Stijn
Smash Cadet
I can't get **** out of my grabsLaser camp samus once you get fed up with trying to approach.
Also grab a lot
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Q&A -Fox Advice/Questions Topic-
- Thread starter Silent Wolf
- Start date
ZeldaFreak0309
Smash Journeyman
i think that's fine, just throw them further away from center stage and it makes them not as comfy in their shieldI can't get **** out of my grabs
Silent Wolf
...
grabs are so important vs everyone regardless of how reliable they are for fosho combos. if not for mix up purposes then for zoning
i mean i guess its always for mix up purposes too. whatever
i mean i guess its always for mix up purposes too. whatever
leffen
Smash Champion
When grabs give less they're also easier to get since you're opponent is not as scared of them, just remember that it still can give you something and if you just keep grabbing them they're gonna eventually flinch and open themselves up to other options
Jim Morrison
Smash Authority
If you get nothing out of grabs (U-throwing them?), just grab them and F-throw, it's fast as **** and can throw them off. If their percentage is too for anything, you gotta D-throw.
- Joined
- Feb 27, 2008
- Messages
- 26,564
Sometimes it's good to just put someone in the air above you with U-Throw even if you don't have a true-combo out of it and just chase their landing, especially against floatier characters like Samus.
unknown522
Some guy
Yeah. Shark from underneath after throwing them to see if you can rob a jump or land random u-airs. Also throwing her off is good for setting up for cheese or just general edgeguards.
Metal Reeper
Smash Champion
Or you could be the dthrow fox
S1 The God
Feeding the streets since 1885
never be the dthrow fox
rokimomi
Smash Lord
someone mentioned sometime ago that samus in the air is bottom tier, thats basically how I play the matchup
unknown522
Some guy
Man. D-throw sucks ***.
unknown522
Some guy
Anyways, leffen vs over:
So I wrote this while commuting to / from work today.
I'm not gonna say things that KK and Raynex said. That will save me a lot of time. Because of that, this write-up will mostly be about combos.
The opening combo you got with the u-tilts -> b-air was very good. After you knocked him off, you should've finished the combo with either a b/n-air to push him even further off and give him limited recovery options. Afterwards though, you got under and I'm not sure if you were actually trying to up-smash underneath, or u-tilt after he threw the needles.
around 1:57, that n-air you hit. There was no possible way a shine was gonna land. If I see them not CC a n-air around that percent, I like to d-tilt. Bonus points if they are near the edge.
In general when you get a waveshine combo. I think you should grab especially in PAL. The up-smash seems to have way too low hitstun to combo off it even at mid percents. D-smash seems to have too low knockback unless they're over like 100%. You could even try waveshine -> d-tilt. It's not bad vs sheik in general. Waveshine -> f-smash is a combo, but it's easy to mess up. There's one time the up-smash worked pretty well though when he DI'd off. You missed the edgeguard though. But there are times where he survival DI'd an up-smash and it looked like you couldn't follow. So It's up to you.
Mid game you're getting hit a lot out of DDs and stuff. You gotta space better or else you could risk losing next time. Either that or try to utilize your shield to mess with their spacing, bait grabs and to get close if needed.
Game 2, looks like you played fairly well and over played bad. So naturally he would get *****.
Game 3, of the top of my head there was a time you should've grabbed the ledge. I think it was around 7:14 or so. There were a few times in game 1 as well where you jumped out but could've just taken the ledge and risked your edgeguard. Around 7:18, you reacted pretty slow to his recovery. Since you were at low percent. If you wanted to make it easy, you could roll on slightly early to prevent them from getting the ledge, but also still cover the landing. It's pretty gay. There were a couple of other times where the same thing could be applied.
A bit after the times I listed, there was a point where he air dodged onto the stage and you did a stand up from the ledge. That was the time to ledge hop b-air/u-air.
Anyways, in the end he got beat pretty bad.
On to the next set. Will post later.
So I wrote this while commuting to / from work today.
I'm not gonna say things that KK and Raynex said. That will save me a lot of time. Because of that, this write-up will mostly be about combos.
The opening combo you got with the u-tilts -> b-air was very good. After you knocked him off, you should've finished the combo with either a b/n-air to push him even further off and give him limited recovery options. Afterwards though, you got under and I'm not sure if you were actually trying to up-smash underneath, or u-tilt after he threw the needles.
around 1:57, that n-air you hit. There was no possible way a shine was gonna land. If I see them not CC a n-air around that percent, I like to d-tilt. Bonus points if they are near the edge.
In general when you get a waveshine combo. I think you should grab especially in PAL. The up-smash seems to have way too low hitstun to combo off it even at mid percents. D-smash seems to have too low knockback unless they're over like 100%. You could even try waveshine -> d-tilt. It's not bad vs sheik in general. Waveshine -> f-smash is a combo, but it's easy to mess up. There's one time the up-smash worked pretty well though when he DI'd off. You missed the edgeguard though. But there are times where he survival DI'd an up-smash and it looked like you couldn't follow. So It's up to you.
Mid game you're getting hit a lot out of DDs and stuff. You gotta space better or else you could risk losing next time. Either that or try to utilize your shield to mess with their spacing, bait grabs and to get close if needed.
Game 2, looks like you played fairly well and over played bad. So naturally he would get *****.
Game 3, of the top of my head there was a time you should've grabbed the ledge. I think it was around 7:14 or so. There were a few times in game 1 as well where you jumped out but could've just taken the ledge and risked your edgeguard. Around 7:18, you reacted pretty slow to his recovery. Since you were at low percent. If you wanted to make it easy, you could roll on slightly early to prevent them from getting the ledge, but also still cover the landing. It's pretty gay. There were a couple of other times where the same thing could be applied.
A bit after the times I listed, there was a point where he air dodged onto the stage and you did a stand up from the ledge. That was the time to ledge hop b-air/u-air.
Anyways, in the end he got beat pretty bad.
On to the next set. Will post later.
Vegard
Smash Lord
hey folks, is this a good place to post videos for feedback on a couple of tournament matches?
if it ain't, just let me know. If someone could give me some brief advice or a few pointers judging from these matches I'd be really happy:
Fox vs Falcon: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjORnTzTGfE
Fox vs Peach: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z35cyzDl67c
if it ain't, just let me know. If someone could give me some brief advice or a few pointers judging from these matches I'd be really happy:
Fox vs Falcon: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjORnTzTGfE
Fox vs Peach: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z35cyzDl67c
omgwtfToph
Smash Master
I only watched the vs. Falcon matches.
- Don't shine after every aerial. Only shine after L-cancelling an aerial when the shine would actually do something for you.
- Get a little better at overshooting. You attack where your opponent is too much, instead of attacking where they will be.
- Something I need to remind myself from time to time: nothing wrong with grabbing, lol. Grab when you know your opponent is gonna shield.
- Calm down when you hit your opponent. If it seems like they're going to be able to hit the ground and have a chance to tech, don't try to force a followup. Just let them land, then get the techchase.
- Stop missing ledgedashes (yeah, not really "advice" per se). What would Wenbobular say!?
- Don't shine after every aerial. Only shine after L-cancelling an aerial when the shine would actually do something for you.
- Get a little better at overshooting. You attack where your opponent is too much, instead of attacking where they will be.
- Something I need to remind myself from time to time: nothing wrong with grabbing, lol. Grab when you know your opponent is gonna shield.
- Calm down when you hit your opponent. If it seems like they're going to be able to hit the ground and have a chance to tech, don't try to force a followup. Just let them land, then get the techchase.
- Stop missing ledgedashes (yeah, not really "advice" per se). What would Wenbobular say!?
Vegard
Smash Lord
thanks toph, I appreciate it 
all of them seem very appropriate for how I play lol
all of them seem very appropriate for how I play lol
omgwtfToph
Smash Master
No problem.
So Leffen's avatar hella resembles my avatar.
We must battle to the death.
Or possibly join forces.
So Leffen's avatar hella resembles my avatar.
We must battle to the death.
Or possibly join forces.
unknown522
Some guy
Leffen va zgetto:
Vs zgetto:
Opening sucked. You just kinda killed yourself. You brought it back fairly quickly and took the next 2 stocks easily. I dunno how you combo'd u-throw -> up-smash (especially half charged in place) at like 100%. Especially in PAL. But w/e it worked.
From then on, it seems like he was out-maneuvering you and was just landing the first hits. Also 1 lucky gimp. This all generally means that you need to work on spacing and defense. Or figure a way to out-aggro him. Like attacking first. Shine oos. Spacing around moves.
Game 2: near the beginning, there was a lot of dash attacks going on by both of you. Too unsafe. You have to be sure you won't get hit or will hit them of using it.
Around 3:32 I'm not sure what happened here but if you had b-air'd that would've beaten his n-air.
Later on, so many under-shot moves that you got punished for (mostly DD -> grab). Like that n-air running off the platform.
There's a lot of random trades that happened, but fortunately you were in the lead at that point so it worked out in your favor.
Game 3: zgetto is usually making more out of a hit. Both combo-wise and positional advantage. He doesn't let it get back to neutral or switch as often. And therefore nets more damage.
You also over-commit a bit too much with like smashes, and sometimes grabs that are really unlikely to hit. Zgetto seems to be less technical and then ends up being just a bit too slow to punish sometimes, when he has the chance. There were a lot of combos that would've been continued with vertical moves, but you end prematurely with n-air. And then he just ends up grabbing the ledge. Some platform tech chases could've been more solid. You guys usually b-air each other across the stage, instead of hitting each other off, or up. Reverse b-air is pretty good.
You won the game by hitting some important tech chases and an edgeguard when it mattered most. It's good you didn't let him get away for sloppy choices.
Game 4: solid all around. You hit more tech chases and edgeguarded fairly well. And spaced better than him.
Vs zgetto:
Opening sucked. You just kinda killed yourself. You brought it back fairly quickly and took the next 2 stocks easily. I dunno how you combo'd u-throw -> up-smash (especially half charged in place) at like 100%. Especially in PAL. But w/e it worked.
From then on, it seems like he was out-maneuvering you and was just landing the first hits. Also 1 lucky gimp. This all generally means that you need to work on spacing and defense. Or figure a way to out-aggro him. Like attacking first. Shine oos. Spacing around moves.
Game 2: near the beginning, there was a lot of dash attacks going on by both of you. Too unsafe. You have to be sure you won't get hit or will hit them of using it.
Around 3:32 I'm not sure what happened here but if you had b-air'd that would've beaten his n-air.
Later on, so many under-shot moves that you got punished for (mostly DD -> grab). Like that n-air running off the platform.
There's a lot of random trades that happened, but fortunately you were in the lead at that point so it worked out in your favor.
Game 3: zgetto is usually making more out of a hit. Both combo-wise and positional advantage. He doesn't let it get back to neutral or switch as often. And therefore nets more damage.
You also over-commit a bit too much with like smashes, and sometimes grabs that are really unlikely to hit. Zgetto seems to be less technical and then ends up being just a bit too slow to punish sometimes, when he has the chance. There were a lot of combos that would've been continued with vertical moves, but you end prematurely with n-air. And then he just ends up grabbing the ledge. Some platform tech chases could've been more solid. You guys usually b-air each other across the stage, instead of hitting each other off, or up. Reverse b-air is pretty good.
You won the game by hitting some important tech chases and an edgeguard when it mattered most. It's good you didn't let him get away for sloppy choices.
Game 4: solid all around. You hit more tech chases and edgeguarded fairly well. And spaced better than him.
Bones0
Smash Legend
unknown522
Some guy
Damn I should've taken a pic but there's a new local who looks like Wenbo. And a guy who looks like Cymanita (cyrain + fly)
Bones0
Smash Legend
Haxpose d
Prince_Abu
Smash Lord
leffen
Smash Champion
Lmao haters gonna hate
thanks a lot unknown, i havent got time to read it yet but ill comment on it when I have
also sidenote, going to play armada this weekend. I'll try to mm him and i'll post some thoughts about playing him and the overall matchup (we're gonna be playing in ntsc)
edit: im up for a mm hax, just can't say a sure number right now since I don't know how much the trip is gonna cost. feel free to take this as proof of me being scared
thanks a lot unknown, i havent got time to read it yet but ill comment on it when I have
also sidenote, going to play armada this weekend. I'll try to mm him and i'll post some thoughts about playing him and the overall matchup (we're gonna be playing in ntsc)
edit: im up for a mm hax, just can't say a sure number right now since I don't know how much the trip is gonna cost. feel free to take this as proof of me being scared
- Joined
- Mar 14, 2011
- Messages
- 5,493
I'm pretty positive Leffen's words were "I won't beat you (he was saying he was bad vs Falcon, I think), but I'll outplace you."
Bones0
Smash Legend
Nvm .
leffen
Smash Champion
yeah, im pretty sure that i even agreed to do a mm, just not a 500 dollar one, because i don't think hax being better than me in the fox/falcon matchup (which I have NO practice in) would be a fair test.
Metal Reeper
Smash Champion
1.How the hell do I edgeguard Doc?
2.What do I do when he's recovering and throwing un-needed prescriptions?
3.Any tips on how to correctly dair him? I guess do it as late as possible and towards the center of his body.
4. Does Uthrow>Uair ever work? Maybe I'm too slow.
5. Is green fox the best?
2.What do I do when he's recovering and throwing un-needed prescriptions?
3.Any tips on how to correctly dair him? I guess do it as late as possible and towards the center of his body.
4. Does Uthrow>Uair ever work? Maybe I'm too slow.
5. Is green fox the best?
Bones0
Smash Legend
1. Ledge invinc + Shine + Bair
2. Bair through them, or if you want to play it safe, Illusion into them right as they come out and shine spike him.
3. I would just FF and not worry about how late I do it, but maybe that's just me.
4. No.
5. Blue
2. Bair through them, or if you want to play it safe, Illusion into them right as they come out and shine spike him.
3. I would just FF and not worry about how late I do it, but maybe that's just me.
4. No.
5. Blue
leffen
Smash Champion
Uthrow uair does work at certain mid percents
unknown522
Some guy
Default fox all day son.
At NEC, in all tourney match fox dittos, I never got my color. I had to use red
At NEC, in all tourney match fox dittos, I never got my color. I had to use red
leffen
Smash Champion
LOL
you're a funny kid hax
you're a funny kid hax
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
Whenever you, chillin, and eggm play against each other the one with red always wins.Default fox all day son.
At NEC, in all tourney match fox dittos, I never got my color. I had to use red
unknown522
Some guy
That's not true. I lost to eggm at RoM 3. (I SD'd when I had the set win)
chillindude829
Smash Master
Metal Reeper
Smash Champion
Ok seriously guys. Next time just do the same color glitch, but use your actual tags. It will seriously be hype for no reason.
Do it.
EDIT: Is it faster to refresh my invinc frames by firestalling? Or just regular re-grabbing?
Do it.
EDIT: Is it faster to refresh my invinc frames by firestalling? Or just regular re-grabbing?
omgwtfToph
Smash Master
FASTER? Firefox stalling.
PGH Carroll
Smash Master
I hate doc. Gayest char in the game.
omgwtfToph
Smash Master
doc is fine lol