WolfCypher
Smash Lord
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- Oct 24, 2007
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- WolfCypher
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Exactly how close to completion is the official tier list and exactly who do we know for sure are in what tiers?
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It just seems like you refuse to accept G&W as a good character. If you want to play some games, I can show you how good he is.I was obviously expecting negative criticism after posting my tier list idea, but I was at least hoping for something other than flaming and childish remarks. At least ganondorf4ever and to a lesser extent Nigerian Star Storm explained why they disagree or why I'm wrong.
@Tim: I have nothing against G&W. You make it sound like I'm out to get him. I told everyone going in that this tierlist was from all of MY personal experiences. If I still explain my actions, and people still go in ready to attack, well then what else can I do? I guess it always easier to bash than to disagree and explain why I'm wrong. But I was ready for that anyway.
Definitely not, especially in comparison to G&W, MK, and Snake.Marth is not top tier.
Side note: **** my new sig is awesome. Subtle yet powerful.
If we all made tier list like that it would be pointless. Here would be minethis tierlist was from all of MY personal experiences
Well, I try not to show biased against G&W, but you are right, I don't see the potential everyone else do, and I've seen tourney vids. I just always see G&W as a middleground character...he's good. Not spectacular, but good. Well, you so strongly state that he's a good character, so I'll take your word for it. I never hated him, more like underestimate him.It just seems like you refuse to accept G&W as a good character. If you want to play some games, I can show you how good he is.
I actually don't know how to post videos online. I'm assuming you copy the replay to an SD card and upload it that way but I don't have a free SD card. It's hard to see how good G&W is through videos because he isn't really all that flashy. It's like watching DK or Bowser, they just don't look as good visually as Snake or MK do.Well, I try not to show biased against G&W, but you are right, I don't see the potential everyone else do, and I've seen tourney vids. I just always see G&W as a middleground character...he's good. Not spectacular, but good. Well, you so strongly state that he's a good character, so I'll take your word for it. I never hated him, more like underestimate him.
If you have any videos of yourself as G&W in action, I'd gladly watch them. Until I get my router fixed, I haven't been able to even get online on my Wii for a little over a week. Otherwise, I'd take that challenge.
G&W should be placed in top tier along with Snake and Metaknight. IMO, he's the best character in the game because of match-ups and pure brokeness. And for the record, I don't main G&W but I have to verse one a lot because my friend uses him.Well the answer me this, please, then I'll be done. Honestly, where does G&W (and Lucario, but I'm interested in it for my own reasons) rank on the tierlist? High? Top?!
WolfCypher;4768430 Lucario's upper-middle tier? So not high tier? Well at least one of my 4 mains isn't in the two highest tiers.[/QUOTE said:Lol. It's always fun to have mains that completely suck. My mains are G&W, Ganon, and DK. WOOT WOOT!
Very nice list. finally someone admits yoshi has a good recovery, everyone seems to forget about his heavy armor frames which are great for countering and what nots. But yeah tourney results for him suck hard apparently so I'll take where ever he is on the tier list since that won't effect whether I play him or not (which i still will even if he's bottom tier just like melee)Concerning Yoshi:
The fluffy dino has a few things in his way to becoming a usable character. Certainly he is not given as much credit as he deserves, but here's a quick breakdown of his pros and cons, and some reasoning behind them.
Pros
- Fast on the ground (This is very true. His tilts and jab come out almost instantly, and his running speed is faster than Toon Link's.)
- Great aerial game (Each aerial has a specific use, whether it's the best damage-racking aerial in the game, a combo breaker, a chaining/WOP move, a spike, or a KO move.)
- Best aerial speed (Not necessarily how long it takes for moves to come out, but he moves through the air at the fastest speed in the game.)
- Spammable projectile (Slower characters on the ground or air and bigger targets have many problems with the eggs, and it can also be used to rack up damage while edgeguarding.
- SA frames on second jumps (This makes it a lot harder to edgeguard Yoshi, not to mention that lack of DJC is actually a buff considering Brawl's physics.)
Cons
- Crappy shield (It can't be jumped out of, but really, that doesn't bother Yoshi as much as how long it takes to attack out of his shield on the ground. This makes him easily pressured and limits his defense game.)
- Somewhat of a big target (This makes for a poor size/weight ratio, since Yoshi can't tank as well as he could in previous games.)
- Recovery relies heavily on second jump (This isn't that big of a problem unless Yoshi's below the stage... if he's level or higher, then he can recover with egg throw. Also note that Yoshi is extremely sucseptible to footstools. In most situations, however, Yoshi's recovery is almost impossible to edgeguard.)
Matchups
I put these under neither pros nor cons, considering that Yoshi's matchups are commonly considered to be crap, even though he can actually do well against some higher tiered characters. For example, he has a lot less of a disadvantage to Snake than most other "established low tier" characters, and he's a good counter to Olimar. (Jury's out on whether he's good or bad against Marth... both characters will say they win.) However, he falls against MK and G-Dub just as much as most other characters, and projectile spams (aka Falco) can hurt him badly due to his slow roll. Against some projectiles, of course, he can spam right back, and his aerials often go through them, but it's hit or miss against spams for Yoshi. He does, however, beat most low/bottom/lower mid characters pretty easily.
Tournament Standings
Sure, I could go on about how "nobody likes Yoshi" and "he's not popular enough", and while that's true to an extent, he should at least have SOME tournament standings. If he wants to be considered better, he should start placing better.
Conclusion
Yoshi is certainly a character with a number of misconceptions, but he does have enough blatant weaknesses to keep him from advancing too much. It does seem like he's better than characters like Captain Falcon and Jiggz who have placed better than him, but until people see some hard facts, they won't be placing him anywhere higher than low.
I wouldn't even be surprised if they took Snake and Sonic out of the next game for some new third-party charactersBut I think we can all agree that Snake and MK are top tier for two reason, they're outrageously good and it's obvious they're going to be nerfed in the next game, second reason is that at least half the people that play brawl in tournaments use these 2 characters since they're relatively easy to pick up (don't even try to argue that anyone you all know it's true)
G&W is no worse that the second highest tier ( probably top six character), and my belief is that Lucario is about middle tier ( he's very predictable).Well the answer me this, please, then I'll be done. Honestly, where does G&W (and Lucario, but I'm interested in it for my own reasons) rank on the tierlist? High? Top?!
Erm....are you sure this is yours? This looks very familiar to one of my previous lists with a few edits O_o.against my better judgment, I'm gonna post my tier list.
Please be honest about what you think about it.
Top Tier:
Snake
Meta Knight
Mr. Game and Watch
High Tier:
Marth
Falco
R.O.B.
Pikachu
King Dedede
Zelda
Pit
High-Mid Tier:
Wario
Toon Link
Olimar
Wolf
Donkey Kong
Lucario
Diddy Kong
Mid Tier:
Ice Climbers
Kirby
Fox
ZSS
Lucas
Luigi
Mario
Ness
Sheik
Mid-Low tier :
Bowser
Sonic
Ike
Pokemon Trainer
Peach
Ganondorf
Low Tier:
Yoshi
Link
Samus
Captain Falcon
Jigglypuff
Actually, it's your list from your newest Gamefaqs topic with a few edits.Erm....are you sure this is yours? This looks very familiar to one of my previous lists with a few edits O_o.
Haha yeah, we are pretty diversified in our opinions. Good thing I'm always rightIf all goes well the SFR should have a finished tier list by August. We have slowed down a bit so I think July may be a stretch. It is still possible though. The SFR has also faced some setbacks that has slowed us down a bit.
The SFR only agrees on a handful of characters
Snake, Metaknight, and Game and watch for top tier.
Wolf, Pikachu and Olimar for somewhere in High/very high.
Bah, I always thought that lots of characters were "usable" in Melee. I, for example used Pikachu, and the only overused character that shuts him down that badly is Marth.. he can hold his own at least semi-well against the others. And he wins the low tier.The only characters that were really played in melee were shiek, fox, falco, marth, peach, and jiggz (everyonce in a while you'd see a samus or doc but yeah) so what is that less than half the cast from the game? The same thing might happen to brawl but I'm sure everyone can agree that every character is at least "usable" unlike in melee
against my better judgment, I'm gonna post my tier list.
Please be honest about what you think about it.
Top Tier:
Snake
Meta Knight
Mr. Game and Watch
High Tier:
Marth
Falco
R.O.B.
Pikachu
King Dedede
Zelda
Pit
High-Mid Tier:
Wario
Toon Link
Olimar
Wolf
Donkey Kong
Lucario
Diddy Kong
Mid Tier:
Ice Climbers
Kirby
Fox
ZSS
Lucas
Luigi
Mario
Ness
Sheik
Mid-Low tier :
Bowser
Sonic
Ike
Pokemon Trainer
Peach
Ganondorf
Low Tier:
Yoshi
Link
Samus
Captain Falcon
Jigglypuff
I offered you a chance, but you didn't want to be in it because Bdawg was in it >_____>SFR fails cuz I ain't in it.
against my better judgment, I'm gonna post my tier list.
Please be honest about what you think about it.
Top Tier:
Snake
Meta Knight
Mr. Game and Watch
High Tier:
Marth
Falco
R.O.B.
Pikachu
King Dedede
Zelda
Pit
High-Mid Tier:
Wario
Toon Link
Olimar
Wolf
Donkey Kong
Lucario
Diddy Kong
Mid Tier:
Ice Climbers
Kirby
Fox
ZSS
Lucas
Luigi
Mario
Ness
Sheik
Mid-Low tier :
Bowser
Sonic
Ike
Pokemon Trainer
Peach
Ganondorf
Low Tier:
Yoshi
Link
Samus
Captain Falcon
Jigglypuff
Just my input. Your mid, mid-low and low seem very accurate in the current metagame, but there are a lot of things I disagree with in your high and high-mid categories.against my better judgment, I'm gonna post my tier list.
Please be honest about what you think about it.
Top Tier:
Snake
Meta Knight
Mr. Game and Watch
High Tier:
Marth - WTF way to high.
Falco
R.O.B.
Pikachu - Can afford a lower spot
King Dedede
Zelda - lol....
Pit - He's upper mid tier at best.
High-Mid Tier:
Wario - I don't understand how Pit and Zelda make high tier and not Wario
Toon Link - Could afford to go down a few slots.
Olimar
Wolf
Donkey Kong - Put him on top of high-mid and I might be somewhat satisfied, but only if pit and Zelda go down
Lucario
Diddy Kong
Mid Tier:
Ice Climbers
Kirby
Fox
ZSS
Lucas
Luigi - Needs to be higher
Mario
Ness - Can go a few slots higher
Sheik
Mid-Low tier :
Bowser
Sonic - Has the potential to move up to the bottom of mid.
Ike
Pokemon Trainer
Peach - Definetly deserves more credit than this.
Ganondorf - Good ****.
Low Tier:
Yoshi
Link
Samus
Captain Falcon
Jigglypuff - Just switch her with Captain Falcon...lol