ShadowLink84
Smash Hero
YOU'RE TOO SLOW!
10char
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Sonic does better against snake? from what I've heard some snakes actually think yoshi has an advantage on snake (grabbing out of cypher, of course this rarely happens so I see it as irrevalant myself).He doesn't do too bad against Snake (once you learn how to deal with grenades anyway), but Metaknight is one of his worst matchups (along with Luigi). I wouldn't say he's doing well, but I certainly wouldn't consider him bottom tier. Mid low or high low tier sounds better, putting him above Yoshi and Jigglypuff. Having the surge of Snakes to get rid of some of the Metaknights could actually be considered benifitial to some of the lower tiered characters (who all get ***** by Metaknight, but tend to do better against Snake).
I also noticed that DanGR's tier list does not have a mid tier. Is there any particular reason you did that?
edit: Never mind the Sonic placement comment. Apparently I fail at reading comprehension. lol.
No, not really.sonic does well against snake?
yeah, there are a couple lower down chars that prove challenging for snake, another one i think is Samus.No, not really.
However, Snake's obvious advantages (grenade counter, tilt range, priority, blah blah blah) aren't as steep a wall in the matchup as you'd think. Rising aerials still hit Snake while keeping Sonic (or any character?? maybe) away from the bad grenade. Sonic likes shieldgrabbing landing lag, tech chasing, gimping, juggling, etc.
`.`; call me crazy but I have fun fighting Snake as Sonic. But Snake still holds the advantage lol.
edit:
Oh yeah. I don't play as Yoshi much, but is your grab release limited to an upwards/outwards trajectory?
Sonic's (and pretty much every other character's) grab release+pummel from the edge drops Snake down and easily sets up for a fsmash, footstool, B-air stage spike, or an insta grabgimp (grab Snake out of cypher and get hit at the same time- can be done before Snake can even airdodge, or if he does, he gimps himself xd) if the Snake is silly and tries to cypher back
Also, Yoshi can do that thing to Sonic, too. Grab either of them from their up-B's before they land from anywhere on the stage and you can just chain-release until they get to the edge and they get gimped :[
Tiers are not personal preference, who will always win, or who will be better in one hands than another. Tiers are, assuming the two players are of equal skill in a tournament settings, an average approximation of how well that character would do compared to every other character. Higher up characters, under equal skill and tournament settings, are already in a position to win easier. A bottom tier character CAN win a tournament, just it would normally take that character more effort than most higher tier characters.I dont follow this tier bull****, because "tiers" are obsolete in Brawl. I think everyone will end up having their own personal tiers, I mean I have about 8 characters that I rank in my own head based on how good I am with them. I use Lucario very well, whereas others try to put him on Low Tier...bring your high tier space animal against my Lucario, and the matchup wont be unbalanced in any way, unless I am playing the likes of Azen or something.
Wolf, lucas, ness, toon link, and mario should be higher.God:
Meta Knight
Not top. god tier. He is better than every character. He has no disadvantaged matchups and if anyone tells you otherwise, they're wrong. He and Snake skew the tourney results too much for me to consider tourney results. period.
High:
Snake
Mr. Game & Watch
Marth
Falco
R.O.B
King Dedede
Wario
Captain Olimar
Diddy Kong
Donkey Kong
Ice Climbers
Pikachu
Sheik/Zelda
Low: [no particuler order]
Kirby
Pit
Lucario
Toon Link
Peach
Wolf
Fox
Zero Suit Samus
Lucas
Ness
[no particular order]
Jigglypuff
Mario
Yoshi
Sonic
Ganondorf
Pokemon Trainer
Captain Falcon
Bowser
Ike
Samus
Link
You can flame me if you want. I don't really care.
My point exactly. Thanks.However, Snake's obvious advantages (grenade counter, tilt range, priority, blah blah blah) aren't as steep a wall in the matchup as you'd think. Rising aerials still hit Snake while keeping Sonic (or any character?? maybe) away from the bad grenade. Sonic likes shieldgrabbing landing lag, tech chasing, gimping, juggling, etc.
`.`; call me crazy but I have fun fighting Snake as Sonic. But Snake still holds the advantage lol.
Well, Sonic can still recover by just DIing towards the stage and footstool jumping off of Yoshi when he's edgehogging, because Sonic jumps out of the grab release as opposed to Snake who just falls.Also, Yoshi can do that thing to Sonic, too. Grab either of them from their up-B's before they land from anywhere on the stage and you can just chain-release until they get to the edge and they get gimped :[
I think it's character specific. Ness does the ground break while Metaknight does the jump break, ect. Characters with the ground break can also jump break if they press jump at the right time (provided they're not being pummeled), but I'm not sureif the reverse is true.edit:
Oh yeah. I don't play as Yoshi much, but is your grab release limited to an upwards/outwards trajectory?
Fixed 10 chars!!Also, MK is to overbalanced as Gdorf is to underbalanced.
As a matter of fact, here is my tier list.
TOP:
Metaknight
MIDDLE:
Everyone else
LOW:
Captain Falcon.
There ya go.
Why have a mid tier? I think everyone in my low tier are too close to rank and everyone in my high tier are too close to rank. If I had only top, high and, mid, it wouldn't make sense. There's no "average" b/c the average character lies in my low tier. Call it what you like. I'll edit my list to accompany this.I also noticed that DanGR's tier list does not have a mid tier. Is there any particular reason you did that?
Spaces represent gaps between sections of the tiers. I've added "no particuler order" notices as well. They mean there's no particular order among the characters that are listed before the next set of characters.
God:
Meta Knight
Not top. god tier. He is better than every character. He has no disadvantaged matchups and if anyone tells you otherwise, they're wrong. He and Snake skew the tourney results too much for me to consider tourney results. period.
High:
Snake
Mr. Game & Watch
Marth
Falco
R.O.B
King Dedede
[no particular order]
Wario
Captain Olimar
Diddy Kong
Donkey Kong
Mid: [no particuler order]
Ice Climbers
Pikachu
Sheik/Zelda
Toon Link
Wolf
Kirby
[no particuler order]
Pit
Lucario
Peach
Ness
Fox
Luigi
Zero Suit Samus
Lucas
Low: [no particuler order]
Jigglypuff
Mario (boss is high tier)
Yoshi
Sonic
Ganondorf
Pokemon Trainer
Captain Falcon
Bowser
Ike
Samus
Link
You can flame me if you want. I don't really care.
Read the boldyour comment
DDD isn't the fourth best character in the game. He's VERY tourney viable as a character though, seeing how horribly unbalanced he is. He's too reliable as a CP. He's either got the advantage 65/35 or he's got the disadvantage 65/35. It's stupid. >_>People not putting Dedede in at least 4th makes me sad.
Red=Should move down.All Comments are appreciated! Please respond!
A (U) beside a name means they could possibly move up on the list.
A (D) beside a name means they could possibly move down on the list.
An (N) beside the name means they could possibly move up or down on the list.
Top Tiers:
Snake (D)
Meta Knight (D)
Mr. Game & Watch (D)
Marth (D)
High Tiers:
King Dedede (N)
R.O.B (U)
Falco (N)
Wario (D)
Captain Olimar (D)
Lucario (N)
Upper Mid Tiers:
Pit (N)
Toon Link (D)
Donkey Kong (U)
Pikachu (N)
Wolf (N)
Fox (D)
Mid Mid Tiers:
Ice Climbers (N)
Zelda (U)
Diddy Kong (N)
Zero Suit Samus (D)
Ness (D)
Kirby (D)
Ike (N)
Low Mid Tiers:
Peach (D)
Lucas (D)
Sonic (U)
Luigi (N)
Sheik (U) (Seriously? Sheik's down B is her only killin move)
Squirtle (D)
Low Tiers:
Mario (N)
Ivysaur (N)
Samus (N)
Bowser (N)
Link (U)
Charizard (U)
Bottom Tiers:
Yoshi (U)
Jigglypuff (U)
Captain Falcon (U)
Ganondorf (U) (He deserves an individual tier lol)
imo best tier list I have seen so far.All Comments are appreciated! Please respond!
A (U) beside a name means they could possibly move up on the list.
A (D) beside a name means they could possibly move down on the list.
An (N) beside the name means they could possibly move up or down on the list.
Top Tiers:
Snake (D)
Meta Knight (D)
Mr. Game & Watch (D)
Marth (D)
High Tiers:
King Dedede (N)
R.O.B (U)
Falco (N)
Wario (D)
Captain Olimar (D)
Lucario (N)
Upper Mid Tiers:
Pit (N)
Toon Link (D)
Donkey Kong (U)
Pikachu (N)
Wolf (N)
Fox (D)
Mid Mid Tiers:
Ice Climbers (N)
Zelda (U)
Diddy Kong (N)
Zero Suit Samus (D)
Ness (D)
Kirby (D)
Ike (N)
Low Mid Tiers:
Peach (D)
Lucas (D)
Sonic (U)
Luigi (N)
Sheik (U)
Squirtle (D)
Low Tiers:
Mario (N)
Ivysaur (N)
Samus (N)
Bowser (N)
Link (U)
Charizard (U)
Bottom Tiers:
Yoshi (U)
Jigglypuff (U)
Captain Falcon (U)
Ganondorf (U)
Epic list, I would move snake down to top, Samus swich with Ike and peach be moved to below ZSS, other wise its godlyGOD:
Meta Knight
Snake
TOP:
Mr. Game & Watch
Falco
Marth
R.O.B
King Dedede
HIGH:
Captian Olimar
Wario
Toon Link
Kirby
Donkey Kong
Pikachu
Lucario
Pit
MIDDLE:
Zelda
Wolf
Ice Climbers
Diddy Kong
Fox
Luigi
Ness
Zero Suit Samus
Lucas
Mario
LOW:
Peach
Yoshi
Bowser
Sonic
Pokemon Trainer
Shiek
Ike
BOTTOM:
Samus
Jigglypuff
Link
Captian Falcon
Ganondorf
Thanks :D!imo best tier list I have seen so far.
You obviously weren't paying attention to the millions of Yoshi-related posts >_<Also, here's a bit of information to stimulate some discussion. The top five characters on whom there is the most disagreement regarding their placement are (from most disagreement to least):
1. Mario
2. Jigglypuff
3. Sheik
4. Peach
5. Luigi
So what do you guys think?
Fixed.The top five characters on whom there is the most disagreement regarding their placement are (from most disagreement to least):
1. Yoshi
2. Yoshi?
3. Yoshi cant wavedash stupid
4. Yoshi canz too wavedash
5. Yoshi
I'm just using the standard deviation of their placement within people's tier lists.You obviously weren't paying attention to the millions of Yoshi-related posts >_<