HeartGold/SoulSilver - Competitive Metagame Discussion

[Deleted member]

I'm getting heart gold, I'll trade you guys whatever you want if you want to get the other. I have no interest in anything other than my team.

 

[D13]

WHich one has Ursaring?

SoulSilver. Here's the list:

http://www.serebii.net/heartgoldsoulsilver/exclusives.shtml

 

[SpiredMoth]

I like some of the SoulSilver exclusives, but since the dogs, Ho-oh and Lugia are in both versions, Kyogre is the only pokemon i'm missing for my collection, since i have Ruby, Diamond, Pearl, and Platinum.

 

[CT Chia]

Donphan, Primeape, Arcanine, Kyogre, Gliscor > Soul Silver

Heart Gold ftw

 

[Oracle]

You forgot mantine

 

[Spire]

SoulSilver has:
Vulpix/Ninetales
Meowth/Persian
Ledyba/Ledian
Teddiursa/Ursaring
Delibird
Skarmory
Groudon

Groudon is the only one I don't like. The others are all among my absolute favorite Pokemon ever. HeartGold only has Phanpy/Donphan for me; I don't care about the others at all.

 

[CRASHiC]

Krogure
Donphan
Gliscor
Arcanine

Yep. Gold for me.

 

[D13]

I'm still right on the line. Skarmory and Ninetails are in Silver, so I may end up going that way. <3 those guys.

 

[Firus]

Wow, I'm confused...why did they swap Teddiursa/Ursaring and Phanpy/Donphan? They were in the opposite games originally.

I may pull a D/P (what I did for it, anyways) and just reserve and get both games on release. I want to get them both at some point anyways, so I might as well bite the bullet and get them both then. Can't decide which one will be my main version, though...

 

[Wave⁂]

If every Pokemon only had three, then four would be considered broken.

Imagine if Lucario had an extra moveslot. Swords Dance, ExtremeSpeed, Close Combat, Crunch / Stone Edge / Ice Punch is the standard set. Imagine if you could have both Crunch and Stone Edge, for example? Lucario benefits greatly from that extra movelot.

Now take CB Mamoswine. Ice Shard, Earthquake, Stone Edge, Ice Fang / Superpower. Ice Fang is just a small improvement over Shard, and Superpower hits few things with Superpower.

 

[Mewter]

Primape, Arcanine, Kyogre, Donphan, Ho-Oh.
Looks like it's definitely Gold for me!

Has anyone noticed how HG has more "bluer" pokemon than SS (which has warmer-colored Pokemon)?

 

[CRASHiC]

But let's look at defensive leftovers Mamoswine

Protect
Curse
Amensia
Toxic
Rock Tomb

There we see a powerful set.
It would change how the game it played, but it wouldn't be broken per say. Only those with a limited move pool would be hurt, but those with a very limited move pool.

Let's take Breloom, THE limited move pool pokemon who has one purpose, and a slew of useless genric moves.

Focus Punch
Spore
Substitute
Seed Bomb
Leech Seed

Now we see Breloom as a pokemon that is not only great on the offense, but is an effective staller as well with Toxic Orb.

Again, taking another one mind set moveset on the defensive side and expanding on it.

Sub
Leech
Protect
Leaf Blade
X-siczor

We see the defense boosted, while the offense still exist just fine.

 

[T-major]

Lugia > Ho-oh

fix'd

also, I don't see why people use Lugia and Ho-oh as reasons, since they're in both games regardless. you just have to wait longer for one of them. :|

either way, I'm getting Silver, since I can just trade gold exclusives over from Diamond.

 

[Mewter]

fix'd

also, I don't see why people use Lugia and Ho-oh as reasons, since they're in both games regardless. you just have to wait longer for one of them. :|

either way, I'm getting Silver, since I can just trade gold exclusives over from Diamond.

But, but, there's no way to get Sacred Fire, then!
Oh, wait. Heart scales.

Edited out text.

 

[Spire]

Has anyone noticed how HG has more "bluer" pokemon than SS (which has warmer-colored Pokemon)?

First thing I noticed actually. Also, Gold, who's mascot is Fire, gets the Water Legendary from Hoenn, while it's the opposite for Silver. From a designer's standpoint, I supposed they don't want to overload either HG or SS with too many warmer and cooler colored Pokemon so the title itself does not seem to pervade every corner of the game. They want each experience to feel diverse.

 

[CaptainEvilStomper9]

But then again, wouldn't giving all these Pokemon more potential for sweeps also give defensive Pokemon more potential for walling? :3

Just something to think about. I do think that four moves is the perfect number, but I'm pretty sure that in the case of Pokemon, any number of moves could work to an extent.

I just think that sweepers would benefit more then the stallers from the extra move slot. I don't think that the game would be unplayable if it was five move slots but I do think that it would open up doors for more Pokemon to sweep more efficiently. Anyway I know much less about Pokemon then your average bear in this thread so I will shut up now.

And to stay on topic I like Extreme Speed Dragonite

 

[CT Chia]

Actually I don't even care about the Pokemon, and even though my favortie color is blue, I tend to choose the more red color side of the games, or I guess the first game when you say the two.

Red
Gold
Ruby
Fire Red
Diamond
Heart Gold

Though I obviuosly also get all the 3rd games as well like Yellow Crystal Emerald Platinum. Though I actually never got Ruby now that I think about it. There was a couple year break where I didn't play pokemon.

And oh yes, I agree with Cpt.Evil,
one of my favorite additions is definitely extremespeed dragonite

 

[Smasher89]

Ursaring looks really interesting now, Bellydrum+Guts Facade sounds very threatening, but I guess quick feet will be used alot more...

 

[Vlade]

I am the EXACT opposite of Chibo

With the exception that I got diamond instead of pearl, otherwise the above statement remains true

 

[Bowser King]

I'm not sure which game to get anymore =/

I'm thinking of getting HG at the moment. That or I'll do what firus might do and get both.

 

[CRASHiC]

I think Tailwind might be underrated.
A lot of viable pokemon have it now, and it can tip the match in your favor by doubling your speed, allowing, say Breloom to spore people it might not have been able to spore before.
At the very least, it makes being a sweeper a harder job than even, an Aerodactyle forced to fit the role of anti-lead even more, who he himself might even carry this move.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

HeartGold it is, since I can just catch a Teddiursa from FireRed and transfer it over. Good thing I didn't plan on using him in-game. XD

-Terywj

 

[Oracle]

Ursaring looks really interesting now, Bellydrum+Guts Facade sounds very threatening, but I guess quick feet will be used alot more...

with poison/burn he won't survive long enough to sweep, and even if you use a salac berry he's not that fast

Belly drum magmortar, on the other hand, has decent speed and attack, as well as mach punch.

 

[verycoolguy]

The now non-exclusivity of the move Pain Split proves that Blissey shall not move to Ubers.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

The now non-exclusivity of the move Pain Split proves that Blissey shall not move to Ubers.

Blissey wasn't really ever headed to Ubers...

-Terywj

 

[verycoolguy]

oh i heard many people complained about Block being added to her movepool for herself being 'too good'

 

[Terywj [태리]]

oh i heard many people complained about Block being added to her movepool for herself being 'too good'

Well sure, with the right Speed investment she can switch in to sponge up a special attack and trap the target, but it's not as game changing as say Scizor was with Bullet Punch.

-Terywj

 

[M.K]

Wow, I'm confused...why did they swap Teddiursa/Ursaring and Phanpy/Donphan? They were in the opposite games originally.

I may pull a D/P (what I did for it, anyways) and just reserve and get both games on release. I want to get them both at some point anyways, so I might as well bite the bullet and get them both then. Can't decide which one will be my main version, though...

Actually, between Gold/Silver (Japanese) and Gold/Silver (English), Phanpy/Donphan and Teddiursa/Ursaring were switched anyways.

Teddiursa was in Silver, and Phanpy was in Gold for the JP Gold/Silver.

Teddiursa was in Gold, and Phanpy was in Silver for the NA Gold/Silver.

now Teddiursa is in SoulSilver, and Phanpy is in HeartGold for HeartGold/SoulSilver.

I seriously like the Version Exclusives for HG more, but seriously....HEARTGold just sounds so effeminate.

 

[CRASHiC]

Nothing wrong with getting a little girly, take it from this man

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Actually, between Gold/Silver (Japanese) and Gold/Silver (English), Phanpy/Donphan and Teddiursa/Ursaring were switched anyways.

Teddiursa was in Silver, and Phanpy was in Gold for the JP Gold/Silver.

Teddiursa was in Gold, and Phanpy was in Silver for the NA Gold/Silver.

now Teddiursa is in SoulSilver, and Phanpy is in HeartGold for HeartGold/SoulSilver.

I seriously like the Version Exclusives for HG more, but seriously....HEARTGold just sounds so effeminate.

He's right, I was going to write this.

I got gold last time and was unable to get me an Ursaring...

Now Ursaring is put in Soul Silver...I'm probably going to get Soul Silver since I have a Donphan in Platinum AND a Gliscor. Plus I have Sapphire and can get Kyogre.

I just want me a Ursaring

 

[Firus]

Actually, between Gold/Silver (Japanese) and Gold/Silver (English), Phanpy/Donphan and Teddiursa/Ursaring were switched anyways.

Teddiursa was in Silver, and Phanpy was in Gold for the JP Gold/Silver.

Teddiursa was in Gold, and Phanpy was in Silver for the NA Gold/Silver.

now Teddiursa is in SoulSilver, and Phanpy is in HeartGold for HeartGold/SoulSilver.

Oh, that's odd...well, I never played the Japanese versions, so I didn't know that. I wonder if they'll change that for the American version.

If I end up going for Heart Gold as my main version, though, that'll make me happy, since I like Phanpy and Donphan better than Teddiursa and Ursaring.

I seriously like the Version Exclusives for HG more, but seriously....HEARTGold just sounds so effeminate.

True, but then again, Soul Silver sounds slightly hippie-ish.

To be fair, they chose really trippy titles for both of these games and they should feel trippy.

 

[Mewter]

Lol, Firus. That was neat!

They should make Mewtwo his own signature move for next generation since he's missing out on so much.
He deserves one.

 

[Spire]

HeartSilver is hippie, SoulGold is pure funk soul.

The Pokemon titles are safe.

 

[WouW]

Well sure, with the right Speed investment she can switch in to sponge up a special attack and trap the target, but it's not as game changing as say Scizor was with Bullet Punch.

-Terywj

No special sweeper will ever stay in on Blissey. And since switching outprioritizes Block, you'll ALWAYS have Blocked a physical attacker who's going to beat you up unless YOU switch out which then neuters the blocking effect.

Seriously. BLOCK. IS. NOT. MAKING. BLISSEY. BETTER.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

Exact;y. That's what I tried to say on the 7th page, I don't know who thought Blissey was going to go to Ubers.

-Terywj

 

[LordoftheMorning]

They're obviously trying to take status ailments less of a threat, because everyone and their mother has been given Heal Bell or Magic Coat. I kind of like that, because status problems were pretty prominent before. Correct me if I'm wrong, but this metagame looks a bit more defensive than D/P/Pt.

Weavile can OHKO Heatran now with low kick.
Dragonite needed a boost.
And a lot of other boost were much needed.

YAY! I love these guys.

 

[momochuu]

New Metagame is gonna be interesting. I really don't like how so many pokemon got Dragon Dance. Like Whishcash...that makes no sense. I'm glad Walrein got Super Fang. *Goes to make a hail team*


Blissey with Block doesn't look like much of a big deal honestly. =/ On paper it seems like it'd be awesome, but most of the time, you're gonna be trapping physically based Pokemon. Most Special Sweepers flee at the sight of Blissey. If all of your physically based pokemon are dead, then you might have a problem.


Also, I'm getting Soul Silver. I usually get the "blue color" games.

Blue
Gold/Silver
Sapphire/Emerald
Leaf Green
Diamond/Platinum


Although I do really hate Groudon. x__x; Kyogre is so much more fun to use.

 

[*JuriHan*]

OU metagame isn't going to change much at all except for maybe the addition of pain split on the Rotom forms. UU and below will experience the most change. I think it's wonderful so many uu pokemon got buffed. Platinum buffed the OU, so they needed it. Also <3 brave bird Ho-oh

 

[supermarth64]

Brave Bird Ho-oh would be amazing if it got Magic Guard <_< >_>.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

The biggest changes in OU is basically Heal Bell Vaporeon and Pain Split Rotoms. The UU is where all the metagame-change hype is at. From Aqua Jet Feraligatr to Water Spout Blastoise. (I just realized that both of those were Water-typed Pokemon and attacks. XD)

-Terywj