Official SWF Matchup Chart v2.0

[Luco]

Thanks Blacktwins! The Lucas boards could probably do with that info as well, whether you want to put it there or want me to or whatever.

In any case, I knew it too... Lucas PKT is usually more beneficial to heal from than PK Freeze in teams because of the risk and lag concerning PK freeze.

Surely there is a difference in a charged PK freeze and a non-charged PK freeze though?

 

[bubbaking]

Woah, what are with all those big numbers??? PKT heals 27%?!?

 

[Luco]

Never seen a Lucas + Lucas team, have you bubba? My brother and I are one. I knew most of this stuff but some surprised me.

Lucas/Ness are OP when it comes to doubles. <3

 

[Tesh]

Woah, what are with all those big numbers??? PKT heals 27%?!?

lucas heals for like 250% of the damage the projectile does. things like flamethrower or double blizzard heal him for 100+ quickly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJDIxGmtgTU

stuff like that

edit: just watching that makes me mad, FAE was at 0% on his first stock 2 minutes in

 

[bubbaking]

Never seen a Lucas + Lucas team, have you bubba? My brother and I are one. I knew most of this stuff but some surprised me.

Lucas/Ness are OP when it comes to doubles. <3

Well, I heard of the famous Shaky + FOW team and I think one of them went Lucas at Apex 2012. I may be mistaking one of those two players, but I'm fairly certain FOW was on it and I'm definitely certain that he was teamed with a Lucas.

Edit: Does energy absorption account for moves staling?

Edit 2: That video alerted me. Why isn't ZSS on that list?

 

[Luco]

lucas heals for like 250% of the damage the projectile does. things like flamethrower or double blizzard heal him for 100+ quickly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJDIxGmtgTU

stuff like that

edit: just watching that makes me mad, FAE was at 0% on his first stock 2 minutes in

Yea this is true. I enjoy double Lucas though because both team members can be stock tanks, both can heal.

 

[infiniteV115]

Lol @ Shaky + FOW
It was Mekos + FOW. And idk how that's a 'famous' team, that was the first and only time they've ever teamed. Nick Riddle + Shaky, ESAM + Mekos and even Nick Riddle + Galeon are more famous teams XD

And yeah when Lucas absorbs ZSS dsmash it heals 29 uncharged and 30 charged. I'm teaming with blacktwins at the next post-apex local, we gon' kick ***.

 

[bubbaking]

Famous because it was double PK Kids of course!

 

[Luco]

I remember Mekos teamed with M2K one tournament... that was a lot of fun to watch. :D

 

[bubbaking]

I guess staling does have an effect. I definitely saw ZSS' uncharged dsmash do varying amounts of healing. The first time it did 25%, then it did 28%, and then it did only 20%.

Edit: Is Lucas' magnet JC-able when it absorbs something?

 

[Luco]

I guess staling does have an effect. I definitely saw ZSS' uncharged dsmash do varying amounts of healing. The first time it did 25%, then it did 28%, and then it did only 20%.

Edit: Is Lucas' magnet JC-able when it absorbs something?

As soon as it absorbs, you can spot-dodge, roll or jump...

Wait, am I mis-interpreting you? :/

 

[Tesh]

Yes, most absord/reflex moves give you OoS options like jumping, rolling, spotdodging. it makes it so frustrating because the dsmash covers him then he just jumps or rolls away with your last batch of punishes healed

 

[Luco]

Yes, most absord/reflex moves give you OoS options like jumping, rolling, spotdodging. it makes it so frustrating because the dsmash covers him then he just jumps or rolls away with your last batch of punishes healed

I can also see him covering his retreat. Magnet cancel --> SH --> retreating PKF

 

[bubbaking]

As soon as it absorbs, you can spot-dodge, roll or jump...

Yes, most absord/reflex moves give you OoS options like jumping, rolling, spotdodging.

TKD mentioned these same options a while ago for Fox's Shine after he's reflected something, but there's something that I don't get (which he did a very confusing job of explaining). If absorbing/reflecting allows one to immediately perform OoS options, does it also allow him to shield immediately? For instance, rather than absorb > roll, could Lucas just absorb > shield?

I can also see him covering his retreat. Magnet cancel --> SH --> retreating PKF

In that video Tesh linked, I saw Lucas doing a lot of Magnet > SH dair to cover his retreat.

 

[blacktwins13]

How does this belong in the "Official SWF Matchup" thread?

And what are those frowns for?

Edit 1: fixed. and why not?, they didn't say anything about doubles matchup thread
Edit 2: @ and no you can't shield, thats the only exception
Edit 3: also to luco you can post this on the lucas forums if you'd like, i wouldn't rly know how to introduce the healing in the thread and stuff so il leave that to you unless i am required to help in any way
and to your charged pk freeze comment, the maximum healing you can get is 30% which is why i didn't label it with the exception of multiple hitboxes like ic's blizzard, thus getting more then 30%

 

[Luco]

All the famous Lucases are gonna be at Apex this year (FAE, Mekos, PF, J), I can't wait to see the tricks they pull out in doubles. :-D I assume NR will also go and if that's the case I also assume he'll be teaming with Shaky again.

Oh and there'll be crew battles.

I'll be watching all of it on stream.

EDIT: Are you going too BT? :o

I'd be happy to post it but I think I was the last poster in general discussion.

Come to think of it, I think there's a thread for it already...?

 

[bubbaking]

no you can't shield, thats the only exception

Ah, I see. Does that mean that one has to buffer the roll then, in order to gain access to the 'shield sub-options'? Also, moves do stale for heals too, right? Sorry for all the questions.

 

[blacktwins13]

All the famous Lucases are gonna be at Apex this year (FAE, Mekos, PF, J), I can't wait to see the tricks they pull out in doubles. :-D I assume NR will also go and if that's the case I also assume he'll be teaming with Shaky again.

Oh and there'll be crew battles.

I'll be watching all of it on stream.

EDIT: Are you going too BT? :o

I'd be happy to post it but I think I was the last poster in general discussion.

Come to think of it, I think there's a thread for it already...?

im trying to go to apex but im honestly gona say 0.01% confirmed
the other 99.9 is if my mother says yes <.<

Ah, I see. Does that mean that one has to buffer the roll then, in order to gain access to the 'shield sub-options'? Also, moves do stale for heals too, right? Sorry for all the questions.

its ok i don't mind the questions. 1st off, no you don't have to buffer the roll for gaining shield sub options. shield access is pretty much guaranteed for rolling, spotdodge, sidestep, etc.
also please note on this for staling; most of the characters moves will stale but by very little% and there are exceptions. EX: Fox's blaster. once absorbed its 3% and will constantly be 3% regardless of staling. but il look more into that as we speak.
feel free to ask me more questions if you'd like and il try to answer them as clearly as possible.

 

[Tesh]

I dont think they stale for healing. The reason you saw drastic differences is because bio was spamming dsmash for coverage and hitting people. The multiplier for the healing is 2.5 remember, so if Dsmash loses like 1-2% its going to heal for 4-6% less right there.

 

[Luco]

So moves don't stale healing but staled moves heal less?

Ok well that's fair enough.

@BT: Here's hoping. I heard you did some good stuff with Lucas recently. Are you a Lucas or Yoshi main btw? It's hard to tell because of the post-bit. ^_^

 

[Tesh]

Healing is just the damage multiplied and reversed. Thats all.

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

ZSS Dsmash heals lucas for 29%? What the hell?

 

[blacktwins13]

So moves don't stale healing but staled moves heal less?

Ok well that's fair enough.

@BT: Here's hoping. I heard you did some good stuff with Lucas recently. Are you a Lucas or Yoshi main btw? It's hard to tell because of the post-bit. ^_^

yea i main lucas, if not a very close secondary. yoshi>lucas>ic's imo.

also@tesh: heals does stale but again for some characters, like mario's fireball will lose only 1% (very surprised if it even loses 2%)
EDIT: Updated the thread so i added pika healing lucas sweetspotted video (shoutout to lucas boards for finding it) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rs7emHQ7nlw

 

[bubbaking]

Updated the thread so i added pika healing lucas sweetspotted video (shoutout to lucas boards for finding it) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rs7emHQ7nlw

THIS is the most broken thing in the universe!

 

[Raven¤]

Sorry I'm new and nose speak much English, but I urgently need to respond to questions as they organize a tournament and I need to know if
1. Camping with Mario is Legal?
2. Fleeing with mario legal?
3. Mario Cape Stall legal?
4. What is not legal with mario?
Thanks, please answer me soon because I need to know now.

 

[RaptorTEC]

Everything is legal with Mario...

 

[bubbaking]

Man, he's already in the mindset of camping someone out. He's gonna be a great Brawl player some day...

#Brawl4Plz

 

[Ayce God]

Mario's infinite cape glitch is banned

 

[Raven¤]

Mario's infinite cape glitch is banned

what is that glitch?
example, Video?
Or you are kidding?

 

[Shaya]

He's kidding.

Cape glitch is a meta knight thing.
there's nothing "banned" about Mario. In a standard rule set the only thing you'd need to feasibly watch out for is grabbing the ledge too much (as in, if the rule set has a ledge grab limit). Otherwise I'm not aware of anything that Mario can do that would be "illegal".

 

[Ayce God]

definetly kidding.

go do whatever you can to win with that Mario ya got there.

 

[bubbaking]

If you can time people with Mario, then you're definitely doing something right, lolz!

 

[Tesh]

universal LGL, so planking with mario isnt legal either.

 

[bubbaking]

It's legal; you just have to be smart (and frugal) with how you do it.

 

[Z'zgashi]

Youd be surprised, Mario is actually quite decent at running down the clock.

The problem is getting the lead so that you CAN run down the clock.

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

Youd be surprised, Mario is actually quite decent at running down the clock.

The problem is getting the lead so that you CAN run down the clock.

if by decent you mean not the absolute worst but still sucks at camping in any and all forms because he's a **** character than sure

 

[Luco]

Well this thread went down the drain.

Maharba stop being so evil.

 

[Alacion]

Diddy beats Peach.

 

[SaveMeJebus]

Bearly. Wouldn't even consider it + 1 for diddy

 

[bubbaking]

Because bears are more dangerous than bairs.....bearly.