Got a question! Sheik Q&A & FAQ

[Judo777]

Nah man my sheik is technical as piss. Btw how many sheiks have you watched? Cause to my knowledge you only listed the ones that have alot of vids on the internet (except ninja link does he play sheik?)

 

[Zankoku]

I don't think NinjaLink uses Sheik in tournament, but you can probably name a character and he'll have a vid of himself winning with that character up on Youtube.

 

[<π]

there is nothing really technical about ftilt locks...

Spare dacus there isn't anything character specific about her that's especially "technical" in my eyes. Its all strong fundamentals and knowing your percents for combos and follow ups.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

I don't even know if I'd define my gameplay as technical.....

 

[Judo777]

You can have technical gameplay on a non technical character. Ever watch trela? Nah I'm sure my sheik is pretty technical by choice.

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

Judo is really technical with Sheik.

 

[Zankoku]

Way more technical than people like Ankoku.

 

[Juushichi]

I play a very Yomi esque Sheik. As much as you can in this game, I guess.

 

[Ripple]

and Ankoku is way more technical than ....Ripple

 

[Alien Vision]

I'm not entirely sure, but does Sheik have enough versatility to pull of a chain edge-guard?

Like: I jump off the edge while someone is recovering (if I chose not to use the needles then, or b-air) and used the chain (while spinning it around like a mad man) towards my decent to keep them from recovering. Then I'd jump and tether the ledge afterwards and possibly charge a few needles or prepare an attack to get them off the edge again when back on stage. (All in a quick motion)

It looks possible, the chain has a very long reach, and the lag afterwards allows you to use your super versatile jump back to unpunishable safety. Not sure on very high gameplay though.

 

[Zankoku]

The chain has minimal hitstun, minimal knockback, does not have a hitbox when retracted, and is automatically retracted after a set amount of time in the air.

So, no.

 

[Alien Vision]

Really? When you spin it around in the air it doesn't seem to retract until you hit the ground. If you just let it sit still in the air it will retract. I tested it out. I did a full hop and used Side-B immediately afterwards (while spinning it) and it stayed out until I hit the ground. Also if you used it off the edge and spinned it around while falling, it'll last until you die.

Although I do agree with the rest of the reasons why it's not viable.

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

Some people will get hit by chain when they ledge drop then DI under the stage and die... Its not reliable though lol

 

[Alien Vision]

Hi everyone! I have another question.

Which moves should I primarily focus on to get my opponent's damage up without staling any potential KO moves. Even if I have to, which moves should I stale and which ones should I save to get my opponent into KO %'s.

Thankyou in advance!

 

[Zankoku]

Moves you should save or stale are forward tilt and up smash, not necessarily in that order.

 

[Alien Vision]

I believe this will be my last question for now.

Is Sheik only low tier because of her lack of kill power?

She has the combos, the speed.. She does lack priority, but her strengths can suffice.

So.. If she has the kill power along with everything, how viable would she become?

Actually, this goes for Samus too. Lol. I am curious. :D

Because everytime I use Sheik, I always have one thing going through my mind:

Sheik is really hard to KO with. If they can't get that KO on me, I will get it sooner or later. :3

 

[phi1ny3]

It's actually less about killpower, and more of a bad combo of bad knockback resistance (she's a twig for her fallspeed/susceptibility to juggles), and a mediocre recovery. Oh, and lack of safety for some MUs where she gets CG'd to bad percents, similar to Fox's problem.

 

[Judo777]

It's actually less about killpower, and more of a bad combo of bad knockback resistance (she's a twig for her fallspeed/susceptibility to juggles), and a mediocre recovery. Oh, and lack of safety for some MUs where she gets CG'd to bad percents, similar to Fox's problem.

It is slightly about kill power but I think one thing that hurts sheik badly is how much worse she becomes ONCE her opponents get into the average characters kill percents. Sheik racks damage at low percents better than almost anyone. But she doesn't reliably kill til 130+ and after 90 her crap stops comboing and stringing together nicely. So the match really slows down at those percents.

But more so than kill power its kill power compared to weight. Samus can't kill either but Samus is fat and lives a long time. Sheik can't kill and dies too fast. This means she loses every trade in the game.

 

[<π]

I disagree about sheik's recovery... I think she has very solid recovery options over all...

she is light.

people don't know how to kill well with her. you can true combo into kills from very very safe set ups, people just aren't using them. So if you are aware of your ftilt staling and percents you can kill even the heaviest characters as low as the 110s

The issue is there is a window for ftilt usmash set ups and even true combos in to nair and dsmash won't always net kills time pretty high percents.

A lot of her weaknesses are sharred with amazing characters like falco (surface kill issues, light weight, sketchy recovery) marth (again, kill set ups normally come form hard reads, poor recovery, light weight)



Ankoku is gonna come in here and rip my head off for comparing marth and sheik

I think sheik is very very underrated because people aren't fully exploring what she can do. And those that do/are aren't don't do it consistently enough.

 

[Zankoku]

I dunno, I think a lot of what I liked about playing both Sheik and Marth equally for a long time was that they had different solutions to each other's weaknesses.

Marth's disjointed range and good horizontal aerial mobility went a long way toward allowing for a margin of error that didn't usually involve risking putting yourself in a bad position. On the other hand, his lack of projectiles pretty much forces him to step forward in the stalemate situation, and he has a hell of a time trying to reset the situation if he ever gets punished for messing up.

Sheik doesn't have a lot of those qualities, but to make up for it she has incredible ground mobility, great vertical aerial mobility, and a set of attacks with weak knockback - all very useful for a low-to-mid pressure/combo game. She also has a pretty solid projectile (needles) and isn't nearly as vulnerable for missing an attack or hitting someone's shield at somewhat close range.

The biggest difference in kill percents is probably that Marth can afford to use basically two attacks (fair and dancing blade) for a large portion of a stock for damage, pressure, zoning, etc., keeping the rest of his moveset nice and fresh. Sheik's attacks have a bit more variety of usage, but it also cuts into her decay unless the opponent happens to let her land a bunch of ftilts, which is not the case for several important match-ups...

Falco's attacks feel oddly disjointed compared to Sheik's, but he doesn't really move that fast either so whatever. I'd rather learn to avoid getting hit than to develop a habit of assuming my attack will automatically connect, anyway.

Sheik's recovery range is nice, but the fact that all she can do at the ledge is either try to out-wait the opponent or get lucky with a ledge-hop something gets to a lot of people. Also, her Vanish being unable to auto-snap a ledge is kind of annoying.

 

[phi1ny3]

You know, I think that's part of the reason I don't do so well against Marth anymore, I don't use needles well enough and often.

It is slightly about kill power but I think one thing that hurts sheik badly is how much worse she becomes ONCE her opponents get into the average characters kill percents. Sheik racks damage at low percents better than almost anyone. But she doesn't reliably kill til 130+ and after 90 her crap stops comboing and stringing together nicely. So the match really slows down at those percents.

But more so than kill power its kill power compared to weight. Samus can't kill either but Samus is fat and lives a long time. Sheik can't kill and dies too fast. This means she loses every trade in the game.

I can agree with that, she seems to have a trouble zone in percent unless you set up and prepare for that scenario ideally, which doesn't come often or easy.

 

[Alien Vision]

Wow! I never expected so much information :D

I agree with alot of what you guys said, and I admire <3's enthusiasm for Sheik.

I've always learned to never believe that there is an end to understanding a particular thing. There is just so much to learn! Even if you think you have all of the data, and knowing it inside and out. Sometimes the answer lies on how you look at everything from different perspectives, and how you bend even that, into something else to manifest. Looking for even the simplest things.

Anyways. I don't know about you, but everyday I see someone come in with a very unique playstyle.. that blows my mind everytime. :o

 

[<π]

needles make every match up significantly easier. Definitely one of sheik's best move. IMO it is her best move.

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

I don't think Sheik has a best move, all of them are useful in different situations, some situations happen more than others due to character Matchups, and play styles, but I wouldn't put any one move above the rest.

 

[Zankoku]

Sheik's best move is being selectable with the X or Y button in Rotation mode.

 

[<π]

well I guess "best" really is subjective. And more than that very situational.

I can say this, needles give sheik a long range poke with high damage potential. its a very safe way to punish just about anything within needle range safely, but also a great way to force a shield, a jump, or approach/retreat, without risking your position to do so.

Strong use off needles very literally add another layer onto what options you have available at any given time.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

i should needle more when im Sheik, my needle game is really lacking

 

[Judo777]

i should needle more when im Sheik, my needle game is really lacking

I feel mine is too.

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

I use needles so i can roll upon landing and to turn myself around in the air.

 

[Alien Vision]

My Sheik knows how to use her needles very well.

Although my sheik sucks at DI'ing. This whole time I was DI'ing with D-Air.

Yes, laugh it up. I don't care.

 

[Zankoku]

I'm laughing at people still calling momentum canceling with aerials DIing.

 

[Juushichi]

I use needles so i can roll upon landing and to turn myself around in the air.

I do the same thing. I think my Sheik can live to pretty high percents overall. It's a byproduct of playing Mario for a year and a half.

 

[Zatchiel]

I think I use Needles too much in my play. I don't know any flaws in my DI and momentum canceling, yet.

What's the SDI multiplier on Needles? And I also need help playing against Wolf. I can shield Bair efficiently, and I manage to punish with grabs sometimes, but it's still difficult for me to get in on Wolf.

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

Walk
Sheld bair

after shielding bair are you withing f-tilt range and is he at roughly 30%?
if yes you f-tilt, if not you walk a little bit further until he is within f-tilt range.

Also if he over commits to his bair you can just forward roll behind him or just walk away once he jumps and punish his landing with needles.

 

[<π]

My DI and momentum canceling are amazing, generally I live till at least 150 per stock unless I kill myself.

 

[Alien Vision]

How?

 

[<π]

good DI, Avoiding situations where kills moves kill me, force the same kill move so it gets stale.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FDRTtQWknZQ&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CGgPvNx3ILM&feature=related

 

[Alien Vision]

Thankyou. I laugh at how much I don't know about DI and other technical things like priority, but still able to be a formidable opponent. :3

 

[<π]

for DI you pretty much just want to aim your self at the corners of the screen. (or for sheik you want to go as high up as you can without getting to the top blast zone; this widens your recovery options by leaps and bounds)

Always use fair to momentum cancel hold down. Some times that isn't enough so you have to use your second jump as well; the reason you use fair is because ithas the shortest total duration of all your aerials so you can jump immediately after. if you are hit up it doesn't really matter what move you use since jumping won't help you live.
Also note some moves have a more hit stun and require you to wait a little longer before you input you aerial to momentum cancel.

OH!
the super up B... sheik's upB and other momentum based upBs (bowsers, links, etc.) get a huge horizontal momentum boost if you use them out of hit stun. I'll try and look for a link to me doing it. It comes up so often where you have used that second jump and super up B will get you back on stage.......

 

[Zankoku]

Alien Vision, I have never heard of you, nor have I ever seen you play. While because of this I cannot make any judgment on your overall skill, the fact that I look at a lot of tournament results tells me that you have no tournament record to back up your evaluation of your own skill, either.

Long story short, please don't brag about your playing ability until you can put up some results to back it up.