Q&A "Everyone Look At Me!" The Marth Video Critique Thread.

[Niko45]

You know what really improves your spacing and reading in melee? playing melee.

I've heard about this but I'm skeptical.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

I have radical training methods, what can i say.

 

[JediSange]

that guy plays brawl.

And so does M2K. Just saying.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

So does zant. Just saying.

 

[Archangel]

Spam, how is it that I have never met you though you are in Delaware? Do you ever travel to tournaments man?

I'm a myth, Legendary...nah seriously I haven't been to an event in like......7 months? I been to busy with life. I'm moving to a different place and when the dust settles...I'll probably start going to some local events again.

I once made an intro video to the competitive community but...I wouldn't watch the whole thing....lol. Maybe start from here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2d0iQmGZ3ek#t=7m04s

Just keep in mind most of the footage was between 08-09 with a few 2010 thrown in

I'm still glad I made this video though. Seeing this whole thing made me improve...simply because being able to beat other people who are slightly worse than u doesn't make you good....I learned that lesson when I went to ROM2. I did however realize that my Marth was at least decent...and my sheik.....well it's sheik...LOL. See ya around sometime though.

It improves your reading and spacing game so well. Melee players don't even know. Especially wi-fi

*insert troll face here*

You know what really improves your spacing and reading in melee? playing melee.

I agree. Although the thinking, reading, spacing, and mindgames/setup all happen at breakneck speeds. Sometimes players don't even know they are there simply because they are happening so fast or because of the speed players never give the chance to learn how to space correctly because someone's flashy spacie is all over them. So they just say fuuck it and build a strategy around something else without ever learning to space.

So since competitive brawl puts on training will for players like that and allows them to learn those things in a very safe and slow environment.

 

[JediSange]

I once made an intro video to the competitive community but...I wouldn't watch the whole thing....lol. Maybe start from here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2d0iQmGZ3ek#t=7m04s

At the 9 minute mark... are you keeping Peach in the air bro? That's very sub-optimal. >: |

 

[TheCrimsonBlur]

Sange v. Spam money match has to happen. This rivalry is so cute.

 

[Mahie]

Thanks for the advice on the Marth Samus matchup guys. It's supposed to be heavily in Marth's favor but I just don't understand how it works, granted , I've only played one Samus in my life and it's the best one in Europe, but still.

 

[stelzig]

I've only played one Samus in my life and it's the best one in Europe, but still.

He's gonna lose that title at BEASTII

 

[Mahie]

Someone's got faith in Eagle Ask Julius though, he was there, he saw it firsthand, I don't think they compare YET.

 

[stelzig]

Ahaha idk I think cyr might still be better, but I wouldn't be so surprised if he wasn't.

 

[ChivalRuse]

Sange v. Spam money match has to happen. This rivalry is so cute.

How is there a rivalry?

 

[Archangel]

At the 9 minute mark... are you keeping Peach in the air bro? That's very sub-optimal. >: |

are you really never gonna let that go?

Sange v. Spam money match has to happen. This rivalry is so cute.

one day it'll happen i'm pretty sure.

How is there a rivalry?

idk...it just kinda started

 

[Niko45]

One more note about Samus...I don't think Samus is a very good character but one thing you really need to watch out for is her fsmash. That **** is top tier. Too much ledgehop fairing will get you fsmashed a lot so be more careful how you get up from the edge against her because that's one of her strongest positions vs marth.

 

[Dart!]

It improves your reading and spacing game so well. Melee players don't even know. Especially wi-fi

I started out in brawl, i know how unhelpful it is.

And so does M2K. Just saying.

M2k is/was one of the best melee players ever.

Zant is at least a good uploader

 

[Niko45]

Zant is at least a good uploader

lmao .

 

[EPsilon933]

Just from personal experience, my fastest interval of improvement was back when I played wi-fi Brawl. But sadly my Wii is kind of broken and my Brawl disk is gone now. Getting a few extra hours of Smash practice is good, regardless if it's Brawl or Melee. I'll improve in both. My tech skill has never been affected (noticeably) by Brawl. I'm tech skilled enough to have a good flow. But imo I think Melee players over-emphasize the need for tech skill. Once you reach a certain point, improvements in that area aren't anywhere near as good as improvements in other areas

But I play Zelda and Peach (and might be picking up Fox too as a main/secondary) in Melee, so...

 

[Archangel]

Just from personal experience, my fastest interval of improvement was back when I played wi-fi Brawl. But sadly my Wii is kind of broken and my Brawl disk is gone now. Getting a few extra hours of Smash practice is good, regardless if it's Brawl or Melee. I'll improve in both. My tech skill has never been affected (noticeably) by Brawl. I'm tech skilled enough to have a good flow. But imo I think Melee players over-emphasize the need for tech skill. Once you reach a certain point, improvements in that area aren't anywhere near as good as improvements in other areas

But I play Zelda and Peach (and might be picking up Fox too as a main/secondary) in Melee, so...

Zelda/Peach don't really have much tech-skill compared to characters like Fox/Falco/IC's.

Brawl changes your state of mind more so then your game-play. doing basic addition, subtraction, multiplication, and division will not take away your ability to do Algebra, Geometry, or Calculus. It is at least more practical that they will enhance your ability to preform them. This is the phenomena known as "brawl improved my melee skills". However there is a downside to the slope. For example I've been away from mathematics long enough to forget how to do alot in Algebra, Geometry, and Calc. However I will never forget the basics because they are simple. There lies the problem i'm afraid. If once you get so enveloped in the basics of mathmatics or a game such a brawl and then you transfer over to more advanced mathmatics or melee....the end result is simply being off.

 

[Dart!]

Peach has tech skill if you play her that way.
FC combos are actually pretty technical if it includes multiple fc aerials.
Dsmash happy peaches aren't really viable anymore. Unless i'm mistaken and people haven't learned how to avoid it yet.

 

[EPsilon933]

Peach has tech skill if you play her that way.
FC combos are actually pretty technical if it includes multiple fc aerials.
Dsmash happy peaches aren't really viable anymore. Unless i'm mistaken and people haven't learned how to avoid it yet.

But Peach can play well without being flashy

FC Comboes are pretty technical?

Of course being down smash happy doesn't get you far

 

[Dart!]

i would consider them pretty cool looking/technical considering i can't use peach at all.

 

[EPsilon933]

i would consider them pretty cool looking/technical considering i can't use peach at all.

I think you're an exception. It's so easy

 

[Archangel]

I think you're an exception. It's so easy

it's pretty easy if you take a few minutes out to try it.

 

[MasterShake]

Plethora of vids of me coming soon, lost to SFAT pretty bad.

How do you own Fox. How do you escape short hop and full hop nair? How do you approach patient fox? How do you stop from getting impatient?

 

[Tee ay eye]

id answer if SFAT didnt beat me too

even though i know way more about the push/pull vs fox now than i did in december

 

[Tee ay eye]

what do you mean by when you ask about how you "escape" shffl nair and fullhop nair?

well, the way i try to think about fighting campy foxes
is that i have to keep moving in and out of their ranges
and getting closer and closer to them until i find out what i have to do to make them respond (whether it be challenging me or running away)

then i try to make note of how they respond and try to react/cover it

and if they never DO respond
just approach... and that is sorta a task in and of itself

also remember to keep in mind to try a bunch of different baiting tactics and stuff and try not to oversimplify it as "if i'm this far from him, he'll approach," since you doing different stuff will also make him react in different ways. so like, if he's never falling for your approach to WD back retreat or your dashdancing, maybe he'll fall for some empty shorthops (into grabs, attacks, wavelands, or double jumps) or some intentionally whiffed fairs/nairs used to bait.

vs fullhop nair, you could try to shffl uair since that reaches up further than u-tilt. a lot of foxes are terrible human beings and like to time themselves around your u-tilt
also against fullhop nair definitely try to CC grab whenever possible

vs shffl nair.... idk, just hit him
keep spacing in mind, though, so you might have to move closer to him before hitting him cuz he might be timing/spacing it to bait you so that thinking "oh, since he's approaching, i'll just hit him" won't work. you could try confusing his spacing with movement, running up and just grabbing him before he can bust out his shffl nair, shield -> do stuff out of that, or more.

 

[MasterShake]

Well, what I mean is at close distances he will either running short hop nair or full hop fast fall nair. Just wondering if any of marths attacks beat it out because it doesn't seem like I can run away from it.

I guess you'll wait till I post it, but honestly sfat is amazing vs marth (even though I think he was sandbagging...)

 

[Tee ay eye]

fullhop nair you could probably utilt, uair, run behind him, or CC grab

shffl nair... you could probably just f-smash, u-tilt, or something if he's really that close to you. and if he tries to bait that, you could move around or just stand still.

 

[JediSange]

I heard there was a guide on that matchup.

 

[OverLord]

I heard there was Mew2King on that matchup.

 

[makoforce]

m2k so damn good, he has been the best marth since '07.

 

[Bob Money]

jesse are you in antioch ? you should come over zels if u can. ill teach you that match up. fbook pm me yo number.

 

[ChivalRuse]

F-throw to tipped d-smash is the most hilarious thing.

 

[MT_]

F-throw to tipped d-smash is the most hilarious thing.

Shutup.

lol >_>

 

[OverLord]

How much was the MM..?

 

[MT_]

It was just a dollar. I went in expecting to lose cuz Tai is too good.

Also, can people tell me how to play Marth dittos while we're on the subject? I don't know anything about that matchup except it's really hard for me. lol

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1O0_QJ63hvo

 

[ChivalRuse]

Don't get locked down in your shield. Or in one place. Dash dance more so Tai doesn't have the leisure to set up his spacing. If you think he'll f-smash your dash dance, just run into a shield and punish out of shield. In general, don't forget you can wavedash out of shield into another shield to gain ground and make it harder for your opponent to grab you and at the same time staying safe from stray fairs, f-smashes, etc.

 

[OverLord]

Wait and punish.

 

[ChivalRuse]

You can't be waiting constantly, though, because you will get cornered/put into disadvantageous situations like with the other Marth poking you with tipped d-tilts. To punish things like that you have to get a read/guess which aren't true "punishes".

 

[OverLord]

I SAID: Wait and punish.



>: (