Mewtwo Patch (Version 1.0.6[7]) Thread [Updated: May 1st]

[sWiTcHeRoO [疾~斬]]

https://twitter.com/dantarion/status/591751394870173696

Based @Dantarion

We in there, finally.

 

[relaxedexcorcist]

It seems like Pit and Dark Pit's side b has less super armor frames now. Sometimes I get hit out of it mid dash. Can someone confirm or disconfirm this?

Fairly certain it did that already for some reason. IIRC the super armor ends on frame 22 which is halfway through the dash.

 

[Lavani]

Fairly certain it did that already for some reason. IIRC the super armor ends on frame 22 which is halfway through the dash.

That, and while the dash has armor the punch doesn't, so both Pits lose their armor when they start to swing and can hit before the arm connects.

Been a thing since 1.0.0 in both cases at any rate.

 

[Scott Melonball]

That, and while the dash has armor the punch doesn't, so both Pits lose their armor when they start to swing and can hit before the arm connects.

Been a thing since 1.0.0 in both cases at any rate.

Ok that makes sense. I thought they ninja nerfed pit for a second; I wish Nintendo would just give us patch notes so people can't think something changed when it hasn't.

 

[Dai Tian]

The latest notice post mentions how there are again gameplay tweaks and that old replays no longer work, though the 2 I had in there were definitely playable. Is it possible then that the tweaks they're talking about are specifically regarding Mewtwo? Cause I didn't have a replay of him in there to check.

 

[Thinkaman]

When dant posts new data, I'll run scripts and post changelogs.

 

[Indigo Jeans]

Mastercore already has a patch diffs viewer tho...

 

[Thinkaman]

Mastercore already has a patch diffs viewer tho...

Right, but we have to convert those comprehensive diffs to something more human readable.

 

[BJN39]

I'll probably be doing a changelog for Zelda as well. But if you're doing all of them, then I'll just leave my notes for the Zelda boards.

Oooh, I'm just getting so excited to look through all the data.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

I'm going to laugh if there are like, a dozen knockback and hitbox changes that we dismissed as placebos.

 

[Zapp Branniglenn]

I'm going to laugh if there are like, a dozen knockback and hitbox changes that we dismissed as placebos.

It would really just be dumb coincidences of one random user saying they think this or that smash attack is "faster when I played in FG today". You don't need to provide video evidence of a change for this thread. Just to provide your theory of a change and a concise testing method.

There probably are several dozen knockback and hitbox changes. Because some of the changes we have found up to this point are not exactly obvious. The slight speed increase of Samus' homing missiles, Link's grounded upB coming out three frames faster, we needed video evidence for stuff like that, because it's too hard to confirm or deconfirm with the naked eye and two hands operating two systems at once.

 

[Phoenon]

I'd love to get closure on Marth's Side B changes myself, because it's definitely not the same as it was.

 

[Shaya]

*cough* HERE WE GO *cough*.

I originally obtained Marth's frame data when 3DS came out. I had put his jab as 29 frames, and as for the most part all of his normals had a +2 frame endlag tacked onto them between Brawl I would've assumed my salt would've forced me to make sure I was correct.
Forward Tilt was also noted as 39 frames.

@ KuroganeHammer was doing framedatas and has told me the jab is 26 frames. There is the chance I originally messed up, or it was a stealth buff no one ever noticed.
Forward tilt is also 35 frames.
Confirming what the case for this is will be hard, there's a chance this change came in 1.04 (as Lucina's knockback on jab was touched then). Is there any hero out there with an ability to check this?

There's only two options: I was wrong (this is becoming too common, dammit) or it got buffed at some stage and no one noticed until now (doesn't help that me bringing this up has so many people saying "Hey I think I noticed this!"; ughh).

tl;dr
Release 3DS patch / 1.07 WiiU
Jab 29 > 26
Ftilt 39 > 35

 

[bc1910]

dude I swear I noticed that

 

[Lavani]

*cough* HERE WE GO *cough*.

I originally obtained Marth's frame data when 3DS came out. I had put his jab as 29 frames, and as for the most part all of his normals had a +2 frame endlag tacked onto them between Brawl I would've assumed my salt would've forced me to make sure I was correct.
Forward Tilt was also noted as 39 frames.

@ KuroganeHammer was doing framedatas and has told me the jab is 26 frames. There is the chance I originally messed up, or it was a stealth buff no one ever noticed.
Forward tilt is also 35 frames.
Confirming what the case for this is will be hard, there's a chance this change came in 1.04 (as Lucina's knockback on jab was touched then). Is there any hero out there with an ability to check this?

There's only two options: I was wrong (this is becoming too common, dammit) or it got buffed at some stage and no one noticed until now (doesn't help that me bringing this up has so many people saying "Hey I think I noticed this!"; ughh).

tl;dr
Release 3DS patch / 1.07 WiiU
Jab 29 > 26
Ftilt 39 > 35

I can confirm the buffs are real comparing 1.0.0 and 1.0.7, at the very least. I don't have access to 1.0.4 though.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

That's quite amusing, this whole time I was adamant that Shaya was crazy.

 

[Shaya]

Get ****ing wrecked aerobone.

Also thanks to aerobone for making me notice!

 

[Elessar]

@ Shaya These are final compiled patch notes for Link according to what we have tested and found at the Link boards: http://smashboards.com/threads/patc...-update-soon-go-to-last-posts-for-now.378472/

Link specific Patch Notes:
BUG FIXES:

• Hylian shield now blocks space animal lasers.

Jab

• Move duration has been nerfed from 19 frames to 27
• IASA frames have been removed.

Dair

• Hit bubble has been increased by 50% resulting in a greater disjoint.

Spin Attack

• Start up time for the front swing has been reduced from frame 11 to 9
• Start up time for the back swing has been reduced from frame 13 to 10
• Knockback for the front swing has been buffed from %152 to %130
• Knockback for the back swing has been nerfed from %152 to %171
• Move duration has been shortened by 4 frames

Dtilt

• Can no longer spike characters hanging from the ledge for unknown reasons
• Knockback drastically nerfed from %175 to %312

Dash Attack

• Knockback for the hitbox on the sword hilt has been nerfed from %106 to %128 (This means the tool tip is now correct in saying that the tip of the sword is stronger than the base. It was actually the other way around before)
• The hitbox comes out sooner (unsure as to how soon, I'll test this more thoroughly later) meaning that Link can now hit characters above him like he always should have. It's now possible to hit characters on the lower platforms of battlefield with the dash attack.

What the OP is missing are the changes to our Dash Attack and Dtilt.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Get ****ing wrecked aerobone.

Also thanks to aerobone for making me notice!

Reported for flaming.

 

[sWiTcHeRoO [疾~斬]]

Any progress on Dantarion's data mining?

 

[Shaya]

Any progress on Dantarion's data mining?

Not sure, but he's aware of our calls for a hero!
Not much more can be done except stalking him on twitter, apparently he's busy with multiple projects and is now looking to try to get them in today?

---

But man, finding that Marth/Lucina buff with the frame data... It's kinda crazy that there could be a lot of these and we don't even notice them, and even worse we don't even have the original frame data to know there's been buffs! UGHH WHAT A TERRIBLE FATE.

 

[Firefoxx]

Its especially shocking given just how many Marth/Lucina players there are and how obsessively they dissect any/every possible change (pp u-tilt, dancing blade, etc.)

 

[A2ZOMG]

Not sure, but he's aware of our calls for a hero!
Not much more can be done except stalking him on twitter, apparently he's busy with multiple projects and is now looking to try to get them in today?

---

But man, finding that Marth/Lucina buff with the frame data... It's kinda crazy that there could be a lot of these and we don't even notice them, and even worse we don't even have the original frame data to know there's been buffs! UGHH WHAT A TERRIBLE FATE.

So is it safe to assume we still don't have an easy way to datamine ending lag? Last I heard this game supposedly does that nonsense directly on the animation files rather than on action data thus leading to complications?

 

[Shaya]

Apparently all animation endings are all in one single encrypted file that has it's encryption changed every patch.

 

[Vipermoon]

Its especially shocking given just how many Marth/Lucina players there are and how obsessively they dissect any/every possible change (pp u-tilt, dancing blade, etc.)

Lol idk if there was any character forum before the Marcinas that had frame data.

 

[Cassio]

I still have the old wii u patch. Too bad we can't give someone a copy of each version (or just have patch notes) .

 

[Scarlet Jile]

This thread was updated in the future?

 

[Shaya]

Whoops it was already past midnight here when I updated the title.

 

[FirstaLasto]

I've done some testing and I'd like to clarify some things about the buffs to Kirby's usmash and dsmash:
Dsmash has a knockback increase on both the early hit and the late sourspot (both hits KO around 4% earlier on 3DS FD; 120% -> 116%, 167% -> 163%).
Usmash has only gotten a knockback increase on the initial sweetspot; all other hits seem to KO around the same percentage as before (at least on 3DS FD).

 

[LordWilliam1234]

But man, finding that Marth/Lucina buff with the frame data... It's kinda crazy that there could be a lot of these and we don't even notice them, and even worse we don't even have the original frame data to know there's been buffs! UGHH WHAT A TERRIBLE FATE.

Marth's Jab 1 is 29 frames, f-tilt is 39 frames in Wii U 1.02.

Marth's jab 1 is 26 frames, f-tilt is 36 frames in Wii U 1.07.

So that change was in this patch.

If needed I can provide a gif.

I'll go through Marth's/Lucina's frame data to see if I can find anything else, frame-wise, that got changed.

Dtilt

• Can no longer spike characters hanging from the ledge for unknown reasons

Actually it can. Yoshi you can spike from the ledge now, he couldn't before. But other characters that he could spike from the ledge, he can't anymore.

Either way it did get changed. But I have no idea what the heck is up with the sweetspot on that move...

Also the frames for Link's spin attack you have is a bit off. Front hit is 8 frames now, not 9: back hit is 10 frames though as you said. Total move duration was reduced by 3 frames, not 4, as the minimum charge time was reduced by 3 frames.

 

[Elessar]

Marth's Jab 1 is 29 frames, f-tilt is 39 frames in Wii U 1.02.

Marth's jab 1 is 26 frames, f-tilt is 36 frames in Wii U 1.07.

So that change was in this patch.

If needed I can provide a gif.

I'll go through Marth's/Lucina's frame data to see if I can find anything else, frame-wise, that got changed.


Actually it can. Yoshi you can spike from the ledge now, he couldn't before. But other characters that he could spike from the ledge, he can't anymore.

Either way it did get changed. But I have no idea what the heck is up with the sweetspot on that move...

Also on Link's spin attack the front hit is 8 frames, not 9. Back hit is 10 frames though as you mentioned.

Thing is that we can't find a consistent sweetspot for the meteor now. Apparenrly it's easier to hit with it, but ti doesn't hit under the ledge unless it's charizrd or yoshi now that you mention it. However, the spike got replaced by a very soft meteor that doesn't kill.

 

[LordWilliam1234]

Thing is that we can't find a consistent sweetspot for the meteor now. Apparenrly it's easier to hit with it, but ti doesn't hit under the ledge unless it's charizrd or yoshi now that you mention it. However, the spike got replaced by a very soft meteor that doesn't kill.

Yeah, previously I think the sweetspot was along the edge of the blade; it would only spike if only the edge hit the opponent (which explained why it would spike Mario and many other characters but not Yoshi at the edge). Now it's...I have no idea. The center?

Also it still spikes. They just need to be at around 110% for it to get that effect now, which I believe is related to the massive knockback nerf you noted.

 

[Elessar]

Yeah, previously I think the sweetspot was along the edge of the blade; it would only spike if only the edge hit the opponent (which explained why it would spike Mario and many other characters but not Yoshi at the edge). Now it's...I have no idea. The center?

Also it still spikes. They just need to be at around 110% for it to get that effect now, which I believe is related to the massive knockback nerf you noted.

The nerf is significant enough that you need to be at ridiculous % for it to kill you. If hit at 120%, ganondorf can still make it back according to some tests.

 

[Quickhero]

Oh yeah, just confirming that Marth indeed GOT a change. I played Brawl Marth and Smash 4 Marth and tested them both out (while hitting and while not hitting) and I got a gif of the latter to confirm.

 

[Vipermoon]

Marth's Jab 1 is 29 frames, f-tilt is 39 frames in Wii U 1.02.

Marth's jab 1 is 26 frames, f-tilt is 36 frames in Wii U 1.07.

So that change was in this patch.

If needed I can provide a gif.

I'll go through Marth's/Lucina's frame data to see if I can find anything else, frame-wise, that got changed.


Actually it can. Yoshi you can spike from the ledge now, he couldn't before. But other characters that he could spike from the ledge, he can't anymore.

Either way it did get changed. But I have no idea what the heck is up with the sweetspot on that move...

Also the frames for Link's spin attack you have is a bit off. Front hit is 8 frames now, not 9: back hit is 10 frames though as you said. Total move duration was reduced by 3 frames, not 4, as the minimum charge time was reduced by 3 frames.

Can you please test jab 2?

 

[Quickhero]

Can you please test jab 2?

It's the same as in Brawl as well. I tested both out in the gif and you can perform another jab (or any other move) at the exact same time.

 

[LordWilliam1234]

Can you please test jab 2?

Jab 2 was changed as well it seems. It's also 26 frames total. Down from 29.

I'll put the gifs of Jab 1, Jab 2, and f-tilt up here momentarily.

 

[Vipermoon]

Jab 2 was changed as well it seems. It's also 26 frames total. Down from 29.

I'll put the gifs of Jab 1, Jab 2, and f-tilt up here momentarily.

Okay thank you!

 

[LordWilliam1234]

Here we go. As usual, top is pre-patch, bottom is post-patch.

Jab 1:

Jab 2:

F-tilt:

All were reduced in total frames by 3.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Sorry I thought the jab mention implied both.

But yeah, both have an FAF of 26 or w/e.