Official "Ask Snakeee Stuff... about Stuff" Thread

[Snakeee]

Good **** against Fatal Snakeee, a couple two stocks if I remember right and you put the new CG to good use.

Thanks a lot . Yeah the CG is a much bigger deal than I realized, because I honestly questioned the legitimacy of it before. I take it all back, and it's pretty amazing.
They were just friendlies, but they were getting a lot of attention lol. No one really saw the CG yet, and they were shocked. I wish it worked on more characters though

Yeah that was nice.

Also, I don't understand all the lingo here, what is over B ?

Thank you too.
It's the B move that can kill, and is a whip not a kick....and not just a spike kill lol

 

[Honeythief]

6B or 4B, or tilt only on the horizontal axis and do your special move.

This I don't get...

Thank you too.
It's the B move that can kill, and is a whip not a kick....and not just a spike kill lol

This I do. ^_^

Thanks

 

[Nefarious B]

So ya I know it was just friendlies, but after singles today I'm thinking you'll have a better idea of how effective the CG is, especially against DDD and Snake. Let us know where you think those matchups are with the grab in play.

 

[ThreeSided]

Are there any significant awesome techniques That I don't know? Maybe certain character specific techs that work on characters I didn't know they worked on? I know:


Out of Dsmash;

U/Dtilt > Aerials
Bair
FB
Stage spike (down off edge)
DB spike kick (off stage)
Usmash
More Dsmash (Dsmash chains)


Chain Grabs;

MK
Squirtel


Infinites;

ROB
Wario


Recovery Tricks;

Down-B edge-hogger spike/footstool
FB before UB for tether
FD lip teching



What am I missing?

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

Was that on the live stream? Guess I missed it...

 

[DeliciousCake]

Snakeee, are you disappointed that I ruined your AIM screenname for you?

 

[Nefarious B]

Ya it was on live stream yesterday.

And Threesided you're missing the newly discovered fthrow CG, there's a thread a few down that gives you the full list.

 

[Snakeee]

So ya I know it was just friendlies, but after singles today I'm thinking you'll have a better idea of how effective the CG is, especially against DDD and Snake. Let us know where you think those matchups are with the grab in play.

Sadly, I couldn't enter singles because my family had plans for Mother's Day . It's a shame because I was starting to get into my perfect state of mind, and I felt like I could have placed really high. A huge tournament like this only a half hour away from me, and I couldn't even enter, but oh well.

 

[shlike]

any vids of the snake cg up?

if not could you just elaborate on it a bit?

 

[Snakeee]

So ya I know it was just friendlies, but after singles today I'm thinking you'll have a better idea of how effective the CG is, especially against DDD and Snake. Let us know where you think those matchups are with the grab in play.

any vids of the snake cg up?

if not could you just elaborate on it a bit?

They might have a vid on the thread for it. Check a few threads down I think it's on the first page.
You have to buffer it pretty much perfectly at least for the first grab against Snake and DDD or else they'll be able to buffer their airdodge on it.

Anyway, I wanted to say that I feel that I am improving drastically just in the last couple of days. My experience at the first day at Apex plus the friendlies I played with my brother today made me come up with new innovations and just generally mix up my gameplay much more.

For one thing, I am really happy to say that I feel that I can take Metaknight with ZSS once again
Up tilt is an amazing move to punish as cheesy as it sounds to be overusing it you kind of should. See, at the right moments, they usually cannot avoid it at all OOS or after a spot dodge.
I've also realized just how ridiculous up air is. especially for this match up. If you shield any of his aerials and time it just right, you can up air him just about every single time.
I also throw in D-smash and Side B only very randomly when I think he won't expect them at all. Sure he can block it easily if he sees it come out, but not if he is in the middle of a move. I try to Side B just before I anticipate a tornado, because it will hit him out of the first few frames.
They also punish random Side Bs from Meta.

Big EDIT: For recovery, I now try to go as high as possible and recover onstage. Usually I end up offscreen when I do this (boost up B jump). If you do this, Metaknight cannot simply gimp your tether like happens to me against top Metas. Then mix up when you will down B, and both of you will be playing the guessing game here. You will either avoid his Up B, trade hits and likely get hit back towards the stage, hit him and possibly spike him, or worst comes to worst he predicts it perfectly and you get hit. This may or may not kill you, but it will not kill as early or easily as a gimp.

Basically I believe you should play as a punisher against him. Run away most of the time on stage, but do things that can punish his approaches. Get ready to predict his approach and counter it. If he's F-airs, shield each hit and up air him. If he grabs, spot dodge-up tilt.
His best approach is f-tilt/d-tilts though. For this you can try to grab him if you do it way before he does it, but the best thing you can really do is just try to jump past him and b-air. He will shield it often, but you'll very rarely get punished for this.

And as always, pressure hard when you have him in the air with the juggle game. Bair him into up airs, b-airs, and up B. Usually go for B-air for the kill.

Last note since not everyone realizes it: whenever Meta is gliding you can simply up air while DIing under him.

Oh and another great thing I'm doing more with ZSS in general, including this match up is DIing out of moves and immediately Up airing. It works quite like how Metaknight can use his aerials for that purpose except it can sometimes KO


All in all, I once again ZSS may potentially be a high tier character.

 

[Cia]

Up tilt is an amazing move to punish as cheesy as it sounds to be overusing it you kind of should.

bang bang

 

[Hence]

bang bang

 

[Snakeee]

bang bang

Haha yeah, but I don't mean to use it stupidly not that you did at all. You've used it at the right times (mostly lol), and I just don't want people to get ridiculous with it now.
It's often really hard to punish, can sometimes shield stab, and usually used to punish itself OOS or after spot dodging which makes it a guaranteed hit a lot of the time.

Also, notice the big edits I made on that post, mostly on Meta

I want to get that info into our match up thread if possible.

 

[Nefarious B]

Aw that sucks you couldn't play, I think Dazwa did alright reppin it, I think he got 13th or so.

I've been getting frustrated with ZSS lately, so it's good to hear you're reconvinced that she's a good character. It seems to me that in hindsight I was relying on my jab too much to beat faster characters, and now that they are all predicting it I'm getting punished a lot with shieldgrabs.

My brother (who admittedly knows my playstyle really well), picked up Fox just last night and was beating me 2/3rds of the time, so I've really been looking for ways to step it up.

Also, random question to Snakeee and anyone else, with tap jump off do you use A or cstick for aerials?

 

[Hence]

Aw that sucks you couldn't play, I think Dazwa did alright reppin it, I think he got 13th or so.

I've been getting frustrated with ZSS lately, so it's good to hear you're reconvinced that she's a good character. It seems to me that in hindsight I was relying on my jab too much to beat faster characters, and now that they are all predicting it I'm getting punished a lot with shieldgrabs.

My brother (who admittedly knows my playstyle really well), picked up Fox just last night and was beating me 2/3rds of the time, so I've really been looking for ways to step it up.

Also, random question to Snakeee and anyone else, with tap jump off do you use A or cstick for aerials?

C-Stick aerials are for Fast Falls or eliminating change in momentum.

Come to think of it, the only time I use an A Button aerial (besides N-Air) is when I'm chasing a recovering opponent.

 

[noradseven]

Aw that sucks you couldn't play, I think Dazwa did alright reppin it, I think he got 13th or so.

I've been getting frustrated with ZSS lately, so it's good to hear you're reconvinced that she's a good character. It seems to me that in hindsight I was relying on my jab too much to beat faster characters, and now that they are all predicting it I'm getting punished a lot with shieldgrabs.

My brother (who admittedly knows my playstyle really well), picked up Fox just last night and was beating me 2/3rds of the time, so I've really been looking for ways to step it up.

Also, random question to Snakeee and anyone else, with tap jump off do you use A or cstick for aerials?

Man this still confuses me am I use jab only slightly more often then I do f-smash, and I pretty much always cancel it after the second hit for a retreat.

I have been very happy with ZSS lately a few matches still get me like Olimar(I actually jab him the jerk), and lucario, falco, but even pit unless its on battlefield Im not hating as much.

 

[shlike]

Aw that sucks you couldn't play, I think Dazwa did alright reppin it, I think he got 13th or so.

I've been getting frustrated with ZSS lately, so it's good to hear you're reconvinced that she's a good character. It seems to me that in hindsight I was relying on my jab too much to beat faster characters, and now that they are all predicting it I'm getting punished a lot with shieldgrabs.

My brother (who admittedly knows my playstyle really well), picked up Fox just last night and was beating me 2/3rds of the time, so I've really been looking for ways to step it up.

Also, random question to Snakeee and anyone else, with tap jump off do you use A or cstick for aerials?

I was getting frustrated with zss too man, I drove up 6 hours for a tourney (hobo16) just to get last ( lost to a wario and pit) the wario was good, but against the pit i was just playing terrible. I was thinking about switching mains, but after watching the live stream on apex, and listening to snakeee's post, i feel confident about zss again. Obviously to beat characters you have to work harder with zss as opposed to other top/high tiers, but it's so worth it imo.

k pseudo rant is done



I use c-stick for ff aerials and momentum canceling as well.

 

[Cia]

what does everyone think of footstool > Dair?

i've incorporated it into my ZSS game recently, and i really like it. but i figure if it was any good, someone else would have come up with it sooner.

thoughts?

 

[MdrnDayMercutio]

I was asking you about this on the LiveStream before. Since I have no expierence in the Iceys matchup with Diddy and I love playing ZSS.

How do you deal with the Iceys. I assume it's alot of SideB to space and catching them NuetralB and stuff. Probably like super campy and stuff? What do you find good for kills? And should I even bother going for UpB gimps of the edge or is it useless here?

I wanna try ZSS vs. them. I find playing them with Diddy to be so ludicrously complex and chaotic and such... And I hear ZSS is supposed to be good there. And stupid Lain is probably gunna result in an influx of Iceys in tourney play.

EDIT: Oh and come to New England more. I want another shot at your Peach and to friendly your Zelda.

 

[Nefarious B]

i've incorporated it into my ZSS game recently, and i really like it. but i figure if it was any good, someone else would have come up with it sooner.

thoughts?

I still have yet to use it against anyone other than ROB because for some reason I always end up doing the full dair against anyone else. Is the timing different for others? Because I can do it just fine on ROB pretty consistently but I have yet to do it right on Snake.

 

[Snakeee]

Man this still confuses me am I use jab only slightly more often then I do f-smash, and I pretty much always cancel it after the second hit for a retreat.

I have been very happy with ZSS lately a few matches still get me like Olimar(I actually jab him the jerk), and lucario, falco, but even pit unless its on battlefield Im not hating as much.

I use jabs a ton with ZSS, but I try to mostly do it when I expect it to catch them in the air.
There are a lot of situations where you can do this.

what does everyone think of footstool > Dair?

i've incorporated it into my ZSS game recently, and i really like it. but i figure if it was any good, someone else would have come up with it sooner.

thoughts?

Well it's not really practical outside of the infinite. And if the footstool is offstage, I'm going for a gimp .

I was asking you about this on the LiveStream before. Since I have no expierence in the Iceys matchup with Diddy and I love playing ZSS.

How do you deal with the Iceys. I assume it's alot of SideB to space and catching them NuetralB and stuff. Probably like super campy and stuff? What do you find good for kills? And should I even bother going for UpB gimps of the edge or is it useless here?

I wanna try ZSS vs. them. I find playing them with Diddy to be so ludicrously complex and chaotic and such... And I hear ZSS is supposed to be good there. And stupid Lain is probably gunna result in an influx of Iceys in tourney play.

EDIT: Oh and come to New England more. I want another shot at your Peach and to friendly your Zelda.

On the ground keep spacing Side B/D-smash. I'm not sure if they can get a grab off if they powershield, and react perfectly, but I don't think it would work for the side B. I think it can on d-smash, but the weird thing about that is even when they shield it it sometimes still hits Nana for some reason o_O. The only other moves you should really use at all on the ground are B-air, falling up air behind them, and occasionally dash attack, but it is risky.

Once you get a hit in, just make sure you get them airborne so you can **** them. ZSS can just about always hit at least one of them once or more everytime they are sent into the air. Try to predict their airdodges, and up air/b-air/up B. Be really aggressive with this, but make sure you space your up airs so that they beat their d-air.

Basically play really campy on the ground, and really aggro in the air. Spacing is extremely important. One grab and ZSS will probably die. She's easier to kill with their CG than some other characters.

 

[ThreeSided]

I'm having trouble with Zelda. My friend mains her. I hear it's a 50:50 match up, so obviously he's better than me, because he always beats me. =\

Any tips?

 

[ph00tbag]

On the ground keep spacing Side B/D-smash. I'm not sure if they can get a grab off if they powershield, and react perfectly, but I don't think it would work for the side B. I think it can on d-smash, but the weird thing about that is even when they shield it it sometimes still hits Nana for some reason o_O. The only other moves you should really use at all on the ground are B-air, falling up air behind them, and occasionally dash attack, but it is risky.

The ICs, if they work the same as they did in Melee, should have a six-frame delay between Popo and Nana, meaning that (with the four-frame PS window), only one IC can PS at a time. Either Popo will PS, but you'll hit Nana, thus preventing a chain-grab, or Nana will PS, and you'll hit Popo's normal shield, causing him to get pushed back (and with his low traction, he won't be getting back to you).

So if your spacing dsmash or Plasma Whip right, it should be really hard for the ICs to grab you.

 

[Snakeee]

I'm having trouble with Zelda. My friend mains her. I hear it's a 50:50 match up, so obviously he's better than me, because he always beats me. =\

Any tips?

ZSS beats Zelda for sure, but not by all that much. I can't really go deep into it at the moment, but you have to apply a really good pressure game. She's a pretty slow character, so once you break through there's not all that much she can do. Be super aggro in the air, and off the stage. Get good at Side Bing her Up B.

The ICs, if they work the same as they did in Melee, should have a six-frame delay between Popo and Nana, meaning that (with the four-frame PS window), only one IC can PS at a time. Either Popo will PS, but you'll hit Nana, thus preventing a chain-grab, or Nana will PS, and you'll hit Popo's normal shield, causing him to get pushed back (and with his low traction, he won't be getting back to you).

So if your spacing dsmash or Plasma Whip right, it should be really hard for the ICs to grab you.

Oh ok thanks for the clarification. Now I feel even more confident in that match up

 

[sasook]

Would you be able to put a ratio on that IC matchup?

 

[Snakeee]

Would you be able to put a ratio on that IC matchup?

From my experience, the match up is strongly in ZSS' favor, and one of her best match ups. I've even 3 stocked a good IC's player in tourney.

I'm not entirely sure, but around 65/35 or 70/30 ZSS IMO.

 

[DeliciousCake]

In my own experience, IC's have a huge advantage over ZSS until you can get them seperated.
Listen to Snakeee.

 

[Cia]

Well it's not really practical outside of the infinite.

huh ?

 

[Nefarious B]

ROB infinite, check the thread on the footstool dair combo or check youtube.

 

[Cia]

^ Well.. while that may have been one of the coolest brawl tricks i've ever seen, what i'm talking about is footstooling someone who's sheilding. and then Dairing them while they're staggering.

i like this because it ***** people who thrive on punishing you when you land. i haven't gotten ZSS footage in a while, but hopefully, i can't get something soon.

btw, i haven't got to see Dazwa's ZSS yet D:

 

[sasook]

Not even in vids? Dazwa has an awesome vid against a Snake on Castle Siege on YT.

 

[Negi Kun1]

I'm having trouble with Luigi, it seems whenever I try to space him, he just down+B's right to me, and when I try to fight him in the air, I get outprioritized.

Any tips for this fight? Also, whats the matchup ratio?

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

I'm having trouble with Luigi, it seems whenever I try to space him, he just down+B's right to me, and when I try to fight him in the air, I get outprioritized.

Any tips for this fight? Also, whats the matchup ratio?

Luigi is tough for all of us. He can outcamp you on the ground and his moves come out faster in the air. I do think this is a fight that would be easier if there were more great Luigis out there. Not many of us probably have a ton of matchup experience. ATM it's probably 35:65.

 

[Negi Kun1]

Ah I see, well it makes me feel better after seeing that ratio, because having struggled so hard, I just couldn't help but think Luigi had an advantage. Not to mention my favorite CPs (Norfair & Brinstar) definitely don't help much, especially Norfair, that favors him I believe. I suppose my backup Marth will be seeing more play in this matchup.

Thanks for the words and ratio.

 

[Snakeee]

I'm having trouble with Luigi, it seems whenever I try to space him, he just down+B's right to me, and when I try to fight him in the air, I get outprioritized.

Any tips for this fight? Also, whats the matchup ratio?

If he's abusing his down B, just hold A

And it's probably only like 60/40, Luigi, but the match up seems to go back and forth for me at least.

 

[Honeythief]

Hmmm

Snakeee, do you have a video of you playing a good falco available somewhere?

 

[noradseven]

If he's abusing his down B, just hold A

And it's probably only like 60/40, Luigi, but the match up seems to go back and forth for me at least.

Pretty much my feelings on the matter I play a Luigi main quite a bit sometimes I seem to dominate, and sometimes well. I know this match has been discussed somewhere before, ZSS loses the matchup because of the mustache is all I can really remember.

 

[ThreeSided]

How does one pronounce your name?

 

[Snakeee]

Hmmm

Snakeee, do you have a video of you playing a good falco available somewhere?

No, and if I did with ZSS it'd probably be horrible

How does one pronounce your name?

This was asked...many times lol. Np though, and it doesn't really matter how you say it. I guess it's "Snak-ey" at this point.

 

[noradseven]

How does one pronounce your name?

Its snake--eeyaaaaaaa (as in falling of a cliff cause he killed them).