Grand Old Thread: League of Legends!

[DMG]

Yeah counter jungling might go out of style for quick 6 routes

 

[Coney]

seems kinda silly to give sivir a passive that is like vayne's but requires activation

i guess we just gotta see how fast it goes, tho. anything faster than vayne's would be silly, but anything less would leave her less of a character

 

[Leacero]

vayne's only works when you're approaching a champ

 

[Faithkeeper]

Also junglers that want to rush six (WW, GP, Noct) are going to see some revival as well.

Only downside is that, depending on the timers, there will be little to no incentive to counterjungle, which takes one of the more dynamic aspects of jungling out of the game :\

It will be interesting to see the dynamic of lanes sharing jungle xp though.

This. I think counter jungling was one of the best parts of jungling because it required some thought, and there was a good reward for the risk of invading the enemy jungle. Now the reward is much smaller.

I don't think the jungle needed to be easier at all. I jungled at level 22 before the mastery changes and did fine. :/

 

[voorhese]

Why is AD nid suddenly so much more better than AP nid?

Been seeing so many lately.

Ok so i've been ranting about this in about 50% of my games. AP nids damage early game comes from spears because heal -> auto attack is bad for herself, it will help a partners damage yeah, but solo damage u need spears. So now that i said if we solo we need spears for damage (traps would kinda work, but they would be going into pounce not swipe or takedown for catform), we can say that spears are the easiest thing in the world to dodge. All someone has to do to dodge spears is sit behind minis, and dodge perpendicular to the spear (i rarely get hit 1 time by spears against enemy nidalees), even being lead out you can just change directions or stop moving. Ok some of the people who argue with me about AP nid say that if you "suck with spearing" then u can just use catform damage...1st off once you throw the spear you commit, they react. This means that the skill that determines if they get hit is on them not you. Also if you just go cat form you will get focused and killed. So the next argument is that you build her tanky AP with like rylais and RoA, it would make her a little less squishy yeah, but she would lose some of her burst and the more health wont be enough to stop her from dying in like 2 seconds. So now lets look at tanky AD. Great sustain solo top with 5 pots and mana only being used for trapping early game till u can get ur boots/SW or ur lantern. U cant just dodge an autoattack on reaction once you go to last hit or something (not the same way u can dodge a spear, i mean u can with the item stat). So her damage early game is much more reliable. Now lets talk team fights, you dont need Catform for realiable damage so u can still attack from a distance (huge advantage), and of course if you get focused it will take a lot longer to kill you, and your team can make the most out of that. When it comes to catform (i build frozen mallet because the health/slow + atmas is nice) and i like to heal get a slow off with an AA, then cat form and chase with AA. The AoE from pounce/swipe isnt that high, but because i have more base movement usually in cat form, and they are slowed cuz my mallet its FREE damage. Now with the Q i can gain up 300% extra damage as an execution. So she can still get kills that way.

point is AP nid sucks and AD nid doest =)

 

[Vyke]

I think they wanted people just starting off to be able to do it more reliably with more than 3 champions.

also new bear champion looks sick. I'm gonna **** my pants multiple times when I see an armored bear on all fours come at me from the jungle.

 

[@TKbreezy]

so I think I wanna start using jarvan in the jungle also

but is he better as a Laner than in jungle?

 

[PhantomX]

Jarvan is average in both, in my opinion. Doesn't really excel anywhere anymore.

 

[Deleted member]

jarvan is somewhat underrated as a laner IMO, post 50 patch nerfs i still wrecked *****es going 21 offense until OP yorick/udyr made me tank like 200 elo by not being able to win

playing top lane jarvan again now that sustain FOTM is gone he still seems to wreck people but still has some poop matchups

 

[DanGR]

i used to think ad nid was the only way to go but ap still does fine and still serves the same purpose. hotshot went ap nid at iem china or a different tourney and carried sooo hard

What'd he lane against, and in what lane? purple/blue side?

*new GP splash art*

He looks like me now rofl. Same exact facial hair.

 

[PhantomX]

Sustain is still pretty popular top. He has some matchups he does well at, but then another handful he doesn't do well against at all. And even then most of that is for the early game with it tapering off near the mid (from what I've seen).

I do think he's better in lane though, b/c, although his ganks are super good, he can be coutnerjungled fairly easily and has no innate sustain (he's one of the few junglers I condone the bladed armor on b/c he needs help [comparatively] on that first clear).

 

[ranmaru]

This. I think counter jungling was one of the best parts of jungling because it required some thought, and there was a good reward for the risk of invading the enemy jungle. Now the reward is much smaller.

I don't think the jungle needed to be easier at all. I jungled at level 22 before the mastery changes and did fine. :/

And I just started junglin, and I'm level 23. I don't even know what was changed yet, i'mma check to practice new routes.

 

[Wave⁂]

The worst part of jungling not at level 30, for me, is that I only have 2 rune pages.

 

[Faithkeeper]

The worst part of jungling not at level 30, for me, is that I only have 2 rune pages.

You can buy more for 6.3k ip. but that's tough, I really just knew I would either jungle or play 1 other role since no one jungled low levels then. Since then I've just got more rune pages though.

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

My main (riven) drinks potions like redneck alcoholics drink natty ice.

****

 

[PhantomX]

Build a Wriggle's on her.

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

I do, just gonna have to rush it before merc treads now

 

[DallasPhat]

http://www.justin.tv/dphat0 Streaming Inhouses atm

 

[Turazrok]

my main (riven) drinks potions like redneck alcoholics drink natty ice.

****

.

 

[Wave⁂]

You can buy more for 6.3k ip. but that's tough, I really just knew I would either jungle or play 1 other role since no one jungled low levels then. Since then I've just got more rune pages though.

I don't think I've ever had more than 2000 IP available to spend. Runes and champs keep me busy.

 

[Faithkeeper]

I don't think I've ever had more than 2000 IP available to spend. Runes and champs keep me busy.

Well, there's always rp.... but yeah just depends on how much you want it compared to other stuff.

I'm wondering if people will start jungling more farmers (could probably keep up with lanes pretty easily on many champs now) or assassins (faster/easier clear = more viable junglers and earlier/more flexible ganks) after the patch. What do you guys who actually know what you're doing think?

 

[adumbrodeus]

I have come to a realization, I need help with Kennen and Ezreal.

 

[DarkDragoon]

Well, there's always rp.... but yeah just depends on how much you want it compared to other stuff.

The $20 you spend on the Rune Page bundle is the best $20 you'll ever spend on LoL.
-DD

 

[Faithkeeper]

Anybody having chat service problems right now? Voorhese and I can't load chat service. :/

 

[PhantomX]

From Stonewall on jungle changes (which he's tested already): less mob xp and gold. Don't reach level 4 if you run from Blue to opposite side :\ Mobs are incredibly weak until jungler hits like level 7 (lol, he jokingly said you wouldn't even have to leave until then).

Ganking is weaker b/c you miss out on the camp respawns (lol, counterproductive to what they want). As expected, farm junglers are quite good and counterjungling is much weaker (unless you can 1v1 other champs).

Red is weaker, blue buff is the same (but possibly drops like one of those health pack things from dominion? [like holy **** how much handholding can there be]).

Claims that Malph will be one of the strongest b/c of how little damage they do (his passive shield is great) and his AoE to super clear, as well as Yi, Nocturne, Lee Sin, and GP. Also Irelia jungle is very viable and strong b/c she has built in sustain and can now farm hard (like Cho) [I would add that Riven will probably be boosted as well].

Wriggle's unnecessary for jungling at all except for Dragon and Baron. Don't even need to specialize for the jungle and almost anything can jungle now if they want. Super easy-moded. *sigh*

 

[ranmaru]

The worst part of jungling not at level 30, for me, is that I only have 2 rune pages.

Why is that?

When I plan on going Skarner (meaning when I play blind pick) I have my pages setup either for AD laning or Jungling (AD for Skarner).

I do wish for more rune pages.

 

[Vyke]

Be sure to link to the video also, PX. The summary is nice, though.

I'm looking forward to the jungle changes. Jungling as it is is really stagnant. I hit things that hit back until they're all dead on my side of the jungle, then go gank.

 

[Faithkeeper]

I'm looking forward to the jungle changes. Jungling as it is is really stagnant. I hit things that hit back until they're all dead on my side of the jungle, then go gank.

So you would prefer to hit things that hit back until they're all dead on your side of the jungle, walk to the other side, and go do it again?

If stonewalls assessment is correct, early jungle will probably be just PvE, which doesn't sound particularly interesting tbh.

And I don't feel like you are pigeon-holed in the current system to clear your jungle> gank>repeat. I like to counter jungle or gank at lvl 3 (after wraiths) with several junglers, but I also have the ability to choose not to.

I may eat my words later, but at first glance I don't like the jungle changes.

 

[PhantomX]

Now it's going to be more of that because you need to kill more to get to the same place.

 

[Wave⁂]

Stonewall was too harsh on the changes. Saying that you don't need Wriggle's anymore is like saying you don't need to build Frozen Heart on Ryze. Sure, you don't need it to the point where it defines whether you win or lose, but it separates the veterans and the noobs.

Also, weaker ganking encourages the laners to be more aggressive, which in turn makes ganking more powerful as lanes are pushed and champions overextend.

 

[JTB]

what suits kass more, 9-0-21 or 21-0-9?

 

[NeverKnowsBest]

Is the swf tourney on Sunday going to be streamed?

 

[PhantomX]

Stonewall was too harsh on the changes. Saying that you don't need Wriggle's anymore is like saying you don't need to build Frozen Heart on Ryze. Sure, you don't need it to the point where it defines whether you win or lose, but it separates the veterans and the noobs.

Also, weaker ganking encourages the laners to be more aggressive, which in turn makes ganking more powerful as lanes are pushed and champions overextend.

Exept a large portion of the reason you get wriggles is for survivability and to help kill the strong mobs faster. Since they are already weak, why not grab a few Doran's since you don't need as many procs and stuff unless you are soloing or sneaking dragon/baron? That gives you the lifesteal and damage and health for cheap so you can get to core items sooner. If you have AoE clearing an can make do without madreds (let alone wriggles), why spend all that extra money?

 

[Vyke]

You guys are assuming too much and reading into it too much. Adopting Stonewall's view without even having experienced it yet is a bit premature.

You don't need to stay in the jungle, you can take risks and gank instead of farm. You never needed to counter-jungle either, but people still did it.

 

[Shaya]

Exept a large portion of the reason you get wriggles is for survivability and to help kill the strong mobs faster. Since they are already weak, why not grab a few Doran's since you don't need as many procs and stuff unless you are soloing or sneaking dragon/baron? That gives you the lifesteal and damage and health for cheap so you can get to core items sooner. If you have AoE clearing an can make do without madreds (let alone wriggles), why spend all that extra money?

Didn't I suggest this to you like a few weeks ago?

 

[ranmaru]

You guys are assuming too much and reading into it too much. Adopting Stonewall's view without even having experienced it yet is a bit premature.

You don't need to stay in the jungle, you can take risks and gank instead of farm. You never needed to counter-jungle either, but people still did it.

It's fun. It's like 'Heehee, I'm taking your red buff. muahahahaha'

I'm not comfortable with doing that unless we pushed pretty far, or I'm in the river and I'm just feeling like it.

 

[PhantomX]

Didn't I suggest this to you like a few weeks ago?

Yes, you mentioned this. And now that creeps will be weak it is nuch more relevant. In the current iteration of the jungle the creeps hit pretty hard and have a good chunk of health for a long while, so Wriggle's is justified.

Counterjungling is a lot more effective at the moment because of long respawn timers. I guess ganking might not be entirely quelled after first clear but it will be at level 3 with one point in each skill or 2-1-0 skilling.

It's also not really an issue of being UNABLE to do something but an issue of, why bother when I can farm safely and harder? (unless a lane is losing, of course)

 

[JTB]

new counter jungling - pushing lane to bait enemy jungler into trap

 

[Shaya]

^ Funny you say that, because stuff like that is an interesting dynamic that can come out from this.

if jungles now going to have similar outcomes as a solo lane does (so in the same way, you focus on farming and leave your lane for map objectives/ganks), then isn't that swell? lol
However, aggression in an enemy jungle seems like it won't be that worthwhile.

 

[Wave⁂]

Exept a large portion of the reason you get wriggles is for survivability and to help kill the strong mobs faster. Since they are already weak, why not grab a few Doran's since you don't need as many procs and stuff unless you are soloing or sneaking dragon/baron? That gives you the lifesteal and damage and health for cheap so you can get to core items sooner. If you have AoE clearing an can make do without madreds (let alone wriggles), why spend all that extra money?

Stonewall's complaint was that the old "best" build is gone. Regardless of what it is, there will always be a "best" build. Maybe in the future it'll be stacking Doran's Blades, who knows? But whatever it is, change isn't a bad thing.