[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

[ChronoBound]

I despise Tingle and love Vaati, but I fully regognize the only Zelda character with a chance of getting in is Tingle.

I'd prefer if we had no new Zelda rep, as there really is noone worthy. Adding a 5th Zelda rep would mainly be for the sake of keeping the series up with Mario and Pokemon. Heck, Young/Toon Link's additions are pretty much just for that, not even they deserve to really be there.

Just do us all a favor and do the one thing with Zelda everybody wants and would prefer to the horrible choices for a 5th Zelda character: Give Ganondorf a new moveset.

I agree. Ganondorf's old moveset can go to a second F-Zero character such as Black Shadow.

Edit: Tingle also translated the maps to find ithe Triforce shards in Wind Waker which is needed to complete the game.

 

[majora_787]

I agree. Ganondorf's old moveset can go to a second F-Zero character such as Black Shadow.

I think it sounds easy enough to give Ganondorf a sword and make Black Shadow a Captain Falcon clone, I mean how hard can that be?

 

[flyinfilipino]

I agree. Ganondorf's old moveset can go to a second F-Zero character such as Black Shadow.

What are the chances of that happening anyway?

 

[ChronoBound]

What are the chances of that happening anyway?

Probably slim considering Sakurai hate Ganondorf with a passion. However, it is the most ideal scenario.

 

[Bowser King]

What? *shakes head

First off, if there is a secondary antagonist to the Zelda series, its Vaati. Secondly, if there is an anti-Link it is most definitely Tingle. Tingle is in his late 30's, Link is in his teens. Tingle is cowardly, Link is brave. Tingle waits for people to meet him, Link searches out over people. Tingle is weak and relies on other people to fight for him, Link is pretty much mostly by himself. Tingle IS the anti-Link. Also, if you actually think the Skull Kid (the Majora's Mask one) is more important than Tingle, please keep in mind that Tingle has a already had two games to date.


Also, Skull Kid has made as many appearances in Zelda games as Anju and Dampe have, and each game they have been in there has been a sidequest revolving around them. Are they important? Skull Kid was merely a side-character in Ocarina of Time and Twilight Princess. The only game he was an important character in was Majora's Mask. Please don't let fanboyism cloud your analysis. Skull Kid (Majora's Mask) is more suited to be an Assist Trophy than a full-character.

You pointing out that Tingle is an anti-link only weakens your argument. Tingle being weak and needing others to fight for him shows that. The fact that he waits for people show that he isn't really fit for brawl wherre you move around and fight.

..because the two games tingle he played an amazing role. Two of them weren't even released in America. Skull Kid has done faaar more then tingle.

In Ocarina of Time he was a side quest character, but in Twilight Princess he helped get the Master Sword. And I think you're letting your love for a fat middle-aged man in green spandex cloud YOUR judgement.

lulz

-Bowser King

 

[Spire]

What? *shakes head

First off, if there is a secondary antagonist to the Zelda series, its Vaati. Secondly, if there is an anti-Link it is most definitely Tingle. Tingle is in his late 30's, Link is in his teens. Tingle is cowardly, Link is brave. Tingle waits for people to meet him, Link searches out over people. Tingle is weak and relies on other people to fight for him, Link is pretty much mostly by himself. Tingle IS the anti-Link. Also, if you actually think the Skull Kid (the Majora's Mask one) is more important than Tingle, please keep in mind that Tingle has a already had two games to date.

Whoa, whoa, whoa, but Skull Kid is just that, an "anti-Link". In relation to Link, he is also sort of a shady counterpart (don't bring up Dark Link to argue this). In OoT, the Skull Kids represented the lost counterparts of Link's kin, the Kokiri, with the Skull Kid representing Link's direct counterpart. If Link rises to save the world, then Skull Kid rises to thwart it. Opposites, yet in some manner or another, they may very well be the same.

Also, I never said Vaati wasn't appropriate. He is easily the second most known villain in the series, and I completely support him. My argument is between Skull Kid and Tingle, not Skull Kid and Vaati, so leave him out of this completely.

Also, Skull Kid has made as many appearances in Zelda games as Anju and Dampe have, and each game they have been in there has been a sidequest revolving around them. Are they important? Skull Kid was merely a side-character in Ocarina of Time and Twilight Princess. The only game he was an important character in was Majora's Mask. Please don't let fanboyism cloud your analysis. Skull Kid (Majora's Mask) is more suited to be an Assist Trophy than a full-character.

Skull Kid may have been in as many games as Anju and Dampe, but also as many as Vaati, and two more than the included smasher, Sheik, so your argument isn't very valid.

*facepalm

I don't like Tingle at all, but you have to realize that Tingle is a more re-occurring character than Skull Kid. In Wind Waker, he is pretty much needed to complete the game, and in Majora's Mask you need him for any maps at all of the overworld and the surrounding areas. Tingle also is constantly stalking you throughout Four Swords Adventures. In Minish Cap, he is simply a sidequest character and can be avoided entirely. I am not sure about the role Tingle played in Oracle of Seasons though. Also, keep in mind that Tingle has been the main hero of two games. How many secondary Zelda characters can claim that?

Let's break this down into two instances. Majora's Mask, and WW/TP, as those are the only games that both Skull Kid and Tingle are even important in.

Majora's Mask. Skull Kid was the main antagonist, and Tingle, a creepy cartographer. Who's more important? Skull Kid.

Wind Waker. Tingle sells you maps to piece together a Triforce. Strangely enough, he was very necessary.

Twilight Princess. Skull Kid leads you through the Sacred Grove to the ruins of the Temple of Time so that you can obtain the Master Sword. Necessary? Incredibly.

So Skull Kid won both MM and TP, while Tingle only has WW. Skull Kid looks to be the winner thus far. Oh, and Tingle's appearances in OoS, MC, FSA, and his bizarre little spinoff game really don't count.

I'd like to call you out on one last part. "Tingle is weak and relies on other people to fight for him." Does he truly sound capable of fighting? Ehh... no. I do not see him ever making an appearance as a smasher.

 

[flyinfilipino]

You pointing out that Tingle is an anti-link only weakens your argument. Tingle being weak and needing others to fight for him shows that. The fact that he waits for people show that he isn't really fit for brawl wherre you move around and fight.

Pokemon Trainer.

jk jk

 

[Bowser King]

Pokemon Trainer.

jk jk

I know your joking but I'll answer this anyway...

PT actually has pokemon to fight for him and is IMO a one-of-a-kind character. I really can't see tingle standing in the background yelling commands

-Bowser King

 

[ChronoBound]

Forget it. Tingle is a more iconic Zelda character than Skull Kid. I don't care what the fanboys in this topic say. Heck, Tingle is the only Zelda character outside the Triforce 3 to have a wikipedia article dedicated solely to him:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tingle

Also, Tingle did fight in Rupeeland and Tingle's Balloon Fight. He also dropped bombs on stuff in Wind Waker.

Skull Kid was a now or never character. His best chances of ever entering the Smash Bros. series as a playable character were with Melee since it was during that time frame in which he was at the height of his importance. The only way Skull Kid will ever become playable would be if he were to become a major character in a new Zelda (either a major supporting character such as Midna/Tetra/Navi, or the main antagonist again like in Majora's Mask).

 

[flyinfilipino]

Forget it. Tingle is a more iconic Zelda character than Skull Kid. I don't care what the fanboys in this topic say. Heck, Tingle is the only Zelda character outside the Triforce 3 to have a wikipedia article dedicated solely to him:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tingle

For what it's worth, I agree with you. But what do I know, I am just a Zelda newbie, starting off with the Wind Waker. I just met Tingle, by the way.

 

[Dark Ryu]

I would prefer ganondorf to keep his moveset instead of getting a new F-Zero character thats just a clone >_>

 

[majora_787]

Whoa, whoa, whoa, but Skull Kid is just that, an "anti-Link". In relation to Link, he is also sort of a shady counterpart (don't bring up Dark Link to argue this). In OoT, the Skull Kids represented the lost counterparts of Link's kin, the Kokiri, with the Skull Kid representing Link's direct counterpart. If Link rises to save the world, then Skull Kid rises to thwart it. Opposites, yet in some manner or another, they may very well be the same.

Also, I never said Vaati wasn't appropriate. He is easily the second most known villain in the series, and I completely support him. My argument is between Skull Kid and Tingle, not Skull Kid and Vaati, so leave him out of this completely.



Skull Kid may have been in as many games as Anju and Dampe, but also as many as Vaati, and two more than the included smasher, Sheik, so your argument isn't very valid.


Let's break this down into two instances. Majora's Mask, and WW/TP, as those are the only games that both Skull Kid and Tingle are even important in.

Majora's Mask. Skull Kid was the main antagonist, and Tingle, a creepy cartographer. Who's more important? Skull Kid.

Wind Waker. Tingle sells you maps to piece together a Triforce. Strangely enough, he was very necessary.

Twilight Princess. Skull Kid leads you through the Sacred Grove to the ruins of the Temple of Time so that you can obtain the Master Sword. Necessary? Incredibly.

So Skull Kid won both MM and TP, while Tingle only has WW. Skull Kid looks to be the winner thus far. Oh, and Tingle's appearances in OoS, MC, FSA, and his bizarre little spinoff game really don't count.

I'd like to call you out on one last part. "Tingle is weak and relies on other people to fight for him." Does he truly sound capable of fighting? Ehh... no. I do not see him ever making an appearance as a smasher.

Spire, let me just say, your debating skills are very...uhmm...POLISHED...when it comes to Skull Kid.

Anyway, ANYONE could make a wikipedia based off of ANYONE. I could go make a wikipedia page for a Pong Paddle and then use the same argument to say that Pong Paddle could get in smash as easily as Tingle.

 

[ChronoBound]

Spire, let me just say, your debating skills are very...uhmm...POLISHED...when it comes to Skull Kid.

Anyway, ANYONE could make a wikipedia based off of ANYONE. I could go make a wikipedia page for a Pong Paddle and then use the same argument to say that Pong Paddle could get in smash as easily as Tingle.

*facepalms

Its because he has appeared in enough games to warrant an article.

Also re-read what I wrote earlier:
Skull Kid was a now or never character. His best chances of ever entering the Smash Bros. series as a playable character were with Melee since it was during that time frame in which he was at the height of his importance. The only way Skull Kid will ever become playable would be if he were to become a major character in a new Zelda (either a major supporting character such as Midna/Tetra/Navi, or the main antagonist again like in Majora's Mask).

 

[Dark Ryu]

*facepalms

Its because he has appeared in enough games to warrant an article.

Also re-read what I wrote earlier:
Skull Kid was a now or never character. His best chances of ever entering the Smash Bros. series as a playable character were with Melee since it was during that time frame in which he was at the height of his importance. The only way Skull Kid will ever become playable would be if he were to become a major character in a new Zelda (either a major supporting character such as Midna/Tetra/Navi, or the main antagonist again like in Majora's Mask).

Not true, think about Pikmin. It was at its prime back in the melee day as well but they didn't join us until now:]]

 

[ChronoBound]

Not true, think about Pikmin. It was at its prime back in the melee day as well but they didn't join us until now:]]

What? Pikmin 2 was released in 2004, one year before development for Brawl started, and a Pikmin 3 is in development.

 

[Dark Ryu]

Yes but pikmin 1 was released earlier.

 

[SkylerOcon]

Blah blah blah

Arguing Zelda with Spire is like arguing Smash with Yuna. YOU WILL LOSE.

 

[ChronoBound]

Arguing Zelda with Spire is like arguing Smash with Yuna. YOU WILL LOSE.

I was arguing Smash on message boards before even Melee was out. I knew the Brawl roster before anyone else did.

Here's what I wrote on Skull Kid before Brawl was released:
Skull Kid: Skull Kid (the one from Majora’s Mask) was another “now or never” character. Skull Kid’s best chances of ever getting into Smash Bros. was back prior to Melee’s release. He was the second-most popular villain in the series, behind only Ganondorf, and in many people’s eyes would have been a very cool addition. Unfortunately, Majora’s Mask did not appear in any more Zelda games, and a Skull Kid only had a minor role in Twilight Princess. Finally, Vaati has usurped Skull Kid’s spot as the second-most popular Zelda villain. I expect Skull Kid (with Majora’s Mask) to get in as an Assist Trophy at the most. However, I think we will definitely see him or Majora’s Mask by itself as a trophy or sticker.

 

[Kraryo]

They could make Tingle fight since they made a plastic add-on for the NES a fighter. Majora's Mask is one of my favorite games, but I didn't care much for the Skull Kid.

Even though Tingle's 2 games weren't released in America, you can't ignore the fact that he more games than the Skull Kid, which is 0. The only reason his games weren't released into America is because Americans are Tinglephobic. Tingle wasn't in Oracle of Seasons, but he was in Oracle of Ages and he was needed to beat the game.

 

[trev94]

Probably slim considering Sakurai hate Ganondorf with a passion. However, it is the most ideal scenario.

why???????

 

[LumpyCPU...]

I would prefer ganondorf to keep his moveset instead of getting a new F-Zero character thats just a clone >_>

well i can honestly say that ganon's moveset has completely grown on me. haha

 

[majora_787]

I was arguing Smash on message boards before even Melee was out. I knew the Brawl roster before anyone else did.

Care to explain how you got the game before Japan? ^^ I'd love to hear that. OR, better yet, if you want to get REALLY technical...

How did you get the game before the roster was finished? which would be when...2006 or 2007?

 

[ChronoBound]

Care to explain how you got the game before Japan? ^^ I'd love to hear that. OR, better yet, if you want to get REALLY technical...

How did you get the game before the roster was finished? which would be when...2006 or 2007?

I knew the entire roster in late December of 2007. It was from an insider (insider told me about R.O.B., Marth, Falcon, Ness, and Luigi). The other characters and the roster number came from other sources such serebii, ChaosZero, and NyaseNya. I pieced all of their information together to figure out Brawl's roster.

 

[LumpyCPU...]

Care to explain how you got the game before Japan? ^^ I'd love to hear that. OR, better yet, if you want to get REALLY technical...

How did you get the game before the roster was finished? which would be when...2006 or 2007?

he's just being a little pooper. lulz
you don't have to play into his hand so well. haha
jk you got this!

 

[majora_787]

he's just being a little pooper. lulz
you don't have to play into his hand so well. haha
jk you got this!

I love it when people act vague, try to justify being a hypocrite, or try to justify nothing at all. It always entertains me.

Anyway, I hope they have a really awesome WTF for SSB4, like ROB.

 

[LumpyCPU...]

I love it when people act vague, try to justify being a hypocrite, or try to justify nothing at all. It always entertains me.

Anyway, I hope they have a really awesome WTF for SSB4, like ROB.

i hope it's power glove!
(he can be master hand's rival)

 

[ChronoBound]

I love it when people act vague, try to justify being a hypocrite, or try to justify nothing at all. It always entertains me.

Anyway, I hope they have a really awesome WTF for SSB4, like ROB.

I said nothing vague. I simply said that I knew the entire roster before Brawl was released. I elaborated on it in my previous post.

 

[notftomearth7]

Yeah...CB, your arguements are COMPLETELY UNFOUNDED. I'd rather have Skull Kid than Tingle. Granted, you CAN warp information with Wikipedia, but Spire knows his stuff. And...a Pong paddle in 4 is....THE BEST ASSIST TROPHY/STAGE IDEA EVER!

 

[Spire]

I knew the entire roster in late December of 2007. It was from an insider (insider told me about R.O.B., Marth, Falcon, Ness, and Luigi). The other characters and the roster number came from other sources such serebii, ChaosZero, and NyaseNya. I pieced all of their information together to figure out Brawl's roster.

You're full of yourself. Making a group all about yourself and your ideas for smash so that your invitees can join and worship you and your ideas? Pitiful.

 

[ChronoBound]

You're full of yourself. Making a group all about yourself and your ideas for smash so that your invitees can join and worship you and your ideas? Pitiful.

Go cry a river. You get hit with the truth brick and you get angsty since you are wrong.

 

[majora_787]

Go cry a river. You get hit with the truth brick and you get angsty since you are wrong.

uhmm...sounds like what's happening to YOU CB. You're the one getting angsty calling all of us fanboys, as if that has anything to do with it. I am a RIDLEY fanboy, thank you very much.

 

[ChronoBound]

uhmm...sounds like what's happening to YOU CB. You're the one getting angsty calling all of us fanboys, as if that has anything to do with it. I am a RIDLEY fanboy, thank you very much.

No, I am not. I am simply saying what I see, and I see poor judgment.

 

[Jash Thor]

Anyway, I hope they have a really awesome WTF for SSB4, like ROB.

I've always thought Stanley the Bugman (from Donkey Kong 3) would make the perfect WTF character. I can't think up a creative moveset right now, but I sense he's ripe for Smash Bros. status. Balloon Jumper is a good second.

 

[VivaLaPika]

You're full of yourself. Making a group all about yourself and your ideas for smash so that your invitees can join and worship you and your ideas? Pitiful.

Practically every one here is full of themselves. No one is meets the definition of an 'internet tough guy' more than the general user base here. Why do you think the majority of the people here are total jerks? SSB is like therapy for the lowest of the low. People love to shove their "knowledge" of the game around, act like it means something, start huge flame wars, and refuse to stop flaming. Why? Because this is their last chance. They have to tell themselves they are at least the best on smashboards (good for you!) or lose all hope. It's pretty ridiculous to see arguments comprised entirely "facepalm" "indeed" "fail" and "lol." It's either that or the complete opposite where their posts are only attacks on the other member's grammar or spelling.

This is the worst community I've ever seen.

 

[ChronoBound]

I've always thought Stanley the Bugman (from Donkey Kong 3) would make the perfect WTF character. I can't think up a creative moveset right now, but I sense he's ripe for Smash Bros. status. Balloon Jumper is a good second.

Diskun fits the bill for the next WTF character. He is a hardware mascot like R.O.B. and Mr. Game & Watch also.

 

[Spire]

Go cry a river. You get hit with the truth brick and you get angsty since you are wrong.

Hahaha. I love your responses. I'm not arguing about the Skull Kid vs. Tingle war anymore. Tingle wins the popularity vote, obviously (something I've not argued this entire time) but Skull Kid will always be a better character, one who has a far more defined spirit, background, and sense of humanity. Tingle is a gimmick, while Skull Kid is a chiseled character, and that's because of his dark (non-villainous) history.

Once a forest spirit Kokiri, he fell lost to the woods surrounding his haven, twisting into a menacing, spectral ghost-of-a-child. Wrought with the greed of power, he stole Majora's Mask and cast the moon down on Termina. Skull Kid was never the villain though, Majora was the villain, controlling Skull Kid like a puppet. The experience scarred the imp, causing him to become a puppeteer himself a century later in the events of TP. Incapacitation and forced-corruption changed the child permanently, yet because of his experience with the Hero of Time, he sought to play with the Hero of Twilight, tasking him to solve his maze while fending off against his puppets, and eventually himself, yet all the while, leading him to a certain hallowed ruins, where Link would find the Master Sword.

What's Tingle's history? He's a flamboyant 35-year old man who thinks he's a fairy, so he wears a green, spandex suit and floats around with balloons, selling maps. He's ****ing crazy.

 

[ChronoBound]

Hahaha. I love your responses. I'm not arguing about the Skull Kid vs. Tingle war anymore. Tingle wins the popularity vote, obviously (something I've not argued this entire time) but Skull Kid will always be a better character, one who has a far more defined spirit, background, and sense of humanity. Tingle is a gimmick, while Skull Kid is a chiseled character, and that's because of his dark (non-villainous) history.

Once a forest spirit Kokiri, he fell lost to the woods surrounding his haven, twisting into a menacing, spectral ghost-of-a-child. Wrought with the greed of power, he stole Majora's Mask and cast the moon down on Termina. Skull Kid was never the villain though, Majora was the villain, controlling Skull Kid like a puppet. The experience scarred the imp, causing him to become a puppeteer himself a century later in the events of TP. Incapacitation and forced-corruption changed the child permanently, yet because of his experience with the Hero of Time, he sought to play with the Hero of Twilight, tasking him to solve his maze while fending off against his puppets, and eventually himself, yet all the while, leading him to a certain hallowed ruins, where Link would find the Master Sword.

What's Tingle's history? He's a flamboyant 35-year old man who thinks he's a fairy, so he wears a green, spandex suit and floats around with balloons, selling maps. He's ****ing crazy.

He has a far more shallow backstory no doubt. However, he has definitely become a more important entity within the series, and may have even broken with his series much like Wario (and to a lesser extent Yoshi have). Tingle probably will have his appearance only relegated to the cell-shaded Zelda's due to their more light-hearted nature.

Also, where is the proof that the Skull Kid from OoT/Majora's Mask is the one from Twilight Princess. Is is fact or merely fan theory?

Also, Rupeeland gives him a backstory as to why he wears the suit and loves rupees so much. In Rupeeland, he was pretty much promised paradise if he donned the suit and was cursed so that he would die if he was not in the presence of a large sum of ruppees.

 

[majora_787]

He has a far more shallow backstory no doubt. However, he has definitely become a more important entity within the series, and may have even broken with his series much like Wario (and to a lesser extent Yoshi have). Tingle probably will have his appearance only relegated to the cell-shaded Zelda's due to their more light-hearted nature.

Also, where is the proof that the Skull Kid from OoT/Majora's Mask is the one from Twilight Princess. Is is fact or merely fan theory?

Also, Rupeeland gives him a backstory as to why he wears the suit and loves rupees so much. In Rupeeland, he was pretty much promised paradise if he donned the suit and was cursed so that he would die if he was not in the presence of a large sum of ruppees.

Okay...uhhm.

1. Tingle is not more important. Would I rather get the Master Sword or a map I could live without? Would I rather save Termina or help a fat guy in green spandex escape from jail?

2. IT DOES NOT MATTER WETHER OR NOT HE IS THE SAME SKULL KID!! THE POINT IS THAT HE IS SKULL KID!!! Why you think WHICH Skull Kid he is is COMPLETELY beyond me.

3. Rupeeland is irrelevant. And all it says is that he's a greedy hole.

 

[ChronoBound]

Okay...uhhm.

1. Tingle is not more important. Would I rather get the Master Sword or a map I could live without? Would I rather save Termina or help a fat guy in green spandex escape from jail?

2. IT DOES NOT MATTER WETHER OR NOT HE IS THE SAME SKULL KID!! THE POINT IS THAT HE IS SKULL KID!!! Why you think WHICH Skull Kid he is is COMPLETELY beyond me.

3. Rupeeland is irrelevant. And all it says is that he's a greedy hole.

Spire specifically said that the Skull Kid of Majora's Mask is the one from Twilight Princess as an argument for why Skull Kid is more important than Tingle. If it is untrue, then it hurts his argument because he used it as a proof against Tingle and for the Majora's Mask Skull Kid.

Also, If somebody cursed you so that you need to be around aquire large sums of pennies in order to survive, would you be a "greedy hole" and constantly search for pennies?

In Majora's Mask you needed Tingle to get maps of the areas.

In the Oracle of Seasons, Tingle gives Link a map that he needs in order to complete the game, and an upgrade that allows him to hold 99 of every seed.

In Wind Waker, he gives Link the Tinge Tuner and translates charts that are needed to find the Triforce Charts and the Triforce Shards from the charts that rest on the ocean floor, which is needed to complete the game.

In Four Swords Adventures, Tingle a friendly antagonist that is always trying to get force gems before the Links. He also heads up thr Tingle Tower where you can go to play minigames in FSA.

In Minish Cap, by fusing kinstones with Tingle and his lookalikes, Link is able to get the Magic Boomerang. Tingle also tells Link how many kinstones are left to fuse in the game.

In two games Tingle is needed in order for the game to be finished, the same number as a Skull Kid. Also, Tingle has has had a minor role in two more games than Skull Kid.

 

[GwJ]

Wait...there's a skull kid in Twilight Princess?