Official MBR Tier List

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

Roy is far from the worst. he has like the best d-tilt in the whole game. it sets up so much it's nuts, he has marth like movement which is really good, good edge gaurd, good throws, and has the 2nd best rnge in the game not counting his sourspot I think he may have like 7th best range or so. Really find out about seth or neo they are amazing roy also has pretty good combo not nearly as good as marth but he can rack up a fair amount of damage.

Really if anything you should be argueing him to he a spot or 2 higher.

also with movement that good no matter how carpy the attacks he should be bottom.

 

[Ocho(*8*)]

Can someone link me to the thread with the discussion of the new stagelist created by the MBR?

its a sticky in tournament discussion i believe.. (too lazy for the link lol)

 

[XIF]

Just a question, but aren't most other FG communities' tier lists based solely on tournament results?

If that were true, SF4 Sagat would be mid tier at best after Final Round last year.

 

[Sasha]

so really it should be tailored to our game. Which should be a representative tier list with tournament resulsts weighing in a heavy factor. because a sheik will never run into a pichu, ness, or kirby of tournament worth at any tournament.

Pichu: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1BJcdrKAbk

Kirby: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6fYkTakTDY

Can't find any of Ness.

Chu Dat's my hero.

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

I cried during the pichu match the last time I saw it I like how things value increase as time passes.

really it you won't see many if any pichu, nesses, or kirby in touraments which that would just be nuts. Being good vs them isn't worth much.

Really on pichu's part I would agrue that's it's impossible for him to havve a good match-up but it should be impossible for him to hit ANYONE. everyone outranges him

 

[`DNS`]

I cried during the pichu match the last time I saw it I like how things value increase as time passes.

really it you won't see many if any pichu, nesses, or kirby in touraments which that would just be nuts. Being good vs them isn't worth much.

Really on pichu's part I would agrue that's it's impossible for him to havve a good match-up but it should be impossible for him to hit ANYONE. everyone outranges him

next match was on FD and he won that too

 

[MarthPwnzer-]

LOL Marth 2nd???

Marth has only 1 or 2 bad matchups Shiek and Falcon. Even then falcon can be contained easily as you can **** over his ground game if your smart. After that its just edge guard and win. Marth ****s over Fox easy with grabs and a easy edge game. Marth loses to shiek. Shiek is obviously the best character because she gays everyone. Another reason why fox is not number one is because no fox has the consistency to win match after match because after awhile the player tends to get sloppy after 1 day of playing fox every match, let alone a two day tournament.

 

[ETWIST51294]

Marth does not **** all over Fox, Fox can pew pew remember? It's even. There's no way in **** Sheiks number 1.

 

[Grimmspada]

Marth's grabs on spacies do a lot of damage, but a lot of the time its hard for Marth to get the kill with good DI from the spacies. Even with the percent damage, it gets hard for Marth to combo people when they get to high percents. Technical spacies are ridiculously hard for Marth. Fox is more consistent than Marth imo, but it depends on the player obviously.

 

[Sasha]

Fox is more consistent than fox imo, but it depends on the player obviously.

I lol'd.

10lols

 

[Grimmspada]

lol whoops, fixed haha

 

[cubaisdeath]

Kirby below ness? lol.. ness should be second to last above pichu IMO
After playing with ness so much on ssb64, ness is absolute garbage on melee, I'm surprised he isn't in the bottom 3... His pk thunder recovery range is horrible, dair is fail, yo-yos are kinda useless, pk flash is just stupid... only thing he's got going in melee is his fair.

lol, ness sucks in that game too

 

[ETWIST51294]

Ness is nowhere near as bad as Kirby >_>

He can actually combo, remember?

 

[x After Dawn x]

"nowhere as bad?"

lol, they're both part of the worst 5 characters in the game. >_>

 

[ETWIST51294]

I can't see Kirby touching Ness.

I'm mad bias >_>

I you gotta problem $15 MM Ness vs Kirby Bo5 FD only.

 

[MarioMariox2]

I can't see Kirby touching Ness.

I'm mad bias >_>

I you gotta problem $15 MM Ness vs Kirby Bo5 FD only.

SSB64 Ness can't touch Kirby.

 

[Scidadle]

No Ness is way better than kirby.

Well, they both suck

but ness is better

@Cubaisdeath: awesome signature

@Marth gets beat by falcon. No it's a fair matchup

@Shiek being best in the game. No fox has no bad matchups and shiek has one which is fox.

@Marth ****ting on fox. No, he does have a really nice chaingrab but a smart fox player won't get grabbed. Sure his ledge game is easy vs fox, but thats the character not the matchup. His ledgegame is good vs like... every character. Shiek does dirty things to marth but fox beats shiek soooo he shouldn't be higher than either of them IMO.

The top tiers in my opinion should be as followed

Fox
Shiek
Falco
Marth
Jiggs

As for bottom tier

Ness
Yoshi
Bowser
Kirby
Pichu

With mewtwo being at bottom of low. I think the bottom tier is pretty accurate

 

[Stev]

Shiek does dirty things to marth but fox beats shiek soooo he shouldn't be higher than either of them IMO.

The top tiers in my opinion should be as followed

Fox
Shiek
Falco
Marth
Jiggs

Falco > sheik, easily

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

I disagree with the bottom tier for you Scidadle I don't think ness should be that high same for kirby.
Really kirby is way to high on the list it's a slap to the face to anyone who thinks that's right. Yes I know I when to far way to far.

But if the list was totally based on match-ups sheik for top pichu for bottom and ice climbers for mid of the whole list they have random bad match-ups. Also puff shouldn't move up but maybe down if it were based on match-ups

 

[Laijin]

Kirby should be no higher than last tier.
EVER.
He is literally the only character in the game who just sucks at everything. He has almost no options against pretty much every match up in the game. At least Mewtwo has a good match up against Sheik and Pichu can chain grab. What can Kirby do? Kirbycide? lol. we're not in 2003 man(we're not all noobs. :O)

 

[St. Viers]

^^this. when all a character can do is ducking WD-> d-tilt and space b-airs, it's not hard to fight him. I know I'm exaggerating, but not by much.

 

[X1-12]

to be fair her crouch can duck under almost every projectile

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

Yeah kirby's duck is amazing but he can't do a lot like puff can with her duck kirby can't duck and rest people. his punishment is lacking I geuss he could down-smash if someone misses a grab on him. Hey you can't forget to talk about his tilts he is the people where the tilts are all way better than their smash (sheik's up-smash and down-smash are pretty good).

In some ways kirby is like pichu people can say no you can't touch me, but at least pichu can dd to nair and he can keep up with his foes. At top speed of everyone I would say kirby is slower than a bowser on YS.

I want to compare their punishment game.
tech chaseing
pichu-can always keep up and jab reset F-smash I do it a lot it's the best F-smash knockback wise, and grab down-throw tech chase
kirby can keep up with many people and he could grab down-throw again.

missed rest
pichu side-B fully charged kills at 25% any stage even if she is in the middle of DL64. does 39%
kirby-up-smash? kills at I don't know but must be higher than 80% most likely 120%

they get grabbed
pichu chain throws, back-throw to edge gaurd, tech chase with down-throw(see tech chase above), up-throw dair on people like puff, down-throw up-smash shouldn't work but it does, f-throw to nair i've done a few times.

kirby-down-throw tech chase, throw them off and kirby dies they can shake out and let kirby kill himself.

edge gaurd goes to kirby I don't know how good kirby is at edge gaurding but he can have that.

 

[ETWIST51294]

SSB64 Ness can't touch Kirby.

I know this. >_>

to be fair her crouch can duck under almost every projectile

Kirby's a guy. Ness can still Fair the **** out of his crouch.

BTW Scidadle, Ness isn't better than Yoshi, he only has a better recovery and OoS game, everything else is out played by Yoshi.

 

[KirbyKaze]

When people start telling me Mewtwo is good against Sheik I raise eyebrows.

 

[MarioMariox2]

If the tier list would be based on matchups, then kirby would be higher than ness.

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

Wait what who said that? Maybe if sheik is handicapped to 1 on 2x damage I think then m2 would have a silght favor. Or maybe if the sheik player was blind. or used in a 3rd party controller with only 1 working button and the stick. Maybe if taj was the lowest level of m2 play and random sheik player was the max skill of sheik.

only cases m2 would have a silght favor.

 

[St. Viers]

^^you mean that if the tier list were based off of old, not really objective matchups that are debatable and not really set in stone, kirby would be higher than ness.

If that were the case, than shiek would be #1, as she has better matchups against low tier chars than fox does (not saying fox has bad matchups against low tier chars, just that shiek has enough better ones)

 

[The Good Doctor]

@Marth ****ting on fox. No, he does have a really nice chaingrab but a smart fox player won't get grabbed. Sure his ledge game is easy vs fox, but thats the character not the matchup. His ledgegame is good vs like... every character. Shiek does dirty things to marth but fox beats shiek soooo he shouldn't be higher than either of them IMO.

The top tiers in my opinion should be as followed

Fox
Shiek
Falco
Marth
Jiggs

As for bottom tier

Ness
Yoshi
Bowser
Kirby
Pichu

With mewtwo being at bottom of low. I think the bottom tier is pretty accurate

This isn't Super Theory Bros, Fox gets grabbed b/c of human error all the time. And I know Yoshi is far better than the rest of the company he keeps, this includes Ness and Mewtwo.

 

[MarioMariox2]

I think this argument was present on the 300s page range also? Repeat arguments, perhaps?

 

[Skye93]

That is a good list, i really didn't expect marth to be so high.
Also, didn't expect DK to be so high either.
I don't think I've ever played a DK user before.

 

[X1-12]

DK has a great grab game

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u99WmKGOGCs&feature=related

 

[Skye93]

WOW!
I have a whole new insight on DK now.
Amazing.....

 

[ryankam10]

BUM routinely zero to deaths space animals and falcon
i think DK just ***** fastfallers in general

 

[Faithkeeper]

i think DK just ***** fastfallers in general

IF he can grab them. And platforms can save them sometimes. Falco's lazers are pretty effective against DK as well. I'd definitely give falco the advantage in that matchup.

 

[Fletch]

BUM routinely zero to deaths space animals and falcon
i think DK just ***** fastfallers in general

DK would own fastfallers if he started every stock with them already grabbed. Too bad the fastfallers all that he can combo so well can avoid those grabs and have lots of good ways to camp DK.

 

[Oracle]

I'd say DK goes even at least with CF because his bair is great at helping to stop CF, one grab is a stock and you can easily escape his nair shield pressure with an OOS up B. Definitely disadvantage against falco because of gayzers and easy, easy dair gimps. Against fox is also disadvantage, but weaker, because of the lack of said gayzers.

^^you mean that if the tier list were based off of old, not really objective matchups that are debatable and not really set in stone, kirby would be higher than ness.

If that were the case, than shiek would be #1, as she has better matchups against low tier chars than fox does (not saying fox has bad matchups against low tier chars, just that shiek has enough better ones)

Tier list=/= matchups success. That would mean the first one would never have changed. The tier list reflects certain characters' viability and success in the current metagame. Thus, the bottom two tiers are essentially irrelevant, as bowser, ness, kirby, pichu, roy, zelda, etc. are never viable in any metagame.

 

[ETWIST51294]

It's not even. Falcon ***** DK every time he gets a hit. It's a slight disadvantage for DK.

 

[Fletch]

It's not even. Falcon ***** DK every time he gets a hit. It's a slight disadvantage for DK.

Agreed, Falcon is faster and should get hits more often, although they can both kind of **** each other once they get that first initial hit.

 

[St. Viers]

I'd say DK goes even at least with CF because his bair is great at helping to stop CF, one grab is a stock and you can easily escape his nair shield pressure with an OOS up B. Definitely disadvantage against falco because of gayzers and easy, easy dair gimps. Against fox is also disadvantage, but weaker, because of the lack of said gayzers.


Tier list=/= matchups success. That would mean the first one would never have changed. The tier list reflects certain characters' viability and success in the current metagame. Thus, the bottom two tiers are essentially irrelevant, as bowser, ness, kirby, pichu, roy, zelda, etc. are never viable in any metagame.

I know this---try looking at who I'm responding to, and what I'm actually saying...also, just because I'm tired and cranky, the changing metagame ends up changing character matchups, so the list wouldn't be the same now as it was in the beginning. It's made up of the votes by the people in the melee backroom, meaning it's a hodgepodge of tourney results, matchups, general impressions, and theorycraft, making it more useful than being based on any one criteria.