[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

[Spydr Enzo]

@Enzo

Adventure mode didn't need them, and in the end didn't have them, but that doesn't mean they wouldn't have improved things. And in any case, the fact that you view none of the stages as being things that are worht playing on their own is a problem in itself, isn't it?

There are millions of features that could have been added into Adventure Mode that could have improved things. That doesn't mean that any of them would be worth the time to implement, like save points or stage selects. And all I'm saying is that there really is no point to choosing a single stage anyway, because all it usually is a just a battle, which you can do in multiplayer mode, it is much more enjoyable to play through the collection of stages together anyway, like a speed-run. And why use stage select anyway when you can play the same stage in the normal Adventure mode plus others and get a trophy for it?

And it would eventually get very sloppy to just have everyone repeat the same thing over again, and in the end you'll probably only have really 6 or 7 different variations. (Mario style, Pokemon style, medieval style for Zelda/FE/GS, retro style, space style for Metroid/FZ/SF, and maybe like one other for Kirby) Thus I'm suggesting just not even bothering trying to make the illusion that everyone else has their own unique story mode, and rather just limit it down from the start.

Actually, Medieval style would be split into Legend of Zelda style, Fire Emblem style, and a possible Golden Sun style, and space would be split into Metroid, F-Zero, and Starfox, so there would be plenty of variations. It would keep things fresh while not wasting so much time, like the SSE did.

It doesn't matter to me WHAT the Adventure mode is like really, as long as it more closely resembles Melee and doesn't take up as much time as the SSE. Simple cut scenes too, not those time-consuming CG ones. Most fans would agree that Adventure mode needs to take a more "Melee-ish" approach, as seen in the latest posts.

 

[Pieman0920]

There are millions of features that could have been added into Adventure Mode that could have improved things. That doesn't mean that any of them would be worth the time to implement, like save points or stage selects. And all I'm saying is that there really is no point to choosing a single stage anyway, because all it usually is a just a battle, which you can do in multiplayer mode, it is much more enjoyable to play through the collection of stages together anyway, like a speed-run. And why use stage select anyway when you can play the same stage in the normal Adventure mode plus others and get a trophy for it?

But the save/stage select is the worst offender. It really hurts the mode's replayability and makes it unpleasent to try to get to a part you like that's later on. And if you acknowledge the fact that the stages aren't that great, and that most of them were just generic battles, then I would hope that you would realize how SSE improved these features. Perhaps it was a bit long for your tastes, but the structure was better when it came to trying to be a platformer.

And going through everything to get the trophy is annoying when you try to do it 25 friggen times.

Of course, I think we're technically moving away from what this was originally about, which was that Brawl's adventure mode was a improvement over Melee's, and even with your suggested improvements, you would still include saving inbetween levels or level selection after completion, would you not?

Actually, Medieval style would be split into Legend of Zelda style, Fire Emblem style, and a possible Golden Sun style, and space would be split into Metroid, F-Zero, and Starfox, so there would be plenty of variations. It would keep things fresh while not wasting so much time, like the SSE did.

It doesn't matter to me WHAT the Adventure mode is like really, as long as it more closely resembles Melee and doesn't take up as much time as the SSE. Simple cut scenes too, not those time-consuming CG ones. Most fans would agree that Adventure mode needs to take a more "Melee-ish" approach, as seen in the latest posts.

So you're suggesting that LoZ would have its own levels that are seperate from FE's or pottentially GS's, and the same thing for the Space series? If you go like that, it will certainly be too many different types of levels, and for several, not enough justification to even go through the process of making them.

And while I'm all for reformating the Adventure mode to make it easier to make through, Melee's Adventure mode was incredibly flawed, so we really shouldn't try to go back to it. That's why I think making mini-SSE's at around 8-12 total would be beneficial, because they can be more focused on certain characters, still have a decent enough amount of levels, won't try to make a false promise of everyone having their own special mode, can keep the cinematic cutscenes (which aren't really time consuming since you can just skip them if need be) and can all around improve replayability.

 

[Spydr Enzo]

But the save/stage select is the worst offender. It really hurts the mode's replayability and makes it unpleasent to try to get to a part you like that's later on. And if you acknowledge the fact that the stages aren't that great, and that most of them were just generic battles, then I would hope that you would realize how SSE improved these features. Perhaps it was a bit long for your tastes, but the structure was better when it came to trying to be a platformer.

And going through everything to get the trophy is annoying when you try to do it 25 friggen times.

Of course, I think we're technically moving away from what this was originally about, which was that Brawl's adventure mode was a improvement over Melee's, and even with your suggested improvements, you would still include saving inbetween levels or level selection after completion, would you not?

The mode didn't have great replayability anyway. Seriously, who wants to play through the same thing 25 times? Replayability was the one thing that Melee's Adventure lacked, the one main reason it was criticized. The stage select is only a small drawback anyway, a very minor issue that isn't even worth debating.

Of course the stages are simple and generic, but thats what makes them great! This is Smash, we don't NEED a huge, time-consuming adventure mode when effort can be put into so much more. Characters, stages, game features, etc., even if it is only 3 more characters or so. That's my problem with the SSE, and everyone elses problem as well. Not it's length. And Melee's Adventure was never "trying to be a platformer" either.

To answer your final question there, yes I would, because the way I would improve it would make level select and saving more necessary, more desired by players. You're complaining that those are what Melee lacked, when implementing a level select and saving points would just be a waste of time for reasons I explained above.

So you're suggesting that LoZ would have its own levels that are seperate from FE's or pottentially GS's, and the same thing for the Space series? If you go like that, it will certainly be too many different types of levels, and for several, not enough justification to even go through the process of making them.

And while I'm all for reformating the Adventure mode to make it easier to make through, Melee's Adventure mode was incredibly flawed, so we really shouldn't try to go back to it. That's why I think making mini-SSE's at around 8-12 total would be beneficial, because they can be more focused on certain characters, still have a decent enough amount of levels, won't try to make a false promise of everyone having their own special mode, can keep the cinematic cutscenes (which aren't really time consuming since you can just skip them if need be) and can all around improve replayability.

I think you are misunderstanding me when I say time consuming. I am not referring to the length of the Adventure mode, I'm referring to all the extra time developers are spending on it that they could be spending on other features.

And like I said in an above post, I don't really care what the Adventure mode turns out like as long as it doesn't take up as much time (to develop) as it did in Brawl. As long as it is more simple and styled more like Melee's, but with better replay value.

 

[drag0nscythe]

Isn't Mission Mode just a different way of saying Events?

And I really don't think there's any need to have both a Melee-styled Adventure mode, and a Brawl-styled Adventure mode. The major complaint from most people inregards to the transition from Melee's to Brawl's was the setting issue, which can easily be corrected without needing two different modes.

Mission mode is basically events. That was what I was thinking, just failed to convey it correctly. As for two adventure modes, I remember a few people (and people on gamefaqs) complaining how Melee had a better adventure mode. The way I see it, one could have a huge sprawling story over many different stages, levels and such as well as a simple 15 minute set of missions and fights. Think of it as a scale.

Classic -> Pure fights
Adventure mode -> Pure fights and missions tied into it for the retro feel.
Mission mode -> Pure Events and Missions

All-star -> Free for all
Story mode -> What people want out of a story
Boss Rush -> Because it was a good idea in brawl.

Perfect. Problem is coming up with a really good story. I like overly complex plots and cheessy melodrama camp. (IE I want to see people die and others have over the top, laughable reactions to it.) Others do not.

Cannot please everyone.

Also, one can say allstar mode is pointless given the kinds of events we had in Brawl. You ended up fighting everyone anyway. Just forget making it a mode and make it a mission in event mode.

 

[Fatmanonice]

I want NPCs to give you missions and whatnot. Also a costume shop.

And yes, CHARACTER SPECIFIC AREAS! Like Lego Star Wars. That would be a great incentive to replay levels.

Agreed. I love for the adventure mode to include more Nintendo characters even if they're not playable kind of like in the game Captain Rainbow.

 

[Gallowglass]

SSE did have a lot of interesting things added to it then from melee. The puzzles, platforms, and stories were really well done. My only problem was they made the world and bad guys generic. I liked melee's connecting the worlds idea.

The Trophy idea was interesting and added replayability but the item itself was the real problem. Had to hold it like an item, threw slowly, and you had to weaken some enemies before using it. That was the problem.

Now I think they should add a more exploration to the game. Like in SSE where you have a map of places but they would be connected to different worlds. So you could have Mario go to Samus' world and fight space pirates. Also they could combine event modes and some stadium games in adventure mode. Now let's look at all the different worlds we would need.

Mushroom Kingdom/Warioland/Yoshi's Island
Hyrule
Fire Emblem
Kirby
Metroid
Starfox
Flatzone
Donkey Kong
Earthbound
Pokemon
Ice Climbers
Kid Icarus
Sonic
Metal Gear
Final Destination/Battlefield

I think that's all the genera's. The worlds will be divided by the number of players (so Mushroom kingdom would be bigger because of the more players). Each character would start off in their own world and then make there way to Battlefield. There they can explore other areas find secret characters, trophies, and advance the story (somewhat like in SSE) but have the familiar worlds like in Melee.

 

[Yung Mei]

SSE did have a lot of interesting things added to it then from melee. The puzzles, platforms, and stories were really well done. My only problem was they made the world and bad guys generic. I liked melee's connecting the worlds idea.

The Trophy idea was interesting and added replayability but the item itself was the real problem. Had to hold it like an item, threw slowly, and you had to weaken some enemies before using it. That was the problem.

Now I think they should add a more exploration to the game. Like in SSE where you have a map of places but they would be connected to different worlds. So you could have Mario go to Samus' world and fight space pirates. Also they could combine event modes and some stadium games in adventure mode. Now let's look at all the different worlds we would need.

Mushroom Kingdom/Warioland/Yoshi's Island
Hyrule
Fire Emblem
Kirby
Metroid
Starfox
Flatzone
Donkey Kong
Earthbound
Pokemon
Ice Climbers
Kid Icarus
Sonic
Metal Gear
Final Destination/Battlefield

I think that's all the genera's. The worlds will be divided by the number of players (so Mushroom kingdom would be bigger because of the more players). Each character would start off in their own world and then make there way to Battlefield. There they can explore other areas find secret characters, trophies, and advance the story (somewhat like in SSE) but have the familiar worlds like in Melee.

you forgot F-Zero

Blasphemy!

 

[DekuBoy]

And any new series. I beleive that inbetween missions there should be a HUB like Flipside. Maybe a city full of Nintendo characters who don't fit in anywhere else like Tamagon, Captain Rainbow or even Alexandra Roivas.

 

[Gallowglass]

you forgot F-Zero

Blasphemy!

Oops it was like 3am when I was typing that. I also forgot Gyromite (ROB's world)

 

[Kholdstare]

SSB4 Roster:

Melee Ganondorf
Toon Zelda
Young Zelda
Saria
Young Ruto
Young Malon
Dixie Kong
Tiny Kong
Zelda
Peach
Daisy
Zero Suit Samus
Old Ruto
Old Malon
Kyrstal
Gardevoir
Imp Midna
Human Midna
Misty
Dawn
May
Sabrina
Erika

 

[diosensakiara]

The BEST SSB4 ROSTER containing 65 characters.

1. Mario
2. Link
3. Kirby
4. Pikachu
5. Fox
6. Bowser
7. Donkey Kong
8. Yoshi
9. Peach
10. Pit
11. Wario
12. Ike
13. Pokemon Trainer
14. Diddy Kong
15. Meta Knight
16. Lucas
17. King Dedede
18. Pikmin & Olimar
19. Ice Climbers
20. Samus
21. Zelda
22. Ness
23. Marth
24. Luigi
25. Falco
26. Captain Falcon
27. Lucario
28. R.O.B.
29. Ganondorf
30. Jigglypuff
31. Toon Link
32. Snake
33. Sonic
34. Wolf
35. Mr Game & Watch
Newcomers
1. Bowser Jr./Shadow Mario
2. MegamanX
3. Zero
4. Shadow
5. Claus
6. Travis Touchdown- Suda 51 wants him in
7. 5th Gen Pokemon
8. Vaati
9. Lyn
10. Mewtwo
11. Roy
12. Micaiah
13. Samurai Goroh
14. Waluigi
15. Krystal
16. Little Mac
17. Tails
18. Grey Fox
19. Dixie Kong
20. King K Rool
21. Geno
22. Paper Mario
23. Issac
24. Viewtiful Joe
25. Sothe
26. Black Shadow
27. Black Knight
28. Saki
29. Zant
30. Knuckles

 

[DarthMaul]

^You're Wrong

This is who will be in

Luigi
Peach
Bowser
DK
Diddy
Wario
Yoshi
Link
Sheik
Ganondorf
Toon Zelda
Luigi
Donkey Kong
Olimar
Meta Knight
Galactia Knight
King Dedede
Kirby
Zero Suit samus
Pit
Ice Climbers
Mr. Game & Watch
Fox
Falcon
Panther
Captain Falco
Samurai Goroh
Deathborn
Marth
Roy
Snake
Sonic
Silver
Gray Fox
Poo
Darth Maul
Yoda
Ridley
Luigi
Darth Vader
Chewbacca
Greedo
Greed
Jabba the Hutt
Han Solo
Emperor Palpatine
Count Dookou
The Count

 

[Kholdstare]

2. MegamanX
3. Zero
4. Shadow
5. Claus
6. Travis Touchdown- Suda 51 wants him in
9. Lyn
10. Mewtwo
11. Roy
12. Micaiah
14. Waluigi
15. Krystal
17. Tails
18. Grey Fox
19. Dixie Kong
21. Geno
22. Paper Mario
24. Viewtiful Joe
25. Sothe
26. Black Shadow
27. Black Knight
28. Saki
29. Zant
30. Knuckles

N o.

 

[Spydr Enzo]

You're all wrong. This is what I see...

MARIO
-Mario
-Luigi
-Peach
-Bowser
-Bowser Jr.

DONKEY KONG
-Donkey Kong
-Diddy Kong
-Dixie Kong

LEGEND OF ZELDA
-Link
-Zelda/Sheik
-Ganondorf
-Toon Link
-Toon Zelda

METROID
-Samus/Zero Suit Samus

YOSHI
-Yoshi

KIRBY
-Kirby
-Meta Knight
-King Dedede

STARFOX
-Fox
-Falco
-Wolf
-Krystal

POKEMON
-Pikachu
-Jigglypuff
-Pokemon Trainer
-Lucario
-(5th-generation Pokemon)

F-ZERO
-Captain Falcon
-Samurai Goroh

MOTHER/EARTHBOUND
-Ness
-Lucas

FIRE EMBLEM
-Marth
-Ike
-(New Fire Emblem Character)

WARIOWARE
-Wario

PIKMIN
-Olimar

NEW SERIES
-Isaac
-Ray Mk III

RETRO SERIES
-Ice Climbers
-Pit
-R.O.B.
-Mr. Game & Watch
-Little Mac
-Balloon Fighter (placeholder for random retro character)

THIRD PARTY SERIES
-Sonic
-Snake
-Megaman



This roster contains a total of 47 characters, 51 if you include transformations. There are 12 newcomers total. I believe these characters are most likely to appear in the next Smash game, but that doesn't mean they aren't debatable. What do you guys think about it?

By the way, the New Fire Emblem character is because I really don't know much about the series, and there is a chance of a viable candidate appearing in a new game. If this was not the case however, we could probably see Lyn or Micaiah instead. The Balloon Fighter is there just because we usually get two new retro characters. One will most likely be Little Mac, the other can be something totally unexpeced. Balloon Fighter is just a place holder.

Questions? Comments? Concerns?

 

[lordvaati]

I made a thread about a theory involving the next Smash I had.

http://http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=9495329#post9495329

on a side note, anyone know if that Heracles game is a new IP by Nintendo?

 

[It's a forum]

We know Sakurai hates huge rosters.

Personally I think we pretty much already know what's gonna be included in SSB4. All that "extra data" is probably hinting at more Wario costume scenarios. Don't expect a slot for "Toon Zelda", rather just a new model.

Wolf and Ness are probably gone IMO, both turning into costumes...maybe.
I do believe that alternate SFXs per costume are a possibility, so all the Ness fans don't have to deal with wimpy Lucas' voice.

It's gonna be like texture hacks, same moveset, only different models and SFX.

As for *NEW* characters, pretty much everything everyone else is thinking (Bowser Jr with Koopa Kids costumes, Megaman with Zero costume, Issac with Felix costume, etc.)

---
I would love a way to give P1 exclusive control over game settings, or at least make it an option.

And a unlockable "Manly Mode" at the start screen would be great. Press "Z" to instantly start a 1v1, 4 Stock, no items, Final Destination, Fox only match. Giving it Melee gameplay would be funny, but not required.

 

[MattC13]

What I expect to see is better online play. To be honest, the online in Brawl was just sad.

Also, I don't think there is going to be any real clones in the next game. Maybe part-clones, but no full ones.

Also, no Toon Link. Or any clone Link.

 

[Jerome]

Wolf and Ness are probably gone IMO, both turning into costumes...maybe.
I do believe that alternate SFXs per costume are a possibility, so all the Ness fans don't have to deal with wimpy Lucas' voice.

Ness is part of the O12. So he is probably not going to be cut. Wolf might be cut but I think that wouldn't be a good idea because Smash lacks villians. Instead of getting rid of a villian Nintendo needs to add more villians like King Krool and Ridley.

 

[Gallowglass]

Can we talk about something else besides character rosters?

Look here's my blog on SSB4 characters. It's about 7 pages on microsoft word.
http://www.smashboards.com/news/blogs/165266/3046/ssb4-character-ideas

Let's talk about Stadium, adventure mode, Level editor, trophies/stickers, special brawl, camera modes.

Hell if you really want to talk about characters lets at least talk about assist trophies, and bosses.

 

[Big-Cat]

Unfortunately, one way or another, it ends up involving characters.

 

[WolfCypher]

Next Pokémon rep for future SSB game...

 

[Shorts]

Next Pokémon rep for future SSB game...

FWAHAHAHAH!???!?!?!?!? :D
whats thiiiiiiss!?!??!
explain PLEASE!

 

[WolfCypher]

A teaser to the 1st revealed 5th Gen Pokémon. Nothing else is known of it, but it'll probably be the 5th Gen spokesperson Pokémon as Lucario was to the 4th Gen, i.e., it'll have a chance of representing SSB4's "New Pokémon" rep.

 

[Shorts]

A teaser to the 1st revealed 5th Gen Pokémon. Nothing else is known of it, but it'll probably be the 5th Gen spokesperson Pokémon as Lucario was to the 4th Gen, i.e., it'll have a chance of representing SSB4's "New Pokémon" rep.

Well im REALLY excited, i mean think about it. This new pokemon game is coming out this year, its been under wraps for probably a year or two, who knows whats goin on with ssb4! Im happy!
pkmn fan

 

[Arcadenik]

Next Pokémon rep for future SSB game...

A teaser to the 1st revealed 5th Gen Pokémon. Nothing else is known of it, but it'll probably be the 5th Gen spokesperson Pokémon as Lucario was to the 4th Gen, i.e., it'll have a chance of representing SSB4's "New Pokémon" rep.

Well im REALLY excited, i mean think about it. This new pokemon game is coming out this year, its been under wraps for probably a year or two, who knows whats goin on with ssb4! Im happy!
pkmn fan

In reponse to these three posts...

Let's wait and see if this Pokemon ends up being the star of a future Pokemon movie before we can determine how likely this Pokemon would be playable in the next Smash game. Remember, Munchlax was the first 4th gen Pokemon revealed yet it ended up in a Pokeball while Lucario was the second 4th gen Pokemon revealed yet it ended up as a playable character. Why? It could be related to the first 4th gen Pokemon movie starring Lucario that came out at around the time Sakurai was planning Brawl's roster.

This one is for the third post...

If Sakurai is really planning a SSB4 roster right now but there is no 5th gen Pokemon movie starring this Pokemon, I doubt this first 5th gen Pokemon would be playable. If there is a 5th gen Pokemon movie starring this Pokemon but Sakurai is not planning a SSB4 roster, I don't think this first 5th gen Pokemon would be playable.

In my opinion, you got to look out for what is going on with the Pokemon media, not Pokemon games, when it comes to determining the Pokemon roster in Smash.

Pikachu - mascot of the whole Pokemon franchise, star of the Pokemon anime
Jigglypuff - popular Pokemon at the time of her inclusion, used to appear a lot in the Kanto and Orange Islands episodes of the Pokemon anime at the time of her inclusion
Mewtwo - star of the first 1st gen Pokemon movie at the time of his inclusion
Pichu - star of several Pichu shorts at the time of his inclusion, but mainly added as a clone filler for Melee
Pokemon Trainer (or to be specific, the original 1st gen protagonist Red) - the only exception to this rule as he was from the games but he was most likely chosen for his best-known Pokemon, the original 1st gen starters
Charizard - most likely chosen over the other forms since Charizard was very popular and appeared in the Pokemon anime more often than the other forms
Squirtle - most likely chosen over the forms since Squirtle was very popular and appeared in the Pokemon anime more often than the other forms (and we already have a 3rd stage form Charizard, so no Blastoise)
Ivysaur - gets in by default as the 2nd stage form since we already have a 3rd stage form (Charizard, no Venusaur) and a 1st stage form (Squirtle, no Bulbasaur) even though Bulbasaur and Venusaur were more popular and Bulbasaur appeared more often than the other forms in the Pokemon anime
Lucario - star of the first 4th gen Pokemon movie at the time of his inclusion (at that time when Sakurai was planning the Brawl roster)

 

[WolfCypher]

Excellent points you have there. I only jumped the gun because that's all this thread is filled with...speculation and guesswork. So that was my contribution.

Here's even more guessing on my behalf; I get a vibe that this mystery Pokémon will play the same role media-wise as Lucario did: overexposure in the games of that generation, merchandising, manga, and a major role in at least one movie (that's released before the games). It may just as well be the 5th Gen Lucario (read: it'll be hyped for Gen V as Lucario was for Gen IV).

 

[Spydr Enzo]

Arcadenik is right about Pokemon appearances in the media. Characters like Lucario and Mewtwo got their own movies, and therefore, the popularity and familiarity of their characters was increased a lot. Those are two qualities that Sakurai needs to look for when choosing a character. Will people recognize this character? Is this a popular character that would increase the number of potential smash fans?

This mystery pokemon may be the star of the 5th gen, but we can't say that for sure yet. Nevertheless, I'm sure we will get a fifth generation Pokemon star in SSB4.

 

[Gallowglass]

Arcadenik is right about Pokemon appearances in the media. Characters like Lucario and Mewtwo got their own movies, and therefore, the popularity and familiarity of their characters was increased a lot. Those are two qualities that Sakurai needs to look for when choosing a character. Will people recognize this character? Is this a popular character that would increase the number of potential smash fans?

This mystery pokemon may be the star of the 5th gen, but we can't say that for sure yet. Nevertheless, I'm sure we will get a fifth generation Pokemon star in SSB4.

Do you think it's the media that brought popularity or that their popularity is what brought them to shine in other media and games. I'm only a first gen so I can't talk about Lucario but Mewtwo was an epic pokemon in Red/Blue. Psychic type and knew rare and powerful moves like recover. They made a movie about him because he was well liked and had more backstory then any pokemon in the game.

 

[DekuBoy]

I would love to see all the Pokemon reps in SSB4 (except Pichu). This guy looks kinda canine to me so I would say Lucario's screwed.

 

[Jerome]

Next Pokémon rep for future SSB game...

[/Q

If this becomes the new popular Pokemon then I think this will really hurt Mewtwo's chance of becoming playable again. Hopefully, they will just make Mewtwo a boss. IMO, I think this could be the evolved form of Lucario because the body of this mystery Pokemon is a little similar to Lucario's body. I'm not sure though.

 

[Big-Cat]

That's what I noticed as well. It has a similar build to Lucario.

 

[Spydr Enzo]

Do you think it's the media that brought popularity or that their popularity is what brought them to shine in other media and games. I'm only a first gen so I can't talk about Lucario but Mewtwo was an epic pokemon in Red/Blue. Psychic type and knew rare and powerful moves like recover. They made a movie about him because he was well liked and had more backstory then any pokemon in the game.

I never said the games had nothing to do with it... All I'm saying is that when a movie is made about a specific Pokemon (Mewtwo, Lucario), it REALLY increases their chances because it makes them both more recognizable and more familiar.

I would love to see all the Pokemon reps in SSB4 (except Pichu). This guy looks kinda canine to me so I would say Lucario's screwed.

Not necessarily. Even if he was canine, his structure is still somewhat different, although I can see the similarity. He could have different physics (could be heavier, faster, smaller, or slower than Lucario) and potentially has a moveset that greatly differs from Lucario. I'd say the chances of getting 5 slots for the "Big Three Series" (Mario, Pokemon, Zelda) are pretty high, so this guy could get in along with the rest of the Pokemon representatives from Brawl.

If this becomes the new popular Pokemon then I think this will really hurt Mewtwo's chance of becoming playable again. Hopefully, they will just make Mewtwo a boss. IMO, I think this could be the evolved form of Lucario because the body of this mystery Pokemon is a little similar to Lucario's body. I'm not sure though.

Mewtwo's chances were hurt form the moment he was cut from Brawl and Lucario (or the Pokemon Trainer) took his place. There was only enough time to max the number of slots at four, and having five for Pokemon while only four for Mario and Zelda would have been a bit strange. Lucario, being the new Pokemon, was chosen over Mewtwo and Pichu in an effort for Smash to keep up with teh series.

Now that we can actually expect an increased number of slots (most likely 5), we can safely assume that Lucario will stay along with a new Pokemon. But Mewtwo, sorry guys. Not going to happen. He had no chance of returning from the moment he was cut.

 

[ElPanandero]

Why wouldn't lucario be booted. If this 5th generation is out then Mewtwo and Lucario are both old news and Mewtwo is classic while Lucario is just old. The only thing keeping Lucario was being the face of the 4th gen which is irrelevant by the 5th generation.

1st Gen= Classic- Reps

2-4= Old, mediocre, meh- no reps

5th= New/Exciting- Rep

 

[Spydr Enzo]

Why wouldn't lucario be booted. If this 5th generation is out then Mewtwo and Lucario are both old news and Mewtwo is classic while Lucario is just old. The only thing keeping Lucario was being the face of the 4th gen which is irrelevant by the 5th generation.

1st Gen= Classic- Reps

2-4= Old, mediocre, meh- no reps

5th= New/Exciting- Rep

We're most likely going to see five reps for each of the "Big Three Series" this time around, I'm extremely confident of this. If we do, Lucario can stay and a 5th-generation Pokemon will take up the 5th slot. The only reason Mewtwo was cut was because the umber of max slots from Melee to Brawl stayed at four.

I really believe there will be an increased number of slots. Mario, Pokemon, and Zelda are all very deserving of it. Mario could use some new faces, and I'm sure the developers would agree. But who would you cut? Definitely not Mario. Bowser? Peach? Luigi? They've all been around for so long and are all important to the series, the only other thing to do would be to add a slot. If you add a slot, why not do it for Zelda and Pokemon, who are deserving as well?

The only way Lucario would get cut is if a fifth generation pokemon (the "spokespokemon" of the generation) and another popular new Pokemon/pokemon character is added. If that happens, then you could say that Lucario will get cut. But I don't think that will happen.

 

[ElPanandero]

Ok I agree with all of the big three getting 5, and I never said anything about cutting any mario characters...

My "numbers list" was the quality of each generation

The 5 Pokemon will be:

Trainer
Pikachu
Jigglypuff
New 5th guy
Mewtwo

Lucario gets cut for Mewtwo because he is no longer new and will not be the popular choice because of the new pokemon. Mewtwo is part of generation 1 which is the most popular and iconic of the series and generation 4 is nothing special compared to the the other 3

 

[Big-Cat]

Not only that, but there was the massive backlash for taking out Mewtwo in the first place. Also, there's nothing proving most recent gen=spot on roster.

 

[ElPanandero]

Not only that, but there was the massive backlash for taking out Mewtwo in the first place. Also, there's nothing proving most recent gen=spot on roster.

Well its been pretty consistent

SSB- Pika/Jiggz First Gen

Melee- Pichu- 2nd

Brawl- Lucario- 4th


All had the most recent generation repped...

 

[Gallowglass]

I think if they're going to use a 5th gen pokemon then they should use a quadroped (like Arcainine, Entei) because that would be a very new style character. It would be like having wolf link but in pokemon form. The only true four-legger was Ivysaur and he wasn't much for mobility.

 

[Big-Cat]

I probably should have said the opposite where an older one can get in considering that Mewtwo and especially Pokemon Trainer have upset this pattern.

Also, Pichu was designed as a (poorly thought out) joke character that was a clone. You could say he doesn't count. Also, there was only one gen back when SSB came out so that's irrelevant.

 

[ElPanandero]

Well Theoretically unless 5th generation is a flop it will be the most popular generation when SSB4 comes out and because it is more popular it will get repped. And Lucario will be removed by being not specifically being popular (being overshadowed by most lilkey: The new starters, the "lucario" of the 5h gen" and potentially a few others