Ness Question and Answer Thread, Ask Ness questions Here!

[thesage]

Dittos are really annoying and generally don't tell skill at all. Examples: Melee sheik dittos and brawl Ness dittos. In brawl Ness dittos you have to play a completely different style than with other characters.

 

[Neon Ness]

Dittos are really annoying and generally don't tell skill at all. Examples: Melee sheik dittos and brawl Ness dittos. In brawl Ness dittos you have to play a completely different style than with other characters.

True. I think the one thing I hate most about Ness dittos is that I can't use PK Flash. Like, at all. Because everyone that I fight here is too good to fall for that mess. But Ness dittos are fun mostly, more fun than Lucas dittos. I also use grabs a lot less with Ness dittos.

 

[thesage]

I played toasty (good Melee player) in a Ness ditto and he absorbed a fully charged pk flash. I forgot Ness had psi magnet lol >_>;

 

[ColinJF]

The fact that Ness has psi magnet is what makes Ness dittos interesting! Psi magnet is a pretty laggy move.

 

[xoxokev]

What are Ness' best shield pressuring moves? IMO, I think its the dair... but I'm looking for something that works like Lucas' nair.

 

[ColinJF]

Back air is too good versus shields. It takes away a ton of shield energy and also pushes the shield back.

 

[xoxokev]

Thanks Colin I'll be sure to try it

 

[thesage]

Bair can be sheildgrabbed. Fair is the best option since it's easiest to sheildstab with. Nair is the safest though since it eats a lot of sheild.

 

[ColinJF]

Back air shield stabs all the time. Hit them high on the shield. It also pushes the shield back a lot.

 

[ViceGrip]

Ness ditto's pwn. use pk flash for mindgames, like explode it right b4 they are within healing range and then jump up 4 an uair. Yea, the Ness with the best basic combat skills and knowledge of the matchup will win (or if they have 1337 simna mindgames). This doesn't mean it's the better Ness though. The Ness who lost may have better projectiles mindgames and just a lack of ness ditto matchup knowledge.

 

[Uffe]

I've got a question. How do you beat a good Lucas? Up until now, a lot of the Lucas' I've come across weren't able to defeat me so easily. Now I'm having trouble with one. The sad part is is that he grabs me more than I grab him. Say I go to grab him, he'll dodge every time and just grab me instead. However, if I don't try and grab him, he'll just shield. Oh and "mind games," how can I make my Ness use these more effectively? The Lucas player told me that I lacked mind games. I've been doing terrible lately.

 

[ColinJF]

He can't spot dodge on reaction to your grab, so if you're expecting him to spot dodge your grab, just run up and wait for him to do the spot dodge and then grab as it completes. Alternatively you could make use of up smash. It often shieldstabs below shields so it has a good chance of punishing both spot dodge and shield.

 

[Uffe]

He can't spot dodge on reaction to your grab, so if you're expecting him to spot dodge your grab, just run up and wait for him to do the spot dodge and then grab as it completes. Alternatively you could make use of up smash. It often shieldstabs below shields so it has a good chance of punishing both spot dodge and shield.

It could have been do to lag, but I don't want to sound like I'm "Johning." I used my Yo-yo a number of times, though. I was able to beat him and he obviously did the same, but he seemed really difficult. Is there a way to escape Lucas' d-throw > u-tilt? I'm used to escaping a d-throw > uair, but that's about it. I tried using dair whenever he spot dodged, nair obviously worked, but he'd seem to hit me with his d-smash instead.

 

[xoxokev]

Charge your upsmashes! Please It really is > spot dodging

 

[Uffe]

Sometimes it gets shielded, though. So it doesn't always work.

 

[Gaussis]

Nair more. Lucas doesn't have much to a nair. It goes over fsmash and dsmash comes out too slow. Ftilt might be a problem, but he has to do it on reaction (which is pretty bad on wifi). Nair also goes over Lucas's grab and is much safer than a yo-yo. If he spotdodges, then switch to dair.

Mindgames...uh...PK Flash? Try to make him use PKT for recovery. Use yours to try to intercept his. If you do, good you just gimped him. If not, usually they try to hit themselves ASAP, so just chase and punish. Lure PSI magnet into favorable positions for PKT2. Also, don't just rush in mindlessly. Pull back aerials and do things to cause your opponent to react. Always do something smart. That's all I got for mindgames.

 

[Neon Ness]

Que? Uffe needs mindgamez help?

I think PK Thunda mindgamez are the best. Offstage PKT is my favorite, it works often for me in tournaments. Stay on the edge of the screen, launch PKT, and loop it backwards off of the screen so that it's out of view. A lot of times your opponent will think you messed up and try to rush you. Loop it around to yourself, and boom. Free PKT2. At point blank I might add. I don't even try PK Flash mindgames against Ness or Lucas, because I know they'll just absorb it.

If my explanation was confusing, EB360 explains it in his guide, too. Good luck with your mindgaaaaaamez.

 

[Gaussis]

Lol. That's the point. When they go for the bright green ball of flash, release it before they get there, or if all else fails, hold it all the way. Punish while they suffer magnet lag if possible.

 

[Uffe]

Thanks, guys. I'll try to do what I can with these. The reason I didn't do any of this is because of him having a PSI Magnet. I'll try to do what I can next time I fight him.

 

[Gaussis]

Yeah, the PSI magnet itself is a mindgame in Ness vs Lucas or Ness vs Ness's nightmare.

 

[_clinton]

Lagless PK Jump + Chance at PKT2 FTW!

Or whatever else floats your boat when dealing with heavy weights (In case you feel you can avoid using the bat)

 

[thesage]

Pkt eats pkt

 

[_clinton]

Indeed it does

 

[Uffe]

Pkt eats pkt

If you're suggesting to gimp Lucas with PKT when he uses his, I already do that.

 

[thesage]

You can also use psi magnet or pkt2 his pkt2 lol.

 

[Ref]

We need more questions, I know you guys are holding them back. We have answers.

 

[Uffe]

Any tips on how to beat a good Pit? It's an arrow > tilt/smash and every time I try to work my way around it, I still get hit. If I block it, I get pushed back and still get punished.

 

[Ref]

What do you mean arrow to tilt/ smash? Never had that happen. I'll need a bit more info on this to help you.

Don't let him sit back and spam stay offensive PSI mag asborbs on frame 10, cancel it, if it is on wifi don't bother, sandbag don't ruin your timing trying to power shield projectiles, unless it's like something you really want to win.

When approaching avoid the arrows, or power shield. Jump, pick stages with platforms. Play offensive, don't let him camp with arrows. Get closer.

Also you can smash di the first hit of the F smash to avoid the second.

 

[g2g4l]

Okay question then.
I used to main lucas before i played Ness so my recovery is very off i am really good on offense and defense and even intercepting. I usually try to save my second jump and Fair back to the stage but that only saves you so many times. in a sticky situation i usually end up dying from a failed recovery. do you have any tips for giving me more options off stage

 

[xoxokev]

g2g4l, there's always the psi magnet stall... idk if that would help you much tho... practice makes perfect, you probably already know, Ness' thunder is faster and i believe can be angled more than Lucas'... so yeah... practice a lot

EDIT: imo, vertical recoveries are the hardest!

 

[Uffe]

What do you mean arrow to tilt/ smash? Never had that happen. I'll need a bit more info on this to help you.

Don't let him sit back and spam stay offensive PSI mag absorbs on frame 10, cancel it, if it is on wifi don't bother, sandbag don't ruin your timing trying to power shield projectiles, unless it's like something you really want to win.

When approaching avoid the arrows, or power shield. Jump, pick stages with platforms. Play offensive, don't let him camp with arrows. Get closer.

Also you can smash di the first hit of the F smash to avoid the second.

I mean that he'll use his arrow to either hit you or to have you put up your shield and then go in for a f-tilt or an f-smash. And this isn't on wifi, either. I should have specified that. My power shielding sucks now. I don't think I do it enough to the point it doesn't seem to work for me. It's strange because I never had a problem with Pit up until now.

 

[thesage]

Uh just keep your sheild up and spotdodge if he tries to grab lol.

How do you play DDDs Ref? Olimar too. It's like he has a constant hitbox around him that once you get through, you just get grabbed X_X

 

[Neon Ness]

There are no Olimars where I play... which is bad because I know the first time I go up against one in a tournament they're gonna hand me my hat. Maybe I should just spam up taunt PK Fire and short hopped down air.

Dedede I can handle because I can fight a good one on a regular basis. Throw out PK Flash randomly and victory is miiiiine

Not getting grabbed helps, too. Also, I pick Battlefield against heavy characters often... Yoyo them onto one of the platforms and give 'em a PK Fairstorm. Hoorah for enormous hurtboxes.

 

[Masky]

There are no Olimars where I play... which is bad because I know the first time I go up against one in a tournament they're gonna hand me my hat. Maybe I should just spam up taunt PK Fire and short hopped down air.

Dedede I can handle because I can fight a good one on a regular basis. Throw out PK Flash randomly and victory is miiiiine

Not getting grabbed helps, too. Also, I pick Battlefield against heavy characters often... Yoyo them onto one of the platforms and give 'em a PK Fairstorm. Hoorah for enormous hurtboxes.

I know a very good Olimar player (even though he secondaries him), he's gonna be at that smashfest on Saturday so I can ask him if you want to get a few games with him. Ness can do very well against Olimar because Ness's nair goes through all his Pikmin attacks and instantly kills any Pikmin it touches, you just have to avoid getting grabbed because of Olimar's huge grab range. Ness players gotta help eachother

 

[Neon Ness]

Ness players do gotta help each other.

Wait, it's this Saturday? ...Oh yeeaaah, it is. I should probably find out where Weaver Hall is before then. Might help...

 

[Masky]

Ness players do gotta help each other.

Wait, it's this Saturday? ...Oh yeeaaah, it is. I should probably find out where Weaver Hall is before then. Might help...

lol, it's right next to Gator Corner Dining Center, just search for weaver on here: http://campusmap.ufl.edu/

 

[Uffe]

I know a very good Olimar player (even though he secondaries him), he's gonna be at that smashfest on Saturday so I can ask him if you want to get a few games with him. Ness can do very well against Olimar because Ness's nair goes through all his Pikmin attacks and instantly kills any Pikmin it touches, you just have to avoid getting grabbed because of Olimar's huge grab range. Ness players gotta help eachother

I still have a hard time getting through the yellow Pikmin with nair, but yeah, nair pretty much does the job.

Neon Ness, if the person using Olimar is tossing their Pikmin, go ahead and use PK Fire. It'll create a barrier and make it a bit harder for Olimar to grab. Don't forget that Olimar is fairly simple to gimp and edge guard. If you go to stages with platforms, be ready that the person using Olimar might hang out under those platforms to have the advantage, so avoid standing above Olimar. He shouldn't be Ness' toughest match up, but don't think that Olimar can't beat Ness, because any character can beat any character. I hope that helped.

But yeah, if you get Pikmin tossed on you, nair them. If he camps, use PK Fire or PK Thunder and try and edge guard the edge when Olimar comes back, but make sure that this doesn't happen:

You must recover!!

 

[Ref]

I short hop D air and N air olimar a lot. I'm actually really good in that match up.

Keep him off the ground and stage, use f air to edge guard. Don't mind his grab just make sure you get him off the ground, once you do rack up damage. Your short hop is one of the best heights in character size relation to be able to hit Olimar and stay safe.

D air to send him up, then follow it. N air works very well. Pk fire sometimes.

It's all about the D air and N air / f air to gimp. Go ahead and B air to double jump if needed.

Olimar is not much of a problem to me personally. Eventually you'll notice that a lot of good characters are very predictable if not played in good players hands. Even then you'll still see something the same.

The key is spot dodging grabs... Sour spot D air does bad things to him...

 

[MetaMario64]

Ref i see you play as ness, im an ex falco/IC player, but now i wanna main ness, i started yesterday and im playing CPU's that are lvl 8, and leik, im improving, do you have any combos and triks you can tell me to move forward and main ness?

PS. i can like handel everyon but pikachu is being a *****, how can i go against it?

 

[Ref]

Don't practice on computers that high of a level, It's best to play in training mode. These are good chains but nothing is guaranteed...

Okay the title is a joke but here are my secret chains.

Short hop fast fall U air > U tilt (Works on lower percents)
Short hop fast fall U air > Aerials ( Works on lower percents)
Short hop fast fall U air > Up smash ( Works on lower percents) ---(Stupid AKA I don't use)

Down air to non laggy fast fall > U air (Works on mid - low percents, cool follow up in higher)
Down air to non laggy fast fall > N air (Works on MidHigh - low percents)
Down air to non laggy fast fall > B air (Works on mid - low percents, cool follow up in higher)
Down air to non laggy fast fall > D air (Really just a chain use at any percent)
Down air to non laggy fast fall > F air (too good perfect, even on higher percents you can probably land that)

The Non laggy fast fall: Since D air does not auto cancel you must wait a bit before fast falling right away. If not you'll land with tons of lag from it. So basically once the d air connects wait a small time then fast fall. The result should be Ness landing like he would if he fast falled without an aerial.

Opposite face opponent short hop N air > U air (Low percents if N air is sweet spotted)
Short hop N air > U tilt (Works on lower percents if N air is sweet spotted)

Opposite face opponent N air: The point of an opposite face n air is only because the U air has more range from behind.

Short hop N air > Footstool > N air (Lower percents and character specific)

Jab > Jab > D air (Works at any percent best done on floaty characters recovering)

Dash attack (It's a chain no johns!)

U air is disjointed... If you guys didn't know.

I can come up with a lot more that I do but not right now....

F air is great as your ranged attack the most basic way to play is short hop aerials.