Gadiel_VaStar
Smash Champion
I love looking at these IC threads, they are so knowledgeable and I feel like I'm learning something new everyday.
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General ICs Q&A Thread
- Thread starter smaci92
- Start date
Xiao-Xiao
Smash Journeyman
I don't know if anyone has answered this already, but can someone tell me how to do Vinnie's ice block trick he does at the ledge as sopo? I try to copy it from watching but I just die everytime
dettadeus
Smash Lord
Lightly hold the control stick away from the ledge to ledgedrop and b-reverse the Ice Block, then jump and airdodge onto the stage.
You should be able to wavebounce the iceblock so it goes onto the stage also but I don't think I've done this before.
Xiao-Xiao
Smash Journeyman
Ahhh I get it. The ice block animation gives him a small jump so you dont have to press jump while doing the ice block. Thanks.
Twigz
Smash Apprentice
What are ICies most preferred ledge options? And particularly against MK edge guarding.
TheSaintKai
Smash Ace
LD1 stand for the Lux Desync 1.
It uses buffering to accomplish an extremely fast desync out of the lag of another move.
Out of most moves (Lux will have to tell you which don't work), buffer a turnaround (this means right as the move ends, LIGHTLY PRESS [don't tap] the direction the climbers aren't facing) and as soon as you see them ACTUALLY turn around, slam the other direction. Nana should end up far behind Popo and you can shield with Popo and Ice block/blizzard/what have you with Nana.
It uses buffering to accomplish an extremely fast desync out of the lag of another move.
Out of most moves (Lux will have to tell you which don't work), buffer a turnaround (this means right as the move ends, LIGHTLY PRESS [don't tap] the direction the climbers aren't facing) and as soon as you see them ACTUALLY turn around, slam the other direction. Nana should end up far behind Popo and you can shield with Popo and Ice block/blizzard/what have you with Nana.
So LD1 is buffering stuff using a shield or something else, but in this case a shield? I tried but I just don't get it without videos, not sure but you might have even shown me a video before but that must have been ages ago.
| Big D |
Smash Master
I think I know what you're doing wrong.
It's not twirl step step pivot.
It's step pivot step and THEN twirl.
Hope this helps.
It's not twirl step step pivot.
It's step pivot step and THEN twirl.
Hope this helps.
I picked up IC's and all I've learned besides playing safe with them is:
1) Backthrow to dthrow chaingrabbing on most if not all of the cast based on a "feel for weight"
2) Desyncing Blizzards and Ice Blocks to a weak extent
3) Nana plays different on different Wii's!?!
Does anyone have a suggestion for the next thing to work on?
1) Backthrow to dthrow chaingrabbing on most if not all of the cast based on a "feel for weight"
2) Desyncing Blizzards and Ice Blocks to a weak extent
3) Nana plays different on different Wii's!?!
Does anyone have a suggestion for the next thing to work on?
| Big D |
Smash Master
I'd recommend watching videos of other ice climbers players. See what they do and why they do it.
And then if something puzzles you and what to know why or how they did what they did then ask here.
And then if something puzzles you and what to know why or how they did what they did then ask here.
crifer
Smash Lord
I picked up IC´s and tried him out at a random smashfest, but I had problems with olimar...
He managed to seperate nana from popo by, I think, just fullhopping and dair.
My main strategy was desyncing blizzards to wall him...
I tried to figure out some strategies which are:
- fullhop blizzard (I imagine doing this only with one IC fullhoping and the other short hoping in order to cover as much vertical range as possible)
- uair with 1 IC (dont know about the priority)
- fair with 1 IC (should beat dair/nair?)
Also I watched vinnie vs nietono and vinnie seemd to go more aggresiv and not desyncing that much... is that recommended?
any other helpful tips are appreciated :-)
He managed to seperate nana from popo by, I think, just fullhopping and dair.
My main strategy was desyncing blizzards to wall him...
I tried to figure out some strategies which are:
- fullhop blizzard (I imagine doing this only with one IC fullhoping and the other short hoping in order to cover as much vertical range as possible)
- uair with 1 IC (dont know about the priority)
- fair with 1 IC (should beat dair/nair?)
Also I watched vinnie vs nietono and vinnie seemd to go more aggresiv and not desyncing that much... is that recommended?
any other helpful tips are appreciated :-)
Hello! I just recently picked up the Ice Climbers because of how fun to play they are! At first I was trying to develop my game without using the main chain grabs ecept for the spike to finish of opponents. But ive realized how important to there game they are! Ive been working on the Dthrow chain where Popo Bthrows to Nana and Nana Dthrows to Popo. Ive gotten the Bthrow to Nana down pretty good, but I cant seem to grab with Popo when Nana Dthrows to him. Any advice?
| Big D |
Smash Master
^ I have some advice for you.
Change the colour of your font. Once you've done that.
Hit the training and learn the timing.
As for Olimar it sounds like you're just approaching with desynced blizzard.
When you're close Olimar wants to get you out. They really want to grab/pivot grab you. Having a desynced ice block/blizzard near you helps this.
When you're close to them, it's good to have nana doing a blizzard/ice block and having popo free to do whatever. If he jumps then you can up air. Shorthops you can shield. If he's on the ground you can roll/spotdodge/shorthop. All good ways of getting in.
Basically once you're in close don't approach with blizzard, use that to get near but not in.
Watch for purples and try and shield them. Beware that blues can out range blizzard.
Change the colour of your font. Once you've done that.
Hit the training and learn the timing.
As for Olimar it sounds like you're just approaching with desynced blizzard.
When you're close Olimar wants to get you out. They really want to grab/pivot grab you. Having a desynced ice block/blizzard near you helps this.
When you're close to them, it's good to have nana doing a blizzard/ice block and having popo free to do whatever. If he jumps then you can up air. Shorthops you can shield. If he's on the ground you can roll/spotdodge/shorthop. All good ways of getting in.
Basically once you're in close don't approach with blizzard, use that to get near but not in.
Watch for purples and try and shield them. Beware that blues can out range blizzard.
![[FBC] ESAM](/data/avatars/l/92/92614.jpg?1365783210){kind=avatar}
[FBC] ESAM
Smash Legend
Honestly, learn how to play ICs first without relying on the CG. It will help you a lot when you actually learn them so you won't be crippled without them. That's what I did.
But yeah, the CGs are the most important tech you have to learn as ICs. Learn the popo f-throw to nana b-throw as it is tripless and can only drop if YOU mess up, not if the game says so.
But yeah, the CGs are the most important tech you have to learn as ICs. Learn the popo f-throw to nana b-throw as it is tripless and can only drop if YOU mess up, not if the game says so.
Hahaha yeah sorry about the font. Ill change it lol
I did hit the training and I put it in slow mo and I found out I was pressing the grab button for Popo to early. When Nana would Dthrow I would actually click before the shockwave would appear.
@ESAM I tried to do that first. At first I tried to play ICs competitivley first w/out even knowing how to do the CG. Ive gotten pretty good with SoPo as well. I would do half decent with them but there were so many games where a CG would have won me the game like when we were both down to one stock and I had high%s. But yeah I've been trying to learn them wi/out it but now I decided it was time to start learning it. Right now Im perfecting my Bthrow to Nana-Dthrow to Popo. I cant seem to get the Bthrow CG or Fthrow CG because when I "tap" the analog stick to lighly nothing happends and if I "tap" it top hard Popo or Nana sprints forward.
I did hit the training and I put it in slow mo and I found out I was pressing the grab button for Popo to early. When Nana would Dthrow I would actually click before the shockwave would appear.
@ESAM I tried to do that first. At first I tried to play ICs competitivley first w/out even knowing how to do the CG. Ive gotten pretty good with SoPo as well. I would do half decent with them but there were so many games where a CG would have won me the game like when we were both down to one stock and I had high%s. But yeah I've been trying to learn them wi/out it but now I decided it was time to start learning it. Right now Im perfecting my Bthrow to Nana-Dthrow to Popo. I cant seem to get the Bthrow CG or Fthrow CG because when I "tap" the analog stick to lighly nothing happends and if I "tap" it top hard Popo or Nana sprints forward.
Gadiel_VaStar
Smash Champion
It depends, why play ICs if you can't CG? That's the main point of playing them plus their great desyncs and stage control and whatnot, but if you can't CG, then there is no reason to play ICs.
You should still try and learn the tripless grabs. Idk if the dthrow-bthrow is tripless or not, but if it isn't then I would suggest trying even harder to learn some sort of tripless grab. It will save you time later on.
DeLux
Player that used to be Lux
- Joined
- Jun 3, 2010
- Messages
- 9,312
@Gadiel-
I would top 5 to win tournaments in the Midwest going entire tournaments doing the following:
- Not completing a CG 0-death or for more than 50% damage
- Forfeiting game 2 if I won game 1 due to RC/Brinstar + MK
CGs are overwhelmingly important, but as you learn to play the character there might be days when you just have an off CG day and it's nice knowing that you're versatile enough to overcome that rather than living or dying on the mantra "I would have won if I could CG him"
I would top 5 to win tournaments in the Midwest going entire tournaments doing the following:
- Not completing a CG 0-death or for more than 50% damage
- Forfeiting game 2 if I won game 1 due to RC/Brinstar + MK
CGs are overwhelmingly important, but as you learn to play the character there might be days when you just have an off CG day and it's nice knowing that you're versatile enough to overcome that rather than living or dying on the mantra "I would have won if I could CG him"
[FBC] ESAM
Smash Legend
I'm not saying don't learn the CG, but learning ICs CGs and that's it will leave you as a really ****ty and gimmicky player. I know that because a LOT of people picked up Pikachu because of the CG against Falco without learning Pikachu and they would question why they get bodied.
It is more important to advance yourself as a player in general than to advance a character you play. Being a better player will help you do better in unfamiliar situations and MUs just because of your smarts. Obviously CGs are godlike and, realistically, you shouldn't expect to do extremely well without them...but that doesn't mean I haven't won multiple tournament matches without a CG.
It is more important to advance yourself as a player in general than to advance a character you play. Being a better player will help you do better in unfamiliar situations and MUs just because of your smarts. Obviously CGs are godlike and, realistically, you shouldn't expect to do extremely well without them...but that doesn't mean I haven't won multiple tournament matches without a CG.
theunabletable
Smash Lord
Also, if the only thing you know how to do as ICs is CG, you're gonna be soooo predictable lol. ESAM's got the right idea c:
Oh yeah and Lux, are there any videos where the LD1 and LD2 desyncs are done? I know you mentioned that a video probably wouldn't help, but when practicing them and trying to learn them, I'm never very sure if I actually succeeded at them in particular, or if I did a different desync (like sometimes I can't tell whether I did the Hylian desync, or one of the other desyncs you've brought up). It'd definitely help me know when I've actually succeeded or not haha (and that'd do a great deal in helping me understand it, too, so I can get consistent).
Thanks in advance c:
Oh yeah and Lux, are there any videos where the LD1 and LD2 desyncs are done? I know you mentioned that a video probably wouldn't help, but when practicing them and trying to learn them, I'm never very sure if I actually succeeded at them in particular, or if I did a different desync (like sometimes I can't tell whether I did the Hylian desync, or one of the other desyncs you've brought up). It'd definitely help me know when I've actually succeeded or not haha (and that'd do a great deal in helping me understand it, too, so I can get consistent).
Thanks in advance c:
DeLux
Player that used to be Lux
- Joined
- Jun 3, 2010
- Messages
- 9,312
Check my youtube channel: www.youtube.com/legendoflux
It's way earlier than my work youth programming brawl tournaments lol
Alternatively you can watch like any recent set of me playing >_>
It's way earlier than my work youth programming brawl tournaments lol
Alternatively you can watch like any recent set of me playing >_>
theunabletable
Smash Lord
Oh wow, that's great, I see the videos for LD1 and 2, thanks. Now do you do those desyncs in those matches vs Dnyce? Just so I can know that I'll see it in a match, as well as in those videos?
Either way, thanks a bunch, this'll definitely help.
Also I have a question about Vinnie's matches vs Brood. Why does he nair so much when Olimar is kind of above him, instead of uairing? Is it to take advantage of Olimar's lack of diagonal hitboxes, or something else?
And what's the general things to do against Snake? What mindset should I have in that matchup, and what should I look for and stuff? What's made it not so bad for ICs when it used to be like awful for them? Maybe some good videos of it?
Sorry if it's too many questions. Trying to switch mains to ICs, and wanna improve as fast as possible c:
Either way, thanks a bunch, this'll definitely help.
Also I have a question about Vinnie's matches vs Brood. Why does he nair so much when Olimar is kind of above him, instead of uairing? Is it to take advantage of Olimar's lack of diagonal hitboxes, or something else?
And what's the general things to do against Snake? What mindset should I have in that matchup, and what should I look for and stuff? What's made it not so bad for ICs when it used to be like awful for them? Maybe some good videos of it?
Sorry if it's too many questions. Trying to switch mains to ICs, and wanna improve as fast as possible c:
DeLux
Player that used to be Lux
- Joined
- Jun 3, 2010
- Messages
- 9,312
My GUESS would be that Nair has multiple hitboxes so it's less susceptible to whistle. It also hits people at that sakurai angle so it doesn't necessarily juggle them as much as it hits them back towards the ground, especially if the hit is on platform. It also kills pikmin if they are latches and is easier to desync option out of on hitlag.
I'll explain Snake in the MU Q&A if you ask there?
I'll explain Snake in the MU Q&A if you ask there?
theunabletable
Smash Lord
ahh okay, that all makes sense. Yeah I can see how it'd be a really good move in the matchup now.
Oh okay.
Oh okay.
So if CGs make you predictable and gimmicky if that's pretty much all you can do, just like me...
Would it be useful to play for a while without using chaingrabs at all? Just using a smash or something from a grab. My whole ICs metagame is just go a grab and win. And ofc it doesn't work.
Would it be useful to play for a while without using chaingrabs at all? Just using a smash or something from a grab. My whole ICs metagame is just go a grab and win. And ofc it doesn't work.
[FBC] ESAM
Smash Legend
I mean if you know the CG and you get the grab, obviously do it, there is no point in crippling yourself. However, you should play without FOCUSING on the grab. The thing about ICs is that they are the SCARIEST character in the neutral game due to the FEAR of getting grabbed. Because of that, people will open themselves up to a lot of things that AREN'T the grab, and you have to recognize that. Honestly, if you hit a road block as ICs, pick up a different character and just play them. You will get used to earning EVERYTHING and then you will see the difference in how easy it is to play ICs.
[FBC] ESAM
Smash Legend
It doesn't work for you because you don't have the mental capacity to do it. Whether or not you have the ability to eventually IDK, but if you have such a basic block that you can't overcome you should probably just not play the character
#RealTalk
#NoOffenseIntended
#RealTalk
#NoOffenseIntended
Ruinn
Smash Ace
esam with that hard cold truth.
Well said. That might be the truth actually... Maybe ICs aren't for me after all. It's just that they are so awesome and everything. Oh well, quitting them isn't an option. I've done that like 10 times already and here we are. Guess I'll have to whine here until I get banned from IC boards
Ruinn
Smash Ace
so lzr, you are fully aware that you just fish for grabs right? and its because you know if you can get a grab you can get a stock? go play some wifi, and set your controls to have none as grabs. will force you to play ics without them. :3
ICs on wifi are pretty much trying to somehow not let Nana wander around thanks to all the lag and stuff. And all my desynchs easily lead into a sideB suicide in wifi >_>
I guess I'll just have to figure out my other options. It's just that aside from Uair and grab I don't find anything too useful. Bair kinda sucks, nair doesn't have range at all and fair is slow... Tilts are kinda ok, smashes are nice, but the sliding really sucks.
I wish I could play some other MUs than Marth on a daily basis since I really really really hate that one.
I guess I'll just have to figure out my other options. It's just that aside from Uair and grab I don't find anything too useful. Bair kinda sucks, nair doesn't have range at all and fair is slow... Tilts are kinda ok, smashes are nice, but the sliding really sucks.
I wish I could play some other MUs than Marth on a daily basis since I really really really hate that one.
Ruinn
Smash Ace
wifi was just so you could get some practice in.