Common Secondaries and their usefulness.

[KAOSTAR]

Fox is easier to play than falco, falcon, marth IMO.

OK, can you elaborate. Im curious as to why. Is it that you play fox and it wasnt very hard for you? How long have you been playing competitively?

 

[Just Sexed]

OK, can you elaborate. Im curious as to why. Is it that you play fox and it wasnt very hard for you? How long have you been playing competitively?

My first tourny was in may 2007........ I only played marth and learned all tech skill with him first. Naturally I could pick up other chars and play them efficiently afterwards.Fox is just easy to pick up once you have everything down tech wise.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

I agree with Marth being harder to play. Maybe even Falcon. Why Falco though?

EDIT: I'd also like to point out that just because there are harder characters doesn't mean Fox is easy to play.

 

[Just Sexed]

I agree with Marth being harder to play. Maybe even Falcon. Why Falco though?

EDIT: I'd also like to point out that just because there are harder characters doesn't mean Fox is easy to play.

Because if you miss one l-cancel it basically means death if your playing someone exceptionally good. Falco has to be played perfectly in order to be used in tournament where as fox can win certain matchup by just grabbing his opponents as opposed to flawless combos. Of course if you new to the game fox seems like a hard character to play but with time he is easy and playing him comes naturally.

 

[KAOSTAR]

I agree with Marth being harder to play. Maybe even Falcon. Why Falco though?

EDIT: I'd also like to point out that just because there are harder characters doesn't mean Fox is easy to play.

If ur are responding to me then I wasnt commenting on how hard to play falcon and falco. I think that falco is easy but loads of fun. Falcon takes some reading skillz tho.

but those are my 4 m2 marth falcon falco. most fun characters in the game IMO.

 

[Just Sexed]

If ur are responding to me then I wasnt commenting on how hard to play falcon and falco. I think that falco is easy but loads of fun. Falcon takes some reading skillz tho.

but those are my 4 m2 marth falcon falco. most fun characters in the game IMO.

Im fairly certain he was responding to my post -_-.

 

[metashinryu]

i think we have a conflict between whos easier to plar and who is easier to make crap with...

i personally think marth is harder to play than say,fox for a noob because fox doesnt needs spacing as marth does but for pro or intermediate players fox is way harder to reach max output of potential ability.

so fox is the harder char to play at higher lv.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Because if you miss one l-cancel it basically means death if your playing someone exceptionally good. Falco has to be played perfectly in order to be used in tournament where as fox can win certain matchup by just grabbing his opponents as opposed to flawless combos. Of course if you new to the game fox seems like a hard character to play but with time he is easy and playing him comes naturally.

I don't understand your point. Yes, Falco can be chaingrabbed or killed from a single grab. Fox can too? And Fox's dair is possibly one of the hardest moves in the game to L-cancel.

What do you mean, Fox can win just by grabbing? Why is grabbing easier than combos? You realize that uthrow uair is for the most part not guaranteed right? People can break out with trajectory DI or SDI or even wiggling.

Also, who just lets themselves randomly get grabbed?

 

[Just Sexed]

I don't understand your point. Yes, Falco can be chaingrabbed or killed from a single grab. Fox can too? And Fox's dair is possibly one of the hardest moves in the game to L-cancel.

What do you mean, Fox can win just by grabbing? Why is grabbing easier than combos? You realize that uthrow uair is for the most part not guaranteed right? People can break out with trajectory DI or SDI or even wiggling.

Also, who just lets themselves randomly get grabbed?

Honestly drill shine is the easiest for me so I think that come down to opinion not fact. A lot of fox's matchups versus floaties your going to want to go for grabs kills and SDI isnt easy to pull off if the fox is much faster than the other player. Grabbing is much less punishable than missed l-cancels that is a fact. DD camping can get you grabs if the other player has to approach you.

We are kinda getting off the topic so if you want to PM to continue talking you can.

 

[soap]

lol at the person confused by nair, l cancel shine. what else could i possibly mean?

I was just commenting how people were saying his tech is so ridiculous it takes years and years to pick him up, which is not true.

Nobody is easy to play in tournament. Everybody knows all the matchups. It may take years to become super proficient at all these matchups with fox and develop your own style and tricks and stuff. j

But if u go to a smashfest once a week for a month, and play straight fox for 5-6 hours, u will have all the basic requisite tech to approach and stuff for mid-level play.

then u spend the rest of your career polishing and becoming sweet, just like every other character.

Now who is easiest to play at really high levels is a different discussion. I'd say marth, then fox, sheik, falco. basically the tier list rofl

 

[Binx]

**** sauce

this, this, this

 

[Che_Lab]

I am actually not sure what my main is, it seems I am equally skilled with multiple characters, and enjoy playing them all equally.
Another point I should mention is that whenever I ask people what they think my main should be, they are as indecisive as me.
Anyways heres the characters I play on a regular basis in no particular order.
C. Falcon
Jigglypuff
Fox
Marth
Falco

Also to the people who were arguing about who is easier to play, Fox does have the advantage over Falco in the sense that his recovery isn't absolutely horrible. But as someone else mentioned earlier, both characters are equally combo-able.

 

[KAOSTAR]

I don't understand your point. Yes, Falco can be chaingrabbed or killed from a single grab. Fox can too? And Fox's dair is possibly one of the hardest moves in the game to L-cancel.

What do you mean, Fox can win just by grabbing? Why is grabbing easier than combos? You realize that uthrow uair is for the most part not guaranteed right? People can break out with trajectory DI or SDI or even wiggling.

Also, who just lets themselves randomly get grabbed?

Actually upthrow to uair is guaranteed if fox knows what hes doin. You can either time it so that you only hit with the second hit and then SDI wont do anything as far as getting out of it. Not to mention its a sure thing even if they DI left and right. As long as the fox player doesnt **** up.

Fox has so many moves that combo into grab as well. Drill to grab, nair to grab, low percents uair to grab[falling uair from the ground lvl], tap to grab.

Alot of those combo into upsmash as well. When they get too high that upthrow to uair no longer works because of the height you go up then you should just upsmash instead.

@Che Lab-in Alaska, I take it ur not allowed to use cold hand johns right. Amirite lol.

 

[The Irish Mafia]

I'm a Peach Main, but firstly sub fox, then marth, then falcon. I also have practice with sheik, doc, and pika.
so yeah I'm a little bit of a tier *****. I think falco is a good sub for marth mains, because EXTREME tech skill isn't really necessary, it's mostly shine combos to spike, and with marth it's mostly fairs to fsmash/dair. Falco's more of a "do x to win" character, while marth is more of a "do x, y, and z to win" character.
I never really thought of falcon a a normal sub for marth mains, because he's so precise, and marth's more variable.

 

[KAOSTAR]

I guess. Marth can be precise just like everyother character. Fox seems more precise IMO. falco is ruthless and bad mannered and peach can downsmash.

What we say in WA is that peach's dsmash is what knocked down the twin towers lol

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Eh, I still don't agree with the whole... Fox being easy to play thing but... I'll drop it.

 

[KirbyKaze]

Fox imo is the hardest character to get his stuff down.

But once you do he's the best for winning purposes.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

I can agree with that.

 

[KAOSTAR]

yea I dont really care anymore. lol. Its just our opinions anyway lol.

 

[sakuraZaKi]

Hello, I second Fox and Falco.

 

[Miggz]

Fox is just easy to pick up once you have everything down tech wise.

Wouldn't this apply to, I don't know, EVERY character one plays?

*sighs*

 

[ArcNatural]

Wouldn't this apply to, I don't know, EVERY character one plays?

*sighs*

Definitely not.

Use some common sense here. Your technically proficient with Fox, your opponent is technically proficient with Falcon. Who do you think has the advantage?

Once your comfortable with tournament play if you start practicing Fox he is pretty easy to become tournament viable with. I know countless players agree here. Players who don't are either thinking in terms of beginners or in terms of people who just don't match up with Fox's playstyle imo.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

That's a matchup thing though. I don't get what point you're trying to make?

 

[KAOSTAR]

ummm we dont need to get into semantics about ppls opinions. There can be no winner here.


new topic: which low tier would u add to your arsenal of tourney characters if u could pick one. or if u had to second a low tier for tourney use who would it be?

 

[Just Sexed]

Wouldn't this apply to, I don't know, EVERY character one plays?

*sighs*

No you live in Bermuda you know nothing lol..............jk im just trolling.


If you read my post a little more clearly you see the point im trying to make.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Roy's a lot of fun... but I really wish I had a good Pikachu. I can't control the Quick Attack very well... if I could, I would so play him all the time.

 

[KAOSTAR]

Roy's a lot of fun... but I really wish I had a good Pikachu. I can't control the Quick Attack very well... if I could, I would so play him all the time.

I use to really enjoy pikachu cuz i mained him as a casual in 64. I want to pick him up as my 5th but cant seem to force myself to play him.

He is faster but ever since I played brawl pikachu I never wanted to play melee one anymore.

Obviously if I were to not already main m2 id second m2 lol. Hes just so much fun to play.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Really? Melee Pikachu feels way better to me than Brawl Pikachu.

 

[KAOSTAR]

Really? Melee Pikachu feels way better to me than Brawl Pikachu.

Haha that might just be the game itself lol. I just feel to limited. like short range and fast. Im not much of a fox or sheik lover.

but ive heard that from a few pikachu mains

 

[elvenarrow3000]

I dunno, outside of his tilt game being somewhat lacking, Pikachu just feels like... viable, I guess. There aren't many low tiers I can say that for.

 

[KAOSTAR]

What about link?

m2 is hella smooth lol

 

[metashinryu]

link, too many **** he can use XD

 

[Miggz]

No you live in Bermuda you know nothing lol..............jk im just trolling.


If you read my post a little more clearly you see the point im trying to make.

Its all good dude.

My bad. ^^;

 

[Just Sexed]

Its all good dude.

My bad. ^^;

Its aite I just like to introduce myself to others by arguing. I don't like to post on forums I am more of an observer.

 

[KAOSTAR]

Well link feels terrible to me but alot of ppl like him or y.link.

Any matchups you might want to use a low tier against instead of your high tier main?

 

[Stewie1288]

Anywho, since this thread is still around. I'm beginning to see what a cruel mistress fox is. There is definitely a tech skill hump to overcome to make him viable. From what I've recently been experiencing I'd say learning necessary fox techs/combos is harder than learning necessary Marth techs/combos.

my2cents.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Yeah, picking up Fox at first is a pain. Shorthopping (and all its variations) was the hardest to learn for me.

Then again, I play a pretty simple Fox.

Although I can shorthop double laser now! But can only shoot to the left.

 

[soap]

Roy's a lot of fun... but I really wish I had a good Pikachu. I can't control the Quick Attack very well... if I could, I would so play him all the time.

im all over that pikachu nowadays. Practice up b tricks, and your recovery will improve ten-fold....and um camp full hop reverse uair! so good

 

[Dark Sonic]

Any matchups you might want to use a low tier against instead of your high tier main?

Link or YL vs Peach. Especially YL.

Other than that....Maybe Pika vs Falcon? Maybe? I don't know any other matchups where high tiers are outdone by low tiers.

 

[metashinryu]

i would say link vs peach, that bitsh turnip spamming goes to hell against my arsenal