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[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

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UberMario

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Doh, I knew I forgot something, yeah that's true that one is from EB, but the main part of the song was actually the Fourside theme for that with those two you mentioned mixed in. Still 1 song out 9 Mother songs used in the series for a game represented with a character in every SSB? That's still kind of sad.
 

ToiseOfChoice

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Out of curiosity, and I'm bored, how much do each of you agree with these statements?
Leaderboards are garbage, I've always been glad that they completely reject the concept.

There are some interviews with Iwata recently about how they're trying to improve online communication, accessibility, and content with the 3DS and any other future systems. The new Pokemon games are supposed to have video chat with friends if you play it on DSi, among a bunch of other things. So a massive improvement over Brawl's system is kind of a given.


One thing I definitely agree with:

Therefore, we tried to think of ways to avoid this form of online gaming and ways to fashion an environment in which parents would feel safe letting their children play games online, debating at length on topics like how to create an online environment free of harassment. As a result, our concept of the WFC slowly began to take shape with two separate modes of play; players could play with friends or play with people they don’t know. It would be more about the fun of sharing rather than simply competing. Amazingly, these were the proposals I found in the first document you gave me.
This is more important than us being able to befriend a stranger we had some good matches with. I know it sucks when you play with someone and you're like "this dude is cool, we should hang out more" but safety for kids really does come first. It's easy to forget that if you don't have a little kid to remind you.

Barring a well-executed system of parental controls (which is actually pretty basic), this won't change for Smash or any first-party game. I'm curious to see what they do with the 3DS, to see if they try something like that.
 

SSBBninja

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Ugh.... :( These types of posts greatly annoy me, so I have a lot to say. Read the bottom of the post thats in RED for the tl;dr version.

Anime characters will just ruin the series, trust me. The purpose of Super Smash Bros. is to bring elements of many popular and familiar Nintendo games together, including characters, locations, items, music, and themes. However, just because the character starred in a game on a Nintendo console certainly DOES NOT mean they are a NINENDO character. Naruto, Goku, and other anime characters do NOT belong in anyway to Nintendo. Therefore, they are not Nintendo and do not belong in the game.

You might say "Sonic and Snake aren't Nintendo and they're in the game!" Well yes, but its different. See, Sonic and Snake originated as video game characters. So placing them in a game that is basically a crossover for multiple video game (mostly Nintendo) series is quite appropriate. Did Naruto, Goku, etc. originate in a video game? I don't think so. Do they belong in Smash? Definitely NOT.

If we went by the standard that any character that has ever appeared in a video game on a Nintendo console could appear in the game, we could add pretty much any character ever invented. Anime characters, sports stars, cartoon characters, pop stars, I could go on. Save all that for a different game, let Smash keep its "Nintendo magic" that makes it so great and enjoyable. Those are my thoughts on the subject.

By the way, R.O.B. is a unique character, he's a video game character, and he's Nintendo. Why not put him in? It's an interesting surprise too. Who cares how "unkown" they are if they're in the game? Do you think many non-Japanese people knew who Marth and Roy were when Melee came out? Sure a few did, but not many. And look what happened, Fire Emblem is now popular in other parts of the world. My point proven.

TL;DR: Anime characters will only ruin the game. They are not Nintendo and therefore will never be in a Smash game. You're wrong. Also, R.O.B. rocks.
Dragon ball Z has expanded itself into a lot of video games since it's anime ended, and Sora from Kingdom Hearts deserves to be in the next game, either him, or cloud / Sephiroth from final fantasy. I understand what you're talking about when you say they're not video game characters, but I was just looking at it from a business perspective, because if they put those characters in there would be a lot of new smash fans :bee:
 

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This is more important than us being able to befriend a stranger we had some good matches with. I know it sucks when you play with someone and you're like "this dude is cool, we should hang out more" but safety for kids really does come first. It's easy to forget that if you don't have a little kid to remind you.

Barring a well-executed system of parental controls (which is actually pretty basic), this won't change for Smash or any first-party game. I'm curious to see what they do with the 3DS, to see if they try something like that.
I didn't forget that, Toise.

For the second quote, the key thing needed to help online play is communication between the players, and those pre-written messages aren't going to cut it. We need to see Wii Speak or whatever implemented so the stronger players can help the weaker players. Then there comes the question of what to do about the children playing. The only thing I can think of in that required is that NWC becomes a multi-tiered service.
Having something like:

Basic: Free. Use the online channels for shopping and downloading DLC, patches, etc. Access to online play, but you do not have a gamertag/screen name, but a friend code per game that only you can distribute. You cannot see other gamertags/screen names. Does not allow Wii Speak.

Paid: Have a gamertag/screen name. Friend codes are NOT used. You now have a friends list, and like XBL, you can see what other people are playing, invite people to games and chat parties. Allows Wii Speak. Can send messages and voice messages to each other.

would likely fix up a lot of issues they have regarding the security of younger players. Parents don't have to pay for X amount of months for their kids to play online and they can play as much as they want in safety of cyber bullies, stalkers, etc. Of course, there is still the parental options option, but I'm no expert on how these companies run their online service, so we might have XBL quality online play for free no matter what.
 

Spydr Enzo

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Doh, I knew I forgot something, yeah that's true that one is from EB, but the main part of the song was actually the Fourside theme for that with those two you mentioned mixed in. Still 1 song out 9 Mother songs used in the series for a game represented with a character in every SSB? That's still kind of sad.
Isn't the Fourside theme called Because I Love You? I might be mistaken but I'm pretty sure they are the same song. But anyway yes it is sad. Especially considering EarthBound has had a character in all 3 games, where Mother 3 has only been represented in 1 game and Mother 1 hasn't had a character in any of the Smashes.

It's like they can add Ness, but anything else related to his character/game is completely shunned by Smash.
 

Big-Cat

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Isn't the Fourside theme called Because I Love You? I might be mistaken but I'm pretty sure they are the same song. But anyway yes it is sad. Especially considering EarthBound has had a character in all 3 games, where Mother 3 has only been represented in 1 game and Mother 1 hasn't had a character in any of the Smashes.

It's like they can add Ness, but anything else related to his character/game is completely shunned by Smash.
Yes and no.

Because I Love You is an arrangement of the Fourside theme. After playing Earthbound, which I need to finish, I find it sad that the music from that game is hardly in. These would've been great:
http://shoryuken.com/f315/srk-training-thread-xbl-243851/ - I think everyone knows this one.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQYSPtfirLM - Boing!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxgsqPA_Ujw&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Gde1VU1tXw&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNGY_fvXUCY&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hjed8WdGSyk - Should've been Ness' credits music.
 

Big-Cat

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What should be done for online play, particularly security and how Earthbound didn't get any music, but its predecessor and sequel did.
 

BBQTV

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because sakurai wants to troll the **** out of earthbound fans. brawl is a big middle finger on earthbound fans
 

Spydr Enzo

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Yes and no.

Because I Love You is an arrangement of the Fourside theme. After playing Earthbound, which I need to finish, I find it sad that the music from that game is hardly in.
Ah, it seems I was slightly mistaken. But, I've never played a MOTHER/EarthBound game in my life. I've only watched numerous gameplay videos and read about it online. It seems like a very interesting series though, I want to get into it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hjed8WdGSyk - Should've been Ness' credits music.
I absolutely love this song. It's hard to imagine fighting to it until it gets deeper into the song, but it's a great piece. What about this?

Eight Melodies

I know it's from the original MOTHER and its also featured with the song Bein' Friends which plays on Onett, but I like it a lot as well.
 

Pee-G

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Wait.... some one tell me whats going on here. Its so coplicated. And Ganondorf should have his sword in SSB4. and anime Char wouldnt make sence in Smash. i was like WUUTT?!!? when i heard sonic and snake where in brawl.
 

Big-Cat

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I absolutely love this song. It's hard to imagine fighting to it until it gets deeper into the song, but it's a great piece. What about this?

Eight Melodies

I know it's from the original MOTHER and its also featured with the song Bein' Friends which plays on Onett, but I like it a lot as well.
We shouldn't think about fighting to the music. To me, some songs should be in because of how much they have a connection with to the original series. Imagine if The Last Story gets a character in SSB4, but the theme is omitted because you can't fight to it.

As I said, I'd like to see this kind of music be used for when you clear Classic Mode.

As for Eight Melodies, you want this version.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYlPTYBhtOI&feature=related

To me, this is one of videogame music's high points. It's a simple song from a simpler time, yet you will feel emotional over this.
 

Pee-G

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there shouldnt be any sad song. that for sure when im fighting i want to hear some HEAVY stuff. like METALLICA .
 

ToiseOfChoice

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I didn't forget that, Toise.
Oh whoops.

Having something like:

Basic: Free. Use the online channels for shopping and downloading DLC, patches, etc. Access to online play, but you do not have a gamertag/screen name, but a friend code per game that only you can distribute. You cannot see other gamertags/screen names. Does not allow Wii Speak.

Paid: Have a gamertag/screen name. Friend codes are NOT used. You now have a friends list, and like XBL, you can see what other people are playing, invite people to games and chat parties. Allows Wii Speak. Can send messages and voice messages to each other.

would likely fix up a lot of issues they have regarding the security of younger players. Parents don't have to pay for X amount of months for their kids to play online and they can play as much as they want in safety of cyber bullies, stalkers, etc. Of course, there is still the parental options option, but I'm no expert on how these companies run their online service, so we might have XBL quality online play for free no matter what.
That doesn't solve the child safety issue because it only covers children who don't have access to a paid account (and quite a lot would if other services are anything to go by). Also Nintendo's not big into charging people extra for basic features since it puts people off.

I'm not sure if you're familiar with the Wii's parental controls, but it basically just asks for an age and then blocks any attempts to load a higher-rated game with a password (also lets you put a password on internet functions). All that's required here is more flexibility with what's allowed and what's not. Well, that and making sure it's easy to use and emphasizing that it exists.


because sakurai wants to troll the **** out of earthbound fans. brawl is a big middle finger on earthbound fans
Other games and series have it much worse than EarthBound, musically or otherwise.
 

MKOwnage

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Knuckle Joe would make great addition to the next game.

His recovery could be rising break.

Jab could be well Vulcan Jab

Neutral B could be Smash Punch

Nair could be aerial spin kick.

Dair could be down kick.





Thats all I have.
 

BBQTV

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there shouldnt be any sad song. that for sure when im fighting i want to hear some HEAVY stuff. like METALLICA .
your gonna need to install hombrew and for the love of all thats good in this world dont update your wii!



i know other series got it bad but lucas brought a truckload of spoilers with him, including King P.'s identity and New Pork City. This did not amuse a large number of Mother fans.
 

Pieman0920

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because sakurai wants to troll the **** out of earthbound fans. brawl is a big middle finger on earthbound fans
Given how Lucas got into Brawl, I wouldn't say Earthbound was trolled at all, especially since its such a small and unknown series. You simply can't expect as much content as other high ranking series, yet it still came close.
 

BBQTV

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Brawlcontains many spoilers for the game, including no less than fivemajor plot points. (Specifically, it ruins Hinawa's death, Lucas' confrontation with Claus, Claus's identity as the Masked Man, Porky's identity as the Pig King, and the purpose of the Needles.
 

Big-Cat

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That doesn't solve the child safety issue because it only covers children who don't have access to a paid account (and quite a lot would if other services are anything to go by). Also Nintendo's not big into charging people extra for basic features since it puts people off.

I'm not sure if you're familiar with the Wii's parental controls, but it basically just asks for an age and then blocks any attempts to load a higher-rated game with a password (also lets you put a password on internet functions). All that's required here is more flexibility with what's allowed and what's not. Well, that and making sure it's easy to use and emphasizing that it exists.
You must have missed it again because I mentioned parental controls at the end of my post as a viable option. In regards to us paying or not paying, that's something I can't really say much about. Nintendo MAY charge for online services if it costs too much to run without some profit from other sources. Miyamoto did say, though, that they are considering paid services, but they never brought up how much it costs Nintendo to run their service.

http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3179183
 

Pieman0920

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I don't see how his trolling though. He gave a character and a boss. The fact that he spoiled doesn't mean much anyways, because that's like if saying the producers of SC were trolling the Star Wars fanbase because they mentioned that Darth Vader was Luke's father. Its also something that happens right in the beginning of the game, so again, it can hardly be considered trolling. Would an EB fan rather have no spoilers via complete lack of anything Earthbound at all rather than actually getting content at the expense of getting characters and spoilers about those characters that they already should friggen know?
 

DekuBoy

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Uh, Earthbound fans are pretty thrilled that their favourite characters can go toe-to-toe with Nintendo's elite.

Brawl has created a huge problem for the series however: people are mainly concerned with more content (fat) than the actual fighting itself. Melee had a perfect balance between the fighting and the bonus stuff, whereas Brawl had too much unnessecary flab.

Also: Cris Redfield is now voicing Sonic. Really. Look it up.
 

Big-Cat

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Sakurai was only trolling us when he put in random tripping. We all know this is his face when we trip:


And I'm so happy that the voices are changing. I was fine with Lisa Ortiz for Amy so maybe she was one of the ones not cut.
 

M@v

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It would be mad easy to make a moveset for Zero in Brawl. He would likely play a lot like marth, except with projectile and the same strength all over his Z saber instead of a stronger tipper and a weaker rest of the blade.


If they put any megaman character in a game though, it would be some form or megaman, probably the original or X.(Then again, in TvC they chose volnut for some dumb reason)


The original megaman has been in a fighting game. Volnut has been in one. Give X a turn D:
 

Kantrip

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I'm hoping for every stage to have some character or other to represent it. Brawl needed an Animal Crossing character, IMO. Improvements to Stage Builder, perhaps an extension on replay times would be nice.
 

UberMario

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The replay cap in Brawl was stupid imo, as is the replay memory per Wii cap when a SD card is not used.
 

Big-Cat

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The funny thing about that is that the hacks allow you to go past two minutes, meaning it was a deliberate limitation.
 

Big-Cat

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It depends. Would you say Sakurai was trolling by revealing Sheik was Zelda all along? No, whether we played OoT or not, he assumed that most people knew that spoiler already.

As for Lucas and his rampant spoilers, I don't think he was deliberately spoiling MOTHER 3. The Japanese should've known those things already. Since it's Japan only, it didn't really matter if the rest of the world was spoiled since they would never be able to play the game legally.
 

Spydr Enzo

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Brawl has created a huge problem for the series however: people are mainly concerned with more content (fat) than the actual fighting itself. Melee had a perfect balance between the fighting and the bonus stuff, whereas Brawl had too much unnessecary flab.
I don't find this "bonus stuff" and "flab" unnecessary at all. In fact, I enjoy the direction Smash has gone. It began as a purely fighting game but through Melee and into Brawl, it has become something more. It's got a little bit of [almost] everything to keep someone occupied, or to keep you from getting bored of fighting over and over and over again.

After fighting, you can check out your trophy and sticker collections, learn more about the Universe of Nintendo. You can play mini-games like Target Smash, Home-run Contest, and Coin Launcher as your favorite Nintendo characters. You an enjoy Nintendo's greatest musical pieces, construct your own stages to fight on, explore the roots of Nintendo characters, items, locations and themes, and do much much more. It isn't only a fighting game anymore. It's like a massive clash of Nintendo worlds into the ultimate Nintendo-themed party game.

The real magic is that while the game does this, it also stays centered around it's fighting game roots. Besides, they've gotta add more than just fighting by now. I wouldn't call it flab either. Maybe muscle is a better word.
 

Big-Cat

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I don't find this "bonus stuff" and "flab" unnecessary at all. In fact, I enjoy the direction Smash has gone. It began as a purely fighting game but through Melee and into Brawl, it has become something more. It's got a little bit of [almost] everything to keep someone occupied, or to keep you from getting bored of fighting over and over and over again.
Then you're really just dodging the fact that the gameplay hasn't had any major changes, physics not withstanding. Remember this is a fighting game first and foremost. The most important thing, the very thing that gets people to come back and play again, is the gameplay. I honestly don't care about most of the extras in the game as I never look at the trophies or stickers.

After fighting, you can check out your trophy and sticker collections, learn more about the Universe of Nintendo. You can play mini-games like Target Smash, Home-run Contest, and Coin Launcher as your favorite Nintendo characters. You an enjoy Nintendo's greatest musical pieces, construct your own stages to fight on, explore the roots of Nintendo characters, items, locations and themes, and do much much more. It isn't only a fighting game anymore. It's like a massive clash of Nintendo worlds into the ultimate Nintendo-themed party game.
Coin Launcher sucks.

There's nothing wrong with some of these modes, but you also have to realize that a good chunk of what you're saying pertains to short term satisfaction. What do you do after you've read and gotten all the trophies and stickers? At least you have stuff like Break the Targets and Home-Run Contest where you can try beating your score (If there is ever a leaderboard for SSB, these two should have it).

The real magic is that while the game does this, it also stays centered around it's fighting game roots. Besides, they've gotta add more than just fighting by now. I wouldn't call it flab either. Maybe muscle is a better word.
I call it flab, and I wouldn't say, with Brawl, that it's stayed centered around its fighting roots. I'm wiling to say that Brawl went for too much fanservice and not enough substance to back it up.
 

ToiseOfChoice

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You must have missed it again because I mentioned parental controls at the end of my post as a viable option. In regards to us paying or not paying, that's something I can't really say much about. Nintendo MAY charge for online services if it costs too much to run without some profit from other sources. Miyamoto did say, though, that they are considering paid services, but they never brought up how much it costs Nintendo to run their service.

http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3179183
I know you mentioned it, but you didn't get into the details so I assumed you weren't familiar with what we have now.

The main point was that a standard/premium system like Live doesn't solve this issue at all and in a way it's kinda irrelevant. Parental controls are the best fix for this sort of thing, all the current system would've needed was some flexibility with restricting specific features. No need to drag subscriptions and whatnot into that.

And yeah I know the Miyamoto interview (and kinda expected it to be mentioned), but they're basically saying "we're tossing around all sorts of ideas, haven't really decided on anything." Iwata frequently mentions wanting to increase online adoption rates; putting a fee on basic communications that a lot of Wii games already have is counterproductive.


Brawl has created a huge problem for the series however: people are mainly concerned with more content (fat) than the actual fighting itself. Melee had a perfect balance between the fighting and the bonus stuff, whereas Brawl had too much unnessecary flab.
I don't see how people aren't concerned with the fighting. The people who hate it won't stop complaining and the people who enjoy it only voice their opinions in opposition to the former. Around here in particular it's impossible to avoid criticism.

And the content is very important in Smash, what's wrong with expanding on it? It's not like people don't care about all the Nintendo stuff, and the encyclopedic features have been around since N64's profiles. As far as I can tell, Brawl didn't have enough of it, especially in regards to its unfortunately limited demos.
 

DekuBoy

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I mean the people who are making the game.

In Melee the game engine came BEFORE the extras.

In Brawl they spent too little time on the engine.

I don't play the Smash Bros games cause I wanna look at trophies and stickers, I play cause I want multiplayer fun. They just need to sort out their priorities is all I'm really saying.
 

MKOwnage

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Uh, Earthbound fans are pretty thrilled that their favourite characters can go toe-to-toe with Nintendo's elite.

Brawl has created a huge problem for the series however: people are mainly concerned with more content (fat) than the actual fighting itself. Melee had a perfect balance between the fighting and the bonus stuff, whereas Brawl had too much unnessecary flab.

Also: Cris Redfield is now voicing Sonic. Really. Look it up.
Thank the lordy no more Jason.

And they should add some new new moves. Like a bsmash.

IMO the next game should focus on better WiFi service. Online tournaments would be cool. A user name password system and a profile.. The ability to just open a room instead of having to wait for random players. A rankings chart would be nice too unless Sakurai is still to sympathetic for the bad players.

However I don't think Sakurai will be doing the next game he doesn't seem to have much interest for it. But Brawl was so successful (the whole series for that matter) I highly doubt Nintendo is going to say no to a 4th addition.
 

DekuBoy

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I wouldn't say that Sakurai doesn't have interest, but he is working on another game so he must get pretty annoyed about everyone asking him about another Smash Bros. He left Hal because he didn't like making sequels.
 

ToiseOfChoice

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I mean the people who are making the game.

In Melee the game engine came BEFORE the extras.

In Brawl they spent too little time on the engine.

I don't play the Smash Bros games cause I wanna look at trophies and stickers, I play cause I want multiplayer fun. They just need to sort out their priorities is all I'm really saying.
They spent more time working on Brawl's gameplay than Melee's or 64's.

You can say that you didn't LIKE how it turned out, but to say they didn't devote a ton of time to it or considered it secondary to the seemingly incomplete extras is just completely false.
 

JBRPG

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I wouldn't say that Sakurai doesn't have interest, but he is working on another game so he must get pretty annoyed about everyone asking him about another Smash Bros. He left Hal because he didn't like making sequels.
I think that Masahiro Sakurai doesn't want to be involved in any more sequels to the Smash Brothers or Kirby since he wants to try something different. If the next Smash Brothers is expected for pitch-up, Nintendo can simply select someone else with enough game industry and Smash Bros experience.
 

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Liquid Snake


I really would of liked to see Liquid Snake in Brawl or in SSB4. Liquid is actually
Solid Snake's, "Cursed Brother," according to Liquid himself.





He would be different than Solid Snake, he would lack the use of weapons and rely on Hand to hand close quarter combat. The only weapon he would have would be a FAMAS he used in the Jeep Chase in MGS1 and a Time Bomb.

SPECIALS

B Attack - FAMAS Assault Rifle. You can run around while holding it and fire it constantly. Each Bullet causes 6% Damage.

Side B - Liquid kneels down and yells. He then runs toward with a extremely powerful charge attack that surprises opponents. Same thing as the move he used against Snake while fighting on ruined Metal Gear Rex. 50% (If fully charged) But with little knockback.

Up B - Liquid does a flip into the air and comes down with a powerful kick. 15%

Down B
- Time Bomb. Liquid plants a Bomb on the ground that will eventually explodes and causes massive damage to opponents. It's the same as Snake's down B except it causes more damage and you cannot set it off with Remote Control. Causes 45% w/ super large knockback. I got the idea from the Bomb he planted on Meryl in MGS1.


FINAL SMASH IDEAS


Final Smash Idea 1 - Liquid jumps into Metal Gear Rex and crushes everyone with it. It can fire missiles and machine gun bullets along with a powerful laser.

Final Smash Idea 2 - He jumps into a Hind D that can fly around and fire Bullets along with Heat seeking missiles.

Somebody tell me which Final Smash idea should be used. I dunno... I might actually add Liquid with Brawl hacks...
 
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