Ganondorf Board's Question & Answer Thread.

[B!squick]

Lame. It gives you the option to post html so I figured you could. :/

 

[SuSa]

Do you guys think this will be useful to you:

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=235804

I think the rolls are the same. I feel grounded rolls ("Getup rolls") and Dodge rolls have different lengths. <_<

Also that list could be useful for you. Sure you have guarenteed followups, but for the away-towards people, if you react quick enough you should be able to side-B follow up almost no matter what...

 

[TP]

Do you guys think this will be useful to you:

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=235804

I think the rolls are the same. I feel grounded rolls ("Getup rolls") and Dodge rolls have different lengths. <_<

Also that list could be useful for you. Sure you have guarenteed followups, but for the away-towards people, if you react quick enough you should be able to side-B follow up almost no matter what...

I tested all that stuff when I worked on tech chasing earlier this year. Don't forget their choice to just do a regular getup without attacking. ROB, for example, has a getup that looks very similar to his getup attack, so it is hard to tell what he is doing. These little details are far more important than data, IMO. However, nice job on working so hard.

Kirby's roll is medium length? More like 3rd to worst, or maybe it just moves so slow it feels that way.

 

[SuSa]

It probably moves so slow it feels that way.

Also roll from the ground =/= roll standing

Snake is a prime example with a sub-par roll, but a roll of epicness when on the ground.....


Also for their getup, we're watching them carefully and observing. That data is not meant for WiFi - but real life play.

And analog stick sounds different then the A button, and for most chars. you don't chase after their roll until you see it. So if you see no roll + Analog stick sound, you know they are doing a getup.

lol... controller sounds..... ftw...

(Although thanks for that detail, if you have more details like that about getups I wouldn't mind adding them that much... but only if their getup can be confused with their getup attack. Because I don't think we can shieldgrab (on reaction) a normal getup... we have to time the grab correctly to do so before the opponent can actually do anything and I think the (11?) + (11?) (so 22..) frames takes a bit long (I think most getups are 16-19 frames?)

 

[fromundaman]

The reason Kirby's roll is/feels so bad is that unless he's doing the <100% ledge roll, his roll is slow and has very few invul frames compared to most.

 

[SuSa]

So a roll from a dthrow counts as a ledge roll? Then WTF when you roll backwards? Oo....

*doesn't quite understand*

Oh yah guys, Snake can boost grab CG you.

 

[@HomE]

Oh yah guys, Snake can boost grab CG you.

Wants to elaborate on that a little?

 

[Ray_Kalm]

So a roll from a dthrow counts as a ledge roll? Then WTF when you roll backwards? Oo....

*doesn't quite understand*

Oh yah guys, Snake can boost grab CG you.

I knew about that a long time ago. I just tried to keep it low-profile. Didn't want to hurt Ganon any further.

I remember only telling Koskinator.

 

[SuSa]

Wants to elaborate on that a little?

Force air grab > boost grab > pummel > force air grab > boost grab

repeat.

We can end that with a dthrow (techchase) or dash attack OR DACUS

DACUS sometimes props you up and you get hit by the Mortar...

(Theres a thread on the Snake boards)

Luckily for you guys Ganon is one of the harder ones to tech chase due to his getup attack.

I knew about that a long time ago. I just tried to keep it low-profile. Didn't want to hurt Ganon any further.

I remember only telling Koskinator.

That's what I thought about this. Seems quite a few mains knew it could happen to them - just didn't want to hurt their main, let alone help Snake.

It's out now...

 

[B!squick]

The snake's out'a the bag and it's biting Ganon in the rump. Major fail.

Oh yeah, can someone link me to Ganon's frame data? I tried searching here before and remember only finding really inaccurate data.

 

[Jekyll]

I know this is old news, but I keep finding people that don't know about it:

Nobody's still getting chain-grabbed by Lucario's forward-B are they?

 

[Metatitan]

The Yoshi boards are discussing you horribly nerfed people
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=7528019#post7528019

 

[TP]

Me and the other 8+ people from BC are coming...and we're playing...no matter what it takes!
Except Koskinator...he got pwned by money shortage and passport failure over the last week.

You're not going to Genesis, Kosk?

I died a little inside. Now M2K will never fear Ganon.

 

[Ray_Kalm]

You're not going to Genesis, Kosk?

I died a little inside. Now M2K will never fear Ganon.

<_<, Tell me that isn't true.

 

[Z1GMA]

I was thinking... The hitstun of our up+B is like ZERO, when about 50%+
And the hitstun below 50% is pretty nasty; like if the opponent got covered in fudge.

So... Could one not use the "fudge stun" (up+B <50%) for any good at all?

Has anybody experienced something good with our <50% up+B ?

 

[thexsunrosered]

I was thinking... The hitstun of our up+B is like ZERO, when about 50%+
And the hitstun below 50% is pretty nasty; like if the opponent got covered in fudge.

So... Could one not use the "fudge stun" (up+B <50%) for any good at all?

Has anybody experienced something good with our <50% up+B ?

i dunno do you wanna play and find out o.O

 

[fromundaman]

You're not going to Genesis, Kosk?

I died a little inside. Now M2K will never fear Ganon.

But.... But....

Will this now never happen?

 

[Squirrely]

That superimposed kosk is well done.
Gave me a smile.

 

[PK-ow!]

I know this is old news, but I keep finding people that don't know about it:

Nobody's still getting chain-grabbed by Lucario's forward-B are they?

I haven't played a Lucario in 4ever, but, yes, if one were to attempt that they would succeed.

How do I escape?

 

[Noobicidal]

I haven't played a Lucario in 4ever, but, yes, if one were to attempt that they would succeed.

How do I escape?

I SHAD towards Lucario.

 

[:034:]

From what I've heard, you mash buttons to get out of it. Like a grab.

 

[@HomE]

Since im the last person who has posted in the smashboards combo vid thread, ill ask here..

WHEN ARE WE GONNA DO THIS?!?


*looks deeply into stRIP's eyes*


WHHHEEEEN

 

[Noobicidal]

Since im the last person who has posted in the smashboards combo vid thread, ill ask here..

WHEN ARE WE GONNA DO THIS?!?


*looks deeply into stRIP's eyes*


WHHHEEEEN

Well, since I'm a welcomed and LOVED member of the boards now, I'd like to offer some clips of Ganon-y goodness as well (unless the vid owner has already reached the video threshold).

So yeah, WHEN'S THIS HAPPENING?

 

[GanonCanon]

button mashing usually works on lucario's side+b but i think it's slightly less likely to break out of it. I'd consult a lucario thread to be certain. thank God gerudo can't be broken out of. *sigh of relief*

 

[fromundaman]

Ummm... I'm pretty sure you can't break out of his sideB... Are you maybe thinking of Lucario's grab?

 

[B!squick]

Yeah, as far as I knew, special grabs couldn't be broken out of unless they involved the mouth.

 

[Squirrely]

You can break out of Lucario side-b's through mashing.
I thought this was old news a long time ago.

 

[B!squick]

Well, I KNOW you can't mash out of the Klaw and if Diddy reacts right after humping your face I'm pretty sure that one is inescapable, too. Figured Luc's worked the same way.

 

[Noobicidal]

Well, I KNOW you can't mash out of the Klaw and if Diddy reacts right after humping your face I'm pretty sure that one is inescapable, too. Figured Luc's worked the same way.

The actual grab is inescapable, so you need to throw off Lukey's timing after the first grab.

Once again, SHAD towards him.

 

[Ant1]

So i was testing using warlock punch today, and i found something interesting, but i think u guys already know of it.
For some reason if u connect the warlock punch whilst in mid-air it does around 3% more dmg. Is that just wierd programming?

Also today i did a d-air on rob, from a footstool and it did 24%!!! This was is training. be4 i used the d-air i had used u-air and i think a u-smash. BUT i had pressed start which refreshed his dmg counter to 0 be4 using the d-air. U guys ever seen a 24% dmg d-air?

 

[@HomE]

the extra dmg for WP in air is known(at least by me), reverse air WP is one of the strongest moves in the game, I've killed a luigi at like 9% from the far side of the big part of Halberd, all the way across the map, **** was nasty.

as for Dair.... all i have to say is training mode..

 

[Noobicidal]

So i was testing using warlock punch today, and i found something interesting, but i think u guys already know of it.
For some reason if u connect the warlock punch whilst in mid-air it does around 3% more dmg.

Yes.

Is that just wierd programming?

No.

Also today i did a d-air on rob, from a footstool and it did 24%!!! This was is training. be4 i used the d-air i had used u-air and i think a u-smash. BUT i had pressed start which refreshed his dmg counter to 0 be4 using the d-air. U guys ever seen a 24% dmg d-air?

Yes; Dair does 23.5 damage.

 

[WhatIsRaizen?]

Yes; Dair does 23.5 damage.

DAir does 23.1 damage, no?

 

[Noobicidal]

DAir does 23.1 damage, no?

Regardless of the actual decimal, dair doesn't do a perfect 23%, so seeing it do 24% isn't out of the ordinary.

 

[weinner]

He said it was in training though. So a D-air would have done 22% damage. Unless the footstool has something to do with it.

 

[B!squick]

Yes, Training damage = base damage which = something you NEVER see in game.

 

[Jekyll]

The actual grab is inescapable, so you need to throw off Lukey's timing after the first grab.

Once again, SHAD towards him.

False, good sir. And I wouldn't bring it up on the Lucario boards either. It shocked the hell out of Blood Hawk when I started doing it, so many of them probably don't know either.

You just mash buttons and you can break out of it. The higher the percentage, the harder it is of course. But it's not hard IMO.

 

[*JuriHan*]

Here is an easy question which I am too **** lazy to try out on training mode.......

what has more knockback, Warlock punch or u-tilt?

 

[fromundaman]

Warlock Punch.

That being said, Utilt is more useful.


Also, Z1gma, I have a question:

After seeing your videos of Utilt trixies on Norfair, if you were to Utilt right above/next to an opponent hitting the lava, would they just stay in it and take a ****ton of lava damage until the Utilt hits?

 

[Jekyll]

I'm too lazy as well, but I'd say WP. I utilt is always exciting to land in a match, but it never packs the UMPH that I think it should.