Character Competitive Impressions

[Tristan_win]

I was watching the stream and False talked about the great donation Sky Williams has done for our community. He got like 20 rooms for smashers for the new hotel. Video talking about it.

That's ****ing insane. I've been watching his youtube channel for a while and he's not the richest guy ever but at times he can be one of the funniest. Right now I'm looking into donating to his twitch channel, I'm truly touched.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Sky is an amazing man, period. He has a good soul. There is no other way to put it.

 

[David Viran]

Sky is an amazing man, period. He has a good soul. There is no other way to put it.

He even DQed zero in his rain of terror during final battle.

 

[Yonder]

The 9am pools were all Falcons but since then like every other match has had a Luigi in it. The decade of Luigi is real. And yeah, that Shulk was really fun to watch, seeing character knowledge like that is always a treat

Wait, Luigi had a decent amount of players for once?

Huh.

I am 100% attributing this rise to Xanadu and Boss. False probably helped too.

 

[David Viran]

Where's the zss rise in attendance? I swear most zss's i see don't ever make it out of pools either. I guess I've been seeing a bit more though.

 

[HeroMystic]

Did people forget this isn't For Glory mode? Idk...do they think he's the easiest to pick up and play?

Speaking of which, what characters would you say have the best ease of use to success ratio everyone?

1. Diddy
2. Ness (b-throw too good)
3. Can't say for sure... maybe Yoshi?

It's usually the characters that have a strong crutch that can be "easy to use".

 

[Alias]

I use Zelda practically exclusively and this is my list based on only my experience



top:

high:

high mid:

mid:

low mid:

low:

bottom:

 

[HeroMystic]

I use Zelda practically exclusively and this is my list based on only my experience

 

[Nu~]

I use Zelda practically exclusively and this is my list based on only my experience



top:

high:

high mid:

mid:

low mid:

low:

bottom:

You forgot mega.
But yeah...let's not

 

[Smog Frog]

I use Zelda practically exclusively and this is my list based on only my experience



top:

high:

high mid:

mid:

low mid:

low:

bottom:

was everything from top going down randomly generated?

 

[ApolloJustice]

I use Zelda practically exclusively and this is my list based on only my experience

Oh my god, wow

 

[FullMoon]

Ike bottom tier, oh god.

I'm not going to comment on Greninja being in mid when I'm fairly sure he's high mid because I think that's the least of that list's problems.

 

[A2ZOMG]

I thought we generally agreed to ignore posted full tier lists given how logically useless they are for discussion. If you're going to reply to that list, just stop and move on. You don't help anything by responding to it.

New topic: Duck Hunt I believe is a very underused character. He has his problems in the negative state, but his neutral game is pretty much comparably consistent to what other top tier characters are capable of (low commitment zoning + regular grab is by design sorta broken), and while his KO power is fairly low, he has a very good positive state that covers options very well.

Not completely sure about his matchups, but I believe he wins some fairly convincingly by design.

 

[Antonykun]

Duck hunt's biggest issue IMO is getting the KO. Unlike Sheik who can kill you off an edgeguard, Duck hunt has very little ways to ko as all their smashes are crap

 

[outfoxd]

Duck hunt's biggest issue IMO is getting the KO. Unlike Sheik who can kill you off an edgeguard, Duck hunt has very little ways to ko as all their smashes are crap

His KOs usually come from filtering people into what option he has, at least from experience and what I've watched. his two hit meteor, setups for Uair, utilt, and sweetspotted bair. along with assorted can shenanigans.

 

[Sinister Slush]

Just woke up, told there was a single Yoshi on stream earlier. He win or lose? Who waz it and is he not making out of pools anymore.

 

[ChronoPenguin]

There were multiple yoshis.
Sky won as yoshi.
Another two yoshis both lost to a Shulk/Mega player.

 

[sunset_raven]

I'm no expert in DhD, but they seem to fall into a trapper category, as their projectiles function not only to damage but to position where they can deal more damage or KO the opponent. Their problem, I believe lies in their disadvantage state. With a poor recovery and laggy projectiles, I fail to see how DhD avoids being gimped or juggled. Sure, when being edgeguarded DhD could attempt to disrupt with can, and while being juggled their small profile and nAir (and possibly b-reversing can? IDK) could help, but these don't seem that good to make their way back to neutral in many cases.

That and Rosaluma seems like a terrible match up... Thoughts?

 

[Ffamran]

Were there any Falcos? *prepares to be disappointed*

 

[TTTTTsd]

Were there any Falcos? *prepares to be disappointed*

Yup, there was as much Falcos there as Dr. Marios!

I'm sorry : (

 

[Yonder]

Did Boss play yet? I know J Miler and False won their pools. And was Concon eliminated?

 

[HeroMystic]

From what I witnessed, there was only Keitaro as Falco and a lesser known player as Doc.

I've only seen three Marios myself.

 

[Antonykun]

Where there any Villagers/Warios? Last time I checked APEX 2015 told us 2015 is the year of Luigi

 

[FullMoon]

By the way is aMSa at APEX?

 

[Spinosaurus]

Where there any Villagers/Warios? Last time I checked APEX 2015 told us 2015 is the year of Luigi

Reflex is at APEX
Wafty as well
Only Wario's I know that are there though, aside from Abadango who pockets him.

By the way is aMSa at APEX?

Yes.

 

[Antonykun]

So, I started to play more pac man in FG and i noticed my Pac Man really struggles against the defensive mechanics (Shielding and Rolling) when it comes to dealing KOes. This just means I got to watch more Abadango and Kool Aid to learn more traps. Hopefully my Villager knowledge can transfer a bit into learning Pac Man's traps.

EDIT: The more I actually look at Abadango's Pac Man the more I find it difficult to beleive that he doesn't have the potential to be top 10 in Smash 4 the guy is a legit threat.

 

[FullMoon]

I'm really hoping aMSa manages to go far with Greninja. From what I've heard so far Greninja hasn't been performing very well, sadly.

 

[deepseadiva]

Turns out Greninja is bad

 

[Real Smooth-Like]

Any oddball characters win a pool yet in apex? I can't watch it right now but I'm hoping link or zard are at least getting played. Bowser jr too, I never hear anything about that guy

 

[ChronoPenguin]

Were there any Falcos? *prepares to be disappointed*

Saw one, he lost to a yoshi if am not mistaken.

Was not keitaro.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Keitaro won a match against a Yoshi as Falco, lost the next one, then switched to Diddy and won the set.

 

[ParanoidDrone]

Any oddball characters win a pool yet in apex? I can't watch it right now but I'm hoping link or zard are at least getting played. Bowser jr too, I never hear anything about that guy

Luigi was wrecking face earlier, there was a good Pac-Man player, someone using Shulk/Mega Man did very well, and there was a surprise Olimar player too.

 

[Sinister Slush]

That sounds about right. He's not actually a Falco main anymore, he's a Diddy Kong. Like everyone else.
Double Houston Diddy's instead of Dao going Megaman...

The Abyss...

 

[A2ZOMG]

Duck hunt's biggest issue IMO is getting the KO. Unlike Sheik who can kill you off an edgeguard, Duck hunt has very little ways to ko as all their smashes are crap

I don't think it it's actually hard for Duck Hunt to get KOs. All of his aerials and Utilt work as KO moves at high percents. He also has very strong edgeguarding. Actually, I would argue his edgeguarding done correctly is on par with Villager and Pikachu. Can covers a HUGE amount of options by itself, and he can edgeguard very deep with aerials. The only problem he has offstage is he is much more vulnerable to counter gimps than the other two.

Also all of his Smashes are good even though he lacks setups into them. They are all disjointed and faster than average in startup. Combine how short he is, he actually can force a lot of conventional spacing to be extremely unsafe.

Duck Hunt mostly suffers from killing later than his opposition, though unlike G&W, who also suffers from this, he does better in neutral and has better, more universally practical traps in the positive state.

 

[bc1910]

No. Realistically Greninja's limited neutral could be holding him back but he's still thoroughly under-represented, his amazing edgeguarding is not being utilised properly and his mobility is not being used effectively. There is no way Greninja is anywhere below high-mid, his tools do not have the limitations of an average-or-below fighter. His Apex results may not reflect that of a strong character, but I think he's going to be a dark horse as the game develops.

And before anyone jumps to call me biased, I would happily main Sheik if I felt limited by Greninja (I only play characters I like from their games, and like Sheik a lot too). I honestly believe the character is far better than he's given credit for. It might be cliche, but I think Greninja is a classic example of a character who is "very good, but hard to use".

 

[Ffamran]

Saw one, he lost to a yoshi if am not mistaken.

Was not keitaro.

Aww...

Keitaro won a match against a Yoshi as Falco, lost the next one, then switched to Diddy and won the set.

Falco is like the test character for Keitaro to get a feel of the match which sort of turns Falco into a sandbag. I... I'm going to get **** on for this, but I don't like how when loses he switches to Diddy. Same with Logic switching to Diddy after doing well with Villager. Whatever though.

 

[Sinister Slush]

Falco is like the test character for Keitaro to get a feel of the match which sort of turns Falco into a sandbag. I... I'm going to get **** on for this, but I don't like how when loses he switches to Diddy. Same with Logic switching to Diddy after doing well with Villager. Whatever though.

It's a common thing for players that's been around in all smash games, either switching to fox for melee MK for brawl and this time around Diddy for Sm4sh.
The only thing I hate about it is when they do it to "win" but they obviously won't get anywhere near the money. If you really want to win, don't bother going your lower tier characters just main the chimp already man.

 

[HeroMystic]

Falco is like the test character for Keitaro to get a feel of the match which sort of turns Falco into a sandbag. I... I'm going to get **** on for this, but I don't like how when loses he switches to Diddy. Same with Logic switching to Diddy after doing well with Villager. Whatever though.

I wouldn't **** on you because I understand the feeling completely, especially when Ally does it and his Mario is liteyears(ahem) ahead of his Diddy.

That said, play to win.

And I completely agree with Slush.

 

[Yonder]

I wouldn't **** on you because I understand the feeling completely, especially when Ally does it and his Mario is liteyears(ahem) ahead of his Diddy.

That said, play to win.

And I completely agree with Slush.

Makes me wonder if False is going to switch to Sheik from Luigi later on.

 

[HeroMystic]

False seems to give equal representation to both Luigi and Sheik, but I imagine against any top level players (such as Ally or ZeRo) he'll default to Sheik and switch to Luigi if he loses.