing around in Training today.
Did you know Pikachu has a 0 to ~70% combo on Fox and Falco?
U-throw -> Uthrow -> Usmash -> Utilt -> Usmash -> Chase -> Dair
Or you could sacrifice a bit of damage and Uair semi-spike off the edge.
Granted, it can be escaped with platform techs or with proper DI.
It might at least make the spacies think twice before counterpicking FD.
If it turns out that none of this works against a real opponent, my fallback plan is to shout "April Fool's" and run.
I was messing around in Training today.
Did you know Pikachu has a 0 to ~70% combo on Fox and Falco?
U-throw -> Uthrow -> Usmash -> Utilt -> Usmash -> Chase -> Dair
Or you could sacrifice a bit of damage and Uair semi-spike off the edge.
Granted, it can be escaped with platform techs or with proper DI.
It might at least make the spacies think twice before counterpicking FD.
If it turns out that none of this works against a real opponent, my fallback plan is to shout "April Fool's" and run.
festizzio
Smash Champion
first of all, you can't chaingrab a fox/falco at 0%
not sure about falcon
dsmash's di is too weird, they could di out of it or get that weird di where they're flying but they can airdodge/jump and stuff
actually, i'm not even sure uthrow -> usmash works at 0% on the spacies and falcon
not sure about falcon
dsmash's di is too weird, they could di out of it or get that weird di where they're flying but they can airdodge/jump and stuff
actually, i'm not even sure uthrow -> usmash works at 0% on the spacies and falcon
Um. You definitely can chaingrab the spacies. I've done it in matches and N64 consistently references it in his matchup thread. If you can't chaingrab them then you're doing it wrong.
And yes, uthrow does lead to usmash. Try it out for yourself if you don't think it can.
The first combo can be DI'd too easily if the opponent knows what you're doing (and we should assume they do) and therefore has been removed. The second can be escaped as Falcon, so he has been taken off the list.
And yes, uthrow does lead to usmash. Try it out for yourself if you don't think it can.
The first combo can be DI'd too easily if the opponent knows what you're doing (and we should assume they do) and therefore has been removed. The second can be escaped as Falcon, so he has been taken off the list.
festizzio
Smash Champion
uthrow chain grab does NOT work at 0% unless they don't DI or DI right behind you.
They can tech out of the uthrow to usmash at 0% IF they DI.
DI screws everything up.
bahamutz69
Smash Journeyman
is pikas fair a legit gimp on spacies?
or is it just a dumb idea/are there better options?
or is it just a dumb idea/are there better options?
All from one thread. I'm sure it has been posted other places but I'm not going to search the entire Pika boards just to prove a point, agree to disagree I guess.
@ Bahamutz: Fair does has pitiful enough hitstun and knockback that the spacies can almost instantly restart their recovery. Just go with uair if you're attempting to jump out and gimp them.
festizzio
Smash Champion
Good job quoting a three-year-old thread. Try chain grabbing a space animal that knows how to DI at 0%. It doesn't work. Your so-called "proof" is just what other people have said/posted, if you were so sure of yourself why don't you post a video of you chain grabbing a DI'ing space animal at 0%?
And by the way, you can only agree or disagree with an opinion, and this is a fact. Just a little clarification for you.
Kyu Puff
Smash Champion
If they're above the stage you can use it to steal their second jump or side+B and push them lower, dj u-air. Or you could ledgehop tailspike. Personally I love f-air, but usually you'll have plenty of other options.
My opinion: This argument is lol.
You're really reaching mang. The age of the thread has nothing to do with it, DI wasn't invented a year ago. Just as another more recent post from a few months ago, if you aren't convinced:
For the record: since when does quoting someone who would know better than both of us not count as proof?
Johns: I don't have a capture card, and I'm sure as hell not going to go out and buy one just for the sake of this post.
festizzio
Smash Champion
I guess we'll wait for someone else to step in since neither of us are getting across to the other side.
festizzio
Smash Champion
lol, now i'm really curious as to what someone really experienced has to say
i think i remember striking up an argument like this a really long time ago when i first started maining pikachu, and someone came in and said it only works at 35-40% until like 80%, but then the same day i started thinking i remembered it i had a dream about it so now i can't remember if what i thought i remembered was in the dream or if it actually happened that day.
so now i'm actually not sure, all i know is i've tried it and it doesn't work for me, so now i'm really, really curious
i think i remember striking up an argument like this a really long time ago when i first started maining pikachu, and someone came in and said it only works at 35-40% until like 80%, but then the same day i started thinking i remembered it i had a dream about it so now i can't remember if what i thought i remembered was in the dream or if it actually happened that day.
so now i'm actually not sure, all i know is i've tried it and it doesn't work for me, so now i'm really, really curious
The real question is,
If chainthrowing works, why bother with a combo?
EDIT: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjWreorRpuw
About three minutes in. Doesn't really prove anything but it's still cool
If chainthrowing works, why bother with a combo?
EDIT: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjWreorRpuw
About three minutes in. Doesn't really prove anything but it's still cool
festizzio
Smash Champion
falcon gets ***** by chaingrabs O.o
only problem is grabbing a falcon on fd in the first place
almost impossible o.O
tdk_Samurai
Smash Ace
I've got a question on if and when to use a little trick I saw chudat do.
I watched a vid where he jumped off the stage and jumped back on the stage while doing a down b to make the thunder come down on the side of the stage for an edgegaurd.
So I started using this, but it seems that instead of knocking them out, it knocks them up and a little out and ends up giving them a better recovery option than they had in the first place.
Noticing this, I now have a theory that that would be a good tool to save your teamate who is going to miss the ledge by just a little and give them another up b from the knock back.
So what I want to know is:
1. Is there a good time to use that trick offensively, and if so when, or is that just an outdated trick that used to work, but not anymore, or what?
2. Does anyone else know of that being used as a teammate saving tool, or have any idea how well it would work. (I know I could nuetral b, you wouldn't have to be as accurate with this and you can't nuetral be below the stage.)
I watched a vid where he jumped off the stage and jumped back on the stage while doing a down b to make the thunder come down on the side of the stage for an edgegaurd.
So I started using this, but it seems that instead of knocking them out, it knocks them up and a little out and ends up giving them a better recovery option than they had in the first place.
Noticing this, I now have a theory that that would be a good tool to save your teamate who is going to miss the ledge by just a little and give them another up b from the knock back.
So what I want to know is:
1. Is there a good time to use that trick offensively, and if so when, or is that just an outdated trick that used to work, but not anymore, or what?
2. Does anyone else know of that being used as a teammate saving tool, or have any idea how well it would work. (I know I could nuetral b, you wouldn't have to be as accurate with this and you can't nuetral be below the stage.)
Works on a smaller stage like YS to KO them
Or maybe you could just jump out and uair them after they get knocked higher, but then it becomes a question of why you didn't uair them in the first place.
btw where in the Midwest do you live?
Or maybe you could just jump out and uair them after they get knocked higher, but then it becomes a question of why you didn't uair them in the first place.
btw where in the Midwest do you live?
tdk_Samurai
Smash Ace
I live in springfield Illinois, my family lives in Cedar Rapids Iowa though, so I have a feeling I will prolly play at some tourneys up there over the summer maybe.
N64
Smash Champion
In teams it could be useful, the main problem is your opponents won't likely let you do it. It takes a little bit of setup (and has decent lag, even though it doesn't hit you). Usually the better option is to stay near the edge and try to uair your teammate (with the intention of popping them up) as they get close to the stage, and then sweetspot the edge with your upB (or upB to stage depending on their response).
For singles, it can be useful. I think usually there are better options, but thundering this way can cover a lot of recovery angles and help set up a kill. By itself it won't usually kill, but it can force them into a more easily punishable position.
Yeah, that's my thoughts.
For singles, it can be useful. I think usually there are better options, but thundering this way can cover a lot of recovery angles and help set up a kill. By itself it won't usually kill, but it can force them into a more easily punishable position.
Yeah, that's my thoughts.
tdk_Samurai
Smash Ace
I do in fact do the u air alot to save my teamates, but I'm always afraid that I'll accidentally spike them, although I'm getting better at angleing myself to determine a spike or a straight up hit, another thing, do you think fair would be better as long as they aren't to far down from the ledge?
and in 1 on 1 are you saying do it to people who are recovering somewhat high and don't need to sweet spot at all?
and in 1 on 1 are you saying do it to people who are recovering somewhat high and don't need to sweet spot at all?
N64
Smash Champion
Fair can work ok to save teammates, it depends on their recovery and fallspeed (if they'll still be able to recover after you fair them), uair sending them upwards just usually makes it easier for them. But again, either can work.
For 1v1, IMO it's best for spacies that are recovering from a little above the stage (but too far out to tailspike). If they go up or straight across, thunder will hit them, if they try to sweetspot, thunder will hit them. I guess it can also be used for other difficult to punish recoveries, but usually just spacing an ftilt towards the edge works better.
For 1v1, IMO it's best for spacies that are recovering from a little above the stage (but too far out to tailspike). If they go up or straight across, thunder will hit them, if they try to sweetspot, thunder will hit them. I guess it can also be used for other difficult to punish recoveries, but usually just spacing an ftilt towards the edge works better.
festizzio
Smash Champion
one thing i've never really been able to master is the timing for uair out of shield against a falco who's pillaring your shield
i try doing it right after the shine, but their dair hits first
i try doing it before the shine, but shine hits first
i try doing it before the first dair, but we just trade hits
i try doing it right after the shine, but their dair hits first
i try doing it before the shine, but shine hits first
i try doing it before the first dair, but we just trade hits
Zig-Zag!
Smash Lord
HEY
Stealthraptor, Zig Zag, and N64 are all 100% for sure totally gonna be at Darkrains midwest circuit tourny. I expect every other pikachu player to be there as well
Stealthraptor, Zig Zag, and N64 are all 100% for sure totally gonna be at Darkrains midwest circuit tourny. I expect every other pikachu player to be there as well
-Chad-
Slackerator
When is it and where Zig?
tdk_Samurai
Smash Ace
man, Kansas city is like 8 hours for me. I don't wanna drive that to get trashed in pools, but my friends tomacawk and gambit might wanna go, so if they do I guess I'll go with.
Zig, you need to hold a circuit event in stl, I'd definitely be there for sure.
Zig, you need to hold a circuit event in stl, I'd definitely be there for sure.
Zig-Zag!
Smash Lord
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=230134
It's Event 52, yeah. May 23rd/24th
And I will hold She's Got A Bomb 2 this summer if the midwest circuit guys want a tourny in st.louis
It's Event 52, yeah. May 23rd/24th
And I will hold She's Got A Bomb 2 this summer if the midwest circuit guys want a tourny in st.louis
CommanderCody08
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Aug 3, 2008
- Messages
- 149
I never realized how much Pikachu was like Fox before.
- Approach with nair a lot
- Up smash kills
-fast dash
- good up throw
- Unusual gimp
- Approach with nair a lot
- Up smash kills
-fast dash
- good up throw
- Unusual gimp
tdk_Samurai
Smash Ace
yea, but I think alot of chars aproach with nair alot, and its prolly a bad idea to dash attack with pika, I only do it when I miss a JC. And a major difference between the two is its super hard to gimp a good pika, noone around my skill level can do it except once in a couple weeks I will stop paying attention in a wall of pain situation.
he meant dash as in initial dash, not dash attack.
And yeah, pikachu is to some degree a low-tier fox. Like, real low tier fox, but yeah.
And yeah, pikachu is to some degree a low-tier fox. Like, real low tier fox, but yeah.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
How long can you chain grab Falco on FD
nicaboy
Smash Champion
pika is like peach a little too. mofo down smash.
festizzio
Smash Champion
some people would say 0 - death, but i can't do it at all until about 35% (with JC grabs)