Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[MasterWarlord]

Too me this bothers me. If Geno IS suppose to be a surprise later down the line of DLC, Wouldn't you wanna wait for the fighter to be revealed BEFORE making those references?

We. Don't. Know. That

You are answering your own question here.

Why would Sakurai tease a character before they were revealed like this? Why would Sakurai just casually mention he wanted a character is in the game then put them in the game afterwards? The reveal trailers cost a lot of money to make, and Nintendo hates characters being leaked. The whole point is to have a surprise. If Sakurai is giving very direct references to a character, that generally tends to not bode well for them, as it means he has spoiled the theoretical surprise.

While nothing is technically set in stone, Sakurai could technically announce Birdo as the next Smash newcomer. There is a big difference between optimistic hoping and expectations.

 

[Giga Kaiju]

Sakurai’s latest POTD is a SMPRG reference using the costume, while it’s sad that Geno couldn’t make it in, atleast he’s still an open fan of the game.

https://twitter.com/sora_sakurai/status/1340492120973447169?s=21

Oh man. Mario RPG reference from Sakurai. If that isn't proof that he is aware of the legacy of the game and its characters (Geno, Mallow and co.) then I don't know what to say.

A throwback to that awesome Culex battle.

Edit: Oh, BTW. The Mii Costume of Geno looks so good when you're not seeing its face. It's so good it almost seems like the actual one than a Costume.

.

 

[Powerman293]

You are answering your own question here.

Why would Sakurai tease a character before they were revealed like this? Why would Sakurai just casually mention he wanted a character is in the game then put them in the game afterwards? The reveal trailers cost a lot of money to make, and Nintendo hates characters being leaked. The whole point is to have a surprise. If Sakurai is giving very direct references to a character, that generally tends to not bode well for them, as it means he has spoiled the theoretical surprise.

While nothing is technically set in stone, Sakurai could technically announce Birdo as the next Smash newcomer. There is a big difference between optimistic hoping and expectations.

When was the last time Sakurai talked about Geno proper? Since Smash 4? I don't think a half decade old passing interest is really a "spoiler".

 

[TooManyToastahs]

Too me this bothers me. If Geno IS suppose to be a surprise later down the line of DLC, Wouldn't you wanna wait for the fighter to be revealed BEFORE making those references?

Yeah, I’m honestly right there with you. All the fun little references used for Geno’s Mii costume reveal trailer and this possible Culex reference in Sakurai’s POTD really feel like the kind of things you’d save for after Geno’s reveal.
I’m sure they could find some other fun ways to reference the game if Geno got revealed as a playable fighter later on down the road, but the nagging feeling in the back of my mind says these are very clear indicators things are not looking good, among the hundred other ones that have appeared as of late.

My pessimism aside, who knows what’s next honestly. We’ve got at the very least 3 more months before we possibly get our next fighter revealed, maybe Sakurai’s just having fun with the costume in the mean time. It doesn’t necessarily hurt or help his chances at this point.
Also I should mention that the POTD looks awesome regardless. Still cool to see this stuff in Smash even if it’s just a Mii in a costume standing in for Geno.

 

[zferolie]

look guys, I'm a big geno fan like you guys, but him getting a mii fighting costume means 100% for sure he is not going to be a fighter this pass. why have you guys said other mii fighters deconfirm, but when geno becomes one it doesn't?

I don't want you guys to get your hype up just to be disappointed. just assume he is out. and if he comes in, great! if not, you don't need to get upset.

 

[pinshadow]

Or, you know, Geno is contracted to him X number of costumes just like Sephiroth was and there are a limited number of returning costumes, and Square only comes with Square content so it was always gonna be like this?

Thus, Geno's costume comes back with Sephy and we all pity party and buy the costume, getting max sales. Then Geno comes in Vol 3 since Sora would still likely fall through negotiations again and now we pay them more money.

Also, imagine having a PNG-Event and then going back that company later and thinking 'You know, we just got Vol 3 greenlit, but we did put glorified pictures in the game already, so I guess Leon or Jill are off limits.'

Would be kinda dumb, right? Though Dante and Wright are on the top of the list for Capcom, so RE is probably screwed anyway.

The argument falls flat when Sakurai has made it extremely clear on multiple occasions that Pass 2 is it, they have no plans after this and he's done with Smash after working on it for 8+ years for a long time. If this was the costume coming back with Hero, then fine, I'd be open to this line of thinking, but they chose not to have the costume come back there only to hold it until Sephiroth, after they have already decided every character they ARE adding as DLC. This isn't some "4D Chess" Situation, he's just not in the game.

 

[Dan]

Everyone on the internet thinks the image of the day is a bad thing but I think it's a rare good thing... it's a harmless good nod. Direct the hate toward the fact that they couldn't finish his face.

 

[OptimisticStrifer]

look guys, I'm a big geno fan like you guys, but him getting a mii fighting costume means 100% for sure he is not going to be a fighter this pass. why have you guys said other mii fighters deconfirm, but when geno becomes one it doesn't?

I don't want you guys to get your hype up just to be disappointed. just assume he is out. and if he comes in, great! if not, you don't need to get upset.

that's like.... literally what 90% of us are doing though.

 

[zferolie]

that's like.... literally what 90% of us are doing though.

Ok. i was just scrolling through the last page and saw a few people saying he's not deconfirmed, and hes going to be a bonus. I really think thats dangerous thinking is all.

 

[Fatmanonice]

In Smash 4 they added six DLC slots, five dummy Marios and Mewtwo.

But you'll remember there were seven DLC characters total.

Because later, as the first three Marios would be accounted for with Lucas, Roy and Ryu, an extra sixth Mario was added.
The original count for characters didn't reflect how many we got. It was a preliminary number, that didn't reflect the final product.

You'll recall that it was also datamined that 4's All-Star had up to, if I recall correctly, nine stages, even though only seven were used in the final product.

There's no reason to believe Ultimate, which had its sixteen slots from the beginning, doesn't follow the same procedure of leaving ample space for the sake of future-proofing (especially given how it was almost assured that DLC was part of the plan from the beginning this time), but without the premeditated intention of having a final exact quantity. This is standard practice in which there is even a precedent in the previous game.

6 became 7 so they added one (which I imagine was Corrin based on how Sakurai talked about them) but didn't subtract. Still case in point for characters, they filled all of them by the time the game was done.

 

[dream1ng]

We. Don't. Know. That

Sure, much in the same way we don't know if Travis and Heihachi and Altair are going to be playable.

But it's pretty safe to assume they won't be.

 

[Cahalan]

I'm still thinking that if Geno's done for, Crono could be next in line if negotiations were successful.

Not 100% confident in Geno's already small chances, but I'm also not 100% confident in Crono's chances either. The only one who could possibly have a chance if Geno & Crono are out of the running is Lara Croft (off the top of my head, there could be plenty more ahead of her in the line).

 

[Fatmanonice]

Just like in the case of spirits, it only takes one for the fan rule to be broken. Pretty likely this is going to happen to at least one Mii costume and one assist trophy before all is said and done.

 

[Enigma735]

look guys, I'm a big geno fan like you guys, but him getting a mii fighting costume means 100% for sure he is not going to be a fighter this pass. why have you guys said other mii fighters deconfirm, but when geno becomes one it doesn't?

I don't want you guys to get your hype up just to be disappointed. just assume he is out. and if he comes in, great! if not, you don't need to get upset.

I mean, I don't think any of us are denying that. I just think as Geno supporters, obviously we're gonna have some Geno bias, and I'm sure Travis and Heihachi supporters are probably the same way.

As for me, its safe to say Geno is deconfirmed, at least for this Pass. As for bonus characters, I can't say I can completely rule him out. Unlikely? Sure, but certainly not impossible, especially if you at least consider my "tinfoil hat" theory from the previous page.

 

[SeasideKingDumb]

That pic of the day basically shows me that if they were able to make it work they'd definitely put Geno in the game. If Square didn't have those copyright shenanigans we'd probably have Geno by now RIP

 

[OptimisticStrifer]

Ok. i was just scrolling through the last page and saw a few people saying he's not deconfirmed, and hes going to be a bonus. I really think thats dangerous thinking is all.

IDK if I'd say it's dangerous. Geno fans are accustomed to disappointment

 

[Paraster]

Has PushDustIn's thread on Geno been posted here?

https://twitter.com/PushDustIn/status/1340497890184110081

 

[SeasideKingDumb]

PushDustin's tweets actually line up with that alleged leak being passed around rn which came out a year or two ago (I think it's the one that mentions Chun-Li) about Geno having TOO MANY connections to Smash already, so it'd be difficult for the character to bring in a new audience for the DLC.

It sucks that that's the case as the base roster was probably the only way for Geno to get in, but that is interesting to note that his fanbase overlapping with the Smash fanbase could be why he isn't there. I'd take the Pic of the Day as more of a sign that if they could start over the base roster and put him in with Square on board they probably would.

 

[zferolie]

Just like in the case of spirits, it only takes one for the fan rule to be broken. Pretty likely this is going to happen to at least one Mii costume and one assist trophy before all is said and done.

Oh i hate relying on fan theories as well... it just, thinking about it from a business and development side: why make a mii costume then in that same pass release that character as playable? was of time a resources.

I think if geno or any Mii costumes have a chance(that were released this pass) it will be in a possible 3rd pass, not this one. and we can't be 100% sure it will happen. I would like it to happen though

I mean, I don't think any of us are denying that. I just think as Geno supporters, obviously we're gonna have some Geno bias, and I'm sure Travis and Heihachi supporters are probably the same way.

As for me, its safe to say Geno is deconfirmed, at least for this Pass. As for bonus characters, I can't say I can completely rule him out. Unlikely? Sure, but certainly not impossible, especially if you at least consider my "tinfoil hat" theory from the previous page.

very true. I hope for a 3rd pass, even if the last 3 characters are my most wanted, because I like this idea of slow constant updates to this game to keep making it better. I would love it if they could have 100 playable characters. with echos I beleive after this pass they will be at 88. 12 more to have a huge mile stone

IDK if I'd say it's dangerous. Geno fans are accustomed to disappointment

that is true haha

 

[QQS]

Seen here

GENO AWAKENS!

 

[The DoE]

look guys, I'm a big geno fan like you guys, but him getting a mii fighting costume means 100% for sure he is not going to be a fighter this pass. why have you guys said other mii fighters deconfirm, but when geno becomes one it doesn't?

I don't want you guys to get your hype up just to be disappointed. just assume he is out. and if he comes in, great! if not, you don't need to get upset.

Probably because returning Mii Costumes are just for preserving Sm4sh Costumes, rather than specifically being Sakurai's last representation of that said character. That applies to bonus/individual character only, though.

Let's say we get a Namco character with Lloyd's old Mii Costume, he would still be fair-game as an individual character since that costume was returning anyway with or without himself. That also applies to Geno and every character that was a Mii Costume in Sm4sh, since those costumes would've returned if they were in the pass or not.

Old costumes would deconfirm from that pass and probably for future ones, but not individual characters since they wouldn't have to bother to include those Mii Costumes with characters that are being individually sold.

 

[Dan]

I still can't tell if people are mad he wasn't playable or that he wasn't a Deluxe... I'm just mad he wasn't a Deluxe.

 

[Cahalan]

I still can't tell if people are mad he wasn't playable or that he wasn't a Deluxe... I'm just mad he wasn't a Deluxe.

I'm mixed on the Deluxe thing. If he's out for good, at least bundle the song and get it over with.

On the other hand, him not being deluxe just leaves just enough bit of hope for something else down the line. Even if it's not Geno, more SMRPG content can sneak its way in with other Square Enix fighters like Crono or Lara Croft.

 

[dream1ng]

6 became 7 so they added one (which I imagine was Corrin based on how Sakurai talked about them) but didn't subtract. Still case in point for characters, they filled all of them by the time the game was done.

Exactly.

You have to ignore all the data save one aspect, including an entire example - being All-Star's data - to make your theory plausible.

Cherrypicking won't change the reality of the situation, being that the overarching point was that in both cases, not just the one favourable for your point, the recurring factor was that the initial data did not correspond to the final product.

I'm not skewing the data, I'm presenting it as is, and highlighting the commonality. If you push all the evidence that doesn't fit the narrative aside you're going to wind up like all the other times you did that.

 

[Xehanort1372019]

Damn...this hits in the feels...

How Sephiroth Got In Smash 🗡️

My boy.. Look how they massacred my boy..Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/terminalmontageMerchandise for sale here! https://terminalmontagemerchportal.weebly...

www.youtube.com

 

[TheCJBrine]

How do y’all feel about this leak/rumor Ayumi Tachibana shared in Newcomer Speculation?

Official - Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

Alright how about a game? Let's say there is a third fighters pass just for the sake of filling up the spaces so you only get three fighters and 1 individual fighter who doesn't have the other stuff like a stage, music or spirit board. Which characters would you pick? What stage would they...

smashboards.com

It came from 5chan. It’s disappointing if true...Square-Enix may have offered to sell the content they owned in the game aside from the Final Fantasy stuff, and Nintendo refused...? And they think people only think he’s a Smash Bros. character, and that they only want a new SMRPG in relation to Smash...?

edit: oh I see it was already mentioned.

Maybe we need to push for a new game first? Or maybe it means he has a better chance in the basegame (although I find their strange fears of people only thinking he’s a Smash Bros. character more likely since this may have been from around the time of the Ballot).

 

[OptimisticStrifer]

Has PushDustIn's thread on Geno been posted here?

https://twitter.com/PushDustIn/status/1340497890184110081

I understand Dustin taking the business position, but the last pass proved there's still room 4 the banjo's in the world. Geno could have easily been this passes Banjo

 

[MrJudd]

PushDustin's tweets actually line up with that alleged leak being passed around rn which came out a year or two ago (I think it's the one that mentions Chun-Li) about Geno having TOO MANY connections to Smash already, so it'd be difficult for the character to bring in a new audience for the DLC.

It sucks that that's the case as the base roster was probably the only way for Geno to get in, but that is interesting to note that his fanbase overlapping with the Smash fanbase could be why he isn't there. I'd take the Pic of the Day as more of a sign that if they could start over the base roster and put him in with Square on board they probably would.

All of this lines up with that claim from 2018, which is why things get even more confusing with what happened: everything we talked about Geno and such started picking up steam AFTER this all had elapsed, with most stuff coming in 2019 and 2020. I don't have an answer to it, but considering how these rumors take years to pan out or be debunked, we won't be able to close the case on it until 2021/2022. Add in the SMRPG rumors outside of Smash also happening this year and the situation gets even more confusing and that is why I'm not claiming any sides until more developments happen.

 

[cosmicB]

Just like in the case of spirits, it only takes one for the fan rule to be broken. Pretty likely this is going to happen to at least one Mii costume and one assist trophy before all is said and done.

For the better part of a year, there was one thing you were consistent with, and that was that seeing the mii costume meant "seeing the corpse". You gave your condolences to Heihachi fans and reassured Lloyd fans they were safe. You pushed back against anything related to Rex for this exact reason despite people that have access to more sources than you do considering him possible like the Gamexplain guys. So what changed?

Let's think about what would have to happen for Geno to still be possible. All those nifty references in the costume trailer and the Sakurai tweet just now would have to be some kind of weird fakeout to lower people's guard. Okay, Sakurai likes surprises, so maybe possible, but now you have to consider a character getting revealed after their likeness is used for a PAID Mii costume. Surely you understand how scummy that is, and in a year full of Nintendo scumminess. Take a step back and look at how people still wishing for Geno (outside of the vacuum of just being a Geno fan which is perfectly fine) are actively wishing for a predatory monetization practice that will piss people off. It's the same logic behind "Oh, Travis is a big joker, so that means the mii costume is a joke and therefore you'll get him as playable too and you get to spend even more money!" I don't want that and Travis was in my top 5. I wouldn't want that for my number 1 either.

There are still things the Geno fanbase can do to make their voice heard and hopefully get the nifty puppet in Smash 6. Maintain the community, keep making cool art, memes, charities, whatever. This thread hasn't reached over 3700 pages for nothing. But his chances are dead for Ultimate. And in the 0.00001% chance he DOES get made a full character in this game, bonus or otherwise, congratulations; this beloved character with a gargantuan fanbase is now forever associated with either Nintendo, Square Enix, or both being an anti-consumer leech. I've grown pretty damn cynical over the years, but even I don't think Nintendo or SQEX would pull something so grossly deceptive and predatory.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Exactly.

You have to ignore all the data save one aspect, including an entire example - being All-Star's data - to make your theory plausible.

Cherrypicking won't change the reality of the situation, being that the overarching point was that in both cases, not just the one favourable for your point, the recurring factor was that the initial data did not correspond to the final product.

I'm not skewing the data, I'm presenting it as is, and highlighting the commonality. If you push all the evidence that doesn't fit the narrative aside you're going to wind up like all the other times you did that.

Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS / Wii U: Downloadable Content Info

Main page for Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS / Wii U and Downloadable Content Info © 2014 Nintendo Original Game: © Nintendo / HAL Laboratory, Inc. Characters: © Nintendo / HAL Laboratory, Inc. / Pokémon. / Creatures Inc. / GAME FREAK inc. / SHIGESATO ITOI / APE inc. / INTELLIGENT SYSTEMS /...

www.smashbros.com

The total number of paid DLC stages was 8 but only 7 were available in both versions. There was 5 ala carte stages and 3 that came with characters. 5/7 so two of these stages weren't used in All-star mode. Do you have more information on All Star mode's stage spread?

 

[S1itchey]

I understand Dustin taking the business position, but the last pass proved there's still room 4 the banjo's in the world. Geno could have easily been this passes Banjo

The only problem is that like banjo, geno needs a Microsoft. And square isnt microsoft.

 

[Awkwah]

Well, a certain discord I know posted a cool edit of the Sakurai tweet:

https://twitter.com/fm_discord/status/1340508280527998977?s=20

 

[Fatmanonice]

For the better part of a year, there was one thing you were consistent with, and that was that seeing the mii costume meant "seeing the corpse". You gave your condolences to Heihachi fans and reassured Lloyd fans they were safe. You pushed back against anything related to Rex for this exact reason despite people that have access to more sources than you do considering him possible like the Gamexplain guys. So what changed?

Let's think about what would have to happen for Geno to still be possible. All those nifty references in the costume trailer and the Sakurai tweet just now would have to be some kind of weird fakeout to lower people's guard. Okay, Sakurai likes surprises, so maybe possible, but now you have to consider a character getting revealed after their likeness is used for a PAID Mii costume. Surely you understand how scummy that is, and in a year full of Nintendo scumminess. Take a step back and look at how people still wishing for Geno (outside of the vacuum of just being a Geno fan which is perfectly fine) are actively wishing for a predatory monetization practice that will piss people off. It's the same logic behind "Oh, Travis is a big joker, so that means the mii costume is a joke and therefore you'll get him as playable too and you get to spend even more money!" I don't want that and Travis was in my top 5. I wouldn't want that for my number 1 either.

There are still things the Geno fanbase can do to make their voice heard and hopefully get the nifty puppet in Smash 6. Maintain the community, keep making cool art, memes, charities, whatever. This thread hasn't reached over 3700 pages for nothing. But his chances are dead for Ultimate. And in the 0.00001% chance he DOES get made a full character in this game, bonus or otherwise, congratulations; this beloved character with a gargantuan fanbase is now forever associated with either Nintendo, Square Enix, or both being an anti-consumer leech. I've grown pretty damn cynical over the years, but even I don't think Nintendo or SQEX would pull something so grossly deceptive and predatory.

This is why I hoping it didn't come to this and either it didn't show up at all or they just made Geno deluxe. Our feelings are irrelevant and all the decisions for DLC were decided very early last year. Whether we think it's "scummy" doesn't matter. Nintendo dodging Joy Con drift is scummy. Mario Kart Tour is scum incarnate. Depending who you ask, people thought Plant and Byleth were scummy. Nintendo makes decisions that piss off people all the time and especially this year has been living testament of this. Life goes on.

Add in: As for Lloyd and Heihachi... Heihachi never really came up in a serious capacity and my opinion until recently was that not all the Smash 4 costumes would come back. With only three left and Geno, one of the most popular characters of this cycle getting a costume, would they really bring back 85 of the 86? It seems less rational now, especially with who is left.

 

[Forthestarcapelad]

This is why I hoping it didn't come to this and either it didn't show up at all or they just made Geno deluxe. Our feelings are irrelevant and all the decisions for DLC were decided very early last year. Whether we think it's "scummy" doesn't matter. Nintendo dodging Joy Con drift is scummy. Mario Kart Tour is scum incarnate. Depending who you ask, people thought Plant and Byleth were scummy. Nintendo makes decisions that piss off people all the time and especially this year has been living testament of this. Life goes on.

What are you talking about? When has Nintendo ever--

Wait, what's this about Melee? I thought Ultimate was the newest game everyone was talking about!

 

[OptimisticStrifer]

This is why I hoping it didn't come to this and either it didn't show up at all or they just made Geno deluxe. Our feelings are irrelevant and all the decisions for DLC were decided very early last year. Whether we think it's "scummy" doesn't matter. Nintendo dodging Joy Con drift is scummy. Mario Kart Tour is scum incarnate. Depending who you ask, people thought Plant and Byleth were scummy. Nintendo makes decisions that piss off people all the time and especially this year has been living testament of this. Life goes on.

Sadly, still relatively low on the list of scummy monetization I've seen from the VG industry tbh. If that hypothetical happened anyways

 

[Inoj]

Damn...this hits in the feels...

How Sephiroth Got In Smash 🗡️

My boy.. Look how they massacred my boy..Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/terminalmontageMerchandise for sale here! https://terminalmontagemerchportal.weebly...

www.youtube.com

Damn your Ninja speed.

I prefeer using the Media... Function? Tool?

 

[TheCJBrine]

Well, if this Chun-Li “leak” from a long while back (2018?) that also mentions Sephiroth, Steve, Erdrick etc. alongside that SMRPG stuff turns out true, I guess we’ll have to start pushing for a new game specifically first, and make Nintendo know we want new Mario RPG stuff and that the Wahoominati’s dumbing down of the RPG stuff (if true, since they allowed a couple of remakes and stuff still) is completely unnecessary so they should take Square-Enix’s offer.

 

[Ravioko]

https://twitter.com/Ravioko/status/1340517297241337860

At least I can keep making memes to hide the pain.

 

[OptimisticStrifer]

If you could go to Nintendo Land with Sakurai or get Geno in smash what would you pick?

(shhh i just want 2 talk about Nintendo Land)

 

[Crankshadow]

I’m not going anywhere but I think our bois chances are defiantly lowered for fp2, however I honestly also don’t think there are ANY rules, other than video game origin. I am anticipating some cheeky shenanigans by the end, like what if the rest of fp2 is all ninty choices, but the what if the alleged final 4 slots are all a la carte “Banjos”. (Geno, wah, Issac, ray man).
I’m kinda relieved I don’t have to clench during mii segments, and I’m already super happy with the game. I will definitely be picking up a pocket gunner. After all that, there’s still a chance our starboi may still return.