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Jigglypuff's Video Critique Thread

illinialex24

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Ok.

Match 1:
You did fairly well avoiding the explosives and the rest but your fair spacing left you way to vulnerable to his grab. You also staled your fair way too early like this so it didn't become a kill move. When bair has more knockback than fair, your doing something wrong. Try spacing with bair more because it leaves you a fair amount less vulnerable to a grab. Next, you had a lot of opportunities for a grab. Grab much more often. Do a U-throw on Snake after a pummel or so. Also, early on where you would go over him to a bair but you would clash with his shield on the forward way can be U-tilted early on. Use more pound and try to go through less often so he's not really suspecting it.

And here's the kicker. Stop using rollout! Notice you died when you used rollout and got 18 damage on him for it. You got hit by a grenade the other time. On Final D, rollout isn't a very good option and just sets you back.

That Snake needed work because he wasn't "cooking" the grenades, meaning it was fairly easy to avoid the overall damage from them. Mix that in with not enough tilts and jabs made this match a bit easier than it should have been.

Match 2:
Much better job getting grabs, but you still had way too much fair spacing. Unfortunately, spacing like this should have never resulted in your 3 stock. Although you had some flashy edgeguards, don't expect to be so lucky on a Marth unless you are really spacing well next time. Any time a Marth gets 3 stocked by a Jigglypuff, he is either spacing terrible, has bad DI's, is too much in the air and isn't forcing you to eat his F-tilt/Dancing Blade, or just SDed way too much. He had fairly bad DI's and wasn't fast falling to get back to the stage. Its gonna be harder to edgeguard a Marth well because of his Up B's invincibility frames. Much better job in this match but I would like to see some more quality opponents.
 

Framerate

Smash Lord
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Hehe for some reason we only recorded like 3 of my matches.

Although I did have an interesting MM against OS.

It didn't go too hot, but I think both matches came down to the last stock.
 

*JuriHan*

Smash Master
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This isn't really for critique... its just really cool. Jigglypuff for the improbable win!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHdhqCZUO_A

I know I make a lot of mistakes... I was sorta burnt out from school, sick family members... johnz

I do lots of weird stuff in it :p... lots of messing around lol

Seriously though, its got a good example of wavelanding.
your Jigglypuff had excellent spacing and made good use of aerials. The rest at the end was very lovely. I also favorited this on Youtube.
 

Mister E

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1:42 in the first match... ;_; free rest! abuse it... :p

I'm not a pro Jiggs but i think you stale your Fair too much... i personally like to use bair for damage and Fair for Kills...
 

Spoonbob

Smash Ace
Joined
Dec 13, 2008
Messages
676
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NY
From the first match:

I agree with Mister E. On the first stock, you used fair well (IMO), and managed to get an fsmash kill, which made me think that that was how you would get the majority of your kills. But then you used fair sooo much (sourspotted fairs at 140%?) that it was just impossible to get a kill with. 200% is ridiculous. Way too much sourspotted fair. It's good to rack up damage with at low-to-medium percents, but not at 140%.

I think that was your biggest problem. Otherwise, your Jiggs is really good. Oh. You missed a jab lock opportunity early on in the first video.

EDIT: Upon watching the second video, I have to say your grab game is great. Like, great shield grabs and such. But again...why were you using sourspotted fairs at 150%?
 

Xivii

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Yes I agree. That is one bad habit I have. I didn't notice missing that burn opportunity in the first match either. I noticed the Jab Lock opportunity when I rewatched , I completely missed it while playing though. I will work on that bad habit of mine.
Thankyou for the input =)
 

Framerate

Smash Lord
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Messages
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Zen!

I was gonna say after the first match to use pound to approach more, but you started doing so in the second match so it's all good. Also that's kind of a preference thing anyways.

All I have to say is don't forget the running attack kills!
 

Glick

Smash Lord
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Mar 19, 2008
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I was just playing my friend ryko yesterday. The match up vs his snake is harder then any other character. Most snakes vs jiggz pull a grenade and sheild. My friend juggles two grenades at once and baits me really well. Here's our match's. These match's helped my general defense.

Ryko is that famous ike, he mains snake these days and hes really **** good.

Here's all our matches, my favorite being our second match.
Some he just straight up owned me. and vise versa.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bbYNARmL0hw&feature=channel_page
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1cLwiyU047k&feature=channel_page <--- favorite
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jxTlg1rrezA&feature=channel_page
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZrbS7aDzXug&feature=channel_page
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bw-aBW6KNSQ&feature=channel_page
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLxu71NXTQM&feature=channel_page
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KnJBQe9F43Q&feature=channel_page
 

Framerate

Smash Lord
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Ok so I have class in 10 minutes so so far I've only watched your favorite match.

I have some things to say.

First and foremost I would like to preface this response by saying that this is my #1 most contemplated match up. Ever. I have been to multiple tournies as puff and every single one I lose to a priority ***** snake. Luckily Ryko is not like those snakes. But it's clear that he is still a little unfamiliar with the character (at least from what I've seen). Just the fact that he doesn't start spamming utilt when you reach 80% leads me to think he hasn't played snake in any tournament setting.

But this isn't about Ryko's snake.

I would say, Jiggs v Snake is the number one match-up where you should never, ever use roll out. Not even once. Don't tempt yourself. Don't even think about it. You won't hit a good snake with roll out. He'll either time a brilliant, exploding smash, grenade, c4, or nakita. If you hit the b button while not holding any direction, the end result will be an exploding balloon pokemon.

I'll probably edit later. Just a little input to hold me over >:D.

Also, rest at 1:55 is insane.
 

Rykoshet

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No really, I quit.
I actually got third going half snake/half ike this past weekend, I admittedly do not just throw out utilt because I'm still unfamiliar when it will flat out kill someone with or without proper DI and I'm still of the mindset that throwing a killshot that doesnt hit is just gonna get my *** kicked. But all in all yes I'm still learning what I can and cant get away with on the character.
 

Framerate

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Hehe no offense Ryko, it's just I can see you aren't fully comfortable with the character, not as fast as snake mains. I suggest not playing snake because nobody likes him and he's dumb. Play someone who takes balls to play. Like Jigglypuff or Ike :)

Edit: Lol this is what happens when I only watch one match. I started watching the first one, on FD, and saw a totally different snake. A lot more confident and "fluid." But I digress, this isn't about snake. PLAY JIGGLYPUFF.
 

Glick

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Jiggz sucks go with snake ryko. Ike held you back big time. I think its obvious.

Yes, I always use rollout like an idiot vs ryko. Vs other snakes I can trick them into using up b or jumping because they are flipping out about their sheild. Ryko kept a cool head because he plays me all the time and he knows how to avoid getting hit by it with my mindset. I can hit other snakes with it, trust me.
 

Framerate

Smash Lord
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Oh I know you can hit snakes with roll out. Heck, I can hit snakes with roll out.

Bad snakes.

So it's kind of pointless getting into the habit of using a tactic that only works on bad players. Oh I know you know what you are doing. I mean, who's the one with their video nominated as best jigglypuff? I'm just giving my 2 cents cause you asked, just trying to help you get to the next level of play. I expect the same in return when I post videos on here. From you. Make me cry.

Also, it's a known fact that every jigglypuff player thinks every other jigglypuff player uses too much roll out. Heck, we all love using roll out. It's the jigglypuff guilty pleasure.
 

Glick

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Its like the cat nip for our overweight cats.

AMIRITE.

I'm right.
You know it.

I'm nominated as best puff? I think you're talking about some OLD wifi video where I rested some rob on lylat under the stage . That in now way represents my talent

But yea, I'll try to make you cry.
 

Noobicidal

Smash Master
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Messages
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Also, it's a known fact that every jigglypuff player thinks every other jigglypuff player uses too much roll out. Heck, we all love using roll out. It's the jigglypuff guilty pleasure.
I'll gladly accuse someone of using too much Rollout, and Rollout isn't EVERY Jigglypuff's guilty pleasure. D-air is crack to me.
 

Framerate

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But dair isn't bad, so it's not even a guilty pleasure.

It's just pleasure.
 

Framerate

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First of all I want to say that I love this video. You have a pretty fast jigglypuff, which can be intimidating if you catch someone in a string of aerials. You do a great job of dodging his projectiles while approaching! Also the empty short hops and full hops make me lol. So did the sing + rest combo. I can't believe that worked!

Now here are some critiques that I can make because I have the same issues. You play very aggressive, which I think is awesome but it can make winning difficult. Once you kill them, back off a bit. You don't always have to be near your opponent. Being ahead a life is a great situation because you can force your opponent to approach. Play defensively in these situations and wait for them to screw up. Free percentage! I don't do any of this, and I lose a lot because of it.

Also something to subconsciously work on is knowing when to rising up-air or falling up-air (like at 1:54 if you had falling up-aired instead of jumping into an up-air it would have connected). It's just knowing where moves will send your opponent at what percentages, which comes from practice.

Also also, at 3:04 you had a perfect setup for a jab lock. Fair at 20% and Bair at 40-50% on most characters can lead to a perfect jab lock situation. If your opponent is right next to you on the ground, short hop a fair into him and keep going forward. When you land, start the jab lock! Maybe some day I can upload a video of this.

All in all, keep up the good work.

Edit: Finished the video. Don't forget the running attack can kill!
 

Noraa

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Thanks, i dont even know how to jab lock with jiggs.
Doesnt the second punch make them stand up?
 

Framerate

Smash Lord
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May 7, 2007
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Hit a -> tap forward -> hit a -> tap forward -> .....

At least that's how i do it.

I'll make a video some day!

SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOME DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY!!!!!!!
 

SDC

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There was a state here, it's gone now...
lol i had a long good message that i was going to post but then of course ****ing internet explorer freezes up b4 i can hit the post button and i lose it all. well anyway, the jist of it was:

i was surprised when you used sleep, but even more surprised when you used rest on him right afterwards, and it actually worked, it was awesome!

im sure you were just messin around, but i would however caution you on your rest and sleep use, at the beginning and near the end you used it, left yourself wide open, and a good T-Link would have punished you 4 it.

you need to work on your edgeguarding, there were many instances where you could have finished him off/kept him offstage if you had better edgeguarding, for me i am personally quite aggressive when it comes to edgeguarding, and was just beggin for a bair/fair or even a nair at around 0:48. if they attack back, fair into it (usually you will both take recoil, and that will only be good for you, as it should send them farther offstage), or space away, and bair/fair once the move is over (maybe have a chance to stage-spike here). or if they air-dodge, follow them and bair/fair them (also possibly a stage-spike opportunity). i know it is a difference in style (i personally am an aggressive edgeguarder), but you are missing out on easy gimp KO opportunities that would have made this easier.

i like your use of f-smash, rare, keeping it fresh, and utilizing its moderate/above average range, such as in 1:32.

overall, good match, good job on your part, you've got a good jiggz
 

Veril

Frame Savant
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Thanks, i dont even know how to jab lock with jiggs.
Doesnt the second punch make them stand up?
no, it doesn't, both of these moves have the "locking" property. Soft-nair, soft-fair, and b-air also lock. The second punch can actually set up an instant jab-lock against a wall.
 

illinialex24

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May 23, 2008
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Ok, Framerate, I'll critique you but this isn't gonna be a common thing:

You started off decent, I recommend going up one more jump, it protects you from the unlucky grenade into rising pound. Then you baired but didn't move away, you gotta be careful while approaching him. Then again you tried to bair through him and got grabbed. What you need is practice playing Snake's. Follow him after his B-up, you wanna try to uair hit him.
 

Jigglymaster

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Ok, Framerate, I'll critique you but this isn't gonna be a common thing:

You started off decent, I recommend going up one more jump, it protects you from the unlucky grenade into rising pound. Then you baired but didn't move away, you gotta be careful while approaching him. Then again you tried to bair through him and got grabbed. What you need is practice playing Snake's. Follow him after his B-up, you wanna try to uair hit him.
I love fighting snakes with Jigglypuff. Try getting them to play on a flat stage like FD or SV. Get them in the air and just grab them as they land on the ground lol and continue doing it. Snakes very very bad in the air. The best thing he can do to avoid you is reverse neutral b to change his molmentum. You can easily sidestep his aireals and his grenades can't do anything if you throw with the up throw since it dosn't really cause a hit box to appear. When hes off the stage **** him with arieals and trick him by edgehogging him after he knows that he dosn't want to land on the ground because Jiggly's dash grab is amazing. Do NOT use rollout in this matchup, you will only get hit by a grenade. To play against snake you need to wait for HIM to get into the air. You can't really approach him any other way because of his tilts. Pound works occasionally but not really nor does just going in and grabbing. If it weren't for jigglypuff's approach against snake Jigglypuff would really **** that matchup.
 
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