Important Carefully Ask PPMD about the Tiara Guy

[Winston]

Yeah I think dtilt is good, but it's not the end all be all to the matchup since it's pretty low reward and it is punishable if you overuse it.

 

[Niko45]

Dtilt is incredibly overrated. It's really about fair, and even then, don't ask me wtf you do against ICs cause they are stupid and incredibly ****.

 

[Cactuar]

Chu will fly in with a fair if I spam dtilt. It is really just about mixing up and reaction with dtilt, fair, and fsmash/ftilt properly.

I've always seen it as being a very simple, straightforward matchup.

 

[Jun.]

Camp fair (they can't do anything)
Don't Fsmash (They'll punch it really hard if you whiff or they'll just WD OOS and grab you to w/e)
Don't grab (there's another one ready to hit you)

I think that's about it in a nutshell? I could be wrong. The only really scary thing is a blizzard nanapault. I recall it stunning me so that the main climber can approach freely.

 

[Niko45]

If you camp fair too blatantly they'll ice block you a lot.

 

[Jun.]

When anyone refers to Fair camping I don't think they mean literally camping Fair across the stage. Chances are it means to camp Fairs within the right zone to pressure them while keeping other options viable. No way IC's would iceblock a Marth that's within a 2-3x sword range.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

And I think many ICs would because it would be safe if you are just fairing in place and stuff. Also, i think grab is a really strong option against ICs simply because they *want* to shield a lot. Its like playing against samus; you're not gonna get a whole lot out of it except making them shield less (which means you can swing your sword more)

 

[Jun.]

when you grab IC's when they are close together the nana gets a free input and you're gonna get smashed.

 

[Niko45]

I try to grab ICs during respawn cause if you actually have the invincibility a grab is really nice against them. Sometimes I'll also grab if I crossed them up somehow and got behind them cause you can get away with it there it seems. Other than that I just get ***** for it, especially if I accidentally grabbed nana.

Once it's Sopo fthrow - dash attack is allll dayyyyy.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

can't you immediately fthrow to gain invincibility and hit the other IC if hes close? I think the only punish is to shield grab in return, though depending on your spacing they may not be able to shield grab you. I haven't tested the spacing, but it make sense in my head lol

 

[Jun.]

There is no way that Marth's grab + fthrow is gonna be faster than an IC dsmash. I'm saying that when Popo is grabbed the IC player can control Nana and throw out a Dsmash or anything else for that matter.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

you realize that the frame you get the grab you can throw, right?


edit- and the frame that you throw you get invincibility

 

[Jun.]

Marth has an instant throw?

wat the...

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

umm no thats just the physics of the game lolololol

 

[Walt]

Yeah, sometimes it feels like you just hold forward/any direction while the grab is coming out and you throw on the first frame you can. Not sure if it actually works like or if I just time it right lol. But I try to insta-throw a lot of the time before they have a chance to DI a specific way on purpose.

 

[TheCrimsonBlur]

Grabbing is great as long as the ICs aren't desynced. If they are, Nana could charge an fsmash/dsmash/do a dash attack/whatever as you go in and you'll get hit before you grab. Popo can follow up that hit and **** gets real ugly.

But if they are synced, you can grab->fthrow and ****. Just make sure you throw immediately. Like the moment you press jump cancel grab, hit forward, as if it was part of the JC grab input (do dash, Y, Z, and forward in quick succession). Just don't be predictable because their spotdodge *****, but thats true with most matchups.

 

[Strong Badam]

Marth has an instant throw?

wat the...

they aren't thrown/released on the first frame
but his throw animation can start immediately after the Catch animation finishes, which is pretty damn short. you could also buffer a dthrow if Nana is behind you.
interesting fact: dthrow is the only throw you can buffer. use the C-Stick to do so.

You didn't know throws had invincibility frames?

 

[Sage Osaka]

Epic *** Marth ic's set coming up soon guys stay posted

 

[Walt]

they aren't thrown/released on the first frame
but his throw animation can start immediately after the Catch animation finishes, which is pretty damn short. you could also buffer a dthrow if Nana is behind you.
interesting fact: dthrow is the only throw you can buffer. use the C-Stick to do so.

You didn't know throws had invincibility frames?

oh cool I didn't know you could buffer dthrows with c-stick. very useful for falcon :D

 

[TheCrimsonBlur]

they aren't thrown/released on the first frame
but his throw animation can start immediately after the Catch animation finishes, which is pretty damn short. you could also buffer a dthrow if Nana is behind you.
interesting fact: dthrow is the only throw you can buffer. use the C-Stick to do so.

You didn't know throws had invincibility frames?

Do you know any data on how long the catch animation takes? I'm assuming it has to do with the distance away from your opponent? I can't imagine the animation being that long even with max distance; it feels nearly immediate every time (max I could see is 6 framesish).

I had no idea you could buffer dthrows. You just hold the c-stick after you press grab?

 

[Strong Badam]

Catch animation takes 1 or 2 frames I think, I never looked into it.
You just hold the c-stick at any time. Like seriously go try it. Hold down on the c-stick and then walk up to someone and grab

officially changing my Marth Player Tier List

Mew2King
slight gap
Ice
Strawhat Dahean's prime
gap
Cactuar's Prime
gap
dart/KFC/the other good marths

 

[Niko45]

So we've got one list that attempts to rank every random pro who plays Marth a little bit on the side, some of which I've at least only seen in friendlies or split pot grand finals etc.

Then we have another that attempts to rank marths by their "primes" across eras.

:/

 

[Strong Badam]

you're mostly just jely because you aren't on my list
removed Ken becuz he don't matter no mo

 

[Niko45]

true

dam it

 

[bdenhawk]

hey guys, does anyone know of any good ways to pressure/intimidate opponents using marth? not necessarily approaching, just ways to keep them scared ya know. or if anyone knows any links to pressure/intimidation in general that'd be great. thank yaaa

 

[Niko45]

walking is pretty good

 

[Juno McGrath]

Bden all this time playing me and you dont know how to scare people?

just watch my marth, when im dash dancing pay attention to the look in my eyes.

 

[TheCrimsonBlur]

Marth is like the most intimidating character in the game. You can just stare at them while you are within fsmash range and they will freak out lol.

Dashdancing is the obvious answer tho. Make it so they don't know when you are going to go in. They will be shoooook.

 

[earla]

1. pro tips vs puff and falcon?

2. having trouble v falco. i get shut down by lasers most the game, stuck in shield. tips on approaching?

 

[OverLord]

Catch animation takes 1 or 2 frames I think, I never looked into it.
You just hold the c-stick at any time. Like seriously go try it. Hold down on the c-stick and then walk up to someone and grab

officially changing my Marth Player Tier List

Mew2King
slight gap
Ice
Strawhat Dahean's prime
gap
Cactuar's Prime
gap
dart/KFC/the other good marths

I'd say I.B. and HBK are kinda like Dahean. Maybe a bit less, but I don't know.

Like them both more than Cactus and Dahean though.

 

[Aber]

hey guys, does anyone know of any good ways to pressure/intimidate opponents using marth? not necessarily approaching, just ways to keep them scared ya know. or if anyone knows any links to pressure/intimidation in general that'd be great. thank yaaa

swing your sword

 

[Tee ay eye]

swing your sword

not really

empty shorthops are amazing, especially cuz you can react with late fairs and mix in late fairs for intimidation sometimes
d-tilt/jab
dashdance
nairs

 

[KILLA.FOR.CASH.]

mew2king once said i was the 5th best marth after i played him at genesis xD

kind of sad, cus at around genesis i couldnt even really think of 5 active good marths

 

[Dark Sonic]

About the grabbing ice climbers thing.

Even if they're synched. If they predict a grab, they can still just input an attack for nana to do.

 

[Niko45]

mew2king once said i was the 5th best marth after i played him at genesis xD

kind of sad, cus at around genesis i couldnt even really think of 5 active good marths

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c39aTVGPs5Y&feature=related

Not surprised. I've been known about you, bro. Still waiting for new marth vids.

I'm curious who M2K's other 4 (3) Marths were.

 

[Sage Osaka]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c39aTVGPs5Y&feature=related

Not surprised. I've been known about you, bro. Still waiting for new marth vids.

I'm curious who M2K's other 4 (3) Marths were.

there's gonna be a supposedly good set of him vs choknater uploaded soon, as soon as he gets around to it >_<

 

[Jun.]

swing your sword

Yeah agreed with Tee aye eye here. Its like a common joke that all Marth needs to do is "swing his sword" but all (good) Marth mains know that swinging the sword is just about the worst thing you can do in many situations. Fast characters like Fox/Falcon can just dash in and hit/grab you in the Marth's subpar lagtime and characters with projectiles could really care less about swords.

Honestly I think the best thing to do to intimidate people is get in the range where a swing COULD be dangerous and do absolutely nothing, and by nothing I mean dash dance. Chances are they'll get scared and retreat towards the outer areas of the stage which is just where Marth wants them to be since its one step closer to them being being off stage.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

I think marth's dash dance is poor for pressuring since all he can really do is grab. Unlike fox who can dash at you with a nair/dair or falco who can laser or dair. I suppose marth can fair or nair himself, but those moves are very risky for pressuring since they open up room for punishment and gives up the advantage.

Personally, i like to be in standing position at the key moments so im able to tilt or jab or take space in response to their actions.

 

[Niko45]

Basically walking or standing are the most intimidating just because you have the most options out of that. If you dash, you are committed to a narrower selection of options. Same thing if you go in the air.

Swinging the sword is the exact opposite of intimidating someone because the intimidation comes in wondering when/how you will swing. Once you do swing, everyone has a set number of responses to that that they are comfortable executing. Before you've done anything, nothing feels safe.

 

[Tee ay eye]

empty shorthops are the business if you space yourself right