[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

[Hero Dude]

No. That idea was good with Pokemon Trainer, but lets not overuse it.

Not with Kid Link, Pokemon Trainer, and Infantry.

Although only one of those will be in, and thats Pkmn Trainer.

 

[Yung Mei]

well i think they should put more female characters in it. its been a sausage fest since the first one. in total only like what 4 female characters have been in (transforming characters dont count as two, only 1) SSB



anyways, my dream character or w.e would totally be ridley, Dark Samus, or even a space pirate

 

[n88]

Gender is not a goood criteria for adding characters. Ridley does have a good chance of making it in, though, seeing as how he's one of the top three most requested characters.

 

[Big-Cat]

No. That idea was good with Pokemon Trainer, but lets not overuse it.

Not with Kid Link, Pokemon Trainer, and Infantry.

Although only one of those will be in, and thats Pkmn Trainer.

I don't see anything wrong with more than one Pokemon Trainer type character if it makes sense. For example, I'd love to see Green (Blue in Japan) with Pichu, Jigglypuff, and Gardevoir. The same goes for transforming characters. Personally, I'd prefer to see Samus and Zamus like Zelda/Sheik.

Regarding this whole Fire Emblem thing, I think we're looking at this the wrong way. Do I think recentness has a role? Yes, but so does popularity. From what I recall, FE8 wasn't all that popular, but FE7 and the Radiant arc are.

 

[n88]

@Kuma

I would hate to see Samus/ZSS like Zelda/Sheik. As is, they're more unique, plus it allows Samus to keep her Morph Ball.

Kinda clueless about FireEmblem. I miss Roy.

 

[ShinoandtheBallonFighter]

I really dislike the whole "unique" aspect of most smashers outlook. While I don't if Samus transforms or not, I really don't see anything wrong with adding more characters that would fit best with a transforming/ duo aspect.
Let's say for the sake of this arguement that Advanced Wars needs to be in Smash. If the best option is a transforming PT style tem of units they shoudn't get the shaft because "someone already can do that"

Should we not ahve any more sword weilders, because they weild swords? No more fist fighters because the roster is loaded with them? No. Just because there are less of a particular archtype of fighter does not mean that they should be preserved for the sake of them being different.

 

[Big-Cat]

@Kuma

I would hate to see Samus/ZSS like Zelda/Sheik. As is, they're more unique, plus it allows Samus to keep her Morph Ball.

Kinda clueless about FireEmblem. I miss Roy.

Who said it would be her Down B? Like the Ganondorf idea drag0nscythe proposed, Samus goes in and out of the armor via a taunt.

 

[n88]

@Shino

Yes, but making Character X work the same way as Character Y when it's logical and feasible for them to work in a new way is kinda stupid/lazy.

EDIT: @Kuma

You did say "like Zelda/Sheik". I assumed you meant via the Down Special. Technically, Samus can change to ZSS by taunting. I suppose I wouldn't mind seeing that made easier and so that it can work both ways.

 

[ShinoandtheBallonFighter]

@Shino

Yes, but making Character X work the same way as Character Y when it's logical and feasible for them to work in a new way is kinda stupid/lazy.

EDIT: @Kuma

You did say "like Zelda/Sheik". I assumed you meant via the Down Special. Technically, Samus can change to ZSS by taunting. I suppose I wouldn't mind seeing that made easier and so that it can work both ways.

But Kicking Character X out because he would take away from Character Y's uniquities is stupid too. I am not saying that Samus/ZSS should switch (I could care less about them specifically)

 

[Hero Dude]

No, What i meant was lets not overuse the idea. It was a good one, like Ice Climbers, but lets not have four partner characters.

I imagen Kamek on his broom the whole time. The Yoshi/Babies idea was just a way to have all the baby characters in the game.

 

[n88]

@Shino

Yes, but making Samus/ZSS switch exactly like Zelda/Sheik would be a case of altering Character X to be more similar to Character Y which would be stupid and a waste of time, as characters don't need to be made the same.

 

[ToiseOfChoice]

Regarding this whole Fire Emblem thing, I think we're looking at this the wrong way. Do I think recentness has a role? Yes, but so does popularity. From what I recall, FE8 wasn't all that popular, but FE7 and the Radiant arc are.

Out of fairness, Roy had zero popularity before Melee and Ike had about a month or two in Japan before Sakurai picked him for Brawl. Sakurai might've been aware of FE7 and FE10 though (was a Sacred Stones sequel ever considered before PoR started development?), that might've helped influence his decision.

 

[ShinoandtheBallonFighter]

@Shino

Yes, but making Samus/ZSS switch exactly like Zelda/Sheik would be a case of altering Character X to be more similar to Character Y which would be stupid and a waste of time, as characters don't need to be made the same.

...I just said it doesn't have to be Samus per se. But there are other characters that lose popularity they would othersie have due to people wanting Zeik, PT, IC's etc. to be the only of their kind which is a stupid regard

 

[Pieman0920]

Out of fairness, Roy had zero popularity before Melee and Ike had about a month or two in Japan before Sakurai picked him for Brawl. Sakurai might've been aware of FE7 and FE10 though (was a Sacred Stones sequel ever considered before PoR started development?), that might've helped influence his decision.

FE9 had more lose ends to fill up, unlike FE8, so it would sort of make sense to assume it would have a sequel. It was probably planned from the begining to be a two part thing, while FE8 was supposed to be stand alone.

 

[ToiseOfChoice]

Oh definitely, there's tons of forward references to RD in PoR too (Lyre's name pops up in a Lethe/Ranulf support and I'm pretty sure there's unused data that reveals the Black Knight's identity).

FE6 didn't have any of that though, so it's pretty clear that Sakurai just said "well, he's new, hope they like him!"

 

[Pieman0920]

Well to be fair, FE6 didn't actually get a sequel, it got a prequel, and there was quite a bit of backstory they set up there for it to happen.

...Though even so, the game hadn't even come out, and I don't think Sakurai would have gotten his hands on the game at the time so he may not have known that anyways. Rumor says that the upper management at Nintendo forced him into including Roy, which actually isn't that unbelievable, considering that the character was a literal unknown. Plus, if you go by the data, Roy was originally just programmed in there as "EMBLEM" which probably meant that when it was decided that he would get in, they didn't even know his name.

 

[ToiseOfChoice]

Yeah, but the only thing I can remember off the top of my head that FE6 references is Pent's name in some of the supports with Klein or Clarine (and Louise is only known as "his wife").


Anyway back to the main point, if popularity mattered in selecting FE characters, I'm sure we would've seen anyone BUT Roy and Ike.

 

[ShinoandtheBallonFighter]

Well Ike was popular, wasn't he?

 

[Pieman0920]

In the time leading up to, and before his announcement in Brawl, Ike was fairly popular. The problem is that we can only assume that his first game was taken into consideration, given the time that Sakurai finalized the roster. (Not including Sonic, this was supposed to be around E3 2005) At that time, Ike would have been a fairly recent character and I'm not quite sure if he would have been confirmed or not for a American release. The point is that his game would have been out for less than a year.

Still, Ike certainly had more popularity than Roy was at their respective times of roster finalization, due to it being hard to be popular when you don't exist. In spite of that, for SSB4 we have at least two series (FE and Pokemon) where the most popular character is only hypothetical and we have no idea what they are like. Thus popularity may not be that big of a deal when it comes to Fire Emblem, but rather being in the right place at the right time.

 

[NxtGenFalco93]

i say makeing custom colors an option in the game (no more hacking for textures) and make a site for people to post theirs for download wile playing the game. there i contributed without talking about new charecters.

 

[Paper Mario Master]

Ike was/is popular, or at least I think he was/is.
anyone that had played PoR liked him I guess, RD wasn't a factor for Brawl, I'm pretty sure.
There are a lot of PoR RD characters that are popular to FE players, aren't there?

Roy NOW has popularity, I don't really care for him but I don't think there will be Mewtwo w/o Roy, and I don't know about you guys but I want Mewtwo back.

I don't think there's anything I'm forgetting.....

 

[ToiseOfChoice]

To give you an idea, Ike's game came out in April 2005. E3 was in May. This was only in Japan (we didn't get the game until Fall that year) and it had only sold around 140k copies in four weeks, the weakest debut of any FE to date short of RD.

Not a definite means of measuring popularity, but it's pretty doubtful he was anything near other FE characters when he got in.

 

[ShinoandtheBallonFighter]

Ike was/is popular, or at least I think he was/is.
anyone that had played PoR liked him I guess, RD wasn't a factor for Brawl, I'm pretty sure.
There are a lot of PoR RD characters that are popular to FE players, aren't there?

Roy NOW has popularity, I don't really care for him but I don't think there will be Mewtwo w/o Roy, and I don't know about you guys but I want Mewtwo back.

I don't think there's anything I'm forgetting.....

I don' think those characters really matter, because every person has characters they like, and can completely ignore others, like pokemon, leaving individual fan popularity less impactual than in other games where characters are nessecary to play as or interact with (Kirby series for example). Where Lords are mandatory to play as making them at least known to fans of the series, and usually the lords are given good stats (Ike's a tank) making them well liked and used (Where Michaia is a pain to use effectively or reliably except for killing Generals)

 

[Hero Dude]

Ike is not going to be removed. Nobody was supposed to be removed from Brawl. (With the exception of kid link, who got a replacement.) Alot of people like Ike, and if he were to be removed it would cause the same kind of contreversy that we got when we removed Roy. If Sakurai knows this, he won't remove Ike.
I like to think this goes for every other character too.

 

[Paper Mario Master]

I don' think those characters really matter, because every person has characters they like, and can completely ignore others, like pokemon, leaving individual fan popularity less impactual than in other games where characters are nessecary to play as or interact with (Kirby series for example). Where Lords are mandatory to play as making them at least known to fans of the series, and usually the lords are given good stats (Ike's a tank) making them well liked and used (Where Michaia is a pain to use effectively or reliably except for killing Generals)

Yeah I know........Micaiah is still insanely important. I say she is one of the closest to getting in.

@ Hero Dude:
He is my main, fav Brawl character, and an Awesome FE character

 

[Hero Dude]

Miciah is def. one of the contenders, but if a new FE comes out, don't be suprised if the lord from that game gets in before her.

 

[Paper Mario Master]

IF a new FE comes out, there probably will be but I hope it's another 3-D one.

Well that way could it be:

Marth
Ike
*New Guy*
Micaiah?

 

[Hero Dude]

I doubt FE will get more than three reps. I would rather a differant chracter than Miciah anyway.

 

[Finman702]

IF a new FE comes out, there probably will be but I hope it's another 3-D one.

Well that way could it be:

Marth
Ike
*New Guy*
Micaiah?

4 FE reps? I wouldn't get my hopes up... MAYBE three. But I think it will stay at 2. But only time will tell.

 

[Hero Dude]

No, 2 isn't enough. We just agreed that they weren't going to remove Ike, and they def. won't remove Marth. I think I am right when I say that there will be atleast one more FE game out in the next five years, and thats closer to when SSB4 will come out.

 

[n88]

Possiblities for FE are probably:

Marth, Ike
Marth, Ike, Roy
Marth, Ike, New Guy

But that's based on what other people (Mostly Toise) are saying, not my own opinion. I've never played an FE game in my life, so I'm not one to ask.

 

[Paper Mario Master]

I say FE is fine w/ 4 reps but whatever.

besides a newbie who else would you suggest instead of Micaiah?
Nobody right? She is the most likely right NOW. Not counting new FE, I say she should get in before Roy

 

[Hero Dude]

Same here, but I know alot about games.

Marth, Ike, New Guy

This^

Wait, I have played Shadow Dragon. They released it for DS, and I bought it.

@Paper Mario Dude: Yeah, like if it were to be released like tommorow, miciah would get in.

 

[n88]

I say FE is fine w/ 4 reps but whatever.

besides a newbie who else would you suggest instead of Micaiah?
Nobody right? She is the most likely right NOW. Not counting new FE, I say she should get in before Roy

Roy>Any existing FE character not already in Smash. Because his Melee appearance granted him massive exposure that no other FE character has had. Melee sold 7 Million copies vs. Fire Emblem's 6 million for the entire franchise.

 

[Dido]

I hope all the characters are equally balanced.....

 

[Paper Mario Master]

Roy>Any existing FE character not already in Smash. Because his Melee appearance granted him massive exposure that no other FE character has had. Melee sold 7 Million copies vs. Fire Emblem's 6 million for the entire franchise.

Sales again? what has that ever proved?

Roy has massive pop, I so does Ridley.......he's not in.....

 

[Hero Dude]

Look, ARE YOU READING MY POSTS?

Dixie kong
Plusle and Minun
Toon Zelda/Toon Sheik
Roy
Mewtwo
Dr.Mario

Data for these Characters where found on the Brawl Disc. If Sakurai had his way, Nobody would've been cut.

(I think I am missing one)

 

[ShinoandtheBallonFighter]

Roy>Any existing FE character not already in Smash. Because his Melee appearance granted him massive exposure that no other FE character has had. Melee sold 7 Million copies vs. Fire Emblem's 6 million for the entire franchise.

As much as I hate to admit it, Roy's appearence In Melee trumps any other unit espcially Mica (I'm done trying to spell her name). And Hero can you explain why you think Mica's so important (outside of her story role?)

 

[Hero Dude]

I never said she was important. I don't even like her. She is just one of the characters that could get in. Roy would get in waaay before she would.

 

[ShinoandtheBallonFighter]

Then explain why she is likely, outsid eher story importance.