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Yeah, both Bowser and Yoshi don't deviate much from their standard gameplans in this MU. Yoshi's kit (especially Egg Lay and the chaingrab) is just a solid counter to Bowser's kit, overall. It's winnable, but horrible.
As an extra thing to note/a bit of trivia, Yoshi is one of the only three characters who are completely immune to Bowser's grounded grab release followups, assuming a non-sloped surface. The other two are Donkey Kong and Jigglypuff. All three of them are vulnerable to air release followups, though. Yoshi can be Faired, Jiggs can be Uaired/Klawed, and DK can be Faired/Klawed.
I don't agree with the idea that experience doesn't make a difference in the MU. I was just using Grim's logic as a basis for the idea that I would beat him in our MM.What kind of MU exists that you don't need experience in? That just sounds counter-intuitive to Smash in general... Also, is Hbox really a high-level Brawl Jiggs player?
Does anyone know what happened to the picture of the MU chart? Even the link to the bigger version doesn't work. Was it taken down in anticipation of the new chart? If that's the case, then I wish it could have been done a little more smoothly than that.v1: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=298484
This is the second version of the BBR matchup chart, which displays ratings of all matchups in Super Smash Bros. Brawl. Aside from scores that changed as opposed to v1, there are some procedural changes for this iteration.
While we worked with panels again, we also asked outsiders for help and gave them access to a subforum created specifically for this project. Although not everyone invited took this opportunity to do their part, overall character representation was better than for v1. In the end we had close to 150 people participating from both inside and outside the BBR, making this the first major Smashboards project that can be seen as a community effort. I’d like to thank all panel leaders and Ankoku, ESAM, Ishieymoro, Krystedez, Red Ryu, Shaya, Slhoka, Twinkie and Zigsta in particular for their help with finalizing scores and preparing the final release.
A common complaint with v1 is that the scores by itself don’t tell you how to play the matchup. While we still won’t likely cover all ~700 matchups in the game, there is an initial batch of writeups included. We would like to ask you, the public, to list what matchups you would most like to see writeups on and we will attempt to add them over time. Furthermore, if you are willing to do a writeup of your own or update an existing one, feel free to send me a PM. This also goes for any mistakes and inconsistencies you might spot, as most of this is the result of manual labour.
Sheilda is still treated as its own entity in order to be consistent with the tier list and v1. The combination does better than either Sheik or Zelda individually in a few matchups, these have been marked with a * in her individual spread.
Finally, some information with regards to reading the chart. This time around characters in the main chart are ordered by their average score against the rest of the cast, as tier lists get outdated and it makes more sense this way. At the end of every line of scores you will find the number of winning, losing and even matchups for that character, as well as their average score and difference in placement with the current tier list (BBR tier list v6.0). You will also find that characters within the individual spreads, found below the chart, are ordered by alphabet. There are some exceptions: these panels internally agreed on an order of difficulty, with left being hardest and right being easiest within any given tier of matchup difficulty.
Note that for all scores a competitive level of play is assumed and the performance of top and high level players was generally considered more strongly than what is seen in lower level play. Keep in mind that the chart does not necessarily reflect the opinions and performances of absolute outliers and is ultimately a consensus between people who are assumed to know their character. Furthermore, the Unity ruleset was kept in mind.
The Matchup Chart
Bigger version here: http://m2eila.fr/smash/tier_lists/brawl_matchup_chart_v2/brawl_matchup_chart_public_v2_1024.png
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I know DK's immune because he usually gets frame advantage when he's released. How do the other characters escape punishment on a grounded release?
Are you sure it's like that or is it just because most moves such as shields and dodges aren't active from frame 1?
I guess some people have been spreading wrong information around then. My bad.
Not your fault, really. The first set of frame data everyone had access to in Brawl was mostly accurate but had a few weird entries that have stuck with us forever. I believe shields were said to start on frame 2. Everyone believed that for a very long time.
Whoops!Does anyone know what happened to the picture of the MU chart? Even the link to the bigger version doesn't work. Was it taken down in anticipation of the new chart? If that's the case, then I wish it could have been done a little more smoothly than that.
Haha! We all make mistakes, s'ok. =D
It is, I was just giving a lazy response.
I think it's 3. Not sure though.
What do these mean? You can't block a projectile before frame 6?
That didn't sound right to me either...What do these mean? You can't block a projectile before frame 6?
Fireball: 14%, Fireball:16% Flame: 2-3% (can heal 100% every 3-4 secs), Stars: 11%, Fire orb (20% close range, 30% far range, dependent on distance), neutral B (8% uncharged, 30% fully charged), (blaster: 10% uncharged, 16% fully charged, d smash: uncharged 29%, fully charged 30%) Arrow (uncharged is 14%, fully charged is 28%, fully charged while stalled is 30%), Blizzard (popo heals 57%, nana heals 48%, both heal 95%), Laser (14% uncharged, 24% fully charged), up B(16% far away, 13% from up close) (stars is 12%, waddle doo is 68%) Blaster: 16%, Blaster (8% can heal 100 in 8 secs), Blaster (6% can heal 100% in 3 secs), Flame: 5%(can heal 100% in 2 secs), (pk thunder: 21%, pk fire non-contact: 11%, pk fire contact: 22%, pk cross uncharged: 24%, pk cross fully charged: 30%), (pk thunder: 27%, pk fire:8%, pk freeze: 30%), (thunder shock: 16%, thunder: 27%, sweet spotted or however its done: 105%), http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rs7emHQ7nlw ( no power/anubis - uncharged aurasphere: 14%, fully charged aurasphere: 30%, side b: 19% - with power/anubis uncharged aurasphere: 28%, charged aurasphere: gdlk, side b: 30)
