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[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

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Conviction

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I think it's time for Knuckles to make an appearance.
No. :glare:

I'm totally down for another Sonic character. Also, I'd like to see Bowser Jr. I hate clones as a rule, but I can't argue with a faster, cuter, smaller bowser.
It would be Shadow then.

I think they'd add Tails first before Knuckles at least I'm hoping, Tails is my favourite character from the franchise.

Yea, then it'd be like Link/Toon Link "thing" going on :(.
They would add Tails before Knuckles because in charts of popularity for Sonic it goes.

Sonic, Shadow, Tails, Knuckles. Look it up if you want.

Overall I'm extremely excited to be speculating over SSB characters again.

The best part about Brawl IMO was slowly finding out weeks by weeks who got in and who didn't.
This.

There are better characters to be represented. Mega Man, Bomberman, Pacman, the list goes on. He would be nice, but not really special like the three above.

Third-party characters must be something that can be done really well and people really want. He's unlikely anyway.
Pacman?? GTF.

1. Brawl was pretty well balanced overall though. IMO Ganon and MK were the only TRUE outliers and they weren't that far off.
:awesome:

@The Real Gamer: I admit it, the speculation is my favorite part of the game. I love imagining the roster and how it'll be.
It is pretty fun thinking of stuff.

Personally I wouldn't even count on there being two versions of Link again. There's not a "child" version of Link recent enough to fit. Toon Link could just come back again, but even though we've forgotten about it somewhat, his inclusion has always felt a little awkward.

@kackamee:
Really? I mean, the difference between say, Mario and Falco is pretty palpable...
The difference between Zelda and *insert random mid tier* is big too. Brawl wasn't as balanced as you think. Better than Melee though. *Ducks under Melee Flames*

here's the thing folks: if Sonic was thrown in to represent the Company(sgega), not the series, he can be the ONLY rep. otherwise, Snake would also have to get Raiden, Psycho Mantis, etc. thrown in the game as playable.
Ok. What's wrong with givng Metal Gear Solid another rep then?
 

augustoflores

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I quoted Iwata word for word:
What Mr. Sakurai suggested was a spicic idea to make Smash Brothers for both Nintendo 3DS and WiiU to make it work together on both platforms. Well since his team is still involved in the final work in... the... to... for the Kid Icarus maybe i shouldn't go into any details today; But I think I have just promised you that Smash Brothers will be developed for the Nintendo 3DS and for WiiU and that the software will work together in some fashion. Of course, this is a product for the future.
spicic must have been meant to be specific...
 
D

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Ulevo said:
1: Commercial or economical success does not equate to quality. In 2007, the per capita spending of health care in the United States was US$6.7 Billion dollars. That adds to the per capita of the of the US, which is a representation of growth, and is supposed to imply how prosperous that nation is. That said, high medical expenses indicate sick and dying people, and lower medical expenses would indicate a nation with a higher quality of life.

This is one of many examples on how money and economical success is detached from true, tangible quality in real life. Don't mistake the two and try to run with it.
Please tell me what this has to do with anything regarding the Super Smash Bros. series. I just can't see it.
The Real Gamer said:
Batman for SSB4?
I wish, but it's not possible.
 

kackamee

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Personally I wouldn't even count on there being two versions of Link again. There's not a "child" version of Link recent enough to fit. Toon Link could just come back again, but even though we've forgotten about it somewhat, his inclusion has always felt a little awkward.

@kackamee:
Really? I mean, the difference between say, Mario and Falco is pretty palpable...
True, but I think the statement that the balance of the overall game was still pretty good still stands. Every competitive game has some underwhelming characters.
I don't think "cuteness" is exactly important to a roster. A few SSBB and SSBM characters are not cute. Marth, Snake, Bowser, the list goes on.

And I don't think better third-party necessarily means more then four third-party characters next game on either 3DS or Wii-U.
I think Marth and Bowser have the cute cartoony look I was talking about. Snake, not so much, but I thought they made him fit very well design wise in SSBB. It's just some characters like the ones I stated would be overboard.
 

Pieman0920

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So, how many would say Lucario is in danger of being cut in favor of Zoroark?
He may be cut, but odds are that it won't be for Zoroark. Victini's the Pokemon who's getting publicity right now, so if you actually believe that having a movie at around Smash's development makes a difference, its Victini that is the better choice to go with as of right now.

It wouldn't surprise me though if both the 3DS and the WU versions have slightly different Pokemon rosters.
 

Conviction

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I can't wait for them to reveal Krystal as a playable character and then we can have four Landmasters!
-___________-

Hey does this mean SSB4 can have it's own forum section like it did before Brawl? Otherwise there will be little reason to post anything here.
That'd be pretty cool yo.

I think there will probably be a subforum when we have a little more information on it, such as characters/development progress.
Oh word?

I can't honestly see Pacman in SSB lol. It'd be very creative.

I'm very scared about the roster in terms of new 3rd party characters though. Nintendo got some new partnerships with Capcom, Namco, etc. I really don't want to see Kazuya, Jin, Wesker and other people of that sort in a SSB game. It has a "cuteness" factor to maintain.
"Cuteness" wtf is this? My Little Ponies. *Read:My little Ponies are garbage

You're an idiot. Pay attention:

1: Commercial or economical success does not equate to quality. In 2007, the per capita spending of health care in the United States was US$6.7 Billion dollars. That adds to the per capita of the of the US, which is a representation of growth, and is supposed to imply how prosperous that nation is. That said, high medical expenses indicate sick and dying people, and lower medical expenses would indicate a nation with a higher quality of life.

This is one of many examples on how money and economical success is detached from true, tangible quality in real life. Don't mistake the two and try to run with it.

2: I don't like Brawl because there are blatant problems with it, problems that shouldn't exist, and are simply bad game design; not because I dislike Brawl for what it tries to be, but because for what it fails to be. Frame disadvantages causing infintes, poor loading times upon Pokemon and Zelda/Sheik transformations, stored lag from up B recovery moves on characters, poor choices in frame data in general on moves (i.e. ZSS not being able to connect her third jab legitimately just by the opponent holding L/R), advantages for port priority, non-optional tripping, exploits like the Infinite Dimensional Cape. The list goes on. I guarantee you that if I hadn't dumped this game two years ago, I'd remember a lot more bull**** to flig at you, and then some. Get someone in here like Magus or Dantarion who has actually broken the game down and they'll give you a whirl too.

3: Brawl is successful in tournaments and otherwise because it road the waves of an amazing series, and its predecessor was one of the best Nintendo titles ever created.
GET- Wait, what are you even talking about anymore? This isn't politics. Also there also going to be game flaws get over it. MK does have broken traits no lie.

I don't think he minds clones and I don't think anyone REALLY minds them either, especially when the clones are either somewhat different (space animals). The only clones I don't like are ones that play similarly but come from different series' (Ganon deserves his own move set, really).

But I think it's a goal of the series to keep relevant characters included, and as Toon Link fades away, it becomes more and more awkward to keep him. I wasn't really talking about "clones" as much as I was just talking about Link in particular.
Fox, Falco, and Wolf really aren't the same. Different learning curves, different playstyles, different mechanics.

Anyone who says they are clones have clearly never played this game.

I don't think "cuteness" is exactly important to a roster. A few SSBB and SSBM characters are not cute. Marth, Snake, Bowser, the list goes on.

And I don't think better third-party necessarily means more then four third-party characters next game on either 3DS or Wii-U.
I think there is going to be more than 4 seeing that we have new-found relationships.

Batman for SSB4?
:glare:

Please tell me what this has to do with anything regarding the Super Smash Bros. series. I just can't see it.
I wish, but it's not possible.
LOL and yeah batman isn't coming.
 

Gatlin

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It was directed at Supermodel From Paris and his notion that a commercially successful game economically speaking = a good game. I thought that would have been obvious.
It has nothing to do with SSB4 speculation however, take it to PM's if you wish to discuss it further with him.

v Don't worry about it, lol
 

Conviction

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Well wouldn't the game be successful economically? You keep talking about economics, so shouldn't be simple to see to them, that they think; "It brings money to us=good game"

EDIT: Sorry posted right when I saw your post Gat.
 

kackamee

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"Cuteness" wtf is this? My Little Ponies. *Read:My little Ponies are garbage






Fox, Falco, and Wolf really aren't the same. Different learning curves, different playstyles, different mechanics.

Anyone who says they are clones have clearly never played this game.

.
The point was that some characters just wouldn't fit well with others.

And Fox, Falco and Wolf were clones in terms of design.
 
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You're an idiot.
Oh.

1: Commercial or economical success does not equate to quality. In 2007, the per capita spending of health care in the United States was US$6.7 Billion dollars. That adds to the per capita of the of the US, which is a representation of growth, and is supposed to imply how prosperous that nation is. That said, high medical expenses indicate sick and dying people, and lower medical expenses would indicate a nation with a higher quality of life.

This is one of many examples on how money and economical success is detached from true, tangible quality in real life. Don't mistake the two and try to run with it.
I think you've forgotten what industry you're dealing with, and more importantly, what kind of game Smash actually is. I can't believe you just compared the video games and electronics industry to taxes and health care benefits (of which your post shows you know nothing about, really).

But more importantly, Brawl not only did what it set out to do, but went above and beyond that. It's a fighting-like party game with literally thousands of hours of single- and multi-player content, beautiful graphics, amazing music, and yes, good gameplay mechanics. Maybe the mechanics weren't what you wanted, but I'm not really sure how often I have to say it: you don't matter. Vocal. Minority.

2: I don't like Brawl because there are blatant problems with it, problems that shouldn't exist, and are simply bad game design; not because I dislike Brawl for what it tries to be, but because for what it fails to be. Frame disadvantages causing infintes, poor loading times upon Pokemon and Zelda/Sheik transformations, stored lag from up B recovery moves on characters, poor choices in frame data in general on moves (i.e. ZSS not being able to connect her third jab legitimately just by the opponent holding L/R), advantages for port priority, non-optional tripping, exploits like the Infinite Dimensional Cape. The list goes on. I guarantee you that if I hadn't dumped this game two years ago, I'd remember a lot more bull**** to flig at you, and then some. Get someone in here like Magus or Dantarion who has actually broken the game down and they'll give you a whirl too.
The fact of the matter is, none of this matters. It doesn't matter of Marth infinites the whole cast by spamming uthrow, and it doesn't matter if King Dedede infinites the whole cast with standing grab. It doesn't matter, and it doesn't matter because my little sister enjoys Smash because she gets to play as Princess Peach and throw bombs and turnips at me. She also really loves Pikachu's Final Smash. The game is especially fun to her, and by the way, mostly everyone else, with 4 or more players on the screen and all the items on, which removes 90% of the balance issues you just talked about, and which most of them will never notice anyway.

Once upon a time, Blizzard introduced a feature into World of Warcraft called the arena. While most of the game's player vs. player combat took place in battlegrounds or in open areas with 10 or more players per side, arenas scaled things down a bit and removed outside factors like potions, and put players in a smaller, more limited area. The result was that the game's balance (which was pretty good, actually, considering how the game was supposed to be played until that point) put under small microscopes with certain team compositions (of 2 and 3 players) dominating and throwing the game's beautiful design and balance into constant question and change.

The reason for this was the same reason Smash is not good when played how you want it to be played: because it's not designed for that. Arena still exists in WoW, and people who enjoy it still can, but the rewards have been dramatically reduced and focus on it has been reduced as well. You can still play and enjoy it, but those who do respect it for what it is and know that certain dumb stuff will happen because of the intent of the design.

3: Brawl is successful in tournaments and otherwise because it road the waves an amazing series, and its predecessor was one of the best Nintendo titles ever created.
This I'll give you, actually. With that said, Brawl still isn't really designed for competitive 1v1 play. Teams is very good in Brawl, incidentally.
 

Croi

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I'm kind of hoping for more female characters this time, if only because they only had Peach, Zelda, Samus, and Pit out of 30 other characters. Was a total sausagefest.

But seriously seeing more diversity would be pretty rad.
 

Jaklub

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I'm just going to say it right now: Anyone having high hopes for Super Smash Bros. 4 needs to come back down to earth, develop some perspective, and be really realistic about this. It's a LOT better to have zero expectations for what is likely to be another big failure and be proven wrong than to have high expectations and be severely disappointed again.
The only people who say Brawl is a failure are tourney players and their nearest friends.

/facts
 

CHOMPY

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So, how many would say Lucario is in danger of being cut in favor of Zoroark?
Zoroark for top tier


Imagine using Zoroarks attack. Lets pretend Player A used Zoroark and Player B used Donkey Kong. Zoroark would use Illusion to transform himself to Donkey Kong and maybe as a added side effect, there would be 2 Donkey Kong. The player would have to guess which one would be the real Donkey Kong and if they attack the wrong Donkey, the fake one dissappears while the real one transforms back to Zoroark and attacks Player B's Donkey by suprise.
 

Conviction

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The point was that some characters just wouldn't fit well with others.

And Fox, Falco and Wolf were clones in terms of design.
Think about it. Before smash could you really see someone like Ike and Peach in the same? What's the difference?

Also, those three come from the same series in which they follow the same path. So wouldn't their design have similarities.
 

Ulevo

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GET- Wait, what are you even talking about anymore? This isn't politics. Also there also going to be game flaws get over it. MK does have broken traits no lie.
My gripe isn't about "game flaws get over it". My gripe is with the excessive game flaws inherent in Brawl. It isn't just Meta Knight, he's just the mascot everyone likes to bash. There's an entire list of problems that follows along with him.

People can have their opinions and differences about all three games of the franchise and which one they like more, but none of the three had as many mistakes in it as Brawl did. If we expect Smash 4 to be a respectable sequel, that has to change.


The only people who say Brawl is a failure are tourney players and their nearest friends.

/facts
I know many casual players (i.e. don't have a SWF account, don't view videos on YouTube, don't go to and never have been to tournaments, do not research the game mechanics) who have dropped this game because they thought it was bad in comparison to the previous two games. That's simply not true.
 
D

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kackamee said:
I think Marth and Bowser have the cute cartoony look I was talking about. Snake, not so much, but I thought they made him fit very well design wise in SSBB. It's just some characters like the ones I stated would be overboard.
I'm not really seeing it. He looks pretty realistic to me, almost as realistic as Snake does. I think those character can fit in as perfectly as Snake does.
some_jerk said:
So, how many would say Lucario is in danger of being cut in favor of Zoroark?
I think he's more likely to be cut due to originating in a movie, but that's just me. And yeah, despite not having played the latest Pokemon, I'd rather have Victini in.
xIblisx said:
I think there is going to be more than 4 seeing that we have new-found relationships.
How does better third-party support = more third-party character? Remember, this is a primarily Nintendo game, not a general fighting game.
 

The Real Gamer

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Zoroark for top tier


Imagine using Zoroarks attack. Lets pretend Player A used Zoroark and Player B used Donkey Kong. Zoroark would use Illusion to transform himself to Donkey Kong and maybe as a added side effect, there would be 2 Donkey Kong. The player would have to guess which one would be the real Donkey Kong and if they attack the wrong Donkey, the fake one dissappears while the real one transforms back to Zoroark and attacks Player B's Donkey by suprise.
Bad idea is bad.

Like Metaknight.
 

BSP

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speaking of MK

will he get that spike he needs?

And speaking of Lucas, maybe they could add a mother rep.
 

kackamee

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Think about it. Before smash could you really see someone like Ike and Peach in the same? What's the difference?

Also, those three come from the same series in which they follow the same path. So wouldn't their design have similarities.
Touche'

And yes they would have similarities, but those similarities are what made them clones. They even had the same Final Smashes.
 

Conviction

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The only people who say Brawl is a failure are tourney players and their nearest friends.

/facts
Not sure if serious...:glare:



Zoroark for top tier


Imagine using Zoroarks attack. Lets pretend Player A used Zoroark and Player B used Donkey Kong. Zoroark would use Illusion to transform himself to Donkey Kong and maybe as a added side effect, there would be 2 Donkey Kong. The player would have to guess which one would be the real Donkey Kong and if they attack the wrong Donkey, the fake one dissappears while the real one transforms back to Zoroark and attacks Player B's Donkey by suprise.
Wut de hell?

Bad idea is bad.

Like Metaknight.
This.

speaking of MK

will he get that spike he needs?

And speaking of Lucas, maybe they could add a mother rep.
Claus? and Mk needs no spike stop adding more broken to the broken.
 

Jaklub

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Not sure if serious...:glare:
Absolutely serious.
They make me go apowitgxdmgpawrawprj

Though it will get hilarious when people start complaining about SSB4. lol they already are, even though game doesn't exist yet
 
D

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Though it will get hilarious when people start complaining about SSB4. lol they already are, even though game doesn't exist yet
Unless the roster ends up really disappointing, oh boy is it going to be hilarious. This happens with every hotly anticipated game like this.
 

Croi

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I have a simple solution for Meta Knight: except for the very last hit, his nado will not cause flinching. Same for his fair, ftilt, possibly bair. Under the excuse that "he's cutting them so fast they can't feel it".
 

Conviction

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Touche'

And yes they would have similarities, but those similarities are what made them clones. They even had the same Final Smashes.
Their Final Smashes were only on real thing clonish about them but that's imo I guess.

Lol, Metaknight. I'm hoping he get's nerfed heavily next time around.
Don't cripple him like the treaty of Versailles did to Germany after WWI though.

Exactly how badly would hell break loose in Smashboards if MK was somehow buffed?
GTF

Just recognized that Lucas is a starting character. That makes him that much less likely to get the boot.
This is a good point.

Absolutely serious.
Those people make me go apowitgxdmgpawrawprj

Though it will get hilarious when they start complaining about SSB4.
The smash community in GA (and pretty sure in other states) is very content with Brawl, there is nothing wrong with state suggestions to make the game better. Stop hanging those "if it's not Melee 2.0, it's bad" players.

EDIT: @Croi - You want MK to have the Roy effect where he gets punished for hitting people?
 
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No talk about the physics. Are we expecting them to stay to same?
No, I 100% expect higher gravity and more combo-oriented gameplay, but I don't expect the game to speed up much.

I would also expect a tighter engine this time around. People looking for ATs will probably be more disappointed than they were in Brawl.
 
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