Louie's Notes-Olimar Q&A Thread!!

[BlueXenon]

I dont main Olimar but I used him for a few matches and I spammed fsmash againt a bowser and won the match. I also used grabs and when he was far away from me I forced him to approach with side b and then spammed fsmash again. I killed using usmash. Does fsmash shut down bowsers moveset?

 

[BSL]

I would imagine fsmash and grab beat all of his approaches. It's not like he has any long range attacks besides lolfirebreath

 

[Dnyce]

Fsmash4lyfe

 

[Sky Pirate]

Yeah, Fsmash is pretty good against Bowser. He can still jab the Pikmin away or PS it if he's grounded, though.

 

[Dnyce]

Nope. Oli fsmash higher on tier list than boozer.

 

[BSL]

If he's jabbing the pikmin or power shielding, why not zoidberg grab?

 

[Dnyce]

Because we can butt **** him so hard with fsmash.

 

[BSL]

I wonder if ftilt beats all of his moves. Would be hilarious.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

It doesn't.

 

[NeeBee]

////////::

 

[Sky Pirate]

Olimar's Forward/Back rolls aren't THAT much worse than most others. You take one fame off of the end of either one and he's tied with most of the cast.

The general opinion on taking MK's Dtilt on-shield is just "try to get away".
- Try being less predictable with your roll habits.
- If he doesn't space it well, you have time to Usmash it OoS.
- You can also jump away OoS and he can't hit you with a follow-up Dsmash/UpB/whatever.

I played around with it a bit with the frame-by-frame, and I think that we can spotdodge a follow-up grab after taking a Dtilt at max/near-max range and rolling away. It's close, but possible.

 

[BSL]

i think he means the distance olimar travels when he rolls.

 

[Sky Pirate]

Oh.

...I have no comment on that.

 

[Noa.]

Fair OoS might work against an mk spamming dtilt. Maybe.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

Because Olimar is so vulnerable in those situations, you have to avoid situations where you would find yourself pressured. I'm not trying to give the generic "don't get grabbed" solution, but considering the character has a good selection of tools for keeping an enemy out, take full advantage of them.

That said, if you do find yourself in that situation (because you will, naturally), you aren't limited to rolling to get away. Have you tried jumping? May seem dangerous at first, but it definitely gives Olimar more options than rolling. And more options for getting away means your opponent has to guess and not just watch and wait for the roll/spot dodge. Not to mention, from a jump you have more options, as long as you're prepared. Like Noa said, you can fair out of shield and possibly catch him off guard. You can use your second jump (extremely risky) if you really need that extra bit of space. Whistling (or air dodge) if you suspect the opponent might catch on to other options, nair is a path I like taking from jumping after a shield. If he whiffs a move when you jump, it should land and combo for free.

Not to say that Olimar isn't vulnerable when pressured, or that it should be impossible for an opponent to infiltrate, but it isn't a lost cause. As long as you make use of what options you have available.

 

[SSS]

What's the difference between his fair and bair? And what are yellows good for?

 

[BSL]

Fair vs Bair: Bair's hitbox comes out and ends earlier, IIRC. Bair has slightly less damage on Y/B/P. Not sure which has more range.

 

[Dabuz]

What's the difference between his fair and bair? And what are yellows good for?

Fair will hit in a 45 degree arc starting from the top of Olimar and has basically no cooldown.

Bair will hit in a 60 degree arc starting from the bottom of Olimar and has quite a bit of cooldown.

 

[Dnyce]

A little late, but hilt always speaks the truth so listen to him!

Also jump oos for god tier options in brawl, lol. **** that ***** yoshi

 

[Youngster Joey]

yellow has the biggest hitboxes right? i might take up olimar. is he really difficult to master or is it just me? recovering and staying on stage seems so hard :/

 

[BSL]

Recovering is hard. If you have to recover, you're doing it wrong.

Playing Olimar is the second gayest thing you could do. The gayest is participating in an Olimar ditto.

When you play Olimar, you run away and throw pikmin at people.

If they get too close for you to comfortably throw pikmin, grab them. Throw them. Combo them. Run away. Throw pikmin.

 

[Youngster Joey]

oh thanks i guess i can go win a tournament with that advice now.

 

[BSL]

You're welcome.

:glasses:

 

[Twigz]

Hey guys I'm not particularly a fan of olimar, but a friend of mines plays him and would like to know:

1) How to not be Gimped
2) how to establish stage control properly

Thanks in advance.

 

[BSL]

1) Whistle has super armor. Use it wisely.

Recover high. If you go low and get hit, you are dead. If you go low and they grab the ledge, you are dead.

Don't get hit (seriously. more on this in #2).

2) Throw lots of pikmin. If you do it right, they have to run at you. If they approach with aerials, aerial them back. The range on pikmin is usually pretty good. If they do a grounded approach, grab them. Throw them off stage to kill them or throw them back across the stage and throw more pikmin.

They shouldn't ever really hit you. If they get too close, run away and throw pikmin. If you can't run away, see ^.

Whistle. It helps you keep stage presence when you get hit. Sure, you take some damage, but whistle->dsmash is good. whistle->anything is good.

Uptilt is good as well, if they're in your face and you can beat their move.





I'm bad at this game, so this could be all wrong. I think it's right.

 

[Twigz]

Thanks for the quick reply

 

[kelumhi]

1) Recover high. If you go low and get hit, you are dead.

I'm just seconding this. If you fail to DI up, your as good as dead 9/10 times.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

Recovering is hard. If you have to recover, you're doing it wrong.

Playing Olimar is the second gayest thing you could do. The gayest is participating in an Olimar ditto.

When you play Olimar, you run away and throw pikmin at people.

If they get too close for you to comfortably throw pikmin, grab them. Throw them. Combo them. Run away. Throw pikmin.

BSL, please don't do this....

yellow has the biggest hitboxes right? i might take up olimar. is he really difficult to master or is it just me? recovering and staying on stage seems so hard :/

Recovering is something you'll have to get accustomed to with regards to Olimar. Picking up Olimar isn't easy, and a lot of people are discouraged by how difficult it seems to be able to keep themselves on the stage with him. If you learn how to make use of the whistle and know when to time his second jump, that's a huge step forward towards recovering well.

I like to save my second jump until I'm horizontal to the ledge. Sometimes I'll jump when I'm still higher (if I'm being edgeguarded in certain manners) or lower if necessary, but the general concept of waiting until you're horizontal to the ledge/stage tends to work the most often and is a good rule for newer Olimar players. When you jump, it's often a good time to whistle at that moment. That exact moment. Practice jumping and immediately whistling so that it'll come naturally when you need to recover. A lot of players will wait until you jump to attack you off the edge. That way they steal your second jump and are able to leave you helpless. Olimar has just about no way to get back to the stage if your second jump is poorly used or stolen by an edge guard. Possibly the most important part of recovering is protecting that second jump and using it effectively.

Yep, Yellow attacks have the largest hitboxes, and actually have more of a disjoint than the others, due to the electricity. They're able to outrange a lot of attacks other pikmin aren't able to. And since pikmin have hurtboxes (meaning they can be attacked and forced to lose their hitbox), a disjoint is handy in cases where an opponent's attack would cancel out your pikmin.

Olimar isn't necessarily the most difficult character, but he's hard to stick to. There's a huge hill you'll have to climb over in the process of picking him up. He'll be frustrating to play at times, but he's a great character that is well worth it.

Twigz, my paragraph on recovering will definitely help your friend if he's having problems getting gimped.

 

[BSL]

Am I wrong, hilt?

Gay isn't a bad thing. It's how you win brawl.

 

[Sky Pirate]

It's the way you choose to phrase these things that might be discouraging or might comes across as trollish, BSL.

Never getting hit is... good, but not always possible for humans. Sometimes taking/trading damage is worth taking a hit, especially with white latches and our whistle (as BSL/Hilt mentioned). You can offer an advantage for the opponent to snatch at, only to take it away with a whistle and punish (and Olimar can punish HARD, regardless of the opponent's percentage) or gain control of the stage.

It isn't nearly as simple as BSL made it out to be.
For example, grabbing isn't always the option to choose when they get up-close. People like to run up and spotdodge the grab or use an attack that knocks us out of it.
Learning when to use options like Fsmash/Usmash OoS/Roll/Spotdodge/Jumping away/Dsmash/what have you is essential. If you just grab all the time when people close in on you, they'll learn to get around it.

Challenging aerials with aerials isn't always a good idea. If a Marth is Fairing, challenging it with Fair will get you Fair'd. Fair can be a good mixup in this situation and can hit him if you start it a bit before he starts his Fair, but you shouldn't be relying exclusively on it to beat the Almighty Falchion.

After a combo, your opponent will often be in the air above you. Simply running away will allow him to land. You should get grounded yourself and make it difficult for him to land with things like pivot grab/Fsmash/Usmash/Dsmash/Utilt/SH Uair/SH UpB/SH Nair. Applying pressure in such a way is not only a good way to get damage, it's also incredibly fun.

 

[Twigz]

Thank you for that piece of info... You guys are awesome

 

[BSL]

See? I told you I was bad at this.

That was what the disclaimer was for, Hilt/SPC. I'm glad you guys came in to weigh in on it. I can't do this on my own.

 

[Youngster Joey]

im willing to put as much time into any character as possible. so much so that im maining a character a month and my time with wolf is just about up and its about time for me to move on. i loved olimar before i got competitive but then i just kept getting gimped. thats when i left him. now im willing to take him back for a month to see how it goes. what is a common thing olimars do that they shouldnt do?

 

[Sky Pirate]

Common new Olimar mistakes? All right, I can take a shot at that.

- Rolling to get around -
Rolling as an evasive action isn't necessarily bad (unless you're being super-predictable about it), but frequently rolling (like to get around) can get you punished. If you're having trouble staying onstage or maintaining stage control, this may be a contributing factor.

- Not spacing Fsmash -
Fsmash is a trap. It has a long-lasting hitbox that can outlast spotdodges/airdodges and can catch people running in. It can be somewhat safe if you're using it properly, but if you're hitting shields point-blank with it, you're going to get destroyed.

- Jabbing everything -
This one is probably just me, but I used to jab to cover everything and got punished a bit for it.

- Recovering improperly -
You have a few options for recovery, but you have to pay attention to what the opponent is doing. When you're knocked away and after you've finished momentum canceling, look for a purple in your line and use Uair or whistle to bring it to the front (if you have enough time). Purple toss is a useful tool for recovery (knocking them off the ledge, forcing them to evade/take a hit if they're coming out to gimp you, etc.) and you can still Uair them off the ledge if you need to. If a purple isn't available, look for a yellow. The larger hitbox means a slightly larger window to tap them off of the ledge with Uair.
Olimar has some good offensive options (aerials and pikmin toss) and defensive options (whistle, whistle bounce, airdodge, footstool) and you aren't restricted to using just one tactic to recover. It's quite common to mix whistle with an offensive option (like whistle to Nair). Fastfalling and immediately airdodging is also incredibly useful, but you need to be careful about doing that out over the edge. Like Hilt said, you should pay attention to when you use your double jump. Different people have different preferences, but many Olimars prefer to come up from below the opponent with a DJ Uair or hold a purple to throw from stage level to clear the ledge.
Sorry, I've forgotten where I was going with this. The point is that Olimar has some good tools for recovering, but you do have to actively think about what you're doing. If you do get smacked with something with some horizontal knockback (or low knockback, depending on where you are) after using your second jump, there is a good chance you're losing a stock.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

Sky Pirate brought up good points, and those are definitely problems you'll see in a lot of Olimars. The first two involve options that Olimar has that aren't necessarily bad options, just bad situations in which the options are used.

What the first three involve is the situation of the Olimar being too close to his enemy. Rolling haphazardly in fear, fsmashing anxiously, jabbing out of habit are all mistakes you'll see made when the Olimar is closed in on. Regarding the third, Olimar's jab is very, very flawed. Even if the opponent is hit by the first hit of the jab, the last hit is not guaranteed. They're able to shield the last hit and punish you for it. Be careful when using jab. If you're able to get the move off, it's actually worth it (it does 15%, which isn't bad for a frame 4 jab), but it's way too easy to get punished for it.

What was said about fsmash can also be applied to grab. Grab is not fast, by any means. Not to mention the fact that Olimar doesn't get grab armor, like every other character does. So when competing with another move the opponent might through out, grab will oftentimes be beat out at point blank.

 

[Ultimate kaos]

Should I be using tilts and stuff? Because I really only use his smashes and aerials, along with pikmin throw. I just dont see a use for them as much.

 

[BSL]

NOTE: THIS POST HAS NO SIGNIFICANCE WHATSOEVER

Olimar's ftilt is so swag.

 

[Sky Pirate]

There was a discussion thread that might help you figure out when and where to use his tilts.
I'll put my two cents in in a bit.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

I'm not a fan of his tilts. Ftilt is no good and dtilt has so few applications. Utilt is the only one with usefulness, but I oftentimes would rather use nair in those situations. It's easier to use out of a shield and isn't as easy to predict and punish as utilt. With utilt, if you're shielded, you're left up close against an opponent ready to pressure you while you're still on the ground. If your nair is shielded (after a jump), you have a lot more options (air dodge, double jump, fair, whistle). You aren't as helpless, even if you still aren't in that great of a situation.

Other Olimars might think differently about them, however.

 

[kelumhi]

I use up-tilt a lot as a mix up against sonic due to the fact that at times a sonic spin dash can go through F-smash but an U-tilt will catch him out of it and gives a chance to punish. Outside of that i would say Hilt nailed it saying that Nair offers more options coming out of it with the same effect.

D-tilt: you can use this to crawl under certain Falco's lazer patterns, but not for too long our they can punish you.

You can also use this to get under some characters moves though it will vary rarely put you into an advantageous position due to ending lag. the only time i can think of this being better then OOS-Upsmash is if your shield is to low to block.

F-tilt on the other hand i think is gold comparatively. i tend to use this quite a bit at the end of combos or during reads. any time that your opponent is out of range of a jab but will have time to block/punish a F-smash, F-tilt will do damage and give you space.

Again though, it is situational to either during a combo when you know they wont have time to react, or when you know that they are coming for a grab or something.