Q&A -Fox Advice/Questions Topic-

[charcoal_]

you can jab reset even if you waveshine backwards at them. it's pretty hard, but if you can pull off thunders combo backwards that's a pretty dangerous fox. at high percentages i ftilt, at low percentages i attempt to jab reset, but otherwise i usually just techchase, but there's probably something better.

 

[TemPesT-]

i should probably just get better at turning around in my shine lol

however the hit lag makes it EXTREMELY hard for me to shine, turn around and then waveshine normally after them... GRRR such a frustrating character sometimes

 

[charcoal_]

turning around in shine isn't a problem for me. my problem is that i can never waveshine at full length. its pitiful

 

[Tomacawk]

k so what do you guys do in fox ditto's if you shine the opponent (on the ground) but you have to waveshine backwards at them, normally my goal is just hit a jab reset, but if i waveshine backwards, thats impossible i think, maybe i'm just not fast enough. but are there other options you guys look for?

right now i just take it as a shine and then try to tech chase follow them with a grab or upsmash.

pivot dash jc usmash
like this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3Tmi8urjsg#t=0m25s

 

[TemPesT-]

hmm thank you tomacawk i'll try that.

fluxwolf said your a pretty cool guy btw lol i'd like to play you someday

 

[Tomacawk]

hmm thank you tomacawk i'll try that.

fluxwolf said your a pretty cool guy btw lol i'd like to play you someday

*blushes*
fluxwolf is a mediocre at best kind of guy =D
I'd love to play anytime man. I think I'm going to APEX, will you be there?

 

[KAOSTAR]

pivot dash jc usmash
like this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3Tmi8urjsg#t=0m25s

Isnt it already implied that you need to dash/move in order to pivot

pivot jc upsmash? lol or dash jc upsmash

 

[TemPesT-]

*blushes*
fluxwolf is a mediocre at best kind of guy =D
I'd love to play anytime man. I think I'm going to APEX, will you be there?

im thinking about tryin to go :D

if i do ill let you know and we'll get some friendlies for sure.

what about POE3? is that the one in like indiana? i think that might be more possible for me to go to

 

[Lovage]

dont turn around in your shine, do a waveshine backwards and then turnaround jab, much faster and easier

 

[Tomacawk]

im thinking about tryin to go :D

if i do ill let you know and we'll get some friendlies for sure.

what about POE3? is that the one in like indiana? i think that might be more possible for me to go to

I'm going to poe3 for sure. That would be an ideal place to play because APEX will be so massive that I think trying to get a friendly tv when you aren't a super pro will be impossible

 

[JPOBS]

dont turn around in your shine, do a waveshine backwards and then turnaround jab, much faster and easier

this.

raynex didnt pivot anything in that clip, he just waveshined backwards and kept holding left, then hit c-stick up real simple. he didnt even jump cancel, or if he did it was just a product of hitting up+A for the upsmash

people use the word pivot a lot im not sure i even know what it means anymore.

 

[TemPesT-]

i tried the jab thing lovage suggested, kept missing it... i could get a dair sometimes tho, and uair was pretty easy for some reason lol

 

[KAOSTAR]

i tried the jab thing lovage suggested, kept missing it... i could get a dair sometimes tho, and uair was pretty easy for some reason lol

IVe noticed most ppl dont waveshine as far backwards. You prob didnt have enough time or were lacking wvshine distance. Maybe dash cancel a jab or waveshine farther.

 

[JPOBS]

theres a recent set of eggm vs someone and he consistenly get lots of reverse thunders combos and i was looking for it to link it here and maybe help but i cant for the life of me remember what set it was/who he was playing against.

 

[Silent Wolf]

IVe noticed most ppl dont waveshine as far backwards. You prob didnt have enough time or were lacking wvshine distance. Maybe dash cancel a jab or waveshine farther.

you cant dash cancel jab until after your initial dash.

 

[Tomacawk]

Maybe raynex didn't do that but that's what I do and it looks almost the same, I just didn't watch that clip close enough
whoops, looks like he did dash and jc usmash. silly me.
also pivot is a cool word get off me i just like saying it lol

IVe noticed most ppl dont waveshine as far backwards. You prob didnt have enough time or were lacking wvshine distance. Maybe dash cancel a jab or waveshine farther.

you cant dash cancel jab until after your initial dash.

lol

theres a recent set of eggm vs someone and he consistenly get lots of reverse thunders combos and i was looking for it to link it here and maybe help but i cant for the life of me remember what set it was/who he was playing against.

this sounds amazing. eggm is so fun to watch. I'll start searching for this in a little bit too

 

[TemPesT-]

k welllll.... i still can't really do it from just a regular standing shine, however if i drill into it, it's much easier because i can space myself a little bit closer to my opponent before i have to wavedash... idk at least it's something =/

 

[Tomacawk]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cx7l_UdTLoU#t=1m19s
holy **** eggm is incredible

k welllll.... i still can't really do it from just a regular standing shine, however if i drill into it, it's much easier because i can space myself a little bit closer to my opponent before i have to wavedash... idk at least it's something =/

perhaps you can utilt after a waveshine backwards and catch them on a missed tech?
I don't have a cube I can't test that

 

[Kanelol]

brb trying waveshine up tilt

 

[Silent Wolf]

it can work, its just not reliable.

 

[Jimbo Slice]

Waveshine outta Shield!!!!

Ahh Eggm *****!

 

[TemPesT-]

perhaps you can utilt after a waveshine backwards and catch them on a missed tech?
I don't have a cube I can't test that

might take like some level 9 computer DI LOL

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

u can utilt, pivot jab or dash attack

edit: ******************** page changes

 

[Silent Wolf]

waveshine dash attack is **** at high percents

 

[Kanelol]

So I can waveshine u-tilt marth and ****

space animals require a level of tech skill beyond me

it's not very reliable

EDIT: well **** me, looks like people already figured this out

 

[TemPesT-]

thunder combo someone near the edge. dash away a tiny bit, then dash at them and dbl shine as they are getting up. pseudo-shinespike ****. sets up super easy edgeguards

 

[FluxWolf]

like when you up throw them (no di) and shine and they go behind u?

i was doing that into upsmash a lot today, and it was working pretty well even when they teched the shine

edit: WOOOW this post was late.... doesnt make sense at all anymore roflll

 

[KAOSTAR]

you cant dash cancel jab until after your initial dash.

i was assuming he was farther away and was running because he had a short reverse wveshne.

edit: in case you meant its called something else lol. whats it called then? I thought hitting down during a run was commonly called dash canceling. not the initial dash obviously.

 

[TemPesT-]

like when you up throw them (no di) and shine and they go behind u?

i was doing that into upsmash a lot today, and it was working pretty well even when they teched the shine

edit: WOOOW this post was late.... doesnt make sense at all anymore roflll

nah i just meant if you were standing and you try to waveshine backwards to hit them.

 

[Silent Wolf]

i was assuming he was farther away and was running because he had a short reverse wveshne.

edit: in case you meant its called something else lol. whats it called then? I thought hitting down during a run was commonly called dash canceling. not the initial dash obviously.

no thats what its called. theres no possible way hed be able to dash cancel jab them, even if they just layed there on the ground unless he waveshined in place or something, which wouldnt work. you cant do it until youre in your full run. pivot jab on the other hand, that could work. just waveshine farther

 

[unknown522]

what unknown said- i agree with u 100 percent.. the community as a whole doesnt have alot of exp vs him and think its a close match up..and i agree about the yoshi's story idea too..ganon is good there but its fox from space ..he ***** there . when people realize how to fight him. he wont be a problem to top players ..especially mango.

Yeah man, Canada's been saying that for years. People need to learn the matchup, even thought ganon is an uncommon character.

------------

Ganon can't hold his own against Fox at all. Between outmaneuvering him on every level and the morbid failure he experiences the moment he blocks your attack, there isn't much he can do. Granted, once he knocks you down there is potential for good damage and maybe a stock. If you can learn to CC jabs, edge-guard his terrible recovery with roughly 90% efficiency, call his DJs with uthrow and land sneaky uairs and weave around his large hitboxes for like 40-50% per aerial...

GG

Having one of the best Ganons in our community really helped us learn the MU inside and out.

Agreed.

I remember Pkmvodka talking to us at Rom2 about how he was beating Kage's Ganon the night before, then that very day he beat Mango. Unknown, KK and I always talk about how weird it is to watch Kage get beat at home but place insanely well oos. lol

man, that was funny.

I hate ganon vs. fox ^_^

Unknown destroyed me.

Johns - none

fox beats falco for sure, everyone just sucks *** against falco. people need better pressure.

edit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Glc2zier57A

you must tech me how to approach falco. Once a good falco gets the lead, I can't beat their camp under platform/run away strategy.

 

[PCHU]

Could someone help me out with approaching Samus and Falco?
I still have nobody to practice against, but I might be playing against some decent people on Sunday.
Is there anything I should really practice doing, like, any specific tech, or what?

That's all I really need to know.

 

[FoxLisk]

yeah, don't approach samus.

you have to be really careful. she has incredibly strong defensive measures. my friend's samus was whoopin on me last night except when i camped. basically the best thing in my opinion is, unless you have a solid read on him (my friend was WD back dsmashing too much so i started just running up and upsmashing late, for example), is platform camp, shoot a few lasers here and there, and be REALLY CAREFUL whenever you try to approach. you have to basically outspace her. if you hit her shield and don't land pretty far away, she'll up B you. your grabs are good but nothing is guaranteed, you have to read his DI and doublejump/nair options. basically platform camp and bair her when you get an opportunity.

against falco: you basically have to find away around the lasers and then try to knock him down. dair shine is good for this, nair if he's at reasonable % or doesn't know how to CC. grab him whenever you can, and punish like a mother****er. DI away. you can try smash DIing dairs and things; i try to do this by just spamming quarter circle DI from up-away to down-away as I'm getting combod, cause then my combo DI will work out and if I'm lucky I'll get an SDI, but I don't do tha twell with it so let someone else give you better advice -_-

 

[lord karn]

Against falco, I stand under a platform and then mix up my time to jump onto it. This makes falco have to decide to either jump onto the other platform to laser you or stay on the ground and laser. If you get on the platform and falco is still on the ground, try to move across the platforms to approach him. Ideally, though, you want falco on the platform lasering. Once he gets up there, then run under the platform he is on. He has a few options there like drop laser, drop dair, etc. You have to outplay him here to get a hit off.

Essentially, you have to use platforms to get into the space where falco cannot shoot lasers safely. Once you get inside of this space, which is like one or two wavedash lengths (not really sure), then you just have to outplay him. His best options in this scenario are to offensively aerial or retreat and laser. If you jump at him with an aerial it beats the laser option. If you both aerial in place, whoever spaces better wins.

Edit: Oh yeah, if the falco is playing aggressively, you need to learn how to shine/upsmash oos. You should still use the platforms, but if he's playing aggressively, you shouldn't be approaching. Just defensively move around to mess with his spacing and shine oos him.

 

[PB&J]

i think the best way to play falco is not to let him breathe..once he does he has the upper hand..more pressure..more stocks..my strat vs him anyway

 

[ChivalRuse]

I try to get the lead on Falco early so he can't just camp me ...

 

[Sinji]

Against falco, I stand under a platform and then mix up my time to jump onto it. This makes falco have to decide to either jump onto the other platform to laser you or stay on the ground and laser. If you get on the platform and falco is still on the ground, try to move across the platforms to approach him. Ideally, though, you want falco on the platform lasering. Once he gets up there, then run under the platform he is on. He has a few options there like drop laser, drop dair, etc. You have to outplay him here to get a hit off.

Essentially, you have to use platforms to get into the space where falco cannot shoot lasers safely. Once you get inside of this space, which is like one or two wavedash lengths (not really sure), then you just have to outplay him. His best options in this scenario are to offensively aerial or retreat and laser. If you jump at him with an aerial it beats the laser option. If you both aerial in place, whoever spaces better wins.

Edit: Oh yeah, if the falco is playing aggressively, you need to learn how to shine/upsmash oos. You should still use the platforms, but if he's playing aggressively, you shouldn't be approaching. Just defensively move around to mess with his spacing and shine oos him.

I aggree I mean theirs alot of aggressive falcos in Jamaica so I play defensively.

 

[Daniel_the_Seraph]

So I finally got the shine cancel usmash down, but the usmash doesn't seem to connect with most characters.

I've only gotten the usmash to connect with falcon and he has to be in the air for it to work. I'm definitely doing it fast enough...

How do I get it to work?

 

[joeplicate]

that's not guaranteed on every character

shines oos are easy

raynex did an upthrow, shine, reverse wavedash, initial dash, jc upsmash
learn how to pay more attention jeez lol

the way i always refer to it, pivot is doing something out of your initial dash dance
there's holding one way to turn around (like after waveshine back, turn around > jab, which i think someone said they were trying to do), which is just the normal turnaround animation out of standing/walking

if you wanna be technical, learn your game mechanics first

 

[TemPesT-]

So I finally got the shine cancel usmash down, but the usmash doesn't seem to connect with most characters.

I've only gotten the usmash to connect with falcon and he has to be in the air for it to work. I'm definitely doing it fast enough...

How do I get it to work?

probably not doing it fast enough lol. falcon shouldn't have to be in the air, and neither should most of the chars. but like joe said it won't work on everyone.