Mario Questions and Answers; Ask here first!

[Inferno3044]

Well we each have our own opinions. Lol at Mario ditto being harder than Falco on Brinstar.

 

[A2ZOMG]

Seriously, Mario dittos are gay as ****. Disregard the matchup ratio for a moment and just think how stupid Mario is to deal with on Brinstar.

Like I want to say Mario beats Mario 60/40, just because of how stupidly the matchup favors the defensive playstyle.

 

[MARLX]

What is the match up between mario and falco?

 

[HeroMystic]

60:40 Falco

 

[~ Gheb ~]

65:35 or 70:30 Falco imo

 

[2fast]

What's so bad about Falco? I've gone even at least even with every falco I've played. Sure he can chain grab to spike but if the Mario's smart, he can easily recovery. Giving falco damage is not hard and gimping him is extremely easy. Falco doesn't have that many approach options and his lasers are easy to deal with if your reactions are fast enough. Fire balls are useless but all Falco's usually fight the same (one may be more campy than the other but that's it) so reading them isn't much of a challedge.

 

[Matador]

Wow, 70:30 Falco?

What Falco put YOU over his knee? Sheesh.

 

[2fast]

In my personal opinion I'd say 55:45 Falco's advantage. Or -1 with that new ratio scale. We have the tools to deal with Falco. We **** him offstage, onstage I'd give him a slight advantage onstage because of the range of his attacks (especially that f-smash, it's range is deceiving).

 

[HeroMystic]

M@V's Falco put me over his knee.

70:30 is a no. I can see 65:35 but that's a stretch.

@2fast: I originally said 55:45 Falco myself until I learned Falco is a extremely gay with his laser camping, and approaching him makes you eat a jab or ftilt.

 

[Matador]

I personally think that's where it is too, though I can live with -2...

Just don't see the big deal about him.

M@V? Really?

 

[2fast]

Edit: Whoopsie

 

[HeroMystic]

M@V? Really?

Yes M@V. It was like a year ago at a tournament before I went on a hiatus.

 

[Matador]

2Fast...how'd you repeat your post 6 minutes from the original?

The techskill on this guy, I swear XD

 

[~ Gheb ~]

What exactly can you do against Falco?

 

[Matador]

What exactly can you do against Falco?

I just approach it knowing his options beforehand.

His spotdodge is ********. His jab is stupid good. Laser shenanigans (SH laser > jab or ftilt. Laser to play keep-away). 45% cg that leads into a potential gimp or may reset into greater damage earlier...And his main KO set-up is laser to DACUS...

There's other stuff, but at long as you know what to look out for, then there's always something you can do about it.

Then we have some advantages here too...grab-hungry characters are easier to bait into Fsmash. Fludd does things to his illusion, and cape gimps it. When comboing Falco (which many claim is impossible), end your string early and shield or pivot grab. That way, if he attempts to break out with Dair or Nair, you can nail him with an OOS option or grab and make him think twice about it next time. Now he may be more keen to airdodge or jump as a mix-up for escaping combos, which can lead to more damage for us on a good read.

I don't see anything that he can do that completely shuts us down. Dealing with laser keep-away is as easy as powershielding and walking forward.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

I don't think a good Falco is "grab hungry". I still don't see how we're supposed to approach him. I guess I just suck at the match-up =/

 

[Matador]

Moreso than most characters, imo since they benefit more from it. Same with D3 and Olimar.

Low risk, very high reward.

Also, you could just be playing better Falco players than I am. I've never felt walled to the point where approaching feels kinda hopeless vs Falco.

 

[2fast]

2Fast...how'd you repeat your post 6 minutes from the original?

The techskill on this guy, I swear XD

You know it it's a funny story actually.

 

[SKidd]

2fast, teach me how to warp through time please.

 

[A2ZOMG]

I just approach it knowing his options beforehand.

His spotdodge is ********. His jab is stupid good. Laser shenanigans (SH laser > jab or ftilt. Laser to play keep-away). 45% cg that leads into a potential gimp or may reset into greater damage earlier...And his main KO set-up is laser to DACUS...

There's other stuff, but at long as you know what to look out for, then there's always something you can do about it.

Then we have some advantages here too...grab-hungry characters are easier to bait into Fsmash. Fludd does things to his illusion, and cape gimps it. When comboing Falco (which many claim is impossible), end your string early and shield or pivot grab. That way, if he attempts to break out with Dair or Nair, you can nail him with an OOS option or grab and make him think twice about it next time. Now he may be more keen to airdodge or jump as a mix-up for escaping combos, which can lead to more damage for us on a good read.

I don't see anything that he can do that completely shuts us down. Dealing with laser keep-away is as easy as powershielding and walking forward.

Wait, Falco is grab hungry? Don't make me laugh. I actually play Falco.

Falco has the best normal combos in the game. He doesn't NEED to grab to get you to 60% really quickly and reliably.

Let's try something more improvised, like N-air -> U-tiltx2 -> B-airx2 as a hypothetical example. That's about 47% if that all hits. And trust me, it's not as hard as it sounds to pull off bull**** like this as Falco. If I end that with a Shine while you're in the air, that's about 53%. If I F-smash you before you hit the ground, or as you get up from the edge, now we're talking perhaps 62%. Falco's damage output is RIDICULOUS.

Oh wait, you could I guess airdodge the first B-air. Hardly matters. The 2nd one will hit you anyway and you're still taking over 30% for letting Falco touch you at low percents.

Furthermore, lol no. Falco is not easy to bait with F-smash. His F-smash outranges YOUR REVERSE F-SMASH for crying out loud. You're easy for him to bait into his F-smash. Good luck punishing it if he charges it. You can't simply roll behind Falco and punish this one keep in mind, partly because it does hit behind him. Partly because he'll just move forward out of range if he releases.

I should point out. Falco's silent laser is +3 on powershield at point blank range. This literally means that he can Jab you before you can even let go of shield. You could I guess buffer a spotdodge to avoid the grab, and then you get Jabbed regardless. Falco's Jab -> rapid Jabs does nice damage keep in mind. You can expect about 11-12% with not completely optimal DI.

 

[2fast]

You make Falco sound broken 0.o.

 

[HeroMystic]

I actually play Falco.

How many characters do you play anyway? >.>

Also Silent Lasering makes me go wtf.

 

[A2ZOMG]

You make Falco sound broken 0.o.

I hate Falco and yes, he is stupidly broken. The thing that depresses me is his moves are just like Mario's...except they are a ton better and the combos I normally do with Mario that only work occasionally...they work with Falco. Consistently. Falco doesn't need to chaingrab and in my opinion should not even be trying to chaingrab to get damage.

How many characters do you play anyway? >.>

Also Silent Lasering makes me go wtf.

Three competitively. G&W, Mario, and Falco.

Not counting the other random characters I picked up for fun and for the sake of learning matchups.

 

[Matt07]

How many characters do you play anyway? >.>

Also Silent Lasering makes me go wtf.

I agree on Silent Lasering, so stupid .

 

[Matador]

Wait, Falco is grab hungry? Don't make me laugh. I actually play Falco.

Falco has the best normal combos in the game. He doesn't NEED to grab to get you to 60% really quickly and reliably.

Nobody said he NEEDED to grab, but for one grab meaning a CG to 45% and free gimp opportunity on Mario, he'll want it.

That's not to say that a good Falco will wrecklessly try to grab you, but if he thinks he's got a good chance of punishing improper spacing with a grab, he's more likely to go for it than other characters. That's just simple risk:reward.

Let's try something more improvised, like N-air -> U-tiltx2 -> B-airx2 as a hypothetical example. That's about 47% if that all hits. And trust me, it's not as hard as it sounds to pull off bull**** like this as Falco. If I end that with a Shine while you're in the air, that's about 53%. If I F-smash you before you hit the ground, or as you get up from the edge, now we're talking perhaps 62%. Falco's damage output is RIDICULOUS.

Oh wait, you could I guess airdodge the first B-air. Hardly matters. The 2nd one will hit you anyway and you're still taking over 30% for letting Falco touch you at low percents.

I've NEVER seen your theorycrafting get to this point before...

Assuming Mario is brain-dead and isn't using SDI, normal DI, upB, Nair, or airdodge/shield/spotdodge during this onslaught and actually eats the whole thing...

What point are you trying to make with this? That Falco can rack damage off a ****load of good reads?

So can anyone. Falco does it a bit better than most, yeah...but not by some huge margin like you're making it seem.

Furthermore, lol no. Falco is not easy to bait with F-smash. His F-smash outranges YOUR REVERSE F-SMASH for crying out loud. You're easy for him to bait into his F-smash. Good luck punishing it if he charges it. You can't simply roll behind Falco and punish this one keep in mind, partly because it does hit behind him. Partly because he'll just move forward out of range if he releases.

Okay, MANY things wrong with this part.

Baiting him into Fsmash has NOTHING to do with the range of his own Fsmash, especially in regards to how I was referring to baiting him. What I'm referring to is when you make the Falco think that mis-spaced your attack (aerial usually), then airdodging/walking away, and punishing their whiffed grab with an Fsmash. Kirin, Boss, 2Fast, Coolwhip and Omari all do this, and it works on every character (I DARE you to argue this. I've been doing this since '08 and have caught players ranging from Chu to M2K with this at one time or another). I was saying this works well since Falco will want to punish with grab more often than not.

Second issue with this part...Why in God's name are you rolling behind anyone charging a smash?

Why, as Mario, are you rolling behind anyone, ever??

You punish something like that by gauging the range and staying outside but close enough to capitalize on ending lag. Either that, or shield and get him OOS. Rolling behind is a BIG no-no.

I should point out. Falco's silent laser is +3 on powershield at point blank range. This literally means that he can Jab you before you can even let go of shield. You could I guess buffer a spotdodge to avoid the grab, and then you get Jabbed regardless.

Don't let Falco laser you at that range then? You guys seem to forget that Falco jumping up to laser makes him vulnerable to a few things as well.

 

[A2ZOMG]

Nobody said he NEEDED to grab, but for one grab meaning a CG to 45% and free gimp opportunity on Mario, he'll want it.

That's not to say that a good Falco will wrecklessly try to grab you, but if he thinks he's got a good chance of punishing improper spacing with a grab, he's more likely to go for it than other characters. That's just simple risk:reward.

Uh, I don't get why you think this makes Falco grab happy. Being grab happy as you are suggesting is simply being stupid.

Assuming Mario is brain-dead and isn't using SDI, normal DI, upB, Nair, or airdodge/shield/spotdodge during this onslaught and actually eats the whole thing...

You cannot normal DI several of Falco's low percent combos. SDIing out of anything that isn't explicitly an extended multihit attack is much harder than you're trying to say it is. N-air loses to almost everything Falco does. Airdodging also loses to the same things N-air does given that Falco actually has the physics to chase reflexive airdodges. His combos are BROKEN because more often than not, they actually do cover all options. Especially on characters that are on the floaty side like Mario.

What point are you trying to make with this? That Falco can rack damage off a ****load of good reads?

So can anyone. Falco does it a bit better than most, yeah...but not by some huge margin like you're making it seem.

Falco not only racks a **** ton of damage with reads. His combos are so good he doesn't even NEED reads, or hell even his chaingrab to rack massive damage. I am not exaggerating when I say Falco has the best normal combos in the game. They are the best not only in terms of damage, but in true reliability. I don't even need to guess if my opponent dodges if they're above me and floaty. I just jump at them and spam B-air, and it HITS them. Period.

Baiting him into Fsmash has NOTHING to do with the range of his own Fsmash, especially in regards to how I was referring to baiting him. What I'm referring to is when you make the Falco think that mis-spaced your attack (aerial usually), then airdodging/walking away, and punishing their whiffed grab with an Fsmash. Kirin, Boss, 2Fast, Coolwhip and Omari all do this, and it works on every character (I DARE you to argue this. I've been doing this since '08 and have caught players ranging from Chu to M2K with this at one time or another). I was saying this works well since Falco will want to punish with grab more often than not.

Why would Falco get baited this way any more than any other character? The situation you are suggesting firstoff is only more likely to work if Mario is at low percents against a so called grab happy Falco, which he's only going to be at the start of a match, or after getting killed. Secondly, Falco often gets a lot more use out of Jab oos, and THEN grabbing.

Not counting the fact he has many more good OOS options besides grab. F-tilt, SideB, retreat laser, B-air, D-air to name a few.

Second issue with this part...Why in God's name are you rolling behind anyone charging a smash?

Why, as Mario, are you rolling behind anyone, ever??

You punish something like that by gauging the range and staying outside but close enough to capitalize on ending lag. Either that, or shield and get him OOS. Rolling behind is a BIG no-no.

That's not solving the problem. The point is if Falco spaces his F-smash correctly, Mario can do very very little to punish it given the massive range, and given that Mario has to actually be inside Falco's F-smash range to do anything for the whole match. My point in why you can't roll behind his F-smash is important. You can actually roll behind Mario's F-smash as an option to punish it. The range on Falco's F-smash however covers so many more options. If all Mario can do is just hope that Falco throws it out poorly and play with better spacing to deal with F-smash, that sucks.

Don't let Falco laser you at that range then? You guys seem to forget that Falco jumping up to laser makes him vulnerable to a few things as well.

Like what? If he SH lasers on autopilot in close range...sure. If he's throwing out F-tilts, Jabs, Shines, SideBing, B-airs, anything else, what does Mario do? At best Mario can just try his luck with poking with B-air and F-tilt....and not only is the reward for that mediocre, Falco has plenty of options that crush those on a read.

 

[Matador]

*sigh*...

When I say grab-happy, I mean it the same way that D3 and ICs are grab-happy, A2. Given the choice to punish an opponent with any move in their arsenal, D3 and ICs will choose grab unless they are going for the kill. The same applies to Falco because it rewards him more than anything else that he can possibly do.

That said, if one were to bait Falco by feigning vulnerability to punishment, then Falco would use grab to capitalize because, if successful, then he gets a greater reward than any other attack. Am I making sense?

I also disagree that the combo you fashioned is as solid as you suggest, but I'm not gonna get into theory-fighter with you.

I ALSO disagree that Falco limits Mario so vastly but, again, I'm not gonna play theory-fighter with you.

He's got great options, but he's not this air-tight character that Mario can't penetrate. Perhaps I'll have to prove this.

 

[2fast]

Matador vs DEHF $5 MM. Les go.

 

[A2ZOMG]

I also disagree that the combo you fashioned is as solid as you suggest, but I'm not gonna get into theory-fighter with you.

This is the ironic part. I'm actually not playing theory fighter at all. You're the one trying to dispute my in game observations with your theories.

What I'm telling you from actually playing people INCLUDING my friend Crackle who essentially taught me how to play Falco is that Falco's combos are in fact really really ridiculously stupidly good due to his physics. Simple strings where you B-air people after putting them above you as Falco aren't just easy to do, they're GUARANTEED to work just due to how stupidly good Falco's physics are. I U-tilt B-airx2 people in consecutive matches. I'm not even mixing up my playstyle, I'm just spamming that **** once I hit confirm that my opponents are above me because it covers all options.

Grabbing people with Falco and getting the chaingrab is hugely overrated given how easy it is to play to avoid that. Falco's grab isn't broken because of that. It's broken because of the fact at high percents, he can D-throw -> BDACUS for kills, and if you DI towards him and he chooses to react to that, he gets a free aerial for reasons mentioned earlier. Now THAT is a reason why Falco's grab is stupidly good.

Either way though, Falco doesn't even need to play for grabs given how much he outdamages pretty much the entire cast through simple combos and amazing stage control and pressure options. Falco can win matches easily by just getting his opponents to 200% each stock and finishing them off with F-tilt or weak B-air. There really is no reason for Falco to be grab baited into Mario's F-smash any more easily than anyone else when Mario doesn't really have the tools to shut down Falco's many many safer options that will essentially guarantee a win for Falco anyway.

It was wifi granted, but I think Mars can attest to losing really badly to my Falco as Mario. This isn't a matchup where Mario has a lot of options that can work or even potentially get him massive reward to offset disadvantages. This is a matchup where almost nothing works, and what little does work gets you barely any reward, and is rarely ever favorable in terms of risk. Falco walls Mario far worse than any character that carries a sword besides Metaknight. You're almost never going to trade hits with him anyway, and his hitboxes are both huge, linger in convenient ways (for him), and mostly very low commitment.

 

[Matador]

This is the ironic part. I'm actually not playing theory fighter at all. You're the one trying to dispute my in game observations with your theories.

Me? You say I'm the one theory-crafting? You just made up a combo and said there was literally nothing Mario can do to avoid it when it's clearly not the case.

And how do you figure what I'm saying isn't from practice? Not from playing as Falco, but that doesn't give what I'm saying any less merit. I've done the Mario vs Falco match-up enough to know that the bulk of what you're saying is exaggerated.

Yes, Falco's moves cover many options simutaneously.

Yes, Falco's combo game is, not only extremely effective, but is also very safe.

Yes, Falco limits Mario well.

That's all well and good until you suggest that Mario can't do anything about it aside from pitiful things like Ftilt and spaced bairs. Just because players that you face as Falco fail to deal with combos like utilt to bair x2 doesn't mean that there's nothing they can do about it.

It's simply not how it works in practice. There's so much left up to the player that you're ignoring.

Mario is GOING to get a shdair in. He's GOING to get a follow-up or two after reading DI from a Dthrow or Utilt. He's not going to be cut off from everything the entire match.

 

[A2ZOMG]

Me? You say I'm the one theory-crafting? You just made up a combo and said there was literally nothing Mario can do to avoid it when it's clearly not the case.

It is actually clearly the case. You can argue it's positionally dependant, which would be true, but the point is more often than not once Falco puts a floaty above him, they are GOING TO GET COMBOED. Mario fits that category. And not only does it work, it's quite rewarding.

That's all well and good until you suggest that Mario can't do anything about it aside from pitiful things like Ftilt and spaced bairs. Just because players that you face as Falco fail to deal with combos like utilt to bair x2 doesn't mean that there's nothing they can do about it.

Not getting hit is how you don't get comboed by Falco. He has a half a billion ways of dealing massive damage that don't put him in much risk though, and this doesn't including looking for a chaingrab at low percents.

Mario is GOING to get a shdair in. He's GOING to get a follow-up or two after reading DI from a Dthrow or Utilt. He's not going to be cut off from everything the entire match.

I'm not too fond of SH D-air given that Falco's spotdodge is broken enough to not get hit by it.

Comboing Falco after D-throw is extremely difficult if he simply DIs away and D-airs. You pretty much have to read and powershield the D-air, or more conservatively throw a fireball.

And U-tilt is terrible in this matchup unless you U-tilt Falco basically from exactly 9-25% or so, or if he does not DI and airdodge a D-throw. This is extremely situational.

What's actually worth knowing when you get in on Falco is that U-throw at 0% is far superior to D-throw for starting combos in this matchup, given that there is a chance you can actually double U-air Falco for doing that, and also because U-throw is a tad less affected by DI away than D-throw.

What also sucks about this matchup is killing Falco. Snake is easy to kill because he barely has anything to stop you from ****** his landing for free. Falco...not really. D-air is annoying and has low landing lag. Falco not only can B reverse laser, his SideB is an option for getting out of trouble. He also has many more options than Snake does to shut down Mario's tricks on the ground. FLUDDing his recovery is sorta good, but it cannot be done on reaction. He does incur RCO from grabbing the ledge, but it's not exactly easy for Mario to take advantage of normally.

 

[Matador]

A2, why don't you main a top tier and be a top player?

Post after post I see you concoct hopeless situations and claim that "x should never get caught by y's Utilt unless they screw up." In practice, however, these situations constantly come to pass.

Surely you, who has this amazing, unparalleled understanding of the game should already be a top level player.

 

[A2ZOMG]

That's what Crackle told me. Pick up a top tier like Falco. Become good with him. Wreck **** in tournament by knowing the game better.

I main G&W and I'm picking up Falco. However my Mario is still in many ways more consistent than any other character I've used in tournament, just because I know the character extremely well. I use G&W, Mario, and Falco in tournament. I did place 3rd in a local with this combination.

Also, there's a bunch of matchups besides Falco that I believe Mario is much better in than most of us give him credit for. If you failed to notice my many many posts where I state my firm opinions where Mario does well, you have some reading to do.

Falco however is a matchup that has been universally underestimated by most Mario users. Ever since Melee to be honest. But regardless, Falco in Brawl I firmly believe is harder for Mario than Marth and G&W on the majority of stages. You beat him slightly on Brinstar, but lose badly almost everywhere else.

 

[Omari]

Theory-Fighter sounds like an awesome game, can I play?

@Matador: From what you explained, Falco attempting to grab to punish would in fact benefit him more than another attack. Granted, it doesn't mean become nonchalant about grabbing but rather thinking smarter. Regarding Theory-Fighter? lol...Leave it be bruh, leave it be.

@A2ZOMG: Not getting hit is how you don't get combo-ed by Falco.

What?

That statement (IMO) is one the silly things you've said thus far. Not only is it vague (your advice: don't get grabbed. Okay, that doesn't stop it from happening occasionally now does it? How to prevent these theoretical strings/combos/juggles is our focus, not the other way around.), makes no sense (If we're going to use this logic (A2logic) then characters with broken grabs shouldn't be winning anything. I'd rather focus on ways to prevent getting grabbed.) & doesn't help the MU anymore than what it already is but it's completely irrelevant (If a smasher (a newcomer for starters) asked for my advice on the Mario:Falco MU (ratio & chain-grabbing) & I replied with, "well...you shouldn't be getting grabbed which would make this MU +1 Mario's favor. Honestly, how does this sound to you?). Regarding you helping fellow smashers? Thanks but there's a different way to go about it other than indirectly implying that your fellow smashers are stupid. Maybe you don't see it (yet) but I do...

 

[HeroMystic]

A2, the problem with this discussion is you have the tendency to exaggerate, and you tend to not give insight on how a character can beat another character. Saying something shouldn't happen is disregarding human element and margin of error, which is a large factor in MU discussions. There is no perfect player.

 

[Inferno3044]

I'm starting to think A2 has theorycrafted so deeply that he doesn't even think he's theorycrafting. He is at the point of no return.

 

[A2ZOMG]

You know what's bloody ironic? This is actually how my matches go in person. I'm not theorycrafting. I'm telling you how people who know how to play against Falco interact with my Falco. This is also how my tournament set against SRK's DK went when I went Falco against him. I walled him with lasers, Jabs, tilts, B-air, and comboed his *** when he was above me. I never tried anything fancy and just waited for kills well beyond the 200% range.

That statement (IMO) is one the silly things you've said thus far. Not only is it vague (your advice: don't get grabbed. Okay, that doesn't stop it from happening occasionally now does it? How to prevent these theoretical strings/combos/juggles is our focus, not the other way around.), makes no sense (If we're going to use this logic (A2logic) then characters with broken grabs shouldn't be winning anything. I'd rather focus on ways to prevent getting grabbed.) & doesn't help the MU anymore than what it already is but it's completely irrelevant (If a smasher (a newcomer for starters) asked for my advice on the Mario:Falco MU (ratio & chain-grabbing) & I replied with, "well...you shouldn't be getting grabbed which would make this MU +1 Mario's favor. Honestly, how does this sound to you?). Regarding you helping fellow smashers? Thanks but there's a different way to go about it other than indirectly implying that your fellow smashers are stupid. Maybe you don't see it (yet) but I do...

It's not vague. It's exactly what I mean. Falco can and will find a way to combo you if he hits you. If you really want it to be super specific, then Falco especially is going to combo you if he puts you above him. He can set up things after Jabs, after basically any aerial, after U-tilt, and after lasers.

Falco's chaingrab is not why his grab game is broken or even why Falco gets anywhere. I explained earlier that Falco's grab game is good because of the DACUS/aerial followup. Falco SHOULD NOT be trying to explicitly going for chaingrabs in the majority of his matchups. Not only is it easy for most characters to avoid, Falco has plenty of other options to easily and reliably get the damage he wants.

A2, the problem with this discussion is you have the tendency to exaggerate, and you tend to not give insight on how a character can beat another character. Saying something shouldn't happen is disregarding human element and margin of error, which is a large factor in MU discussions. There is no perfect player.

I ALWAYS factor human error in matchup discussion. It is quantifiable. More important is factoring human error between players who actually know the tools and options in the matchup.

I'm ashamed you don't realize it. And why should I suggest that Mario can beat Falco on any stage besides Brinstar? It's a seriously terrible matchup, and a Falco player only needs to know a few things about Mario to make it a living nightmare for Mario. Playing Crackle, who was a Falco that was also a Mario user, was in fact a living nightmare when all he did was camp me for 8 minutes straight and never took any unnecessary risks. Yeah I could do less than terrible against him with some funny shenanigans including one that let me land a fully charged F-smash on him after he committed to his own charged F-smash...I don't even recall if I ever beat his Falco outside of that one match.

I even told you guys the ONE remotely practical way you can actually try to combo Falco (after U-throw at 0%), and you're not satisfied? Be more grateful.

 

[Omari]

Here we go (again)...

You know what's bloody ironic? This is actually how my matches go in person. I'm not theorycrafting. I'm telling you how people who know how to play against Falco interact with my Falco. This is also how my tournament set against SRK's DK went when I went Falco against him. I walled him with lasers, Jabs, tilts, B-air, and comboed his *** when he was above me. I never tried anything fancy and just waited for kills well beyond the 200% range.

-Granted, you're a skilled smasher (even though I've yet (not) to meet you IRL or played you, I'll definitely give you the BoD (Benefit of Doubt)) but your presentation (how you present yourself & your argument(s)) requires improvement.
-You're definitely theory-crafting & you're in denial (its okay bruh, we'll work through it...).
-Now I can see why several smashers call you selfish. Why? It's true. Re-read this sentence you previously wrote (think). I'm telling you how people who know how to play against Falco interact with my Falco. The world (more or less, the smash community) doesn't revolve around you (we shape it, not one self).
-Agreed that smashers shouldn't attempt anything fancy unless they know exactly what they're doing (that's another topic).

It's not vague. It's exactly what I mean. Falco can and will find a way to combo you if he hits you. If you really want it to be super specific, then Falco especially is going to combo you if he puts you above him. He can set up things after Jabs, after basically any aerial, after U-tilt, and after lasers.

I'm not going to argue.

My point regarding giving advice to your fellow smashers (especially when you're a self-proclaimed Smash Researcher): Don't suggest (IMO) not getting grabbed (vague due to it not explaining how to prevent getting grabbed opposed to actually getting grabbed) as it won't help your fellow smashers prosper.

That's generally speaking (regarding Falco attempting to combo characters who float) when Falco's grounded & you're airborne. I agree that Falco will make an attempt to combo in a sense, but that won't always occur. Realize that you're debating about what Falco can do (options) versus what he actually will do (split decisions).

Falco's chaingrab is not why his grab game is broken or even why Falco gets anywhere. I explained earlier that Falco's grab game is good because of the DACUS/aerial followup. Falco SHOULD NOT be trying to explicitly going for chaingrabs in the majority of his matchups. Not only is it easy for most characters to avoid, Falco has plenty of other options to easily and reliably get the damage he wants.

Regarding Falco's Chain-Grab (CG): While Falco's CG in it's own may not be (IYO) the "ultimate" reason it's declared "broken", it is in fact one of the main (several) reasons why it is what it is (Partly the reason why Falco mains are successful-no offense to any Falco mains out there because it is in fact difficult to pull the advanced ATs that have been discovered thus far).


Yes, I'm aware that this part of your post wasn't directed towards me but I'm going to address this anyway.

I ALWAYS factor human error in matchup discussion. It is quantifiable. More important is factoring human error between players who actually know the tools and options in the matchup.

Not even going to start here...

I'm ashamed you don't realize it. And why should I suggest that Mario can beat Falco on any stage besides Brinstar? It's a seriously terrible matchup.

Here we go...

I even told you guys the ONE remotely practical way you can actually try to combo Falco (after U-throw at 0%), and you're not satisfied? Be more grateful.

Here we go again...What are you saying?

See? This is the **** I'm talking about...Indirectly ridiculing your fellow smashers while increasing your already enormous ego (self-proclaiming yourself as superior to other smashers (possibly human beings) informs me that you're definitely a cocky smasher (& person probably), no ifs, &s or butts about it A2ZOMG which will ultimately become your downfall).

These countless debates with you has gotten far out of hand so I'll end with these words...However you choose to carry-on with your impression(s) (whether they be first-last) is up to you.

 

[HeroMystic]

Rage post.

Keep in mind I actually agreed with you with Falco being a difficult match-up. That doesn't mean however that I'm gonna disregard your behavior in the meantime. If I actually didn't know you I'd say you were trolling, but you're not.

The reason why it's so hard for you to get your point across is because we already got it, but you keep drilling the point in our heads. And when someone tries to have a fair discussion with you, you practically do this:

Keep in mind this has happened every time and is the reason why the Ike boards hate us to the point where they don't even discuss MUs with us anymore.

Contrary to popular belief, people listen to a constructive post more than a jerk post. And the more you act like one the less credible you are. Maybe if you were at Boss' level of play and getting top 8 at regional/national tournaments you'd have the luxury of doing so, but honestly you don't. And since you're known for being like this people are usually willing to brush your analysis aside (you built this up for at least three years).

On a personal level, I know your analysis are good for the most part. Your insight on G&W vs Mario is a main factor why the MU stopped being a 80:20, and you make a lot of informative posts of which I listen to and take into account (like how F-tilt is good), but you'd be taken a lot more seriously with everyone else if you just learned to chill out and be more constructive.

 

[Coolwhip]

Let's try to focus on continuing mario's metagame & finding the formula to make mario
"Broken-tier" then arguing like abuch of little girls.