Ness Question and Answer Thread, Ask Ness questions Here!

[Ghnaschnakoff]

I've picked up Ness recently and played him for the first time at a tourney and got ***** by falco. I raged and no contest'd. So my question is, is there a way around falco's cg? I've heard that you can DI upward and footstool him at the first grab, is this true?

 

[Uffe]

Chances are that's not possible. It might be, but I'm not sure. I used to think it was possible to escape Falco's CG, but I think was wrong.

 

[AvariceX]

I was actually the one who found that DI up -> footstool.. Turns out the guy I was playing just wasn't doing the CG properly.

However if you play someone who dash grabs for the CG without boost grabbing then you can do the footstool trick. Sadly it's not actually possible to escape the cg if done properly. Your best bet is to DI directly away from him and you'll break out earlier (though you'll eat a dair at the end if he knows what you're doing).

 

[Eagleye893]

i did some really wierd CGs against computer lvl 9s on my wii, but i didn't save them...

one was bthrow>buffered dashgrab>bthrow> buffered dashgrab>bthrow on lucas, and it was really wierd... It was from 0% though just so you know.

another was against a snake where i dashgrabbed him multiple times out of a grab release...

I'm fairly sure that none of these are true at all, but don't you think it's wierd how it consistently happened over and over again after i did it several times to the computer?

Another random thing (just so you know, i play teams of 3 cpu lvl9 and use dthrow quite a bit) and i often am able to, almost immediately, use utilt right out of my dthrow.... could we possibly have some testing done with the throws? these are all wierd occurrences yet from my perspective they seemed almost inescapable (the utilt doesn't hit the one you throw, but it comes out really quick and if enemies are around you and expect to punish, it will most likely get them if they are within range). I can't really do much, i've gots stuff goin on. I'm pretty sure with the bthrow thing someone can easily jump to get out of it and the dashgrab someone can either jab or spotdodge, but it was wierd because these happened consistently to my insane cpu lvl9s that can get 60+ damage off on me with some wierd as heck true combo and spotdodge/airdodge/perfect shield everything i throw at them, even if they are going through insane ending lag stuff.

 

[Uffe]

I think I've seen the b-throw thing mentioned before. I'm not sure if it really works on other players, though. I thought I'd go ahead and say this. Don't practice against level 9 CPU's. If you're able to play online with other people, it's best you play them instead. Or if you know people offline that play Brawl, play them. Just avoid CPU's altogether.

 

[Eagleye893]

once i get my Mac that will all change (goes to get new, yet old, computer)

 

[PMKNG]

the snake thing, I've done it, and seen it done however it's not that applicable except to ness and lucas themselves lol.

It can be used to mindgame someone if they think you're going to throw, and instead you just grab release to another grab, then throw them etc.

 

[K.K_Slider]

What distance from the opponent do i have to be for ness' down tilt to constantly trip?

 

[Uffe]

There was actually a video of that recently. I think it's between the length of how far his leg goes when he uses his d-tilt that makes an opponent trip. Sure enough they'll trip anyway, but that seems to hit the spot.

 

[Eagleye893]

with a small amount of testing, i was able to find that there are multiple tripping points, but it's really difficult to hit with two of them (there might be one slightly behind ness and one at nearly the end of the ditilt hitbox)..... either that or it was random and i don't know.... I might need to test it out but the 100% trip that we know so far is what uffe said. it's difficult to judge, but you can constantly do it over and over again if you can space it fairly well.

 

[K.K_Slider]

Thanks I'm starting to get the feel for it. Also how viable is trip D-tilt to F-smash for damage dealing, and what should we do during days that we don't have people to practice with?

 

[Neon Ness]

Thanks I'm starting to get the feel for it. Also how viable is trip D-tilt to F-smash for damage dealing, and what should we do during days that we don't have people to practice with?

Dtilt x 2 > FSmash...

Ah, the bread and butter of xoxokev Ness.

Honestly, I wouldn't use it more than like twice a match, until you're abosutely certain it will trip, because bat can be perfect shielded and punished. Once you've mastered the spacing for when it will trip, you've the freedom to use it more often, but it can still get predictable.

When there's no one to play, do not play CPUs of any level. You will develop bad habits. Try the Ness Wifi thread if you have a Wifi connection. Good for mirrors practice... well, sort of.

Or just take the day off. That sometimes helps more than trying to grind away at the game to get better.

 

[Uffe]

Yeah, if you have nobody to play in person, don't fight against CPU's. If you can find people on wifi, go for it. If you have absolutely nobody to play, don't even think about Brawl. But more importantly, if you want to get some ideas, spectate by watching some Brawl videos on YouTube. Chances are you'll see something interesting that you've never done. If you're lacking in some match ups, view those on YouTube as well.

 

[MrsSaturnandWatch]

How do you deal with Robot?
I keep finding myself getting hit by gyros and lasers. I try to stay on the air with Fairs, Dairs, but that doesn't work a whole lot. Any help? Any stage choices along with it?

 

[mobilisq]

use your yoyos

 

[Uffe]

How do you deal with Robot?
I keep finding myself getting hit by gyros and lasers. I try to stay on the air with Fairs, Dairs, but that doesn't work a whole lot. Any help? Any stage choices along with it?

R.O.B.'s Laser and Gyro are pretty obvious. That's not to say you'll never get hit by them, but when used, you can see it coming. If R.O.B. is off the stage or on the edge, he'll most likely use his Laser since you're at a distance and his attacks can go really far. If you're off the stage, he'll either try to fair you off or shoot his Laser at you. You should be able to airdodge both of those.

I'm told you should keep him in the air. Try to avoid using dair unless he spotdodges. Of course I think nair or the Yo-yo can work, too. A R.O.B. at your level shouldn't be too much of a problem to deal with. However, if they're more experienced than you, then this could be awhile. Anyway, try to keep him in the air. I'm not sure where he's better at, but I believe your attacks come out quicker than his in the air.

One more thing. If they like to spotdodge > d-smash, that becomes predictable very quick as well. Make sure you see that. That's probably a good time to dair.

 

[xoxokev]

a well timed fair will protect you from rob's gyro. also, keep him in the air, as uffe said. rob sucks when he's on top of you

 

[PMKNG]

in bed.



I'm pretty sure ive seen others mention that pkt ***** rob in the air, idk I havent played a rob in a while and I didn't use pkt as much as I do now.

 

[Uffe]

XD @ PMKNG

I was wondering why you wrote what you did in the beginning of your post.

 

[Man of Popsicle]

Who are all the people FOW lost too at Genesis, because I think I know one, and he won't tell me who he is. He uses Zamus, Snake, and Marth mostly, but is pretty proficient with most characters. It's bothering me. A lot.
HELP!

 

[Eagleye893]

a well timed fair will protect you from rob's gyro. also, keep him in the air, as uffe said. rob sucks when he's on top of you

in bed.

lolz...

well, i don't really like rob, but all i do is go completely random and shield/airdodge whenever i see a gyro or laser coming, but i try to airdodge as the gyro gets near me so i can grab it and use it to my advantage. i hate dtilt and..... actually rob isn't that bad... not as bad as snake (i hate snake players now).

IM SICK AND TIRED OF THESE MONKEY FIGHTING SNAKES ON THIS MONDAY THROUGH FRIDAY PLANE!!! (i say as a snake player fights a DK and diddy on corneria and i'm left alone to absorb the lasers)

as for FOW, there are results posted on AiB... i can't remember the bracket stuff for fow, but he swept his pool, even with lain in it.

 

[PMKNG]

Glad I could be of some service in the lol factor.

 

[NintenJoe]

What moves can I use to mix up my off-the-stage game? I usually use Nair (to push them away further) or Dair (to spike), but not much else.

 

[Man of Popsicle]

What moves can I use to mix up my off-the-stage game? I usually use Nair (to push them away further) or Dair (to spike), but not much else.

Nair, Bair, Uair, Fair, Dair, and Psi Magnet

 

[Bartolon]

Rising fair.
The only thing I can think off atm

 

[NintenJoe]

Nair, Bair, Uair, Fair, Dair, and Psi Magnet

I mean to like, kill them. Of course I'll use Uair if they're above me...

 

[Eagleye893]

i go rar bair or bair stagespike sometimes, but all aerials should be thought of. i even go psi magnet sometimes, but thats more for mindgames and lucas/ness gimp. its very difficult to gimp anyone else with psi magnet.

 

[CarVac]

Cazcombo! PKF to rising Dair.

 

[K.K_Slider]

Does anyone have a list of characters who have grab release combos that hurt real bad other than the most commonly known?

 

[Man of Popsicle]

Peach, Zard, Marth, Bowser, Meta Knight, and Snake.

 

[SoupaSonic]

Is it better to do PK fire twice and then do forward smash?

 

[Eagleye893]

people can SDI out of pkfire anyways, so it really depends.

On bowser, maybe even more times than that.
on people who can't SDI well, sure, but make sure they stay trapped in the 2nd pkfire and you can hit them with the bat if they do get far enough out of range.
on people who can SDI well, go with something you know will hit, because they will likely perfect shield or jump away.

It all depends on your opponent's actions though.

one useful, semi-true combo is to get someone trapped in the pkfire wall, sh dair them then immediately utilt them as you hit the ground. the dair auto cancels if you start the dair early enough, so you don't really undergo much ending lag at all. once i found this combo, i said, "forget the unreliable dthrow>fair, this can almost hit all the time!" if they tech, you're in trouble, if they di out of the pkfire wall, you can still get them with it, but they have to have just gotten out and your dair hitbox is basically already coming out. if they get up or roll, which they havent against the players i've done it on, then you have to follow up with something else (getup attack = shieldgrab or shield usmash; getup = wait then do an attack; roll = either dash attack or dash grab, depending on how far the person rolls, and if they roll slowly, maybe another pkfire). i like this move so much! its worked several times.

 

[K.K_Slider]

Is it possible to use this to set up for jab locks if they don't tech or does the PK fire prevent this?

 

[AvariceX]

It is possible to dair someone out of a PK-Fire pillar into a jab lock but it's really situational. First they have to be off the ground (either from being at high damage or from DI'ing up in the pillar), then the dair has to hit near the end of the pillar duration as if they are daired back into the pillar it will just force them up again, then they have to not tech.

It's really specific, but if you pull it off it looks really flashy.

 

[Rockmix]

What are some of Ness's safe approaches?

 

[NintenJoe]

What are some of Ness's safe approaches?

In order from most safe to least safe:

1. SH Fair->AR'd (Aerial Risen- See this.) Retreating Fair
2. SH Fair->AR'd Nair
3. SH Fair->Nair->Jab Combo
4. Shield Dash'd Grab
5. Dash Attack (If spaced properly)
6. Hyphen Smash (Usmash while running)
7. Dash grab
8. Pivot grab (Anti-Shield and Anti-Spot Dodge ONLY)

It's not a perfect list, but those are all pretty safe. (Ok, not the last two)

 

[K.K_Slider]

Thank you, also about the 3 jabs > 2 D-Tilts = harmless get up animation can you do this at any point of the jab lock past 3 jabs or does It only work when you only do three jabs before hand, And are the get up animation frames for each character universal?

 

[Rockmix]

Okay thanks!

 

[Uffe]

How do you fight a really good Captain Falcon? This is more for my friend, but I've had my share of good Falcon mains. Advice? Video related.

Uffe (Ness) vs LightSide (Captain Falcon)

 

[Man of Popsicle]

Use a lot of grabs!

He has a bad approach, no range, and no projectile, so wait for him to come to you and just space well.

Shield grab dominates falcon.