Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[Fatmanonice]

Does anyone known how is the structure of Namco-Bandai Smash team ? Namco-Bandai act as a contractor to Nintendo (they paid and N-B developed the game). I suppose that Ultimate base game team got reduced for FP1 as they rotate their employees to other projects. Thus, I think that the “31/12/2021” placeholder date is just the day the contract between Ninty and N-B ends, and smash team workers can go to work on other internal projects.

So, Sakurai team has 1 more year to work on smash, they need to finish the second FP and if they do it earlier than end 2021, they have 2 options. 1) end Smash Ultimate development, 2) continue doing other things like more Mii Costumes, stages or bonus fighters until end 2021.

Of course Nintendo can re-negotiate the contract with N-B but who knows what plans they have later. Maybe they have arranged to develop a new game (not necessary another Smash, N-B helps a lot with Nintendo) after Ultimate development ceases.

This explanation also explains why both Smash 4's DLC and the Fighter's Pass were releasing content literally up until days of their respective deadlines. When they say everything will release by 2022, I feel that's the same as them saying that they're going to release stuff up until that point. I don't think they're going to release FP 11 in September, clasp their hands together and be like "welp, we're done", I think they have things planned out up until New Year's 2022.

 

[pinshadow]

I would normally agree with you, and I will admit that there is much past precedent that suggests Nintendo will do the same here, but I also feel that this is the prime opportunity for them to have learned what works and what doesn't and base of the results of other companies doing similar things.

Also, Smash is a lot easier to monetize than those two games. As far as I know, new costumes and stuff for Splatoon were all free updates. I think that Mario Kart Tour is proof you COULD charge for new Karters in a game where the kart racer offers more to the game than just a face and a couple of stats, but Smash is better off for monetization because you get a whole new character with a new moveset and mechanics, a new stage, new music and new spirits.

That's fair, but you could also argue Smash costs more since not only are you paying for the development, but also licensing, and multi-million dollar CG trailers. Either way, I guess I should make clear my argument isn't that characters like Geno, Travis or Leon can't be playable because they are spirits or costumes, it's that they ARE Spirits and Costumes BECAUSE Nintendo has already decided who's going to get in the game instead of them.

If we do get a miracle situation where Nintendo does greenlight a Pass 3, fantastic, all those characters can be considered back on the hypothetical table, but until then I'm staying cautious and taking Sakurai's word on it.

 

[Icewolff92]

Keep in mind that Splatoon 2's updates were free for 2 years (except for the Octo Expansion Pass). I can't really blame them for having a 2 year limit since those updates costs time and money.

Let´s not forget that, while Nintendo loves money, they aren´t exactly like every other company
"No microtransaction or loot boxes" in their 60 dollar game.

Refuse to support the competitive scene even though companies are willing to pretty much give them ownership of the circuit, and only asking for their blessing, in a market that Nintendo could make millions if not more.

Focusing more on new installments than doing actual paid DLC. Are there games that have DLC? Sure, but they are like 1% of the games they put out. Heck people begged for DLC for Super Mario Party.... did it get any? Nope. and that game was a success.

What I´m trying to say is... Just because a fighter pass 3 might be a logical sense in terms of cash, Nintendo isn´t exactly a "normal" company in terms of how they operate.

Could we get a Fighter Pass 3/Bonus character? Sure, but I argue that it's even a miracle that we got the second fighters pass, to begin with, and as other has mentioned, Sakurai has made it abundantly clear that this is it. He never said anything of it during the first pass. He clearly loves this franchise, but he has worked on it for 8 years straight. Everyone wants to move on to other projects after a while.

 

[Griselda]

I'm not even leaning towards 'Sakurai is just kidding and Geno is still in', but just because I'm keeping the possibility in mind doesn't make me or anyone else who does delusional. I'm also acknowledging that it's a possibility that I might get nothing other than the costume, because the fact that one is much more likely than the other doesn't mean that they aren't both still possible. It's feeling like people are misinterpreting people saying 'It's possible' as them saying 'It's happening', when that's not what's being said here.

There's nothing at all wrong with saying, "I'm pretty sure we lost, but maybe we haven't".

 

[ForsakenM]

That's fair, but you could also argue Smash costs more since not only are you paying for the development, but also licensing, and multi-million dollar CG trailers. Either way, I guess I should make clear my argument isn't that characters like Geno, Travis or Leon can't be playable because they are spirits or costumes, it's that they ARE Spirits and Costumes BECAUSE Nintendo has already decided who's going to get in the game instead of them.

If we do get a miracle situation where Nintendo does greenlight a Pass 3, fantastic, all those characters can be considered back on the hypothetical table, but until then I'm staying cautious.

Even with all that said, Smash Ultimate has sold 21 million copies.

Let's say that only half the consumer base has bought just Vol 2, which I doubt is accurate and I KNOW it's more than that, but let's just say it's only half of those 21 million buy Vol 2.

Unless I'm a complete mongrel, that comes out to $300,000,000. That is a lot of money, and that is only half, which I'm sure it's a lot closer to the full consumer base.

When you factor in that they are likely making much more than that, that they are using much less resources since Sakurai has a smaller team and they are doing in-house presentations now instead of more bombastic breakdowns, it makes a lot more sense on how Nintendo is likely making a profit.

Now, let's factor in costumes, because they are sold separately. Once again, just under half the consumer base would make $7.5 mil per costume. Remember, Smash fans tend to buy everything they can unless they truly hate something, meaning it's likely this number is higher.

Sure, profits have to be shared with other companies and **** like that, but if it wasn't profitable companies like Bamco and Capcom would have stopped doing this already instead of pushing it even further.

 

[pinshadow]

Even with all that said, Smash Ultimate has sold 21 million copies.

Let's say that only half the consumer base has bought just Vol 2, which I doubt is accurate and I KNOW it's more than that, but let's just say it's only half of those 21 million buy Vol 2.

Unless I'm a complete mongrel, that comes out to $300,000,000. That is a lot of money, and that is only half, which I'm sure it's a lot closer to the full consumer base.

When you factor in that they are likely making much more than that, that they are using much less resources since Sakurai has a smaller team and they are doing in-house presentations now instead of more bombastic breakdowns, it makes a lot more sense on how Nintendo is likely making a profit.

Now, let's factor in costumes, because they are sold separately. Once again, just under half the consumer base would make $7.5 mil per costume. Remember, Smash fans tend to buy everything they can unless they truly hate something, meaning it's likely this number is higher.

Sure, profits have to be shared with other companies and **** like that, but if it wasn't profitable companies like Bamco and Capcom would have stopped doing this already instead of pushing it even further.

Oh, it's obviously very profitable, I'm just comparing it to other Nintendo games.

 

[Fatmanonice]

A lot of people have specifically come into the thread to ask me why my thoughts were that Heihachi was totally out of the running in June but not Geno now. Based on my own theorycraft and stuff I've heard, I always figured that not all the Smash 4 Mii costumes would come back because several characters would make the jump to playable. I always figured that Geno and Lloyd/Heihachi's Mii costume would be force fed into a wood chipper and simply not show up in Ultimate. 6 months later, Heihachi and Geno are Mii costumes. Would they really bring back 85 of the 86 Mii costumes? Two popular Mii costumes not coming back would be weird but understandable but just one feels like a huge stretch, especially if they justified bringing back Gil, arguably the most niche DLC costume pick by a country mile. On this note, if people want to have hope for Heihachi or Travis or Rex or whoever, I'm not going to stop them. I have my opinions but I say them here and I don't badger threads for characters I don't think are likely. I'd not going to mock or be like "dude, give up. IT'S OVER" because it's really no skin off my nose if people want a Creeper playable or Cuphead or whatever. I'm not going to go around gut checking people if our opinions on this aren't 1:1 because it's really not that important in the grand scheme of things.

 

[Awkwah]

Wonder if the next fighter will use the same skit from the Banjo/ K. Rool reveals? Would be fun to add Cloud/ Sephiroth to that trailer then get faked out by something else. (Like a Geno Mii to Geno) or Waluigi

 

[ForsakenM]

I'm working on a motivational video for us Geno Bros, but let me just say this.

If you REALLY think Geno has no chance to get into Smash Ultimate, then keep pushing to see him in other things, but keep in mind that if you give up on him for Ultimate 100% then if there is more DLC down the road a major loss in push for him to be playable could be seen as his costume being sufficient and it may ruin his chances.

If you don't think it's over, don't let anyone make you think otherwise and fight for him to get in.

Also, don't just fight for him to 'be in the next game' as we have no idea if there will be one and how many cuts it could have. At that point, if all the characters people really asked for got into Ultimate but got cut in Smash 6 and THEN Geno got in Smash 6, I'm not sure I could see that as an absolute win.

 

[TheCJBrine]

So...what are all of your thoughts on that rumor/“leak” with Chun-Li, Sephiroth, Steve etc., Square-Enix apparently having offered Nintendo all the SMRPG stuff aside from the Final Fantasy stuff it had, and them not being sure if Geno fans were serious or not since we kept focusing on Smash even when we mentioned a new SMRPG as well since it was alongside Smash, so they didn’t want him associated with just Smash and may be why he’s only a mii and a spirit with Mallow since fighters are the main focus/big thing?

It’s probably all fake, as Steve and the seven squares stuff was being discussed around the time the “leak” was made, but I wonder if at least some of the Square-Enix stuff is realistic, and if we should focus more on asking for a new game before Smash so they know we’re serious...

I mean, yeah, they sound dumb to not think we just love the character and game, but maybe they thought it’d make more sense to ask for him to be in more Mario stuff and for a new SMRPG and stuff...even if the leak is fake I just wonder...

And it sounds even more realistic now since we know Square-Enix isn’t actually that stingy, and it’s just artwork owners (maybe?) and, as Sakurai said, the different companies with music rights in different countries and stuff...

 

[cosmicB]

This is why I hoping it didn't come to this and either it didn't show up at all or they just made Geno deluxe. Our feelings are irrelevant and all the decisions for DLC were decided very early last year. Whether we think it's "scummy" doesn't matter. Nintendo dodging Joy Con drift is scummy. Mario Kart Tour is scum incarnate. Depending who you ask, people thought Plant and Byleth were scummy. Nintendo makes decisions that piss off people all the time and especially this year has been living testament of this. Life goes on.

Add in: As for Lloyd and Heihachi... Heihachi never really came up in a serious capacity and my opinion until recently was that not all the Smash 4 costumes would come back. With only three left and Geno, one of the most popular characters of this cycle getting a costume, would they really bring back 85 of the 86? It seems less rational now, especially with who is left.

There's nothing scummy about Plant and Byleth (disappointment is different from scum in this context). Post-game content is post-game content, and completely manufactured expectations does not invalidate that. And I know what the response to that would be. "But paid mii costumes deconfirming is also a manufactured expectation." Here's the thing about that; mii costumes being a consolation prize has long been established by Sakurai himself. IIRC, you even pushed that fact quite a bit during any Rex conversations. It's quite different from the expectation that the first pass would be entirely 3rd party, something based on precedent but not actual words to accompany it. As for drift and MKT, you're right. But these are also expected levels of scummery. As much as I like FEH, gacha is by definition scum, and hardware issues are basic incompetence that's represented more by inaction than actively screwing over the userbase. A more fitting example would be the limited availability of 3D All-Stars/Fire Emblem.

But the point of all this is Geno coming as a paid fighter later down the line would be an actively hostile tactic, unlike the apathy of a hardware defect or the desire to jump on a new pay model that will probably be regulated anyway (limited availability stuff is just weird more than anything, though it is definitely anti-consumer). It requires stringing along a fanbase, asking them to pay for a consolation prize in hopes that things might change in the future, and then revealing the plan all along was to just drain money from them while giving them what they were hoping for in the first place.

The ONE low-probability workaround I could see potentially happening would be something like this:

IF Geno ends up being a fighter, I think the least scummy scenario is him being a completely standalone bonus fighter, with people who purchase both him and the costume getting a bonus song.

 

[Icewolff92]

So...what are all of your thoughts on that rumor/“leak” with Chun-Li, Sephiroth, Steve etc., Square-Enix apparently having offered Nintendo all the SMRPG stuff aside from the Final Fantasy stuff it had, and them not being sure if Geno fans were serious or not since we kept focusing on Smash even when we mentioned a new SMRPG as well since it was alongside Smash, so they didn’t want him associated with just Smash and may be why he’s only a mii and a spirit with Mallow since fighters are the main focus/big thing?

It’s probably all fake, as Steve and the seven squares stuff was being discussed around the time the “leak” was made, but I wonder if at least some of the Square-Enix stuff is realistic, and if we should focus more on asking for a new game before Smash so they know we’re serious...

I mean, yeah, they sound dumb to not think we just love the character and game, but maybe they thought it’d make more sense to ask for him to be in more Mario stuff and for a new SMRPG and stuff...even if the leak is fake I just wonder...

And it sounds even more realistic now since we know Square-Enix isn’t actually that stingy, and it’s just artwork owners (maybe?) and, as Sakurai said, the different companies with music rights in different countries and stuff...

Concidering how Nintendo is with "original Mario characters" that are not made by the "Super Mario Bros chairs" (look Odessey contra the current status of the "RPGs".) in a combination of Square can´t really do anything with the characters concidering where they originated, it wouldn´t be surprising if Square at one point, been trying to sell the rights to the likes of Geno, Mallow, etc. I mean, just look at Mario Kart 8 deluxe.

9 out of 41 characters are baby version/uncreative alts, instead of filling the roster with other fan favorites from the Mario franchise. Heck, they are even doing a Super Smash Brothers, adding in Link, Inkling, Villager/Isabelle instead of giving us more "Mario originality".

About Chun-LI.... truth be told, I could see that happening. Capcom has a streetfighter coming soon, and if you put another SF character in, she is the most logical choice. However, if I have to guess, if there is a Capcom rep in this pass, my money is more on Monster Hunter (due to Rise) and Phoenix Wright (concidering its legacy on Nintendo consoles.

 

[MarioRaccoon]

This explanation also explains why both Smash 4's DLC and the Fighter's Pass were releasing content literally up until days of their respective deadlines. When they say everything will release by 2022, I feel that's the same as them saying that they're going to release stuff up until that point. I don't think they're going to release FP 11 in September, clasp their hands together and be like "welp, we're done", I think they have things planned out up until New Year's 2022.

If they want to work until the end, I would recommend to temper a bit the expectations about how many “bonus” fighters we would get. Remember that a new fighter takes between 6 months to 1 year of development (i suppose this includes planning, design, programming and lots of testing), a mean of 9 months per fighter is very pausible. It all depends on the complexity of the fighter and how many stuff they can recycle.

With FP1, they worked 3 characters at the same time. With FP2, its likely they are doing the same. So, nowdays, they are full on board with CP9, working on CP10 and starting CP11.

So well, let’s say that CP9 will release around march (8-9 months after Min Min and next Amiibo wave is end of that month), CP10 by June (late month, after E3) and CP11 by September. The CP6/9 team would have been “free” around 9 months earlier than the end date, that is enough time to develop a new fighter (don’t expect a full CP, just the fighter with one new remix, no stage or spirit board) for a december release. Meanwhile, CP7/10 team would have 5/6 months left, that is not enough time to develop a completely new fighter, unless its a semi-echo, like for example Wolf. CP8/11 can help the other teams to speed up things a bit after they finished.

In summary, if its possible to get some bonus, expect 1/2 fighters (no stage or spirit board, maybe 1 new remix). One can be a full original fighter (without complex mechanics like Steve or Min Min), the other must be a semi-echo yes or yes (i think a good candidate for that would be dixie kong as she can borrowed many things from Diddy kong to make her development more quickly).

As you have been saying, december is an important date for smash (and its true), so maybe by next december, we can get a final smash presentation showcasing this two last fighters and a bonus mii costume wave.

PS: Talking about Chun-Li, IIRC, there is a user here called xenother that commented on gamefaqs a long-time ago (2018, before Ultimate was on the streets) that Chun-Li was considered for base game but sadly scrapped.

 

[DeniroSerafim]

I've been mostly sticking to the Dixie Kong thread as she is my most wanted character at this point, but I just wanted to say I feel for you guys, the way Geno supporters have been treated is extremely childish and immature. I hope that anyone who experienced bullying or negativity in any way due to this situation understands they're not weird, stupid or wrong for liking what they like. The passion you guys have for Geno is what kept him alive all these years. Nintendo could have easily ignored him, it's not like he fits in with Nintendo's current plans for the Mario series, but that's not what happened. If he didn't matter, the Mii costume would not be there. But it is, because your love for Mario RPG and Geno has been noticed, just like the fan support for K. Rool before. I would be lying if I said I think it's likely he'll show up in this second fighter pass, but that doesn't mean you should stop wanting it or feel bad for wanting it, and it doesn't mean it can never happen, Smash isn't going anywhere. I wish all the best for everyone in here, hopefully one day I can see a match between Geno and Dixie take place in this fantastic series.

 

[Nekoo]

One last thing to keep in mind is that, according to Sakurai, the last character of Season 2 was greenlit in January 2020 around Byleth's presentation so everybody who is going to happen between now and 2022 has already been decided.

Just pointing this out, but maybe Byleth's presentation went from December to January BECAUSE of that last character deal, maybe pushing the pass from 5 to 6 and then not sure they would 100% get it?

 

[Bobthealligator]

BY December. We've talked about this before, but the December 2021 deadline makes zero sense, especially in a pre-COVID development cycle. Assuming Steve and Sephiroth were out E3 reveals, we get a schedule like this.

• Min Min: Spring 2020
• Steve/Sephiroth : E3 2020, Steve released in Summer, Sephiroth in early Fall
• Fighter 9 : Fall Direct, released late 2020
• Fighter 10 : Game Awards, released early 2021
• Fighter 11 : Revealed in early 2021 Direct, released Spring

Maybe some of these locations and times are a little off, but the point is that they would have to arbitrarily stretch out time between characters CONSIDERABLY to reach that deadline. Both Smash 4 and Fighter Pass 1 took about a year to get all their characters out, there's no reason Pass 2 wouldn't be the same.

Here's a reason the second pass wouldn't be the same, we were explicitly told that it wouldn't be. Sakurai talks very openly about the development procces, so I see no reason to believe that there were any substantial delays thus far.

Back in January 2019 it was datamined from the game that there was 16 character dummyslots within World of Light. Once Plant was added to the game, this data was scrubbed along with the "Brave" dataset. Thanks to modding, we discovered that if exactly 16 slots were added onto the character select screen, this was the absolute limit that the game could handle before it would soft lock. We've used this to determine that, outside of an enormous hardware update, 16 DLC characters is the absolute limit Ultimate can handle. The Fighter's Pass plus Season 2 fills 12 of these slots at face value, leaving 4 unaccounted for.

This isn't true, the dummy slots weren't filled, they're still there. In fact only two slots were filled, by Pot Plant and Pipe Plant, so this means nothing.
Though honestly it's worth mentioning that Sakurai said there were no plans for a second pass around the same stage in the first, and while I don't necessarily expect another one, I also wouldn't rule it out.

 

[Colololin]

So...what are all of your thoughts on that rumor/“leak” with Chun-Li, Sephiroth, Steve etc., Square-Enix apparently having offered Nintendo all the SMRPG stuff aside from the Final Fantasy stuff it had, and them not being sure if Geno fans were serious or not since we kept focusing on Smash even when we mentioned a new SMRPG as well since it was alongside Smash, so they didn’t want him associated with just Smash and may be why he’s only a mii and a spirit with Mallow since fighters are the main focus/big thing?

It’s probably all fake, as Steve and the seven squares stuff was being discussed around the time the “leak” was made, but I wonder if at least some of the Square-Enix stuff is realistic, and if we should focus more on asking for a new game before Smash so they know we’re serious...

I mean, yeah, they sound dumb to not think we just love the character and game, but maybe they thought it’d make more sense to ask for him to be in more Mario stuff and for a new SMRPG and stuff...even if the leak is fake I just wonder...

And it sounds even more realistic now since we know Square-Enix isn’t actually that stingy, and it’s just artwork owners (maybe?) and, as Sakurai said, the different companies with music rights in different countries and stuff...

If you mean that list I do not buy it. On two occassions Sakurai's opinion was vetoed (Byleth and Min Min) and then somebody from Nintendo heavily prioritised Minecraft even though Sakurai implied he did not want it and the whole presentation felt like his heart was not in it like the Sephiroth one. There seems to be too much "you ARE adding this" for him to have freely picked. Even if everybody who gets in was on that list it is so broad and includes a lot of heavily speculated names.

Nintendo have obviously restricted his say on the roster this time.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Chun Li in the pass would be iconic though not gonna lie.

Wasn't there some "buff" to someone's legs to make them thicker that made people think they'd be used as the basis for her?

You could even use Min Min for a Chun Li trailer and it'd probably work exceptionally well.

 

[Icewolff92]

Just pointing this out, but maybe Byleth's presentation went from December to January BECAUSE of that last character deal, maybe pushing the pass from 5 to 6 and then not sure they would 100% get it?

If you mean that list I do not buy it. On two occassions Sakurai's opinion was vetoed (Byleth and Min Min) and then somebody from Nintendo heavily prioritised Minecraft even though Sakurai implied he did not want it and the whole presentation felt like his heart was not in it like the Sephiroth one. There seems to be too much "you ARE adding this" for him to have freely picked. Even if everybody who gets in was on that list it is so broad and includes a lot of heavily speculated names.

Nintendo have obviously restricted his say on the roster this time.

Yeah, you can certainly feel the difference in enthusiasm in presentations like Sephiroth compared to Steve for example

 

[SoopahSanikMoo]

hey so uuuhh i had to step out of star road for a bit but now i cant find the serv's link again, would someone be so kind as to pass it to me

 

[Crankshadow]

I saw people talking about scummy practices, and personally I don’t know about y’all but 6.75 for star boi, and the ability for sans-o, cup-o , pig-o etc sounds like a great deal to me.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Just pointing this out, but maybe Byleth's presentation went from December to January BECAUSE of that last character deal, maybe pushing the pass from 5 to 6 and then not sure they would 100% get it?

A lot of people theorized this last January and why Imran Khan bringing up Sora and Master Chief around that time was extra HMMM for a lot of people. Basically the idea that some people still have about FP11 is that they were a pain in the ass to get or their company had very, very specific conditions that had to be followed for them to be allowed.

 

[Nekoo]

A lot of people theorized this last January and why Imran Khan bringing up Sora and Master Chief around that time was extra HMMM for a lot of people. Basically the idea that some people still have about FP11 is that they were a pain in the ass to get or their company had very, very specific conditions that had to be followed for them to be allowed.

I see...

I SEE...

Then, even if I got Sephiroth, even if it's the end of the battle for Geno. As the Square-Enix Ultimate fanboy, and for the list of the Seven Square, I shall continue the battle. One day... All of us shall be in Smash. WAIT FOR ME- FIGHTER PASS 11!

I wish you all luck, even if it's the end of the fight, it's not the end of the war. You guys can still cheer up and fight for Geno to appear anywhere else! Any Mention! It's the 25th anniversary Soon right? THEN RAISE YOUR VOICE AND DON'T GIVE UP! HAVE IT GET A MENTION SOMEWHERE!
Smash, Mario Kart, just a tiny mention somewhere....BUT WORK TO SHOW YOUR LOVE FOR HIM!

 

[Sam2004]

Look I know you guys are disappointed about geno but dont spin the narrative that he's mad about Steve. Remember, Steve and Min Mins presents where made during a panemic and sakurai was probably getting tired of it. I mean, he even said himself that he was lonely during steve's presentation.

 

[Oracle Link]

Could you stop Posting FOR FIVE MINUTES!!!!

 

[KirbyMonadoBoy]

The chances are pretty low, however.... maybe Geno is planned as a final, individual bonus fighter (the ultimate christmas present 2021 from Sakurai) and free for people who have bought every single DLC character so far (either individually or via the fighters passes)? This could be a way to thank all loyal fans and additionally push the DLC sales.

This would be the best possible way to end the long Super Smash Bros. Ultimate ride, to finish this epic masterpiece!

 

[DarkShadow20]

The chances are pretty low, however.... maybe Geno is planned as a final, individual bonus fighter (the ultimate christmas present 2021 from Sakurai) and free for people who have bought every single DLC character so far (either individually or via the fighters passes)? This could be a way to thank all loyal fans and additionally push the DLC sales.

This would be the best possible way to end the long Super Smash Bros. Ultimate ride, to finish this epic masterpiece!

That would make sense since Geno is purely a Smash fan request and wouldn't bring in any outside fans like most other 3rd party characters. So it would be a nice reward/incentive for those of us who bought every character. Plus it would also get some people to go ahead and buy every other character to get Geno for free, which would give both Nintendo and Square more money.

 

[Colololin]

Look I know you guys are disappointed about geno but dont spin the narrative that he's mad about Steve. Remember, Steve and Min Mins presents where made during a panemic and sakurai was probably getting tired of it. I mean, he even said himself that he was lonely during steve's presentation.

I am not mad at Steve or anything. I am just giving examples of the continued piling evidence against the idea that Sakurai picked these characters. Even the claim that he considered Slime is misinformation. It was a suggestion as part of his pitch/plan for the series to join.

 

[Vector Victor]

The chances are pretty low, however.... maybe Geno is planned as a final, individual bonus fighter (the ultimate christmas present 2021 from Sakurai) and free for people who have bought every single DLC character so far (either individually or via the fighters passes)? This could be a way to thank all loyal fans and additionally push the DLC sales.

This would be the best possible way to end the long Super Smash Bros. Ultimate ride, to finish this epic masterpiece!

Merely for speculation, but that situation would be a fascinating reverse karma end result against detractors, as they repeatedly claim that Geno not making it is karma for the fanbase's attitude. Then after Geno's costume reveal where the detractors have acted worse, karma swings back on them, not only having to deal with playable Geno, but he would also be the final character for Smash. The final character was always going to be hated, and then it turns out to be THE hated character to them.

 

[Dukefire]

Terminalmontage has made his video about the Geno costume's return.

 

[Geno Boost]

Chun Li in the pass would be iconic though not gonna lie.

Wasn't there some "buff" to someone's legs to make them thicker that made people think they'd be used as the basis for her?

You could even use Min Min for a Chun Li trailer and it'd probably work exceptionally well.

I feel they would give a 2nd non echo Street fighter rep to Akuma as he would generate more hype also a villain from a fighting game which we don’t have yet

 

[Oracle Link]

Terminalmontage has made his video about the Geno costume's return.

Ive got Criticized for saying its Karma

but i was reffering only to Terminal Montage (because he is Pretty mean to BWD Fans)

 

[Theguy123]

I feel like the dlc makes it obvious that they’re using the dlc characterto promote games so we need to get square and Nintendo to pick up the super Mario RPG series again. If we can do that we’ll Stand a better chance of getting Geno in smash because they’d have a reason to promote the games.

Instead of focusing our support on Geno in smash now we need to focus it on smash and a super Mario RPG remake. Dunno how we do that but with alphadream unfortunately dead we need to start petitions and hope Nintendo and square Enix see them.

 

[MidoriBlade]

Sakurai: You can't join Smash Bros yet, Geno...

portal shows future smash game

Sakurai: Not yet... Not yet...

 

[Fatmanonice]

The chances are pretty low, however.... maybe Geno is planned as a final, individual bonus fighter (the ultimate christmas present 2021 from Sakurai) and free for people who have bought every single DLC character so far (either individually or via the fighters passes)? This could be a way to thank all loyal fans and additionally push the DLC sales.

This would be the best possible way to end the long Super Smash Bros. Ultimate ride, to finish this epic masterpiece!

One thing I will say on the topic of Geno potentially being a bonus is that the timeline of events doesn't suggest he would be dead last. The most notable "weird stuff" concerning Geno happened between July 2019 and early November 2019. In comparison, Master Chief's "big stuff" started popping up around December 2019/January 2020, coincidentally near the end of when the final decisions of Season 2 were being made. Seeing how Steve and now Sephiroth's "big stuff" first came up in fall 2018, it paints a new picture of a potential timeline.

 

[Cahalan]

I'm pretty damn sure that Chun-Li Leak is fake.

Why would Capcom want to add another Street Fighter character when they have a couple of franchises on the table, even after RE is out of the running?

And the whole situation with Square Enix being absolutely clueless about what Geno fans want with the character is just flat out stupid.
Even if Nintendo is the one picking the characters, are they that ignorant about what we want with Geno when Sakurai has been personally wanting him since Brawl?

I know both companies can have a dumb streak, and Nintendo has been recently on a roll in that front, but at least Square Enix is competent enough to want some extra money down the road if Cloud has to be base game for Ultimate.

 

[xNovaNebulax]

One thing I will say on the topic of Geno potentially being a bonus is that the timeline of events doesn't suggest he would be dead last. The most notable "weird stuff" concerning Geno happened between July 2019 and early November 2019. In comparison, Master Chief's "big stuff" started popping up around December 2019/January 2020, coincidentally near the end of when the final decisions of Season 2 were being made. Seeing how Steve and now Sephiroth's "big stuff" first came up in fall 2018, it paints a new picture of a potential timeline.

im just confused about all the copyright stuff from that year...

 

[JoscarGamma]

With the Chun-li leak, the part about square-Enix unsure about Geno has me somewhat baffled. I was always under the impression that If there was fan demand for a character, it showed there was interest in not only the character, but the series as well.

I’d use both Marth/Roy and Pit as an example, especially Pit. After Melee, Fire Emblem was released for the Game Boy Advance, and after Brawl was complete, Kid Icarus Uprising. Hell, fans were at least happy Little Mac got acknowledged in brawl, and that led to a new punch-out...

You would think with how many times the fans have asked for both Mallow and Geno they’d get the hint.

So with that, what would be the approach now?

Petition for a new game featuring Mallow and Geno? (we have to be specific, cause clearly they’re so clueless that they’ll just do another Super Mario RPG without Mallow and Geno)

Sure, that’s fine, but then they’ll sit on their hands again and not include Geno in the next smash game because of uncertainty? Idk...

 

[MattX20]

People are looking at this "leak" because it got Sephiroth right:
39 ：名無しさん必死だな：2020/10/06(火) 02:04:48.28 ID:aZ22kCgS0.net
ソニーっていうかセフィロスとクラッシュ来るよ
残りはこの2体と東方の霊夢とゼノサーガのKOSMOS
かなり攻めたラインナップだから荒れそう
Mii衣装から参戦することは残念だけどないです

Not really Sony reps, but Sephiroth and Crash are coming.
The remainings are these two and Reimu from Touhou and KOSMOS from Xenosaga.
The lineup is trying way too hard to play to the crowd so it won't be pretty.
Unfortunately, there won't be any promotions from Mii costumes.

http://anago.2ch.sc/test/read.cgi/ghard/1601895454/39

 

[Dan]

Great, now people on Twitter are making up that Sakurai wanted Geno to be a Deluxe and playable but Square wouldn't allow it. The only thing I could ever see is he wanted him in Brawl but they couldn't work it out, but I truly believe that he just hasn't felt he's important enough.