Meta Knight Q&A Thread

[Boofy!]

You can also use your ledgejump to perform platform canceling.

doing this with falco or fox is godlike

 

[Staco]

learn to punish wolf from below and offstage, as well as his smashes, and the matchup goes wildly in your favor.

there are literally no MKs with matchup experience with wolf though

The MU doesn't go widely in your favor, its still pretty close, when the players know the MU. +1

 

[Kuro~]

MK has a pseudo-platform cancel with his dair and midair jump. It's pretty much the same but not a legit PC.

 

[Kaffei]

So is Bair>Dsmash a legit combo? lol

Yes but you have to buffer a turn around so it hits with the 1st hit of dsmash and not the back hit

 

[Exdeath]

How the **** do you deal with olimar? I really, really struggle to get past even an incredibly bad olimar. Approaches from the ground get completely shut down, and aerial approaches tend to eat usmashes. What do I do about this? How the hell do you get in on this character?

Meta Knight can't really get in on Olimar unless Olimar makes a mistake, however it's not difficult to do that. Against bad Olimars I just retreat rising Dairs until they hold shield for a bit, Neutral B, and proceed to take their stock.

 

[KassandraNova]

So is Bair>Dsmash a legit combo? lol

YES YES YES! I love doing this. <3<3

I was going to put it in my video about the uses of Bair! Lmao.
Like everything in brawl it's pretty situational. haha.

 

[Dr. Tuen]

YES YES YES! I love doing this. <3<3

I was going to put it in my video about the uses of Bair! Lmao.
Like everything in brawl it's pretty situational. haha.

I use this as a sort of trap sometimes (some people in the PNW even recognize it as the "Tuen Trap", lol). The bair -->dsmash is just a part of it. I like to stand on the platform of battlefield when the opponent is on the edge. if they roll on, attack on, or do some kind of ledge hop move, then drop and bair to dsmash. if they go higher, dash to the end of the platform (or stay where you are... depends on the spacing) and use grounded shuttle loop. It's pretty awesome.

Also, be sure to turn around when dsmashing. Otherwise it doesn't come out fast enough.

Also also, nothing is guaranteed if they shield the bair.

Also also also, you must cancel the bair before the third hit. That hit has too much knockback to follow up on.

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Question for anyone with the ability (hacks) to find out:

When gliding, if you cancel the glide, how many frames until you can act again? (this is assuming you do not touch the ground. like... if you wanted to cancel the glide and uair ASAP, how long does that take?)

 

[Player-4]

So is Bair>Dsmash a legit combo? lol

Just like anything in Brawl, it can be SDI'd, but for 95% of the time and unless it's someone like Peach or Puff, yes it works.

Bair into a lot of stuff works. I like to do Bair (first 1-2 hits obviously) into turn around grab or Ftilt.

And unlike what Kaffei said, you don't have to do turn around Dsmash for it to work. You can hit with the back side of Dsmash out of Bair.

Here's a simple little tip, treat your opponent like they're stupid. Until they earn your respect of the MU or character or moves you're using, don't stop doing it.

If they get out of your Bair > whatever set ups, that's when you stop going for them. If they get out of Bair to back side Dsmash then stop trying for that and go for the turn around Dsmash.

One question I have though is how many frames does it take to do a buffered turn around? I only ask because MKs Dsmash is 5 frames for the front and 10 for the back, so if turn around is close to 5 frames or at 5 frames then doing the backside of Dsmash would be the same or almost the same as a buffered turn around Dsmash out of Bair.

 

[Kaffei]

Just like anything in Brawl, it can be SDI'd, but for 95% of the time and unless it's someone like Peach or Puff, yes it works.

Bair into a lot of stuff works. I like to do Bair (first 1-2 hits obviously) into turn around grab or Ftilt.

And unlike what Kaffei said, you don't have to do turn around Dsmash for it to work. You can hit with the back side of Dsmash out of Bair.

Here's a simple little tip, treat your opponent like they're stupid. Until they earn your respect of the MU or character or moves you're using, don't stop doing it.

If they get out of your Bair > whatever set ups, that's when you stop going for them. If they get out of Bair to back side Dsmash then stop trying for that and go for the turn around Dsmash.

One question I have though is how many frames does it take to do a buffered turn around? I only ask because MKs Dsmash is 5 frames for the front and 10 for the back, so if turn around is close to 5 frames or at 5 frames then doing the backside of Dsmash would be the same or almost the same as a buffered turn around Dsmash out of Bair.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2uJ8YQNtRMk#t=3m12s
Back side of dsmash after 2 hits of bair is not guaranteed

but yea you're right if they dont know that you can shield it then just keep doing the back side of dsmash

 

[Player-4]

Lol you just posted a vid of the best reactionary player in the entire world (Smash wise at least).

But, I get what you're saying.

 

[Albert.]

Yeah Ally's reaction time is documented to be ridiculously good, but that doesn't mean that mid-level/high-level players aren't going to be shielding after the falling Bair in situations like that.

For Snake, at least, In a rock-paper-scissors situation like that where it's either the "Get hit by the Dsmash" or "Shield the dsmash, but he might grab instead" type thing, It seems smarter for the Snake player to risk getting grabbed, instead of risk getting hit by a fresh back-side Dsmash. The follow ups from a grab are less consistent then the near-death position after getting hit with a Dsmash (but living) at that percent.

Remember, One of the most reliable ways to kill snake is the "Falling Uair into Nair/Dair to punish Airdodge" and it kills surprising early sometimes, depending on the height/positioning/boldness of the MetaKnight

 

[Kaffei]

Lol you just posted a vid of the best reactionary player in the entire world (Smash wise at least).

But, I get what you're saying.

?? it's not a matter of reaction you were saying that "you don't have to turn around" as if bair to back side dsmash was guaranteed. im just talking about guaranteed stuff.

 

[Player-4]

?? it's not a matter of reaction you were saying that "you don't have to turn around" as if bair to back side dsmash was guaranteed. im just talking about guaranteed stuff.

No no, read again, I didn't say it was guaranteed, I just said most of the time it will work, but in some cases it won't due to people either knowing or people just having really good reaction time.

I also went onto say, do stuff that in a sense pseudo works until they stop what you're getting away with

 

[Exdeath]

A lot of players hold shield and will shield just as soon as Ally would. What is guaranteed varies from character and percent.

 

[Kaffei]

im gonna put that on my to do list: test bair to dsmash on every character and % intervals of 10

 

[Thebest1pj]

lmao bair to dmsahs is sooooo ****ing good.

wifi combo that works offline

 

[Exdeath]

im gonna put that on my to do list: test bair to dsmash on every character and % intervals of 10

I was working on that just this morning haha.

 

[phi1ny3]

I thought bair -> move was recognized as the ksizzle combo :\

Tuen trap is more catchy though tbh, and since he's from my state, I feel that is what I'd call it.

 

[Player-4]

I thought Nado > Nado was the Ksizzle combo

 

[Exdeath]

I thought Nado > Nado was the Ksizzle combo

I thought that Neutral B*30+Bthrow into Halberd's bomb was the Ksizzle combo.

Ksizzle the combo fiend, obviously.

 

[Napos]

Glide tossing with Meta? I saw a few vids. Ex would be anti in the meta vids. I know how to glide toss but how does he make meta glide so far?

 

[Boofy!]

same as any other character, just learn the timing.

 

[ksizl4life]

name search and skimming.

me and shadow "discovered" bair into stuff and fair into stuff a long time ago. reminds me of the Shadow Lock he made

With MK, Fast fall fair and they pop up, into jump fast, footstool them, fall with weak nair, d-tilt lock. If they air dodge after the Fair when you're jumping, dair them under you so you at least get some damage.

Idk if people discovered this but we never told anyone cuz it was around the time that mk ban debate was happening. don't give 2 ****s anymore though lol

Bair to dsmash doesn't work on other MK's. Shadow would always aerial up b me after the bair ended since the bair would get him in the air.

/gone.

 

[Dr. Tuen]

In my experience, turning the dsmash around on the bair --> dsmash "combo" prevents people from being able to shield. they can, however, smash DI it. So you can reduce their chances of being able to do THAT but cancelling the bair after the first hit. Less damage is incurred, but if it's the battlefield set up I mentioned before, they're off the stage... which is highly beneficial to you anyways.

@ksizzle idk if you meant aerial fair to footstool, but I know you can cancel the fair before the third hit and they'll pop right over your head (barring any weird SDI). I'm not sure if enough stun is generated to get a footstool in the cancelled-fair case though.

==

Also, does anyone know this?

When gliding, if you cancel the glide, how many frames until you can act again? (this is assuming you do not touch the ground. like... if you wanted to cancel the glide and uair ASAP, how long does that take?)

 

[Thebest1pj]

ksizzle has spoken.

 

[KassandraNova]

name search and skimming.

me and shadow "discovered" bair into stuff and fair into stuff a long time ago. reminds me of the Shadow Lock he made

With MK, Fast fall fair and they pop up, into jump fast, footstool them, fall with weak nair, d-tilt lock. If they air dodge after the Fair when you're jumping, dair them under you so you at least get some damage.

Idk if people discovered this but we never told anyone cuz it was around the time that mk ban debate was happening. don't give 2 ****s anymore though lol

Bair to dsmash doesn't work on other MK's. Shadow would always aerial up b me after the bair ended since the bair would get him in the air.

/gone.

This is pretty useful. Thank you dude.

 

[BadKarma]

whats the best way to kill donkey kong? I can't kill him till like 195 -_-
I save my down smash till like 160 but it just doesn't seem to cut it :/

 

[BlueZebra]

whats the best way to kill donkey kong? I can't kill him till like 195 -_-
I save my down smash till like 160 but it just doesn't seem to cut it :/

Gotta kill him by the ledges (shuttle loop and nair are great options), otherwise they'll airbrake, spin back over and punch you in the ****ing face.

 

[Orion*]

With MK, Fast fall fair and they pop up, into jump fast, footstool them, fall with weak nair, d-tilt lock. If they air dodge after the Fair when you're jumping, dair them under you so you at least get some damage.
/gone.

go back to your hole

 

[Staco]

Thats so impractical, it will probably work vs. a CPU but not vs. a human player.
Fair has got lots of lag and you can´t just jump up afterwards and footstool, except your enemy is doing nothing.
If they attack and you just jump up you will get hit.

 

[earla]

whats mk's best anti air tools?

 

[-LzR-]

Grounded Shuttle Loop. Eats aerials alive. If it doesn't, nado covers a lot of options too. They alone of course won't beat everything and neither might work on long ranged lagless aerials.

 

[Staco]

Uhm, define "air".
There are a lot of different things which work in different situations.

 

[clowsui]

do you mean in the traditional fighter sense of an AA? AAs are weird in this game i think

 

[Exdeath]

Thats so impractical, it will probably work vs. a CPU but not vs. a human player.
Fair has got lots of lag and you can´t just jump up afterwards and footstool, except your enemy is doing nothing.
If they attack and you just jump up you will get hit.

It works very well, especially since virtually no Meta Knight uses this right now. I haven't even heard of someone trying to Dtilt lock someone else in tournament outside of the famous Seibrik combo vs. ESAM, and I'd say that worked out pretty well -- even if it was situational.

Situational MK combos are really under-rated because they're so good and have the benefit of being -- well -- under-used. Most of them are near 0-Death status and in terms of profile, the players who will actually know how to deal with MK's Dtilt lock won't be good, because they won't allot their time to something that they will encounter so little.

do you mean in the traditional fighter sense of an AA? AAs are weird in this game i think

I agree, but I think that it's for the better.

 

[Boofy!]

the players who will actually know how to deal with MK's Dtilt lock won't be good, because they won't allot their time to something that they will encounter so little.

am i reading this correctly? what you are saying is people who know what to do against mk's dtilt lock are not good players, since good players don't use their time learning how to defend against it?

 

[Exdeath]

am i reading this correctly? what you are saying is people who know what to do against mk's dtilt lock are not good players, since good players don't use their time learning how to defend against it?

I said by profile. Practically speaking, knowing how to SDI/avoid the Dtilt lock is pretty pointless right now because no one uses it. As such, the people who would know how to do so probably don't budget their time well, which is not a trait that belongs to significant tournament threats.

 

[marcookker]

Who is the best metaknight?

 

[Exdeath]

Who is the best metaknight?

Mew2King is the best overall Meta Knight.

 

[Kaffei]

Who is the best metaknight?

Mew2Kin g