General ICs Q&A Thread

[DeLux]

Good luck with that on Lucas without dropping

But being able to CG on platforms has been around since the beginning of time

 

[PKBeam]

what exactly makes us significantly harder to CG?
someone said it was his small hurtboxes during hitstun?

 

[DeLux]

We're harder to CG because we are real people and are not in the game.

 

[PKBeam]

rolls eyes.
Fine, I'll just ask the nice, caring and helpful people at the ICs Boards Q&A thread. They wouldn't do this.

 

[DeLux]

ICs are typically considered harder to CG because in the ditto you have to deal with the secondary climber first before you are able to CG.

Since most people don't bother practicing CGs in the ditto because it takes longer to setup than every other character on random, they are less familiars with the nuances to the Popo / Nana CG.

It's kind of why people have trouble CGing ZSS as well since she doesn't appear on random, I speculate.

 

[KAP22714]

Good luck with that on Lucas without dropping

But being able to CG on platforms has been around since the beginning of time

I guess I should have formulated that question a little bit better lol but I wasn't in the appropriate mental state for that at the time. What I meant was, on the YI:B platform it feels like the fthrow CG becomes considerably easier on characters I can't normally do it on consistently (e.g. Snake, ROB, even Lucas). I was never able to 0-death those characters on normal flat ground so I was wondering whether the platform had special properties that accommodated CGing. I didn't notice this on other platforms (battlefield and Lylat) so idk just curious

 

[PKBeam]

ICs are typically considered harder to CG because in the ditto you have to deal with the secondary climber first before you are able to CG.

Since most people don't bother practicing CGs in the ditto because it takes longer to setup than every other character on random, they are less familiars with the nuances to the Popo / Nana CG.

It's kind of why people have trouble CGing ZSS as well since she doesn't appear on random, I speculate.

I meant Lucas.

 

[DeLux]

Ahh, kinda drunk right now
but
Going up platforms helps fthrow usually. Going down makes it harder usually

Lucas is hard because his hurtbox is put into a weird spot when fthrowing

Try frame advancing an fthrow and you'll see

 

[fwb]

I'm new to IC. Needed to pick up a good secondary against MK, and I'm fairly proficient and 0-KOing him now. Anways...

First of all, your boards are lame...after digging through all the guides and tips I could find, I saw a bunch of replies throughout that complain "this is outdated...". Yet most of the front page is covered by posts started in 2009, and only 12 topics down, the last reply was over 2 years old. Wtf?

Secondly, I always see that things like desyncing are emphasized, and how you should NOT be just be a grab-spammy ICs. Yet I haven't seen a single grand final match where someone actually desynced more than briefly. A huge majority do not have any desyncing at all. Virtually every match is IC trying to 0-KO MK in the finals.

So...what gives? Be honest...I just need to be grab spammy to take care of MK finalists?

 

[KAP22714]

Yes, you're observant: most of the front is covered by outdated information. Desyncing isn't suggested against MK because MK has too easy a time abusing it and separating you for it. Being grab spammy isn't suggested against MK because any competent MK will notice and just kill you whenever you whiff a grab (which you will, or you wouldn't be posting here). The claim that virtually every match is IC trying to 0-death MK is false; you're just saying something to try and help your case. Most ICs juggle MK for most of the damage and take the grab when they can get it. If you're picking up ICs for the sole purpose of beating MKs, you're going to be playing them for so long it'll probably end up being your main. Pick up MK and outplay your opponent or something if you want a secondary idk

 

[-LzR-]

MK craps on ICs. Why the hell would you pick ICs for MK?

 

[onlyaaron17]

I'm new to IC. Needed to pick up a good secondary against MK, and I'm fairly proficient and 0-KOing him now. Anways...

First of all, your boards are lame...after digging through all the guides and tips I could find, I saw a bunch of replies throughout that complain "this is outdated...". Yet most of the front page is covered by posts started in 2009, and only 12 topics down, the last reply was over 2 years old. Wtf?

Secondly, I always see that things like desyncing are emphasized, and how you should NOT be just be a grab-spammy ICs. Yet I haven't seen a single grand final match where someone actually desynced more than briefly. A huge majority do not have any desyncing at all. Virtually every match is IC trying to 0-KO MK in the finals.

So...what gives? Be honest...I just need to be grab spammy to take care of MK finalists?

People like Delux have spent plenty of time against mk and 0-deathing a lot of other people in the roster, and founded plenty of neat tricks to make ICS what they are today. S-rank, but its one of the hardest, and probably frustrating character to learn as its mostly finding out some crazy things JUST to win a game when you could easily pick up an mk. If you think this thread is trash, which I don't then see how far you can think of things yourself, since most top ICS have did themselves. Its a privilege to have this info.

 

[DeLux]

To be fair, I think ICs are probably 5th to 7th best in the game. >_>

 

[KAP22714]

lol Not in the current metagame where people are **** and get grabbed and stuff

 

[Nemy]

I'm new to IC. Needed to pick up a good secondary against MK, and I'm fairly proficient and 0-KOing him now. Anways...

First of all, your boards are lame...after digging through all the guides and tips I could find, I saw a bunch of replies throughout that complain "this is outdated...". Yet most of the front page is covered by posts started in 2009, and only 12 topics down, the last reply was over 2 years old. Wtf?

Secondly, I always see that things like desyncing are emphasized, and how you should NOT be just be a grab-spammy ICs. Yet I haven't seen a single grand final match where someone actually desynced more than briefly. A huge majority do not have any desyncing at all. Virtually every match is IC trying to 0-KO MK in the finals.

So...what gives? Be honest...I just need to be grab spammy to take care of MK finalists?

Lol. I cant.

 

[PKBeam]

ICs are good. Just that they go evenish/lose to some random low(er) tiers.

 

[JB IV]

I think ICs are pretty awful and (mainly) lack of match-up knowledge and human error seem to be the reasons why non-ICs mains think ICs are S tier.

 

[PKBeam]

idk about their exact position but I find it odd that ICs have their own tier.
i think maybe something like
S:
A+:
A-:
but i don't think Marf is that good, so i'd have him under falco at least.
ICs could probably go down a couple spots, but i'd have em at least in top tier. I saw PF/Mekos beat a lot of good ICs but i think that'd be BC of Lucas' decent matchup with ICs (and maybe lack of MU exp.).

I think ICs are pretty awful

then where do you want them at? top? high? upper mid?

 

[JB IV]

idk about their exact position but I find it odd that ICs have their own tier.
i think maybe something like
S:
A+:
A-:

then where do you want them at? top? high? upper mid?

I definitely think that ICs shouldn't be in their own tier. I'd put them in A- just below Marth.

 

[DeLux]

I'd put them somewhere in the top of mid tier

 

[PKBeam]

Mid as in top of C or top of D?

 

[GoblinGamerKid]

So I have my own little question again don't know if its just something simple or not.

But I've seen 9B in some matches where hes sopo and he side b's back to the stage and while he does it he rises just a bit

I know you're supposed to mash during it but I don't think I ever make it rise. My question is how is he doing this? or is this even a thing or not..?

 

[JB IV]

It's the same as synced side-b: based on the timing between mashes of the b button during the move.
Once you get used to the timing it's fairly easy to do. Just go into practice mode and you'll have it mastered before 20 minutes.

 

[DeLux]

If by timing you mean "mash the **** out of the special button" then yea

you need good "timing" for squall hammers

 

[KAP22714]

How do desync nairs? Like the **** Vinnie does where Nana and Popo are alternating nairs

I don't even know if this has any practical application except maybe walling out ****ty characters, but I'm just curious to learn how to do it just for fun.

Wait is there any real application for this?

 

[DeLux]

Nana Nair generally combos into popo grab at lower percents. At lower percents, Popo Nair will often combo into Nana Nair. So you can do the math on that one.

It's just a timing thing to do the nairs. Generally there are better options in my opinion and it's super gimmicky despite being intimidating looking lol

 

[Hoenn]

What frames are Nana Invincible during belay. I know when the hitbox comes out, but I can't seem to find the info on invincibility

 

[DeLux]

Something is screaming "frame 15" off the top of my head, but I don't have my wii with frame advance anymore to verify what the significance of that number is. Could be random, but I want to say frame 15.

Using Belay for Nado is not viable

 

[Hoenn]

Something is screaming "frame 15" off the top of my head, but I don't have my wii with frame advance anymore to verify what the significance of that number is. Could be random, but I want to say frame 15.

Using Belay for Nado is not viable

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