Kong Kollege: Diddy Kong Tactical Discussion

[~@~Tilde~@~]

I actually tried using more dair out of side-B (and just in general) while playing on Netplay tonight, I was extremely pleased with the results. I think it's a really good option to make floatier characters easier to rack up damage on, and I noticed that I was comboing midweight characters much harder at earlier percents.

In an unrelated note, I spent some time tonight getting my teeth kicked in by Kirby. How do you guys deal with his edge stall/kirbycide shenanigans? It seemed like if I ever got behind in stocks he just slowly worked me to the edge and then suicided or gimped me there.

You can dair out of side b?

 

[Soft Serve]

You can dair out of side b?

Side-b slap > follow DI with DJ> Dair them.

 

[Soft Serve]

https://soundcloud.com/thedj****s/new-bananas-feat-dandy-duck
lol smashboards sensors >.>
https://soundcloud.com/thedjdicks%2Fnew-bananas-feat-dandy-duck

 

[SpiderMad]

Something people often forget about is if there's a banana near you while you're shielding, you can jump out while you AGT it. This applies to a banana near the ledge as well while you're on the ledge.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yZaBPp5ZF0#t=160

 

[DeFish]

https://soundcloud.com/thedj****s/new-bananas-feat-dandy-duck
lol smashboards sensors >.>
https://soundcloud.com/thedj%2A%2A%2A%2As%2Fnew-bananas-feat-dandy-duck

If I ever needed a reminder of why I love Diddy, this is it.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Picking up Diddy, what's a good out of shield for him?

 

[DeFish]

Picking up Diddy, what's a good out of shield for him?

Grabs, usmash, nair, and if you're feeling extra cheeky, up-b. Nair can be tricky vs shorter characters, though.

 

[Soft Serve]

Picking up Diddy, what's a good out of shield for him?

Glide tosses and agts are arguably one of the best oos options in the game. Glidetoss back throwing down trips people that are doing deep aerials on your shield thinking that makes it safe.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Glide tosses and agts are arguably one of the best oos options in the game. Glidetoss back throwing down trips people that are doing deep aerials on your shield thinking that makes it safe.

Yeah been practicing glide tossing today with a friend who uses Marth and I love it. I'll practice doing that as well, seems great. AGTS is air glide toss yeah?

Cheers, lads. This character is too fun.

 

[1FD]

theres a local team of falcon diddy and it's really stupid
Diddy throws a banana out when the falcon says FEED ME and he flies by catches the banana and of course he's way better at projectile use than the diddy is and gets control of them right off the bat when diddy decides to run in and she just causes havoc with dash attacks and dd grabs while falcon becomes a flying hyper speed TL bomb thrower type of character
The diddy isn't even the greatest but doubles are hell with the combo
Then they do pika sometimes instead and that's a whole other story when they're on their game
but yeah fast characters that are NOT diddy WITH bananas = ******************

 

[DiSQO_BuNNY]

Didn't read.

 

[Soft Serve]

Sonic\diddy is crazy as well.

Edit: @DISQO i had no idea there was so much Diddy salt in socal. Like I knew some people hated him but I didn't think it could be worse than the complains about diddy in the xanadu stream, but Aggro got on the mic during a crew battle and couldn't stop saying Diddy was op lol. Does socal really think Up-b is unpunishable? or that "Diddy is a smaller faster Ganon" or bananas have no counterplay? Because the salt was palpable over the stream.

 

[Praxis]

Sonic\diddy is crazy as well.

Edit: @DISQO i had no idea there was so much Diddy salt in socal. Like I knew some people hated him but I didn't think it could be worse than the complains about diddy in the xanadu stream, but Aggro got on the mic during a crew battle and couldn't stop saying Diddy was op lol. Does socal really think Up-b is unpunishable? or that "Diddy is a smaller faster Ganon" or bananas have no counterplay? Because the salt was palpable over the stream.

We had a guy on our stream that kept shouting about how OP Diddy is too. It's ridiculous.

I'll watch people repeatedly fail to edgeguard Diddy because they don't know what they're doing and people will scream "Diddy's recovery is too good, nerf it nerf it!" when Diddy isn't even sweetspotting.

 

[ThatGuyYouMightKnow]

 

[Hashtag]

In all honesty, 1 or 2 things could be changed about diddy.

Up b barrels, though if they do this they need to make it easier for him to sweet spot the ledge.

Angle of his fair, make it exactly like sheik's.

Other than that, people don't want to have to learn counterplay to beat a character.

Because they are lazy.

Recently, before I took my break, people here in az started punishing my up b regularly.

 

[Hinichii.ez.™]

So, I tried Diddy the other day, and I liked it, was fun. I've been looking for a secondary for a while now and he seems to fill the needs that needed getting fulfilled. The main thing I would like to do with Diddy, is DEFEAT MARTHHHHHHHH. What do you guys suggest I do when going against him? Oh, how does he fair against M2? I tried it once er twice, got booped, went back to my main lolz. I'm also rather new to the character so any tips in general would be nice. I have read the help threads and guides here and I've gotten some what of a feel for this character.
QUESTIONS, what do you guys go for after you get a dair on people? I've ether gone for another one and then tech chaise if they don't pop up, if they tech it the first time I'll just tech chase, I might start going for some combos, I might fair if their in kill range, sometimes I can pull a naner if they are close at low % and sometimes up B since it kinda kills peps.
Is his dair a spike or meteor? This might have been on one of those threads, bout to check myself, REAL QUICK.
Also, what moves are safe on shield? It looks like a cross up nair and probably dtilt are safe bets, but what else?

 

[Spinosaurus]

What I do against a friend who uses Marth is to space him with bananas. It limits his approach severely. Glide tossing really lets you control the space against him. (Especially if the Marth doesn't know how to glide toss heheheh)

I'd still like tips on the match up as well though, as I recently picked him up like you.

 

[1FD]

You just grab Diddy when he upbs and doesn't snap the ledge
Are the only things that really changed going into 3.0 the banana tripping thing or a few other small buffs?
If it didn't affect his speed or recovery and those are what people are complaining about then why wasn't everyone complaining in 2.6 and stuff?

 

[Soft Serve]

You just grab Diddy when he upbs and doesn't snap the ledge
Are the only things that really changed going into 3.0 the banana tripping thing or a few other small buffs?
If it didn't affect his speed or recovery and those are what people are complaining about then why wasn't everyone complaining in 2.6 and stuff?

Iirc the tracking on up-b barrrels was changed/improved somewhere between 2.6 and 3.02. people were complaining aboutparts of his kit, but that was back when he had diffferent problems. Up-b OoS was really really fast with only like 8 frames of landing lag (it has 18 now, it used to be like samus). It also had more inital distance uncharged and netted more height gain when fully charged. Bananas were semispikes and hard knockdown on anything expect running over them or Glidetoss down on feet, which was argued that it didn't really fit into diddy's game plan. It was great against spacies though, one banana near the ledge was a dead falco. The biggest complaint people had about previous itterations of Diddy was that side-b had zero comitment. Back when it had tilt and smash inputs, you had the option to use the kick a significant time after the grab boxes went away. Basically it was stupid. Side-b slap, Up and down/throw have had their trajectories changes quite a bit, fsmash , upsmash and DA have been tweaked a lot, some itterations more easy to CC/SDI out of than current. Fair got buffed in the transition to 3.0. Side-b hop (and footstool) had their height on short jump lowered for a better mix up potential in the move. His AGT distance got lowered slightly along the road as well, he can't AGT two bananas upward forever anymore. His item throws got bufffed/cleaned up somewhere as well.

Thats all I can remember since I can't find the change logs. I've only been playing Diddy since the end of 2.5/begining of 2.6 though, picked him upat evo 2013 and never looked back. Don't know what he had in dev builds.

Diddy still has some stupid things that he doesn't necessarily need. He has a uniquely threatening neutral game and I think thats fine. He doesn't really need his fair to be quite this good, although he does need a strong air finisher like the fair because most of his kills come more from resets and tech chase reads than heavy hittting combos. I think Diddy has enough tools so that even if he gets hit hard, he will still be a very potent character, just need to be played a lot differently.

 

[King K Rool]

love Diddy in both brawl and PM, hes so quick and tricky, his banana peels are his important factor in his play style (to me). I find that if your opponent is trying to keep distance and make you come to them using your banana peels then are a great way to close the gap. 1st because you have the time frame to throw the peels without being attacked and second is if you place the peels close to your opponent then charge in they have a great chance on taking a fall and being opened up for a combo.

This is one of my main ways on playing Diddy, love the little guy, if they where to change anything on him i guess i would prefer having his jetpack buffed to like it is in Project M, i have to dislikes to Diddy but if they where to add something i would love them orange grenades to be added :D

 

[Praxis]

The 2.6 update removed the semispike property of the bananas, and fixed a bunch of his broken moves to be useful (which was an overall buff, though not a huge one).

For example: In 2.6, Diddy's dash attack and usmash attacks didn't link in to each other properly, if you DI'd right you would pop out of it every single time, which made those moves horrible.

There were a few other mini buffs (IIRC dair comes out 2 frames earlier in 3.0, ftilt got restored to Brawl).

I actually think this was needed- 2.6 Diddy had a lot of issues because of how poorly dash attack and usmash linked together. You'd often get punished for hitting someone with either move, and Diddy needs usmash to fight spacies.

 

[Soft Serve]

What I was saying earlier about doing side-b hop>WL grab isn't as good as I thought it was. the hop does dmg so is stoll a hitbox, and is DI/SDI able as well as recovering faster. It still a good mix-up though. Hop>banana toss, the "sand trap" is still godlike.

 

[DLA]

I found a new banana tech last night. It basically won me winners finals of Wavedash Wednesday.

http://www.twitch.tv/windycitysmash/b/526807224 3:43:55

 

[Soft Serve]

I found a new banana tech last night. It basically won me winners finals of Wavedash Wednesday.

http://www.twitch.tv/windycitysmash/b/526807224 3:43:55

I didn't see anything, maybe it was the time stamp in a wrong place. Can you break now what you found?

alsso if Laz would just d-throw fsmash you when he got the multiple grabs at >100% it would have been GG. Tink's d-throw f-smash is pretty guranteeed at those percents on us

 

[Spinosaurus]

Trying to trip them in real life?

Ah, thinking ahead. Genius strategy.

 

[Praxis]

I found a new banana tech last night. It basically won me winners finals of Wavedash Wednesday.

http://www.twitch.tv/windycitysmash/b/526807224 3:43:55

There was no naner technique at this timestamp Congrats!

 

[Soft Serve]

Trying to trip them in real life?

Ah, thinking ahead. Genius strategy.

boss already optimzied that option
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Kkc3cYg964#t=547

 

[Hinichii.ez.™]

He made y'all slip up mentally
GGs

 

[Spinosaurus]

boss already optimzied that option
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Kkc3cYg964#t=547

But he didn't use real banana peels.

That's the mark of a true Diddy

 

[DLA]

boss already optimzied that option
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Kkc3cYg964#t=547

OMFG lmao that's brilliant

 

[DiSQO_BuNNY]

Yeah @ Soft Serve the socal diddy hate is strong. To the point of it being disgusting and pathetic. And I don't even wanna help people. Like, plenty of characters are just good. We need characters to be good, or else we're basically just playing melee with added mid tiers. And it doesn't even matter that I've put massive work into diddy and my own improvement. I've never played melee, but I'm attempting to better myself. But socal ain't hearing it. They just want exactly what you guys already said, easy counters and minimal work required. And it sucks.

 

[Meechman400]

Sonic\diddy is crazy as well.

Edit: @DISQO i had no idea there was so much Diddy salt in socal. Like I knew some people hated him but I didn't think it could be worse than the complains about diddy in the xanadu stream, but Aggro got on the mic during a crew battle and couldn't stop saying Diddy was op lol. Does socal really think Up-b is unpunishable? or that "Diddy is a smaller faster Ganon" or bananas have no counterplay? Because the salt was palpable over the stream.

I'd like to apologize on behalf of SoCal. You see, a stigma has been created by my region that Diddy is Goku and cannot be beaten. Even though Disqo is literally the ONLY successful Diddy main we have here in SoCal. There's a lot of salt and anomosity towards the character here, and I really hope it changes soon. We should be worrying about getting better as a region instead of crying about one character 24/7. Diddy is definitely a great character, but people are blowing it way out of proportion. AZ made SoCal look pretty silly when K9 solidly beat Disqo at our last SSS.

 

[DiSQO_BuNNY]

Solidly.


It hurts.

 

[Hashtag]

I'd like to apologize on behalf of SoCal. You see, a stigma has been created by my region that Diddy is Goku and cannot be beaten. Even though Disqo is literally the ONLY successful Diddy main we have. There's a lot of salt and anomosity towards the character here, and I really hope it changes soon. We should be worrying about getting better as a region instead of crying about one character 24/7. Diddy is definitely a great character, but people are blowing it way out of proportion. AZ made SoCal look pretty silly when K9 solidly beat Disqo at our last SSS.

AZ also gets plenty of practice against my diddy... A lot.

I may not be well known, or quite as good as disqo, but I ain't no scrub and K9 will vouch for that. These guys here have adapted well to diddy.

 

[King K Rool]

There was no naner technique at this timestamp Congrats!

lol check again but this time dont watch the gameplay watch the players i saw it lol

 

[Praxis]

Diddy has a ton of representation and no results. Diddy doesn't win tournaments. No one good things Diddy is top five. He's solidly top ten, but he's not Lucas, or Pit, or Link, or Mario, or a space animal.

But he has a threatening neutral game that makes people feel awkward, and if the opponent doesn't fight it properly, makes the match appear boring. You know what Melee character is like that? Jigglypuff. And we all know how much salt she had.

 

[Hinichii.ez.™]

People only say pit is top tier cause armada, WAKE UP, it's not the character, it's armada being armada.

 

[Soft Serve]

There are tons of diddys placing and doing well, look at MD/VA (although they are really condenced), DLA does great in Chicago (I think he won last night?), Disqo does good in socal, etc. Diddy isn't that dominating though so yeah

@ Hinichii.ez.™ Zero's pit is really good too

 

[Hinichii.ez.™]

There are tons of diddys placing and doing well, look at MD/VA (although they are really condenced), DLA does great in Chicago (I think he won last night?), Disqo does good in socal, etc. Diddy isn't that dominating though so yeah

@ Hinichii.ez.™ Zero's pit is really good too

True, but I mean, after everyone saw armada's put at apex, everyone and their mother just up and decided that makes pit top tier. I personally don't have decision about his placing but I can't say for sure if he is a top tier. I'm leaning more so towards high tier.

 

[DeFish]

What do you guys do to deal with Squirtle's side-b? Got knocked out of the Netplay tournament tonight by Wombat and his shellnanigans.